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-   -   Continuation Man shot, killed by off-duty Dallas police officer who walked into wrong apartment p2 (http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=335459)

William Parcher 22nd March 2019 08:16 AM

Man shot, killed by off-duty Dallas police officer who walked into wrong apartment p2
 
Trial date set for Amber Guyger in Botham Jean murder case

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dallas News
Former Dallas police Officer Amber Guyger had a court date Monday but the only movement in the case happened outside the courtroom.

Her murder trial was set Monday for Aug. 12 -- less than a year since Guyger shot and killed Botham Jean in his own apartment. She was off-duty but still in uniform when she shot Jean once in the chest.

Guyger told law enforcement she confused Jean's apartment with her own and thought he was a burglar. She said his door was unlocked and ajar, though Jean's family has questioned that account.

Murder cases in Dallas County usually take more than a year to go to trial. It's also common for trials to be delayed.

Also on Monday, State District Judge Tammy Kemp signed a subpoena requested by prosecutors for records related to any cruises Guyger took on Royal Caribbean between Sept. 23 to March 4...

https://www.dallasnews.com/news/crim...an-murder-case


Mod InfoThread continued from here.
You can quote or reply to any on-topic post from that thread here.
Posted By:zooterkin

Drewbot 22nd March 2019 08:32 AM

To see if she was talking about the case on the cruise ship?

This seems unusual

Drewbot 22nd March 2019 08:36 AM

Or was she ordered not to leave the state?
But the murder happened in early 2019 right?

RecoveringYuppy 22nd March 2019 08:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drewbot (Post 12641974)
Or was she ordered not to leave the state?
But the murder happened in early 2019 right?

The murder either happened on Sept 6 2018 or we plotted it here for four months before it happened.

How stupid would you have to be to go on a cruise when you're on conditional release?

ETA: Can't find a source I completely trust but the order for Guyger not to travel may not have happened until November.

William Parcher 22nd March 2019 08:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drewbot (Post 12641974)
Or was she ordered not to leave the state?

The conditions of her bail probably don't allow her to leave the country. Generally the passport is handed over.

Whip 22nd March 2019 08:53 AM

wonder if they are looking to see if she got on the wrong cruise ship. :rolleyes:

Dave Rogers 22nd March 2019 08:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RecoveringYuppy (Post 12641983)
How stupid would you have to be to go on a cruise when you're on conditional release?

Oooh, I think I know this one. Stupid enough to mistake somebody else's apartment for yours and shoot the owner dead just for being there?

Dave

Drewbot 22nd March 2019 08:55 AM

So THATS why her hair is lighter, and she looks so tan and fit.

William Parcher 22nd March 2019 09:06 AM

From November 30th, 2018...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dallas News
The case has been assigned to state District Judge Tammy Kemp. A former prosecutor who took the bench in 2015, Kemp ordered Guyger to surrender her passport Friday and not to travel outside the state without approval, according to court records. She's also forbidden to use alcohol or drugs.


https://www.dallasnews.com/news/cour...ng-botham-jean

Drewbot 22nd March 2019 09:09 AM

Ohh.
They are going to get her locked up until the trial aren't they?

William Parcher 22nd March 2019 09:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drewbot (Post 12642006)
Ohh.
They are going to get her locked up until the trial aren't they?

She would have been able to travel on cruise ship prior to November 30th 2018 because she wasn't restricted to Texas and she still possessed her passport.

After November 30th 2018 she cannot leave Texas without permission, and she wouldn't have a passport for any international travel either.

Bob001 22nd March 2019 10:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by William Parcher (Post 12642011)
She would have been able to travel on cruise ship prior to November 30th 2018 because she wasn't restricted to Texas and she still possessed her passport.

After November 30th 2018 she cannot leave Texas without permission, and she wouldn't have a passport for any international travel either.

She was initially charged with manslaughter and released on $300K bond. Wouldn't travel restrictions have been imposed then? That is very likely why the prosecutor wants her travel records as far back as Sept. 23. https://newsone.com/3848852/amber-gu...uise-subpoena/

William Parcher 22nd March 2019 10:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bob001 (Post 12642054)
She was initially charged with manslaughter and released on $300K bond. Wouldn't travel restrictions have been imposed then? That is very likely why the prosecutor wants her travel records as far back as Sept. 23. https://newsone.com/3848852/amber-gu...uise-subpoena/

I can't answer why it didn't happen previously.

It was on November 30th that she was forced to surrender her passport and forbidden from travelling out of state. This is in the link I provided.

Whip 22nd March 2019 10:51 AM

I don't see how they could restrict her travel before any indictment which didn't happen until December 1

Bob001 22nd March 2019 11:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Whip (Post 12642098)
I don't see how they could restrict her travel before any indictment which didn't happen until December 1

She was arrested, charged and released on $300K bond in September. That would be plenty of reason to restrict her travel, and would usually be a condition of release.

William Parcher 22nd March 2019 11:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bob001 (Post 12642107)
She was arrested, charged and released on $300K bond in September. That would be plenty of reason to restrict her travel, and would usually be a condition of release.

Her arrest back then was for manslaughter, not murder. Maybe that makes a difference.

Bob001 22nd March 2019 12:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by William Parcher (Post 12642110)
Her arrest back then was for manslaughter, not murder. Maybe that makes a difference.

Terms are set by the judge. I guess it's possible that the judge thought restrictions weren't necessary. But people are sitting in jail without bail for lesser charges than manslaughter.

RecoveringYuppy 22nd March 2019 12:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Whip (Post 12642098)
I don't see how they could restrict her travel before any indictment which didn't happen until December 1

Guyger was briefly jailed on September 9th and only released because she able to meet the bail. I'm not a lawyer but it seems to me that if they could throw her in jail at that time then they could have also restricted her travel at that time. I can't find anything that says any judge actually did restrict her travel at that time though.

The timing on the records they are looking for is probably driven by the day she was fired. They can probably account for her time up to that point.

quadraginta 22nd March 2019 11:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bob001 (Post 12642144)
Terms are set by the judge. I guess it's possible that the judge thought restrictions weren't necessary. But people are sitting in jail without bail for lesser charges than manslaughter.


How many of them are cops?

LTC8K6 24th March 2019 07:22 AM

Trip to St Lucia?

Drewbot 1st April 2019 05:34 AM

I think this writer must be ghosting our thread.
His article came out days after our in depth questioning of this.

https://newsone.com/3848852/amber-gu...uise-subpoena/

Quote:

Did Amber Guyger Go On A Caribbean Cruise After Killing Botham Jean?
Quote:

The subpoena could be damning for Guuyger on multiple levels. Not only could it allow prosecutors to portray Guyger as a carefree vacationer following what appeared to be a cold-blooded murder of an innocent man. It could also show Guyger violated the terms of her conditional release from jail.

“Beginning in November 2018, the judge stated Guyger was to surrender her passport to her attorney and was not to travel outside Texas without the court’s approval,” NBC reminded.

JoeMorgue 1st April 2019 05:41 AM

Well she would need a vacation after experiencing the trauma of staying awake for 16 grueling hours. You need some self care after a horrific experience like that.

Darat 1st April 2019 12:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JoeMorgue (Post 12651829)
Well she would need a vacation after experiencing the trauma of staying awake for 16 grueling hours. You need some self care after a horrific experience like that.

Or she may have just accidentally booked the cruise and went on the cruise because the entrance to the booking office looked like the entrance to her local Target store. Who hasn't done that?

Whip 1st April 2019 12:48 PM

I'll guess, since we haven't heard, she didn't shot someone that she thought was in her room after mistaking another guests room as hers because, you know, tired from all the fun in the sun for 16 hours. Or, maybe she did and that's why the cruise records are wanted.

LTC8K6 2nd April 2019 07:02 AM

Why would it take more than a few hours to figure out if she took a cruise when she was not allowed to?

Babbylonian 2nd April 2019 07:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LTC8K6 (Post 12652877)
Why would it take more than a few hours to figure out if she took a cruise when she was not allowed to?

Figuring out that something happened is separate from gathering evidence to prove something happened?

RecoveringYuppy 2nd April 2019 07:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LTC8K6 (Post 12652877)
Why would it take more than a few hours to figure out if she took a cruise when she was not allowed to?

What makes you think it is?

Horatius 3rd April 2019 07:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darat (Post 12652231)
Or she may have just accidentally booked the cruise and went on the cruise because the entrance to the booking office looked like the entrance to her local Target store. Who hasn't done that?


You know what's probably more likely? She'd booked the cruise prior to the shooting (if they're looking back as far as Sept 23, that's quite likely). Then she looked at the already-paid-for cruise, and thought, "Well, I ****** up shooting that guy, I know it, and so I'm likely going to end up in prison sometime in the next year or so. So, **** it, let's take the cruise. What, are they going to throw me in prison even harder?" After all, there's no vacations from prison, so you might as well go while you've got the chance.


Sure, maybe they should have put travel restrictions on her much earlier than they did, but if they didn't, well, **** it. I'd have probably done the same in her place.

Giordano 3rd April 2019 08:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Horatius (Post 12653831)
You know what's probably more likely? She'd booked the cruise prior to the shooting (if they're looking back as far as Sept 23, that's quite likely). Then she looked at the already-paid-for cruise, and thought, "Well, I ****** up shooting that guy, I know it, and so I'm likely going to end up in prison sometime in the next year or so. So, **** it, let's take the cruise. What, are they going to throw me in prison even harder?" After all, there's no vacations from prison, so you might as well go while you've got the chance.


Sure, maybe they should have put travel restrictions on her much earlier than they did, but if they didn't, well, **** it. I'd have probably done the same in her place.

Of course this is speculation, but let's say the cruise was already booked.

Taking it certainly could persuade a juror or two who would otherwise have been be leaning toward clearing her to instead convict her, interpreting the cruise as evidence of her state of mind being callous and unconcerned as to the killing of an innocent man.

And even if one assumes that she would have been convicted anyway, her going on a cruise could certainly impact her sentence.

So as I see it, yes, they certainly could throw her in jail harder; a lot harder!

So I would not recommend it.

Horatius 3rd April 2019 08:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Giordano (Post 12653881)
Of course this is speculation, but let's say the cruise was already booked.

Taking it certainly could persuade a juror or two who would otherwise have been be leaning toward clearing her to instead convict her, interpreting the cruise as evidence of her state of mind being callous and unconcerned as to the killing of an innocent man.

And even if one assumes that she would have been convicted anyway, her going on a cruise could certainly impact her sentence.

So as I see it, yes, they certainly could throw her in jail harder; a lot harder!

So I would not recommend it.


Well, it's all speculation to us, but it's not speculation to her. We don't know what actually went down that night, but she does. This might be a sign that she knows she's guilty, and that even a brain-dead juror will see that once all the evidence is presented. So, since she's in the know, why not live a little before the hammer comes down?

Drewbot 9th April 2019 07:18 AM

What is possible, is that she booked the cruise previous to the shooting.
And didn't go. But looking through the finances, they saw the charge, so they are seeing if she actually went. Unless you buy cancellation insurance, I don't think all cruises are refundable.

Also- Trial date got moved to september 23rd.

Drewbot 9th April 2019 08:01 AM

CBS Story about the Trial being delayed.

Also a funny note, it says 'Gunshot Wounds' to the chest and abdomen.

We were pretty clear only one bullet hit Jean.

https://dfw.cbslocal.com/2019/04/03/...r-botham-jean/

Drewbot 26th April 2019 11:32 AM

Now a bunch of criminals are getting charges dropped because Amber Guyger has been charged.


https://www.dallasnews.com/news/crim...ks-murder-case

Bob001 26th April 2019 01:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drewbot (Post 12677255)
Now a bunch of criminals are getting charges dropped because Amber Guyger has been charged.

https://www.dallasnews.com/news/crim...ks-murder-case

Is that a surprise? Could anyone rely on the testimony of an accused murderer? (And I dunno if nine drug possession cases is quite "a bunch of criminals.")

theprestige 26th April 2019 02:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drewbot (Post 12677255)
Now a bunch of criminals are getting charges dropped because Amber Guyger has been charged.


https://www.dallasnews.com/news/crim...ks-murder-case

Paywall. What are the facts?

qayak 26th April 2019 03:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bob001 (Post 12677373)
Is that a surprise? Could anyone rely on the testimony of an accused murderer?

It isn't just that . . . how willing would she be to testify for the prosecution at this point?

Bob001 26th April 2019 03:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theprestige (Post 12677420)
Paywall. What are the facts?


Quote:

In the months since Amber Guyger fatally shot Botham Jean in his home, prosecutors have dismissed at least nine cases she investigated when she was still a Dallas police officer.
....
Four of the dismissed cases stemmed from the arrest of two men during a January 2018 traffic stop by Guyger and another officer. Three of those involved drug charges. The fourth, involving an allegation of unlawfully carrying a weapon, was also dismissed, and the gun was returned. But prosecutors' motion to dismiss that case was not found in the court file.
https://www.dallasnews.com/news/crim...ks-murder-case

Try clearing your history and cookies.

Darat 26th April 2019 03:37 PM

I find this really strange. One for the fact that she is still innocent of any crime in the eyes of the criminal justice system and two what bearing does her charges have on the past arrests?

Bob001 26th April 2019 03:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by qayak (Post 12677454)
It isn't just that . . . how willing would she be to testify for the prosecution at this point?

She would probably be willing to do anything to make the prosecutors happy, which itself would raise doubts about the veracity of her testimony.

Bob001 26th April 2019 03:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darat (Post 12677480)
I find this really strange. One for the fact that she is still innocent of any crime in the eyes of the criminal justice system and two what bearing does her charges have on the past arrests?

1/ Criminal prosecutions, especially in high-profile cases, take a long time in the U.S. Both sides get to conduct thorough investigations, question witnesses, hire experts, examine evidence etc. before trial. 2/ The past arrests require her testimony at trial. The fact that she's charged with murder certainly raises doubts about her judgment and integrity.


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