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-   -   Continuation Donald Trump has 'dangerous mental illness' say psychiatry experts at Yale... Pt 3 (http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=341507)

Skeptic Ginger 14th June 2021 07:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by xjx388 (Post 13508708)
The Ethics Police have arrived and consider this a nuisance call at this point
Because they give up? :p

Norman Alexander 14th June 2021 08:18 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by bruto (Post 13443510)
I wonder sometimes if it isn't both at the same time. To presume he must either believe or not believe his lies presumes that he is still in some sense in control of himself.

I think a certain sort of narcissist can intentionally lie, but he also cannot disbelieve anything he says. Once he's uttered it, it cannot be anything but true.
They invent their own universe as they go along. So it is always "true" in the sense that it is the universe in which they live.

Stacyhs 14th June 2021 10:52 PM
Perhaps the Ethics Police need a bit of retraining in this area.

Skeptic Ginger 14th June 2021 11:17 PM
March 2021: Academic Freedom and the Goldwater Rule
Quote:
Bandy Lee, a former Yale University faculty member in the Department of Psychiatry in the School of Medicine, filed suit in federal court March 22 against the University alleging “unlawful termination… due to her exercise of free speech about the dangers of Donald Trump’s presidency.” Lee charges that Yale fired her in response to a January 2020 tweet that characterized “just about all” of former president Donald Trump’s supporters as suffering from “shared psychosis” and said that Trump attorney Alan Dershowitz had “wholly taken on Trump’s symptoms by contagion.” Dershowitz then sent a letter to Yale administrators, in which he complained that Lee’s tweet constituted “a serious violation of the ethics rules of the American Psychiatric Association” and asked that she be disciplined. ...

In a September 4 letter to Lee, Krystal wrote that the termination “was not because of the political content” of her statements. Instead, he invoked her “repeated violations of the APA’s Goldwater Rule and your inappropriate transfer of the duty to warn from the treatment setting to national politics,” which, the letter claimed, “raised significant doubts about” Lee’s grasp of professional ethics in psychiatry.
Dershowitz's handiwork on his crusade to install professors who align with people like himself and Trump.

A protest letter was sent:
Quote:
We rely on the report in the Yale Daily News (March 23, 2021) that quoted your letter terminating Dr. Lee as follows:

“Although the committee does not doubt that you are acting on the basis of your personal moral code,” the letter read, “your repeated violations of the APA’s Goldwater Rule and your inappropriate transfer of the duty to warn from the treatment setting to national politics raised significant doubts about your understanding of crucial ethical and legal principles in psychiatry.” ...

The validity of the Goldwater Rule has been widely disputed: many professionals consider it a scientifically untenable privileging of corporate psychiatry’s interests over individual psychiatrists’ rights of free speech and expressions of conscience (Lilienfeld, S., Miller, J., Lynam, D., The Goldwater Rule, Perspectives From, and Implications for, Psychological Science, Perspect Psychol Sci . 2018 Jan;13(1):3-27. doi: 10.1177/1745691617727864. Epub 2017 Oct 12; Post, J., Narcissism and Politics: Dreams of Glory, New York: Cambridge University Press, 2015; Pouncey, C., President Trump’s Mental Health-Is It Morally Permissible for Psychiatrists to Comment?, New England Journal of Medicine 2018, 378 (5), pp. 405-407).

Additionally, the APA’s 2017 restatement of the Goldwater Rule broadened its wording to proscribe apparently any discussion by psychiatrists and, by extension, other mental health professionals, not only of putative diagnoses but of the psychology and behavior of public figures. This colonizing of scholarly discourse by the APA flies in the face of academic traditions of inquiry. ...

Further, Dr. Lee’s profound contributions to the field (Lee, B. editor. The Dangerous Case of Donald Trump; St. Martin’s Press, 2017, p. 83-93) would have been impossible if she allowed herself to be gagged by the Goldwater Rule. Bearing in mind that the 37 contributors to this book which Dr. Lee edited include many scholars and international exemplars of psychiatric ethics, we wonder if they too would be terminated were they to be members of your department.

There is a well established body of professionals with relevant expertise who side with me and others in this thread.

Stacyhs 14th June 2021 11:27 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger (Post 13508794)
March 2021: Academic Freedom and the Goldwater Rule
Dershowitz's handiwork on his crusade to install professors who align with people like himself and Trump.

A protest letter was sent:


There is a well established body of professionals with relevant expertise who side with me and others in this thread.



:bigclap

Stacyhs 14th June 2021 11:34 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger (Post 13508794)
March 2021: Academic Freedom and the Goldwater Rule
Dershowitz's handiwork on his crusade to install professors who align with people like himself and Trump.

A protest letter was sent:


There is a well established body of professionals with relevant expertise who side with me and others in this thread.
From your link:
Quote:

In the opinion of many prominent mental health professionals, the Goldwater Rule arose to protect the image of the psychiatric profession in the wake of its humiliation after the successful lawsuit initiated by Barry Goldwater against Fact magazine (Martin-Joy, J., Diagnosing from a Distance: Debates over Libel Law, Media, and Psychiatric Ethics from Barry Goldwater to Donald Trump, Cambridge University Press, New York, 2020).

The validity of the Goldwater Rule has been widely disputed: many professionals consider it a scientifically untenable privileging of corporate psychiatry’s interests over individual psychiatrists’ rights of free speech and expressions of conscience (Lilienfeld, S., Miller, J., Lynam, D., The Goldwater Rule, Perspectives From, and Implications for, Psychological Science, Perspect Psychol Sci . 2018 Jan;13(1):3-27. doi: 10.1177/1745691617727864. Epub 2017 Oct 12; Post, J., Narcissism and Politics: Dreams of Glory, New York: Cambridge University Press, 2015; Pouncey, C., President Trump’s Mental Health-Is It Morally Permissible for Psychiatrists to Comment?, New England Journal of Medicine 2018, 378 (5), pp. 405-407).

Skeptic Ginger 12th July 2021 10:47 PM
Listen to Dr Bandy Lee interview on the Damage Report a year ago and see how right she was about Dump. She predicted he would get more desperate to stay in office the closer to the election and that his pathology would infect others.

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Stacyhs 13th July 2021 01:01 AM
She was certainly right! Trump's pathology has spread to millions of people and we see it in members of Congress like MTG, Boebert, Gaetz, Gosar, Meadows, Johnson, etc. They're delusional, too.

Delvo 14th July 2021 07:54 PM
The mental illness of Trumpism since the election has become the perfect demonstration of what I figure is the origin of Christianity: the followers of a real guy who actually existed but spectacularly failed & lost had to come up with some way to say it secretly hadn't really happened.

ZiprHead 15th July 2021 10:06 AM
Exclusive: Documents suggest Russia launched secret multi-agency effort to interfere in US democracy

Quote:
Vladimir Putin personally authorised a secret spy agency operation to support a “mentally unstable” Donald Trump in the 2016 US presidential election during a closed session of Russia’s national security council, according to what are assessed to be leaked Kremlin documents.
..

jimbob 15th July 2021 11:41 AM
Shh. That's probably a violation of professional ethics... :rolleyes:

It has been pointed out that governments use psychological profiling of other governmental leaders, and police forces, for example hostage negotiators, also do similar. Again this is presumably considered invalid by some in this thread.

Skeptic Ginger 15th July 2021 11:43 AM
Not surprised to hear that Putin knew full well Dump was mentally ill. Putin surely knew something about Dump from his wanting to build a Dump Towers there and from the Miss Universe contest.

Putin is not stupid so there is no way he missed it. Maybe he even encouraged Dump to act on his claim he could be POTUS.

jimbob 15th July 2021 11:49 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger (Post 13538624)
Not surprised to hear that Putin knew full well Dump was mentally ill. Putin surely knew something about Dump from his wanting to build a Dump Towers there and from the Miss Universe contest.

Putin is not stupid catatonic so there is no way he missed it. Maybe he even encouraged Dump to act on his claim he could be POTUS.

Not a correction, but something that would work just as well.

Stacyhs 15th July 2021 11:55 AM
This does not surprise me at all. As said, Putin is not stupid and he could see how mentally unstable Trump was and is. From the article:


Quote:
There is a brief psychological assessment of Trump, who is described as an “impulsive, mentally unstable and unbalanced individual who suffers from an inferiority complex”.

And right on cue, Trump reinforces that assessment:

Quote:
Later, Liz Harrington, his spokesperson, issued a statement on his behalf.

“This is disgusting. It’s fake news, just like RUSSIA, RUSSIA, RUSSIA was fake news. It’s just the Radical Left crazies doing whatever they can to demean everybody on the right.

“It’s fiction, and nobody was tougher on Russia than me, including on the pipeline, and sanctions. At the same time we got along with Russia. Russia respected us, China respected us, Iran respected us, North Korea respected us.

“And the world was a much safer place than it is now with mentally unstable leadership.”
That last line is pure irony.

Stacyhs 16th July 2021 03:52 PM
It's being reported that Trump was being encouraged to strike Iran after the election.
[quote]
Quote:
Former prime minister Benjamin Netanyahu urged Donald Trump to launch a military strike against Iran after it was clear that the former US president had lost the 2020 election, a report said Thursday.

General Mark Milley, the chairman of the US Joint Chiefs of Staff, battled to prevent Trump from ordering a strike against Iran, while the president was circled by hawks, including Netanyahu, pressuring him to execute such a strike, according to a report Thursday by the New Yorker.

Other foreign policy advisers, including then-vice president Mike Pence, also reportedly pushed for military action against Iran.

When Milley asked why they were so intent on attacking the Iranians, at a meeting where Trump was not present, Pence replied: “Because they are evil.”
Quote:
“In the months after the election, with Trump seemingly willing to do anything to stay in power, the subject of Iran was repeatedly raised in White House meetings with the President, and Milley repeatedly argued against a strike,” the New Yorker piece reported. Milley “was worried that Trump might set in motion a full-scale conflict that was not justified. Trump had a circle of Iran hawks around him,” it said, and Netanyahu “was also urging the Administration to act against Iran after it was clear that Trump had lost the election. ‘If you do this, you’re gonna have a ******* war,’ Milley would say.”
https://www.timesofisrael.com/netany...n-loss-report/

Thank goodness for Milley.

Skeptic Ginger 16th July 2021 07:15 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stacyhs (Post 13540178)
It's being reported that Trump was being encouraged to strike Iran after the election.
Quote:
https://www.timesofisrael.com/netany...n-loss-report/

Thank goodness for Milley.
And thank goodness Dump probably knew deep down that he was not competent to order such a strike. I'm guessing it is not as simple as wishing it so. Dump would have needed someone like Millie to actually carry it out.

bruto 16th July 2021 09:16 PM
On this general subject, it seems that most of the recent attempts by the Republicans to curtail voting rights and invalidate fair elections and disenfranchise minorities are based, at least to a great extent, on Trump's "big lie" about voter fraud. I'm wondering how far down the toilet American democracy will have to go before some of the naysayers here might reconsider whether his delusions are, in fact, dangerous.

mgidm86 17th July 2021 04:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by bruto (Post 13540388)
On this general subject, it seems that most of the recent attempts by the Republicans to curtail voting rights and invalidate fair elections and disenfranchise minorities are based, at least to a great extent, on Trump's "big lie" about voter fraud. I'm wondering how far down the toilet American democracy will have to go before some of the naysayers here might reconsider whether his delusions are, in fact, dangerous.

I'm not sure we've ever been in a more dangerous place.

Stacyhs 21st July 2021 11:00 PM
During a recent interview, Trump blamed his election loss on voting dead people and illegal immigrants and on bad judges (including the ones he appointed). All 86 of them. The man is NUTS.

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I AGREE

zorro99 22nd July 2021 05:10 AM
Audio: Trump says he spoke to a ‘loving crowd’ at Jan. 6 rally

The former president described the atmosphere on Jan. 6 as largely friendly and peaceful in exclusive interview for the new book ‘I Alone Can Fix It.’

When former president Donald Trump sat down for an interview in late March at his Mar-a-Lago Club in Palm Beach, Fla., he described the events of Jan. 6 as largely peaceful and his supporters as friendly, saying the audience he addressed at a rally on the Ellipse before the attack on the U.S. Capitol was a “loving crowd.”

https://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...ne-can-fix-it/

zorro99 22nd July 2021 05:17 AM
Listen to the audio clips in the above link. Among other things, he says. Indians were paid to cast votes. The man belongs in a home.

Belz... 22nd July 2021 05:54 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mgidm86 (Post 13541198)
I'm not sure we've ever been in a more dangerous place.
1860.

The Great Zaganza 22nd July 2021 06:20 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by zorro99 (Post 13545876)
Listen to the audio clips in the above link. Among other things, he says. Indians were paid to cast votes. The man belongs in a home.
yeah, but which home would accept him?

mgidm86 22nd July 2021 03:38 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Belz... (Post 13545899)
1860.
Since then ;)

Besides, I said "we", and I wasn't there, so... :p

And it could be worse, as in I'm not sure the good guys will win this time.

Captain_Swoop 22nd July 2021 04:43 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by zorro99 (Post 13545876)
Listen to the audio clips in the above link. Among other things, he says. Indians were paid to cast votes. The man belongs in a home.
Half way round the globe to vote?

How much were they paid?

RecoveringYuppy 22nd July 2021 06:33 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain_Swoop (Post 13546562)
Half way round the globe to vote?
Mail in votes. Duh.

Bob001 13th August 2021 08:21 AM
Mary Trump doesn't like Mitch McConnell, either.
Quote:
Mary Trump called her uncle the "weakest man" she's ever known — and compared Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell, R-Ky., to Robert E. Lee.

The twice-impeached one-term president's niece published a lengthy essay in The New Republic laying out her concerns that Donald Trump and his Republican allies were dead set on establishing a white supremacist minority rule over the U.S., and explained what was necessary to prevent that.
https://www.salon.com/2021/08/13/mar...e-lee_partner/
https://newrepublic.com/article/1631...gainst-america

Stacyhs 13th August 2021 06:32 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob001 (Post 13569047)
That is one hell of an article and I agree with everything she says. The more I know of Mary Trump, the more I wonder how Trump and she could come from the same family.

theprestige 13th August 2021 06:46 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stacyhs (Post 13569856)
That is one hell of an article and I agree with everything she says. The more I know of Mary Trump, the more I wonder how Trump and she could come from the same family.
Try looking at it the other way around. They come from the same family. Donald found an eager audience for his lies. What did Mary find?

Stacyhs 13th August 2021 06:55 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by theprestige (Post 13569868)
Try looking at it the other way around. They come from the same family. Donald found an eager audience for his lies. What did Mary find?
If all Mary had wanted was attention, she would have spoken up before and during the 2016 campaign. She didn't. Try again.

theprestige 13th August 2021 06:59 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stacyhs (Post 13569878)
If all Mary had wanted was attention, she would have spoken up before and during the 2016 campaign. She didn't. Try again.
Nobody said anything about attention. Start with eager audience and try again.

Stacyhs 13th August 2021 07:02 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by theprestige (Post 13569883)
Nobody said anything about attention. Start with eager audience and try again.
I know I'm going to regret this but...stop beating around the bush and just come out say what you want to say.

xjx388 13th August 2021 07:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by theprestige (Post 13569883)
Nobody said anything about attention. Start with eager audience and try again.

It’s her turn to profit off the Trump name!

Stacyhs 13th August 2021 07:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by xjx388 (Post 13569891)
It’s her turn to profit off the Trump name!
Oh, for crying out loud. She could have done that a lot earlier if that's what she was all about.

Ladewig 13th August 2021 08:33 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by xjx388 (Post 13569891)
It’s her turn to profit off the Trump name!
Then I say raise your glasses and join me in a toast. “May she be the last one ever.”


…..
I was just kidding. I reallly don’t think attention and money are her prime motivations.

Bob001 13th August 2021 09:21 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by theprestige (Post 13569868)
Try looking at it the other way around. They come from the same family. Donald found an eager audience for his lies. What did Mary find?
An audience for the truth.

Bob001 13th August 2021 09:22 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by xjx388 (Post 13569891)
It’s her turn to profit off the Trump name!
But she's doing it by honest work, a first for that family.

Bob001 13th August 2021 09:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ladewig (Post 13569945)
Then I say raise your glasses and join me in a toast. “May she be the last one ever.”


…..
I was just kidding. I reallly don’t think attention and money are her prime motivations.
She pretty clearly is horrified, professionally and personally, that this lunatic she has known all her life could have become President.

dann 13th August 2021 10:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stacyhs (Post 13545732)
During a recent interview, Trump blamed his election loss on voting dead people and illegal immigrants and on bad judges (including the ones he appointed). All 86 of them. The man is NUTS.

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I AGREE

That can't be true!
"Trump Promised He’d Only Hire ‘The Best People.’"
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Skeptic Ginger 13th August 2021 10:39 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob001 (Post 13569971)
She pretty clearly is horrified, professionally and personally, that this lunatic she has known all her life could have become President.
I have heard her speak in these interviews many times and I'm convinced this ^ is her motivation.


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