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-   -   How do psychic mediums know stuff about you (http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=338417)

AmyW 23rd August 2019 03:27 AM

How do psychic mediums know stuff about you
 
Hello All,

I have been speaking with a medium who said she has a message to give me from my mum. I don't know how she knew my mum has passed away.
I am a skeptic but how can they know things about you when they haven't met you?
She also said that she is an evidential medium and can give me evidence by giving me a message that only me and my mum would know.... pretty freaked out.

abaddon 23rd August 2019 03:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AmyW (Post 12796226)
Hello All,

I have been speaking with a medium who said she has a message to give me from my mum. I don't know how she knew my mum has passed away.
I am a skeptic but how can they know things about you when they haven't met you?
She also said that she is an evidential medium and can give me evidence by giving me a message that only me and my mum would know.... pretty freaked out.

Google cold reading, warm reading and hot reading. They are all standard methods.

It's a trick. That is all.

AmyW 23rd August 2019 04:44 AM

Thank you :-)
This is what the medium emailed to me .... Can this really be true -

Hi Amy ,*

Every reading I give to a client has evidential information . I know one thing for sure . When my mom passed I asked my friend who is a medium to connect with her on several occasions.. I asked my mom to give her specific info through my friend . My mom would not give her the info . Although there was a lot of evidential info that only me and my mom knew . What I am trying to say is you may not get the exact memory you are asking for , but there definitely will be evidential message so you will know it is her .l can guarantee that there will be evidence . If for some reason after 10 minutes I would give you a full refund . Sorry , but I will not give you a reading before payment . Your mom knows we need evidence when I start the reading and that’s what she will do . I am like a telephone.. I listen to what spirit says and I repeat it to you . Think about it and if you want a phone reading pay online on my website*judithannepsychiedium.com*

Dave Rogers 23rd August 2019 04:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AmyW (Post 12796257)
Thank you :-)
This is what the medium emailed to me .... Can this really be true -

Hi Amy ,*

Every reading I give to a client has evidential information . I know one thing for sure . When my mom passed I asked my friend who is a medium to connect with her on several occasions.. I asked my mom to give her specific info through my friend . My mom would not give her the info . Although there was a lot of evidential info that only me and my mom knew . What I am trying to say is you may not get the exact memory you are asking for , but there definitely will be evidential message so you will know it is her .l can guarantee that there will be evidence . If for some reason after 10 minutes I would give you a full refund . Sorry , but I will not give you a reading before payment . Your mom knows we need evidence when I start the reading and that’s what she will do . I am like a telephone.. I listen to what spirit says and I repeat it to you . Think about it and if you want a phone reading pay online on my website*judithannepsychiedium.com*

No, it can't. Look at what she's doing here; she's saying that at some point during the session she will pass on something to you that you are able to interpret as significant and related to something only your mother and you would know. She's therefore preparing the ground for ten minutes of carefully worded generalisations, with the aim that you'll find that at least one of them is related to something more specific. When she does hit on something, she'll start suggesting more and more detail, glossing over the bits that you reject and emphasising the bits you recognise; in effect, she'll be playing a game of 20 questions with you, but in a way that obscures the fact that you're the one supplying the answers.

As for how she knew your mother had passed away, do you have a Facebook page?

As with so many things, there are some simple starting points on Wikipedia; the articles on cold reading, hot reading and the Barnum effect are good starts, and they include links to more rigorous sources. There are a wide range of tricks employed by psychics to make it appear they know things they could not possibly know.

I think this thread would be better suited to the "General Skepticism and The Paranormal" sub-section of the forum, so I'm going to suggest a thread move.

Dave

AmyW 23rd August 2019 05:02 AM

Thanks Dave. This was her original email -
Does this sound like a prediction or just a general statement? Yes I am on Facebook but she doesn't know my full name.
Hi Amy ,*

One more thing . If I am connecting with a loved one who has past I ask them to give me some specific info so there is no doubt who is coming through . So if your mom. were in spirit and she wanted to come through she would need to give some kind of evidence that only you and her would know .

* * * * *Sincerely ,

* * * * * * * * * *Judith Anne*

3point14 23rd August 2019 05:05 AM

This person wants your money. That's all.

Dave Rogers 23rd August 2019 05:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AmyW (Post 12796269)
Thanks Dave. This was her original email -
Does this sound like a prediction or just a general statement? Yes I am on Facebook but she doesn't know my full name.
Hi Amy ,*

One more thing . If I am connecting with a loved one who has past I ask them to give me some specific info so there is no doubt who is coming through . So if your mom. were in spirit and she wanted to come through she would need to give some kind of evidence that only you and her would know .

* * * * *Sincerely ,

* * * * * * * * * *Judith Anne*

She's already prepared the ground for this by saying that the specific info won't be anything you ask for. She can therefore simply use a shotgun approach, home in on anything that gets close to a hit by asking yes/no questions and claiming a hit either way ("Was your father there too? No? Ah, yes, she says he wasn't there as well" is a typical approach), and end up leaving you thinking she's given you information, when in fact you've given it to her.

Dave

Darat 23rd August 2019 05:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AmyW (Post 12796257)
Thank you :-)
This is what the medium emailed to me .... Can this really be true -

Hi Amy ,*

Every reading I give to a client has evidential information . I know one thing for sure . When my mom passed I asked my friend who is a medium to connect with her on several occasions.. I asked my mom to give her specific info through my friend . My mom would not give her the info . Although there was a lot of evidential info that only me and my mom knew . What I am trying to say is you may not get the exact memory you are asking for , but there definitely will be evidential message so you will know it is her .l can guarantee that there will be evidence . If for some reason after 10 minutes I would give you a full refund . Sorry , but I will not give you a reading before payment . Your mom knows we need evidence when I start the reading and that’s what she will do . I am like a telephone.. I listen to what spirit says and I repeat it to you . Think about it and if you want a phone reading pay online on my website*judithannepsychiedium.com*

As Dave says above she is preparing the ground for a typical reading.

If you go ahead with it I would suggest you record the reading. During a reading, especially one you will be emotionally involved in we often underestimate the the number of things the psychic got wrong and place emphasis on the things we think they got right. It's human nature and that is what most psychics rely on. An example I once saw was someone who said the psychic had only mentioned about 6 names during a reading, on the recording of the reading it was nearer 40 names they threw out!

You may also be amazed at how much information you provided the psychic. If you can manage it simple use yes or no answers.

When you think about it if the psychic is communicating with the spirit why does the psychic have to ask you anything? She is only conveying what she "hears", remember according to her she is just a telephone.

3point14 23rd August 2019 05:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darat (Post 12796275)
You may also be amazed at how much information you provided the psychic. If you can manage it simple use yes or no answers.


Even then body language will give away a bucketload. During the "It begins with a 'd', no, a 'b' or maybe an 'f'" routine it's really difficult not to let it show in your face when one of the scattergun 'facts' hits.

wea 23rd August 2019 05:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AmyW (Post 12796257)
.. you may not get the exact memory you are asking for , but ... I will not give you a reading before payment .

just a little more polite than "I'm swindling you"

Wudang 23rd August 2019 05:29 AM

If you'd like an easier read try Chris Brookmyre's "Attack of the Unsinkable Rubber Ducks". In it he describes some of the techniques used.

n.b Adult language, violence etc.

Darat 23rd August 2019 05:33 AM

The best book is still Ian Rowland's Full Facts of Cold Reading.

AmyW 23rd August 2019 05:36 AM

Thanks guys, I am a definite skeptic but these kinds of emails freak me out... like how did she know. Do you think her second email -
If I am connecting with a loved one who has past I ask them to give me some specific info so there is no doubt who is coming through . So if your mom. were in spirit and she wanted to come through she would need to give some kind of evidence that only you and her would know .*
Is she just suggesting that she thinks my mum had passed (guessing) but isn't saying for a fact my mum has passed?

AmyW 23rd August 2019 05:37 AM

Thanks Dara I'll get that book :-)

Scorpion 23rd August 2019 05:47 AM

There is a telephone psychic on twitter, and I tweeted her asking if I could reverse the charges.

Finster 23rd August 2019 05:54 AM

As far as the initial email and knowing your mother has passed - she probably sends out thousands of emails - some percentage of them will have dead relatives. She could also buy marketing lists of people over a certain age to increase the percentage. (That's the easiest most likely but there are other ways too)

Shrinker 23rd August 2019 05:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AmyW (Post 12796269)
Thanks Dave. This was her original email -
Does this sound like a prediction or just a general statement? Yes I am on Facebook but she doesn't know my full name.
Hi Amy ,*

One more thing . If I am connecting with a loved one who has past I ask them to give me some specific info so there is no doubt who is coming through . So if your mom. were in spirit and she wanted to come through she would need to give some kind of evidence that only you and her would know .

* * * * *Sincerely ,

* * * * * * * * * *Judith Anne*

She didn’t say your mom died. Read it again carefully. Imagine you mom was still alive. How would you interpret what she said? You’d probably just take it as an example scenario and barely notice it at all.

She will also have been watching your reaction. if you replied with any surprise or amazement she’d double down on the dead mother routine and try to tease more out of you. If you didn’t react she’d try another gambit to see if it was your father you were interested in.

JoeMorgue 23rd August 2019 05:58 AM

- Cold reading
- Hot reading
- "Horoscoping" (Telling you stuff that is so vague that it applies to everyone.)
- Lying when they know they aren't going to be called on it because the person wants to "play along" for some reason.
- Having the person they are "reading" in on it when there's an audience/3rd party watching.
- Making educated cases based on demographics and pure probability.
- Depending on the person they are reading to demonstrate confirmation bias.

BStrong 23rd August 2019 06:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AmyW (Post 12796257)
Thank you :-)
This is what the medium emailed to me .... Can this really be true -

Hi Amy ,*

Every reading I give to a client has evidential information . I know one thing for sure . When my mom passed I asked my friend who is a medium to connect with her on several occasions.. I asked my mom to give her specific info through my friend . My mom would not give her the info . Although there was a lot of evidential info that only me and my mom knew . What I am trying to say is you may not get the exact memory you are asking for , but there definitely will be evidential message so you will know it is her .l can guarantee that there will be evidence . If for some reason after 10 minutes I would give you a full refund . Sorry , but I will not give you a reading before payment . Your mom knows we need evidence when I start the reading and that’s what she will do . I am like a telephone.. I listen to what spirit says and I repeat it to you . Think about it and if you want a phone reading pay online on my website*judithannepsychiedium.com*

Cherish your memories of your mother and get the hell away from this con-artist as fast as possible.

JoeMorgue 23rd August 2019 06:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BStrong (Post 12796362)
Cherish your memories of your mother and get the hell away from this con-artist as fast as possible.

It's times like this that I feel that Penn Jillett's words from the pilot episode of Penn & Teller's B.S. where they discussed the whole "Talking to dead" psychic thing are appropriate. (Language cleaned up.)

Quote:

Before we bust up this party, and God dammit we're gonna bust it up, we have to make it very clear where our hearts are. We have nothing but empathy for the people who are experiencing the loss and grief of the death of a loved one. That guy who lost his mom rips my heart out. I'm a momma's boy whose mom died a couple of years ago, and I'll never get over it, and my dad died at around the same time, and I was very close to both of them. I loved them so much there isn't a moment that goes by that I don't miss them. Houdini didn't really go nuts busting these mediums until he lost his mom. Once you've felt that pure grief, seeing it exploited can take away your sense of humor.

Once a loved one has died, all we have is our memories of them. There is nothing more precious to me than my memories of my mom and dad. We don't give a rat's [butt] about the money these bastards are taking from the grief stricken; what we do care about deeply is the desecration of memories. These "performance artists" are, in a very real sense, mother-[censored]ers. That poor guy's grieving memories of his mother are now all [messed] up by somebody else's images. All he will ever have left of his mom are memories, and this pig has pissed on those for a buck and a little un-earned fame. I'm sure these lame [censored] tell themselves that they're easing the grief, but skits for money can not replace loving memories. How low do you have to be to exploit someone's true grief to sell some bull[censored] book?

One of the weird things Houdini discovered is that some of these mediums actually slip into believing their own bull. They forget their own misses, or as John Edward, the Biggest Douche in the Universe, does, rewrite them as hits that we're just not able to recognize. Cold reading can be done accidentally. That doesn't mean the psychic is a better person. Lying to themselves does not make lying to others OK. It can make intellectually lazy scumbags more convincing and dangerous. But even if these [censored] know they're just making this [stuff] up and pushing people's buttons, they tell themselves, "At least I'm comforting the bereaved." Who are they to decide that lying about the universe and a dead loved one is what the bereaved needs!? That's condescending bull!

AmyW 23rd August 2019 07:05 AM

Thanks people. Do some psychics truly believe they have powers? It's utter BS

3point14 23rd August 2019 07:33 AM

There's a series of vids from Derren Brown. I've not watched them but I'm pretty confident they'll pain an accurate picture of what 'cold reading' is.


https://coldreadingworld.com/derren-brown-cold-reading/

Ricardo 23rd August 2019 08:02 AM

you can't generalize ... not everything is cold reading ... this is evidence of the existence of spirits

Dave Rogers 23rd August 2019 08:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ricardo (Post 12796443)
you can't generalize ... not everything is cold reading ... this is evidence of the existence of spirits

Wrong. The techniques are well-known and clearly in evidence from the e-mails AmyW has quoted. There have been well-documented experimental verifications in which fraudulent psychics relayed fabricated messages from the spirit world. The rational conclusion is that there is no credible evidence that people are able to communicate with the living after their death.

Dave

8enotto 23rd August 2019 08:14 AM

Another Penn and Teller sage advice item. When all else fails. - Follow the money.

Judith has contacted you and a few dozen others with a message from possibly dead mom or dad, she can't be sure yet. But her possible fuzzy message is a way to use a lot of words to not say anything at all.

If you want to know whatever it is contact Judith and pay the fee up front, play a machine gun paced game of 21,000 questions ( not give the mark time to think ) and feed her all the information she needs to tell you about possibly dead mom or dad.


Follow your money. She has it and you got told her version of what you already knew. Good deal for half an hours work.

One in Georga, USA will talk to your dearly loved deceased dog for 500 bucks. She doesn't even have to guess if it's mom or dad. And dogs being predictable creatures a narrow range of activities yo guess.

AmyW 23rd August 2019 08:22 AM

Do you think some mediums might have a mental illness as some claim to hear the dead.... is this delusional thinking? Hearing voices like a schizophrenic?

Czarcasm 23rd August 2019 08:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AmyW (Post 12796303)
Thanks guys, I am a definite skeptic but these kinds of emails freak me out... like how did she know. Do you think her second email -
If I am connecting with a loved one who has past I ask them to give me some specific info so there is no doubt who is coming through . So if your mom. were in spirit and she wanted to come through she would need to give some kind of evidence that only you and her would know .*
Is she just suggesting that she thinks my mum had passed (guessing) but isn't saying for a fact my mum has passed?

How much information is available about you and your loved ones on Facebook, LinkedIn, various message boards? This "medium" has had enough time to do enough research about you that she probably knows things that you don't remember any more. If she actually revealed anything of substance(doubtful), then I am betting that any of us here could find out the same information online.

Czarcasm 23rd August 2019 08:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AmyW (Post 12796462)
Do you think some mediums might have a mental illness as some claim to hear the dead.... is this delusional thinking? Hearing voices like a schizophrenic?

Is she doing this for free? If not-then there's your answer.

Segnosaur 23rd August 2019 08:29 AM

If you want something a bit lighter and more fun than reading a book or a bunch of Wikipedia entries, might I suggest watching the Season 6 episode of South Park called "The Biggest Douche in the Universe".

In that episode, the kids from the show meet John Edwards (who, if you didn't know, is/was a fairly famous psychic; even had his own TV show.) One of them becomes convinced that John Edwards really did give a message from a deceased relative, but another is skeptical, and learns how to do "cold readings".

Although the episode focused on John Edwards, the tricks that he uses can be applied to most/all psychics (including the one you mentioned in the opening post who had a message from your 'mother').

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Bi...n_the_Universe

Segnosaur 23rd August 2019 08:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AmyW (Post 12796462)
Do you think some mediums might have a mental illness as some claim to hear the dead.... is this delusional thinking? Hearing voices like a schizophrenic?

Some might have some sort of mental illness, but I suspect for the vast majority, the chief motivation is either financial, or an attempt to get undeserved attention/fame.

The Greater Fool 23rd August 2019 08:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AmyW (Post 12796462)
Do you think some mediums might have a mental illness as some claim to hear the dead.... is this delusional thinking? Hearing voices like a schizophrenic?

One schizophrenic has already responded in this thread in favor of spirits.

epeeist 23rd August 2019 08:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slythe (Post 12796467)
Is she doing this for free? If not-then there's your answer.

Quote:

Originally Posted by AmyW (Post 12796462)
Do you think some mediums might have a mental illness as some claim to hear the dead.... is this delusional thinking? Hearing voices like a schizophrenic?

Not about mediums per se, but even some people who genuinely believe things that are provably false, charge for their time (or would if people were willing to pay them). Just like people who genuinely believe things that are true do. A physicist might well charge for their time giving a talk on physicist, doesn't mean they don't believe what they're talking about. Likewise a so-called psychic who believed they had a gift might seek to make a living that way. Or dowser, or faith healer, or whatever.

I agree that odds are that most people making a living this way are probably not deluded believers but fraudsters. But assuming 100% are seems an unwarranted assumption to me, I've read about a few who do seem to have had belief in what they were peddling. That makes them wrong, mistaken, maybe even dangerous, but they're not liars.

Dave Rogers 23rd August 2019 08:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by epeeist (Post 12796476)
A physicist might well charge for their time giving a talk on physicist, doesn't mean they don't believe what they're talking about.

...wait, what?

Dave (a physicist)

alfaniner 23rd August 2019 08:36 AM

Welcome, AmyW to the Forum. You have applied some effective skepticism already, asking many of the right questions.

Some "psychics" think they have a gift and provide their guesswork for free. Some may be genuinely deluded or mentally ill. Most are fully aware that they are charlatans, frauds, and are raping people's memories of their loved ones for money.

There are no true psychics. At least, no one has proven that under reasonable testing conditions.

Armitage72 23rd August 2019 08:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Segnosaur (Post 12796470)
In that episode, the kids from the show meet John Edwards (who, if you didn't know, is/was a fairly famous psychic; even had his own TV show.)


It's worth noting that his TV show was composed of broadcasts of his live shows, which I believe were usually several hours in length. The TV show was an hour, including commercials. I wonder what they edited out to get the proper run time?
My mother used to be amazed by how accurate he was when she saw him on TV. Yeah Mom, that's because they edited out his mistakes and guesses.

Czarcasm 23rd August 2019 08:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AmyW (Post 12796226)
Hello All,

I have been speaking with a medium who said she has a message to give me from my mum. I don't know how she knew my mum has passed away.
I am a skeptic but how can they know things about you when they haven't met you?
She also said that she is an evidential medium and can give me evidence by giving me a message that only me and my mum would know.... pretty freaked out.

I am curious-You call yourself a skeptic, then ask how this medium can know stuff about you when said medium has yet to actually reveal anything of a personal nature yet.

Dave Rogers 23rd August 2019 09:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slythe (Post 12796510)
I am curious-You call yourself a skeptic, then ask how this medium can know stuff about you when said medium has yet to actually reveal anything of a personal nature yet.

That seems a little harsh. The whole modus operandi of psychics is to give the impression of having revealed information of a personal nature without actually having done so. If it were that easy to spot, they'd be fleecing people some other way.

Dave

Segnosaur 23rd August 2019 09:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slythe (Post 12796510)
I am curious-You call yourself a skeptic, then ask how this medium can know stuff about you when said medium has yet to actually reveal anything of a personal nature yet.

She has stated that the psychic new that her mother died. If you're unfamiliar with the techniques of hot/cold reading, then that might seem like its something revealing.

We recognize it as a scam because we've been exposed to it before. Its possible that AmyW has just never had the chance to see how the 'trick' is done.

Ricardo 23rd August 2019 09:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AmyW (Post 12796462)
Do you think some mediums might have a mental illness as some claim to hear the dead.... is this delusional thinking? Hearing voices like a schizophrenic?

not that of schizophrenia is a lie of pseudo-skeptics ...

look for a medium who helps for free ok! free service
look for a spiritist center ... are you from the united states? what city do you live in ... maybe you have a spiritist center in your city?

dann 23rd August 2019 09:32 AM

James Randi: The Art of Cold Reading.


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