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-   -   White House Survivor (http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=321828)

dudalb 29th September 2017 04:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stacko (Post 12013054)
It's weird to see a normal political scandal play out in the normal way. I mean why didn't he just defiantly stay on? That would fit better with what the Trump era has brought us to.

I think he got the word that Trump was going to pull the trigger,and decided to resign to avoid that humiliation.
IMHO it was all about the optics. It was not so much what Price did, but that vioilated the 11th Commandment:Thou Shalt Not Get Caught.
But it is a nice scalp for Politico, which broke the story. I am pretty sure there are asking "How the hell did we miss this" at the WAPO.

Stacko 29th September 2017 04:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dudalb (Post 12013074)
I think he got the word that Trump was going to pull the trigger,and decided to resign to avoid that humiliation.
IMHO it was all about the optics. It was not so much what Price did, but that vioilated the 11th Commandment:Thou Shalt Not Get Caught.
But it is a nice scalp for Politico, which broke the story. I am pretty sure there are asking "How the hell did we miss this" at the WAPO.

Politico also broke the story the prevented Puzder from being appointed. But as their editor said:
someone just said "your reporters brought price down" I said no -- Tom PRice's poor judgment and costly travel brought him down

Skeptic Ginger 29th September 2017 06:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dudalb (Post 12012941)
Devos is safe;she paid for her charter flights out of her own pocket. I dislike her immensely,but will give her credit for that.

She owns the jet. :rolleyes:

DeVos travels "on personally-owned aircraft"

Skeptic Ginger 29th September 2017 06:39 PM

Rachel Maddow had a long list of the people currently on survival island.

Last night's program is on the top playlist but hopefully there'll be a link to tonight's program soon. She listed a half dozen or more with the same abuse of power scandals.

Looks like the VA head has some explaining to do: VA chief took in Wimbledon, river cruise on European work trip; wife’s expenses covered by taxpayers.

I vote David Shulkin the next off the island.

The EPA administrator could be in trouble even though the National Review tried to clear him yesterday: The Scott Pruitt Non-Scandal.

That may not help: EPA inspector general launches probe of Scott Pruitt’s travel costs.

It's not just travel costs. That $25K cone of silence is certainly an eyebrow raiser.

The Don 29th September 2017 11:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by d4m10n (Post 12013043)
Kudos to everyone who had him in the pool.

Personally, I'm shocked to find that anyone in that political party can still be shamed.

Is this really only about the flights or is there some payback for the failed healthcare bills and he resigned before he was fired ?

nvm.....should have read on to dudalb's post :o

Craig4 1st October 2017 04:56 PM

I think Tillerson will resign when he gets back from China. How can he not? Where's the way forward for him after this?

http://www.cnn.com/2017/10/01/politi...rea/index.html

Stacko 4th October 2017 03:57 AM

Tillerson seems like a good bet at this point.

Quote:

Secretary of State Rex Tillerson was on the verge of resigning this past summer amid mounting policy disputes and clashes with the White House, according to multiple senior administration officials who were aware of the situation at the time.

The tensions came to a head around the time President Donald Trump delivered a politicized speech in late July to the Boy Scouts of America, an organization Tillerson once led, the officials said.

Just days earlier, Tillerson had openly disparaged the president, referring to him as a “moron,” after a July 20 meeting at the Pentagon with members of Trump’s national security team and Cabinet officials, according to three officials familiar with the incident.

TheL8Elvis 4th October 2017 06:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Craig4 (Post 12014956)
I think Tillerson will resign when he gets back from China. How can he not? Where's the way forward for him after this?

http://www.cnn.com/2017/10/01/politi...rea/index.html

Agreed. Trump has neutered him and rendered him useless.

The Don 4th October 2017 06:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheL8Elvis (Post 12019311)
Agreed. Trump has neutered him and rendered him useless.

I guess that could be true for any senior member of the Trump Administration. The President seems to make up policy on the hoof which means that any deal that someone has been patiently working on is scuppered when President Trump makes a speech extolling the complete opposite position.

Toontown 4th October 2017 06:38 AM

It is now official. The secretary of state has confirmed that Trump is indeed a "moron".

Which comes as no great surprise. Putin did not select Trump to be our president because he admired Trump's intellect.

d4m10n 4th October 2017 07:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toontown (Post 12019341)
It is now official. The secretary of state has confirmed that Trump is indeed a "moron".

http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slate...ws_report.html

He won't be the first person fired for excessive truth-telling.

***ALL MY CHIPS ON TILLERSON***

Stacko 4th October 2017 07:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by d4m10n (Post 12019420)
http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slate...ws_report.html

He won't be the first person fired for excessive truth-telling.

***ALL MY CHIPS ON TILLERSON***

Tillerson is making a statement at 10:40EDT from the Treaty Room. Topic unknown. We could be getting moron this story.

SOdhner 4th October 2017 07:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by d4m10n (Post 12019420)
***ALL MY CHIPS ON TILLERSON***

Yeah, same here.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stacko (Post 12019431)
Tillerson is making a statement at 10:40EDT from the Treaty Room. Topic unknown. We could be getting moron this story.

I don't see anything yet, fingers crossed he goes off script and quits with some flare.

d4m10n 4th October 2017 07:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stacko (Post 12019431)
Tillerson is making a statement at 10:40EDT from the Treaty Room. Topic unknown. We could be getting moron this story.

[emoji23][emoji23][emoji23]

NoahFence 4th October 2017 07:52 AM

Well the jerk store is running out of YOU!

....I hate when I want to make a joke that someone already made. :(
"Moron" this story.

:dl:

NoahFence 4th October 2017 08:03 AM

Doggone it. He's just giving Trump a gobbie and praising Dear Leader.

TheL8Elvis 4th October 2017 08:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by d4m10n (Post 12019420)
http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slate...ws_report.html

He won't be the first person fired for excessive truth-telling.

***ALL MY CHIPS ON TILLERSON***

Hmmm. Tillerson never considered leaving, and doesn't understand the media "misreporting" everything. Plays the "I'm not from Washington" card.

Honestly, IDK what's doing here.:boggled:

Toontown 4th October 2017 08:09 AM

When directly asked if he called Trump a "moron", Tillerson refused to answer.

From this non-answer we can confidently conclude Tillerson did in fact call Trump a "moron".

We can also confidently conclude Tillerson is not ready to leave yet. We should probably be relieved that Tillerson and a couple of others are hanging around, keeping an eye on Putin's selection.

Stacko 4th October 2017 08:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheL8Elvis (Post 12019479)
Hmmm. Tillerson never considered leaving, and doesn't understand the media "misreporting" everything. Plays the "I'm not from Washington" card.

Honestly, IDK what's doing here.:boggled:

Has he denied calling Trump a moron yet?

TheL8Elvis 4th October 2017 08:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toontown (Post 12019489)
When directly asked if he called Trump a "moron", Tillerson refused to answer.

From this non-answer we can confidently conclude Tillerson did in fact call Trump a "moron".

We can also confidently conclude Tillerson is not ready to leave yet.

It appears that way, but I would like more information on WHY.

ETA: I don't believe him when he makes noises like it's love of country, duty etc

Stacko 4th October 2017 08:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheL8Elvis (Post 12019494)
It appears that way, but I would like more information on WHY.

A public health service. Think of the damage of the eye rolling at, "Can Secretary of State Nikki Haley save the GOP," columns would induce. That could cause some strains.

Doubt 4th October 2017 08:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by d4m10n (Post 12019420)
http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slate...ws_report.html

He won't be the first person fired for excessive truth-telling.

***ALL MY CHIPS ON TILLERSON***

Just saw the CNN scroll stating that "Trump aware that Tillerson called him a moron".

I think Rex will be gone by Monday.

Stacko 4th October 2017 08:27 AM

On NBC, @SRuhle clarifies that her source says Tillerson didn’t just say moron — “he said ****** moron"
:p

Armitage72 4th October 2017 08:30 AM

Mattis is publicly questioning Trump's judgment. He'd better be careful.

Quote:

Secretary of Defense James Mattis said Tuesday that he believes it is in US national security interest to remain in the Iran nuclear agreement despite repeated hints from President Donald Trump that he is inclined to scrap the deal.
During a hearing before the Senate Armed Services Committee, Sen. Angus King asked Mattis: "Do you believe it is in our national security interest at the present time to remain in the (Joint Comprehensive Plan of Action)? That is a yes or no question."
Mattis replied, "Yes, senator, I do."

"The point I would make is if we can confirm that Iran is living by the agreement, if we can determine that this is in our best interests then clearly we should stay with it," Mattis added. "I believe at this point in time absent indications to the contrary, it is something the President should consider staying with."

Trump said that it's a terrible deal that we should get out of at the first opportunity. How dare he disagree.

phiwum 4th October 2017 08:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by d4m10n (Post 12019420)
http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slate...ws_report.html

He won't be the first person fired for excessive truth-telling.

***ALL MY CHIPS ON TILLERSON***

Well, yes, but you can't expect much return on what seems a near certainty.

d4m10n 4th October 2017 08:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doubt (Post 12019519)
Just saw the CNN scroll stating that "Trump aware that Tillerson called him a moron".

I saw that one too. ;)

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...27bc99a8b9.jpg

The Great Zaganza 4th October 2017 09:19 AM

The problem for Trump is not that Tillerson called him a *********** moron - that can be handled with enough sweet-talk.
But that it has become public knowledge makes Trump think it will make him look weak.

jimbob 4th October 2017 09:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza (Post 12019623)
The problem for Trump is not that Tillerson called him a *********** moron - that can be handled with enough sweet-talk.
But that it has become public knowledge makes Trump think it will make him look weak.

That was what I was thinking.

Especially with the very public non-denial.

Trebuchet 4th October 2017 09:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheL8Elvis (Post 12019479)
Hmmm. Tillerson never considered leaving, and doesn't understand the media "misreporting" everything. Plays the "I'm not from Washington" card.

Honestly, IDK what's doing here.:boggled:

Haven't most of the previous WH evacuees made similar statements right before leaving? I'm pretty sure Spicer did.

Toontown 4th October 2017 09:43 AM

Of course. Precision requires the asterisk- laden adjective.

Presumably Tillerson was chosen for the SoS position in part because of his verbal precision.

d4m10n 4th October 2017 11:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phiwum (Post 12019565)
Well, yes, but you can't expect much return on what seems a near certainty.

https://www.predictit.org/Contract/8123#data

jimbob 4th October 2017 03:03 PM

Of course the most notorious tweeter has already produced a tweet for every occasion


https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/...780480/photo/1

From 2014

ETA you have to click on the photo to see the caption in all its glory :D

Craig4 4th October 2017 04:32 PM

Tillerson is now a little prison date. His one chance to save any self-respect was to resign after he got undercut by the president while he was in China.

Trebuchet 4th October 2017 05:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jimbob (Post 12020204)
Of course the most notorious tweeter has already produced a tweet for every occasion


https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/...780480/photo/1

From 2014

ETA you have to click on the photo to see the caption in all its glory :D

And even then it can get covered up, so here's the caption:
"I keep thinking that we should include something in this constitution in case the people elect a *********** moron."

dudalb 4th October 2017 06:28 PM

Tillerson's creditbility as S.O.S with other countries is pretty much shot after this tiff.
I don't think his penance today will save him. I suspect he will be gone before Halloween.

dudalb 4th October 2017 06:33 PM

Not sure it qualifies as a White House Casuality but Tim Murphy , GOP congressman from Pennsylvania, will not run for relection after he, a hardline anti abortion leader, was caught.via texting, urging his mistress to get an abortion.
In a year full of hypocrisy, this one stands out.

quadraginta 4th October 2017 06:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dudalb (Post 12020469)
Tillerson's creditbility as S.O.S with other countries is pretty much shot after this tiff.
I don't think his penance today will save him. I suspect he will be gone before Halloween.


And that is only one effect.

More importantly, I think, is that the credibility of any SecState under Trump is now pretty much shot with other countries.

They know that Trump will cheerfully contradict anything his official Secretary of State says in a heartbeat, without hesitation, whenever it suits him.

That doesn't do much for credibility no matter who has the job.

quadraginta 4th October 2017 07:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dudalb (Post 12020472)
Not sure it qualifies as a White House Casuality but Tim Murphy , GOP congressman from Pennsylvania, will not run for relection after he, a hardline anti abortion leader, was caught.via texting, urging his mistress to get an abortion.
In a year full of hypocrisy, this one stands out.


Color me surprised. That's actually more integrity than I have come to expect from the average GOP pol. Usually they just claim to be "saved", beg for forgiveness, and go back to work with the enthusiastic support of the people who voted them in before.

(This option is not available to Democrats, of course, since they aren't ever "real" Christians.)

Darth Rotor 4th October 2017 08:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheL8Elvis (Post 12019494)
It appears that way, but I would like more information on WHY.

ETA: I don't believe him when he makes noises like it's love of country, duty etc

Why do you hate America?

@Quad
Quote:

This option is not available to Democrats, of course, since they aren't ever "real" Christians.
Sez you. Are you qualified to make that assessment? If so, would you care to establish your bona fides? 'Round where I live, quite a few very liberal people are very vocal Democrats and Christians.

NoahFence 4th October 2017 08:07 PM

Corker says that Tillerson, Mattis and Kelly are the only thing that keeps us from total chaos. That's probably why he's sticking around.


But...emails!

PhantomWolf 4th October 2017 08:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darth Rotor (Post 12020572)
Why do you hate America?

@Quad

Sez you. Are you qualified to make that assessment? If so, would you care to establish your bona fides? 'Round where I live, quite a few very liberal people are very vocal Democrats and Christians.

If they are liberals they are faking it, and are likely to really be a secret Muslim, or worse one of those atheists! Just ask any "true Conservative."

Toontown 5th October 2017 06:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NoahFence (Post 12020577)
Corker says that Tillerson, Mattis and Kelly are the only thing that keeps us from total chaos. That's probably why he's sticking around.


But...emails!

But Kelly Ann Conway spun that as protecting us from the chaos in the external world.

I think she is a True Believer. Trump has her mesmerized with his Caring Nurturer act. Plus the fact that he pays her $1000 a word to chatter like a demented magpie on TV.

The Great Zaganza 5th October 2017 06:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toontown (Post 12021028)
I think she is a True Believer.

Maybe.

Sunken Cost and Stockholm Syndrome are a powerful combination.

But more importantly, Conway is the last high-ranking asset of the Mercer family in the Trump administration, after Bannon had to go. It is them who pay her, no Trump.

Craig4 5th October 2017 05:04 PM

Tillerson should have resigned instead of going to the Whitehouse tonight. It's going to be the difference between being a martyr for his country and a little bitch.

d4m10n 5th October 2017 05:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Craig4 (Post 12022132)
Tillerson should have resigned instead of going to the Whitehouse tonight. It's going to be the difference between being a martyr for his country and a little bitch.

Tillerson has a moral duty to stay for so long as he sincerely believes he can help avert war on the peninsula.

Stacko 5th October 2017 06:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Craig4 (Post 12022132)
Tillerson should have resigned instead of going to the Whitehouse tonight. It's going to be the difference between being a martyr for his country and a little bitch.

Resignations are a Friday activity in this administration (Spicer, Priebus, Bannon, Price).

Trebuchet 5th October 2017 06:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by d4m10n (Post 12022214)
Tillerson has a moral duty to stay for so long as he sincerely believes he can help avert war on the peninsula.

Wellington ended the Peninsular War over 250 years ago! Oh, you mean the Korean peninsula. That war has never officially ended since 1952.

Seriously, if Tillerson can pull that off he's doing well. Trump has seemed pretty determined to have "Fire and Fury". At the moment he's mostly interested in "Fake News" reporting what's actually happening in Puerto Rico, but he's got the attention span of a gnat.

quadraginta 5th October 2017 08:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by d4m10n (Post 12022214)
Quote:

Originally Posted by Craig4 (Post 12022132)
Tillerson should have resigned instead of going to the Whitehouse tonight. It's going to be the difference between being a martyr for his country and a little bitch.

Tillerson has a moral duty to stay for so long as he sincerely believes he can help avert war on the peninsula.


I see.

A deluded little bitch?

Problem is that you are working on the premise that there is any morality there to begin with.

Trump's Cabinet is comprised of people who agreed to be Trump subordinates in full knowledge of his character and track record.

Being that (for whatever faults they might have) they are not stupid ... or blind ... there is no way that they could not know that Trump would ignore, contradict, and humiliate them at any given moment, if for no other reason than simply because he could. Personal morality begins with a certain minimum of self-respect. Obviously that is not an impediment to their political ambitions.

It is unlikely that any moral imperative is in play. They were all the first ones as the list of potential candidates was pared away willing to prostitute themselves for the prestige of the position.

d4m10n 5th October 2017 08:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by quadraginta (Post 12022364)
I see.

A deluded little bitch?

Problem is that you are working on the premise that there is any morality there to begin with.

Trump's Cabinet is comprised of people who agreed to be Trump subordinates in full knowledge of his character and track record.

Being that (for whatever faults they might have) they are not stupid ... or blind ... there is no way that they could not know that Trump would ignore, contradict, and humiliate them at any given moment, if for no other reason than simply because he could. Personal morality begins with a certain minimum of self-respect.

Self-respect is important, indeed, but perhaps it may be outweighed by hundreds of thousands of human lives in the balance.

dudalb 6th October 2017 08:28 PM

CNN is reporting that Kelly might be nearing the breaking point,telling Trump that if Tillerson goes it would be almost impossible for him to function as COS.Since Tillerson is pretty much a Dead Man Walking, we could have a double exit.....


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