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-   -   Bill Barr and his October Surprise (http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=346780)

TahiniBinShawarma 22nd October 2020 05:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darat (Post 13266380)
Very different scenarios.


What makes you think so?

The Great Zaganza 22nd October 2020 05:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TahiniBinShawarma (Post 13266413)
Not sure why you think that given the repair guy gave it to the FBI months before his intermediary contacted Giuliani's attorney Costello.

I think that because of the issues I mentioned.
There could be a ton of illegal porn on that machine, and no one could get convicted, thanks to Rudy, Bannon, the Post and the White House.
You can thank them.

TahiniBinShawarma 22nd October 2020 05:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by uke2se (Post 13266410)
Not so different if you count Rudy Giuliani as "authorities". Of course, no sane person would, and it seems likely that Giuliani actually aquired this particular trove of Russian disinformation in Ukraine.


How'd they end up on a laptop the repair guy gave to the FBI months before Giuliani had any contact with the repair guy?

TahiniBinShawarma 22nd October 2020 05:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza (Post 13266419)
I think that because of the issues I mentioned.
There could be a ton of illegal porn on that machine, and no one could get convicted, thanks to Rudy, Bannon, the Post and the White House.
You can thank them.


There is no issue with the evidence, that's wishful thinking on your part. The FBI had the laptop before Giuliani even knew it existed.

wareyin 22nd October 2020 05:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shuttlt (Post 13266414)
What are you talking about? You seemed to be claiming that I was missing some critical bit of evidence that the external drive that the repair guy copied the files to might not have been manufactured until the day after the laptop was dropped off with him. Where are you going with that?

I will try to use smaller words: The FBI subpoena you think is important is for a hard drive made after the man pretending to be Hunter Biden dropped off the laptop. That doesn't mean the FBI has anything belonging to Hunter Biden. You have repeatedly (that means more than once) questioned why the FBI hasn't said anything about the ongoing investigation, as though their lack of comment is bad for Hunter Biden. In the real world, the FBI doesn't like to comment about ongoing investigations, so a lack of comment now is normal and means nothing.

Is that more clear?

TahiniBinShawarma 22nd October 2020 05:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wareyin (Post 13266364)
Earlier in the thread there was a link to a Twitter sleuth who examined the FBI document. The serial number of the hard drive named in the document wasn't manufactured until after the anonymous person who couldn't fake Hunter Biden's signature had supposedly dropped off the laptop. You might have missed that because of your ignore list (like you're missing this).

And if you actually read the whole thread he gets shown why he was wrong, and dmits he doesnt know what he's talking about lol.

shuttlt 22nd October 2020 05:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza (Post 13266419)
I think that because of the issues I mentioned.
There could be a ton of illegal porn on that machine, and no one could get convicted, thanks to Rudy, Bannon, the Post and the White House.
You can thank them.

I think the claim is more around a child protection issue relating to Hunter's sister-in law/ex lover's daughter. It's not nothing, but I'd think any attempts to cover it up risks being more politically damaging than what ever may originally have occurred.

Horatius 22nd October 2020 06:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TahiniBinShawarma (Post 13266421)
How'd they end up on a laptop the repair guy gave to the FBI months before Giuliani had any contact with the repair guy?



Assumes facts not in evidence. Giuliani has been working the Hunter Biden angle for well over a year now, and there's no reason to trust him when he says he only got the contents of the laptop recently. Since there's evidence that the person who dropped off the laptop wasn't Hunter, it's entirely possible that Giuliani (or his Russian handlers) is the one who arranged the whole thing, and paid someone to pose as Hunter. That makes Repair Guy nothing more than a patsy, and contradicts none of the actual information we current have.

shuttlt 22nd October 2020 06:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wareyin (Post 13266426)
I will try to use smaller words: The FBI subpoena you think is important is for a hard drive made after the man pretending to be Hunter Biden dropped off the laptop. That doesn't mean the FBI has anything belonging to Hunter Biden. You have repeatedly (that means more than once) questioned why the FBI hasn't said anything about the ongoing investigation, as though their lack of comment is bad for Hunter Biden. In the real world, the FBI doesn't like to comment about ongoing investigations, so a lack of comment now is normal and means nothing.

The subpoena is for the laptop and the drive that the data on the laptop was copied to. You still haven't explained what the point of the Twitter thread is that suggests the drive the files were recovered to was manufactured the day after the laptop was dropped off and seven months before it was handed over to the FBI.

TahiniBinShawarma 22nd October 2020 06:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Horatius (Post 13266435)
Assumes facts not in evidence. Giuliani has been working the Hunter Biden angle for well over a year now, and there's no reason to trust him when he says he only got the contents of the laptop recently. Since there's evidence that the person who dropped off the laptop wasn't Hunter, it's entirely possible that Giuliani (or his Russian handlers) is the one who arranged the whole thing, and paid someone to pose as Hunter. That makes Repair Guy nothing more than a patsy, and contradicts none of the actual information we current have.

And Giuliani's psychic knew repair guy would call his attorney lol. Oh and repair guy is lying also when he says he contacted the FBI months before Giuliani was contacted. Lol

TahiniBinShawarma 22nd October 2020 06:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Horatius (Post 13266435)
Assumes facts not in evidence. Giuliani has been working the Hunter Biden angle for well over a year now, and there's no reason to trust him when he says he only got the contents of the laptop recently. Since there's evidence that the person who dropped off the laptop wasn't Hunter, it's entirely possible that Giuliani (or his Russian handlers) is the one who arranged the whole thing, and paid someone to pose as Hunter. That makes Repair Guy nothing more than a patsy, and contradicts none of the actual information we current have.

And sorry, it assumes nothing. Unless you want to say the repair guy is lying. If that's what you think, quit beating around the bush and say it.

The Great Zaganza 22nd October 2020 06:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TahiniBinShawarma (Post 13266440)
And Giuliani's psychic knew repair guy would call his attorney lol. Oh and repair guy is lying also when he says he contacted the FBI months before Giuliani was contacted. Lol

Guess we need to revisit this issue next year.

Rudy&Trump are creating too much smoke, and the FBI and DOJ won't do anything before the election.

TahiniBinShawarma 22nd October 2020 06:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Horatius (Post 13266435)
Assumes facts not in evidence. Giuliani has been working the Hunter Biden angle for well over a year now, and there's no reason to trust him when he says he only got the contents of the laptop recently. Since there's evidence that the person who dropped off the laptop wasn't Hunter, it's entirely possible that Giuliani (or his Russian handlers) is the one who arranged the whole thing, and paid someone to pose as Hunter. That makes Repair Guy nothing more than a patsy, and contradicts none of the actual information we current have.

Do you believe in 2 Oswalds as well? Lol

shuttlt 22nd October 2020 06:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TahiniBinShawarma (Post 13266440)
And Giuliani's psychic knew repair guy would call his attorney lol. Oh and repair guy is lying also when he says he contacted the FBI months before Giuliani was contacted. Lol

This does sound like the sort of thing that should be fairly easily checkable.

TahiniBinShawarma 22nd October 2020 06:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza (Post 13266443)
Guess we need to revisit this issue next year.

Rudy&Trump are creating too much smoke, and the FBI and DOJ won't do anything before the election.

Even if we agreed on that, no one else would. I concur though, the FBI isn't going to do anything publicly before the election.

shuttlt 22nd October 2020 06:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TahiniBinShawarma (Post 13266446)
Do you believe in 2 Oswalds as well? Lol

The real secret that they are trying to hide is that it was nothing but Oswalds. It's Oswalds all the way down.

wareyin 22nd October 2020 06:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shuttlt (Post 13266436)
The subpoena is for the laptop and the drive that the data on the laptop was copied to. You still haven't explained what the point of the Twitter thread is that suggests the drive the files were recovered to was manufactured the day after the laptop was dropped off and seven months before it was handed over to the FBI.

I don't know how to make it more clear to you. The subpoena was not for the laptop. Giuliani claimed to have the laptop. If the laptop was in his possession until he turned it over to the Delaware PD, then it was not in possession by the FBI.

Horatius 22nd October 2020 06:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TahiniBinShawarma (Post 13266442)
And sorry, it assumes nothing. Unless you want to say the repair guy is lying. If that's what you think, quit beating around the bush and say it.



No, the repair guy could have gotten played. Russian agents have been known to manipulate people on occasion, you know, sometimes even stupid people.

shuttlt 22nd October 2020 06:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wareyin (Post 13266475)
I don't know how to make it more clear to you. The subpoena was not for the laptop. Giuliani claimed to have the laptop. If the laptop was in his possession until he turned it over to the Delaware PD, then it was not in possession by the FBI.

Where are you getting this from? This still has nothing to do with the Twitter thread that was so important.

wareyin 22nd October 2020 06:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shuttlt (Post 13266448)
This does sound like the sort of thing that should be fairly easily checkable.

When the repair guy contacted the FBI will probably come out. We know the repair guy has at various times claimed to have contacted the FBI over the laptop but other times claimed that the FBI were the ones to contact him. At this point we don't know which version of his story, if either, is true.

When the repair guy was in contact with Giuliani first probably won't be ever known. We certainly can't assume that he is being honest about it as he has given contradictory details about the rest of his story.

Bogative 22nd October 2020 06:41 AM

Has anyone asked Hunter Biden if he dropped the laptop off?

Tero 22nd October 2020 06:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shuttlt (Post 13266354)
Is the theory here that the repair shop guy has forged multiple documents from the FBI including signatures of FBI agents and passing them around and the FBI haven't done anything about it? Why?

There is no laptop, or if there is one, the receipts and so on were generated so as to make it seem there is a Hunter Biden laptop. Nothing has indicated that any of that is true. Hunter Biden would have an Apple ID that could be verified in minutes on any laptop.

The laptop was invented to be the source of the documents Rudy got elsewhere.

wareyin 22nd October 2020 06:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shuttlt (Post 13266481)
Where are you getting this from? This still has nothing to do with the Twitter thread that was so important.

I'm getting it from this thread. Did you miss the claims that Giuliani turned over the laptop to the Delaware PD a page or 2 back? And if he had it to turn over, then the FBI didn't have it. Simple logic.

What it has to do with the Twitter thread is...that the Twitter thread is where we learned that the FBI didn't subpoena the laptop. They subpoenaed a different device that never belonged to Hunter Biden.

shuttlt 22nd October 2020 06:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wareyin (Post 13266488)
I'm getting it from this thread. Did you miss the claims that Giuliani turned over the laptop to the Delaware PD a page or 2 back? And if he had it to turn over, then the FBI didn't have it. Simple logic.

He didn't turn over the laptop. The FBI has the laptop. Supposing all of this is a fraud committed by Giuliani, or the Russians, or somebody else.... what would be going on in the FBIs minds if they didn't secure the laptop?

Quote:

Originally Posted by wareyin (Post 13266488)
What it has to do with the Twitter thread is...that the Twitter thread is where we learned that the FBI didn't subpoena the laptop. They subpoenaed a different device that never belonged to Hunter Biden.

We don't learn that from the Twitter thread. The FBI subpoenaed the laptop. The FBI has the laptop.

MinnesotaBrant 22nd October 2020 07:07 AM

Apparently according to Hannity Biden is reeling from allegations of corruption from this. I confess I haven't bothered to read more than the headline seeing where it's coming from.

MinnesotaBrant 22nd October 2020 07:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tero (Post 13266487)
There is no laptop, or if there is one, the receipts and so on were generated so as to make it seem there is a Hunter Biden laptop. Nothing has indicated that any of that is true. Hunter Biden would have an Apple ID that could be verified in minutes on any laptop.

The laptop was invented to be the source of the documents Rudy got elsewhere.

haha Bidens son stored his dick pic on the cloud? Kidding, just trying to wrap my head around that.

wareyin 22nd October 2020 07:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shuttlt (Post 13266492)
He didn't turn over the laptop. The FBI has the laptop. Supposing all of this is a fraud committed by Giuliani, or the Russians, or somebody else.... what would be going on in the FBIs minds if they didn't secure the laptop?


We don't learn that from the Twitter thread. The FBI subpoenaed the laptop. The FBI has the laptop.

Guiliani and the police department in question claim that Giuliani did turn over a laptop that he claimed was Hunter Biden's. https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/...es/6005040002/

As for what was going on in the FBI's mind that they didn't secure a piece of false evidence planted by bad actors? Why? Is there a compelling reason to do so that doesn't involve making it look genuine to prop up a story that is falling apart?

sackett 22nd October 2020 07:18 AM

Five'll get you fifty that Trunpf drags all this into the Great Debate Mark 2 tonight. Spittle flying.

dmaker 22nd October 2020 07:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sackett (Post 13266524)
Five'll get you fifty that Trunpf drags all this into the Great Debate Mark 2 tonight. Spittle flying.

Of course he will. He'll open with his usual "I shut down travel to China" (as if we haven't heard that story a thousand times now), he'll toss in the usual Biden called me xenophobic and Pelosi wanted to dance in Chinatown, and the rest will be about Hunter. Maybe he will bring some print outs of right wing websites and bandy them about as he has embarrassingly done in the past.

It's all he's got.

shuttlt 22nd October 2020 07:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wareyin (Post 13266521)
Guiliani and the police department in question claim that Giuliani did turn over a laptop that he claimed was Hunter Biden's. https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/...es/6005040002/

The mistake you are making is reading the headline and first paragraph and thinking they are accurate and truthful. Where are they getting the facts they claim in the headline? They quote the spokesman for the Delaware AG saying:
Quote:

“They’ve got a hard drive or a laptop or something to that effect. They try to turn it over to New Castle County PD. New Castle County PD calls us"
So, he isn't their source, or if he is they are misrepresenting what he said. They don't give any other source for their claim that the FBI decided they'd prefer a copy to the original laptop.

Quote:

As for what was going on in the FBI's mind that they didn't secure a piece of false evidence planted by bad actors? Why? Is there a compelling reason to do so that doesn't involve making it look genuine to prop up a story that is falling apart?
So, the idea is that there is a laptop that has been planted to try to set Hunter Biden up with a bunch of fake photos and emails, or possibly to set up Guiliani, and the FBI decide to leave the laptop out there and let it be used to set up Guiliani/Hunter Biden for fear of making the claims against Hunter Biden look genuine? Assuming all that is true, why did they subpoena the laptop?

Tero 22nd October 2020 07:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MinnesotaBrant (Post 13266513)
haha Bidens son stored his dick pic on the cloud? Kidding, just trying to wrap my head around that.

A good 80% of people are that dumb with smart phones. And most of then never viewed what's in their cloud.

Tero 22nd October 2020 07:34 AM

Quote:

It remains unclear whose laptop this actually was, how it came to be dropped off at the Maryland computer store in April 2019, whether the emails and other materials found on it are indeed legitimate, or whether more “October Surprises” will follow. However, one thing is clear: The New York Post “smoking gun” story — packed to the brim as it is with half-truths, outright lies, innuendo, smears, and foreign actors credibly accused of U.S. election meddling — is disinformation. Whether or not it will be credibly weaponized remains to be seen.
https://www.truthorfiction.com/the-s...bidens-laptop/

JoeMorgue 22nd October 2020 07:39 AM

It's literally like the Right just somehow thinks it's just so totally unfair that the Left gets to use all these scandals and criminal charges against them so they have some inherent right to make up some to balance the scales.

TahiniBinShawarma 22nd October 2020 07:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wareyin (Post 13266483)
When the repair guy contacted the FBI will probably come out. We know the repair guy has at various times claimed to have contacted the FBI over the laptop but other times claimed that the FBI were the ones to contact him. At this point we don't know which version of his story, if either, is true.

When the repair guy was in contact with Giuliani first probably won't be ever known. We certainly can't assume that he is being honest about it as he has given contradictory details about the rest of his story.


You are conflating. He contacted the FBI and gave them a copy of the drive. They came back with a grand jury subpoena for the original.BOTH are correct, he contacted them, they contacted him.

TahiniBinShawarma 22nd October 2020 07:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Horatius (Post 13266476)
No, the repair guy could have gotten played. Russian agents have been known to manipulate people on occasion, you know, sometimes even stupid people.



So Giuliani had nothing to do with it?

TahiniBinShawarma 22nd October 2020 07:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tero (Post 13266487)
There is no laptop, or if there is one, the receipts and so on were generated so as to make it seem there is a Hunter Biden laptop. Nothing has indicated that any of that is true. Hunter Biden would have an Apple ID that could be verified in minutes on any laptop.

The laptop was invented to be the source of the documents Rudy got elsewhere.


So, the repair guy is lying?

shuttlt 22nd October 2020 08:00 AM

Has this been posted yet?

https://nypost.com/2020/10/22/hunter...ns-from-china/
Quote:

My name is Tony Bobulinski. The facts set forth below are true and accurate; they are not any form of domestic or foreign disinformation. Any suggestion to the contrary is false and offensive. I am the recipient of the email published seven days ago by the New York Post which showed a copy to Hunter Biden and Rob Walker. That email is genuine.

This afternoon I received a request from the Senate Committee on Homeland Security and Government Affairs and the Senate Committee on Finance requesting all documents relating to my business affairs with the Biden family as well as various foreign entities and individuals. I have extensive relevant records and communications and I intend to produce those items to both Committees in the immediate future.

I am the grandson of a 37 year Army Intelligence officer, the son of a 20+ year career Naval Officer and the brother of a 28 year career Naval Flight Officer. I myself served our country for 4 years and left the Navy as LT Bobulinski. I held a high level security clearance and was an instructor and then CTO for Naval Nuclear Power Training Command. I take great pride in the time my family and I served this country. I am also not a political person. What few campaign contributions I have made in my life were to Democrats.

If the media and Big Tech companies had done their jobs over the past several weeks I would be irrelevant in this story. Given my long standing service and devotion to this great country, I could no longer allow my family’s name to be associated or tied to Russian disinformation or implied lies and false narratives dominating the media right now.

After leaving the military I became an institutional investor investing extensively around the world and on every continent. I have traveled to over 50 countries. I believe, hands down, we live in the greatest country in the world.

What I am outlining is fact. I know it is fact because I lived it. I am the CEO of Sinohawk Holdings which was a partnership between the Chinese operating through CEFC/Chairman Ye and the Biden family. I was brought into the company to be the CEO by James Gilliar and Hunter Biden. The reference to “the Big Guy” in the much publicized May 13, 2017 email is in fact a reference to Joe Biden. The other “JB” referenced in that email is Jim Biden, Joe’s brother.

Hunter Biden called his dad “the Big Guy” or “my Chairman,” and frequently referenced asking him for his sign-off or advice on various potential deals that we were discussing. I’ve seen Vice President Biden saying he never talked to Hunter about his business. I’ve seen firsthand that that’s not true, because it wasn’t just Hunter’s business, they said they were putting the Biden family name and its legacy on the line.

I realized the Chinese were not really focused on a healthy financial ROI. They were looking at this as a political or influence investment. Once I realized that Hunter wanted to use the company as his personal piggy bank by just taking money out of it as soon as it came from the Chinese, I took steps to prevent that from happening.

The Johnson Report connected some dots in a way that shocked me — it made me realize the Bidens had gone behind my back and gotten paid millions of dollars by the Chinese, even though they told me they hadn’t and wouldn’t do that to their partners.

I would ask the Biden family to address the American people and outline the facts so I can go back to being irrelevant — and so I am not put in a position to have to answer those questions for them.

I don’t have a political ax to grind; I just saw behind the Biden curtain and I grew concerned with what I saw. The Biden family aggressively leveraged the Biden family name to make millions of dollars from foreign entities even though some were from communist controlled China.

God bless America.

Dr. Keith 22nd October 2020 08:03 AM

At this point are we to believe that Trump's FBI is working hard for the Bidens by hiding this obvious evidence of criminal conduct?

Deep State?
Trump's Best People?
Barr too distracted by Covid exposure?

Why would Trump's FBI be protecting the Bidens for so long? Why would Trump's own people hide a smoking gun of Biden corruption?

I swear, I can't wait for Trump to finally be elected so he can drain the swamp and get the Federal Government working for the Truth 'n Just-us and Lawn Order.

shuttlt 22nd October 2020 08:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Keith (Post 13266568)
At this point are we to believe that Trump's FBI is working hard for the Bidens by hiding this obvious evidence of criminal conduct?

Deep State?
Trump's Best People?
Barr too distracted by Covid exposure?

Why would Trump's FBI be protecting the Bidens for so long? Why would Trump's own people hide a smoking gun of Biden corruption?

I swear, I can't wait for Trump to finally be elected so he can drain the swamp and get the Federal Government working for the Truth 'n Just-us and Lawn Order.

Bureaucracies don't necessarily change their politics just because the CEO changes. Short of firing the whole of the DoJ, any change is going to be gradual.

wareyin 22nd October 2020 08:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shuttlt (Post 13266533)
The mistake you are making is reading the headline and first paragraph and thinking they are accurate and truthful. Where are they getting the facts they claim in the headline? They quote the spokesman for the Delaware AG saying:

So, he isn't their source, or if he is they are misrepresenting what he said. They don't give any other source for their claim that the FBI decided they'd prefer a copy to the original laptop.

You really just keep adding in tidbits when your original claims fail, don't you? The FBI decided they'd prefer a copy to the original? Who made that claim? Right now we have you claiming the FBI has the original laptop with no evidence, Giuliani and the Delaware PD claiming that Giuliani gave a laptop he claimed was Hunter's to the Delaware PD, and the repair guy providing evidence that the FBI subpoenaed a hard drive but not the laptop.


Quote:

Originally Posted by shuttlt (Post 13266533)
So, the idea is that there is a laptop that has been planted to try to set Hunter Biden up with a bunch of fake photos and emails, or possibly to set up Guiliani, and the FBI decide to leave the laptop out there and let it be used to set up Guiliani/Hunter Biden for fear of making the claims against Hunter Biden look genuine? Assuming all that is true, why did they subpoena the laptop?

Your evidence they subpoenaed the laptop is lacking. In fact, given that Giuliani claimed he has the laptop, you are contradicted by the original source of this story.


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