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-   -   Bill Barr and his October Surprise (http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=346780)

slyjoe 22nd October 2020 08:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shuttlt (Post 13266573)
Bureaucracies don't necessarily change their politics just because the CEO changes. Short of firing the whole of the DoJ, any change is going to be gradual.

When an administration changes I think you will find that most US attorneys are changed.

shuttlt 22nd October 2020 08:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wareyin (Post 13266586)
You really just keep adding in tidbits when your original claims fail, don't you? The FBI decided they'd prefer a copy to the original? Who made that claim? Right now we have you claiming the FBI has the original laptop with no evidence, Giuliani and the Delaware PD claiming that Giuliani gave a laptop he claimed was Hunter's to the Delaware PD, and the repair guy providing evidence that the FBI subpoenaed a hard drive but not the laptop.

I haven't seen any claim from Giuliani or the Delaware PD that Giuliani had the laptop. The laptop is on the subpoena. The repair guy is quoted as saying he handed the laptop to the FBI.

Quote:

Originally Posted by wareyin (Post 13266586)
Your evidence they subpoenaed the laptop is lacking.

It's on attachment A to the subpoena that you got the serial number for the external drive from. Look one line up from the external drive. There were two items on the subpoena, the laptop and the external drive. The laptop was item 1, the external drive was item 2.

Quote:

Originally Posted by wareyin (Post 13266586)
In fact, given that Giuliani claimed he has the laptop, you are contradicted by the original source of this story.

Where does Giuliani claim to have the laptop?

shuttlt 22nd October 2020 08:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slyjoe (Post 13266590)
When an administration changes I think you will find that most US attorneys are changed.

Maybe, but you don't fire the whole FBI.

Tero 22nd October 2020 08:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TahiniBinShawarma (Post 13266565)
So, the repair guy is lying?

Yes.

TahiniBinShawarma 22nd October 2020 08:36 AM

May 20, 2017 text exchange obtained by #FoxNews - Tony Bobulinski is warned by business partner James Gilliar "Don't mention Joe being involved, it's only when u are face to face, I know u know that but they are paranoid"

Tero 22nd October 2020 08:40 AM

A rational person sorting the misinformation:
https://www.politico.com/news/2020/1...d-drive-431022

wareyin 22nd October 2020 08:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shuttlt (Post 13266594)
I haven't seen any claim from Giuliani or the Delaware PD that Giuliani had the laptop. The laptop is on the subpoena. The repair guy is quoted as saying he handed the laptop to the FBI.

What laptop is the Delaware AG claiming Giuliani turned over to the Delaware PD?

shuttlt 22nd October 2020 08:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wareyin (Post 13266606)
What laptop is the Delaware AG claiming Giuliani turned over to the Delaware PD?

Do you have a quote of the Delaware AG claiming a laptop has been handing over by Giuliani. The quote you showed before said:

Quote:

They’ve got a hard drive or a laptop or something to that effect. They try to turn it over to New Castle County PD. New Castle County PD calls us
Do you have a quote that confirms it is in fact a laptop, and not maybe a hard disk, or some other media? Again, there was a subpoena for the laptop in December 2019 and the repair guy says he handed it over to the FBI then.

Babbylonian 22nd October 2020 08:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slyjoe (Post 13266590)
When an administration changes I think you will find that most US attorneys are changed.

More critically, an attorney general loyal to the law will be put in office.

TahiniBinShawarma 22nd October 2020 08:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wareyin (Post 13266586)
You really just keep adding in tidbits when your original claims fail, don't you? The FBI decided they'd prefer a copy to the original? Who made that claim? Right now we have you claiming the FBI has the original laptop with no evidence, Giuliani and the Delaware PD claiming that Giuliani gave a laptop he claimed was Hunter's to the Delaware PD, and the repair guy providing evidence that the FBI subpoenaed a hard drive but not the laptop.




Your evidence they subpoenaed the laptop is lacking. In fact, given that Giuliani claimed he has the laptop, you are contradicted by the original source of this story.


https://www.delawareonline.com/story...te/3655753001/

"In a winding interview with the media, John Paul Mac Isaac, owner of The Mac Shop in Wilmington, recalled how in April 2019 a man who identified himself as Hunter Biden brought three liquid-damaged laptops to his small repair shop in the Trolley Square shopping center"

"A Wilmington computer repairman who reportedly gave a copy of Hunter Bidenís laptop hard drive to Rudy Giulianiís attorney, Brian Costello"

"During the subsequent summer and fall, Mac Isaac said he became alarmed after browsing through the computer's files. He claims he then spoke with an associate more versed than him in the law and in current events.

That unnamed person then contacted the FBI, Mac Isaac said.

Federal investigators from Wilmington and Baltimore then subpoenaed the laptop in December"

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/hun...paul-mac-isaac

"When asked, Isaac, whose social media posts indicate is a supporter of President Trump, rejected the possibility that the laptop did not belong to Hunter Biden and was an attempt to set him up."

"The customer did not return for the laptop within 90 days and Isaac could not get in touch with him. Isaac said he first searched the emails by keyword in June or July of 2019."

"In September, he contacted an intermediary about the emails. The intermediary then contacted the FBI."

"According to Isaacís account, the FBI first made a forensic copy of the laptop, then returned weeks later with a subpoena and confiscated it. When he stopped hearing from the FBI, Isaac said he contacted several members of Congress, who did not respond. At that point, his intermediary reached out to Rudy Giulianiís attorney, Robert Costello."

shuttlt 22nd October 2020 08:55 AM

Is nobody interested in Biden's business partner? It amounts to an accusation that Joe Biden has been lying about his involvement in Hunter's business dealings and has been taking bribes from the Chinese. Plus obviously confirming that some of the emails are genuine.

wareyin 22nd October 2020 08:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shuttlt (Post 13266609)
Do you have a quote of the Delaware AG claiming a laptop has been handing over by Giuliani. The quote you showed before said:



Do you have a quote that confirms it is in fact a laptop, and not maybe a hard disk, or some other media? Again, there was a subpoena for the laptop in December 2019 and the repair guy says he handed it over to the FBI then.

Somehow we're both reading that quote of Giuliani trying to turn over a laptop to the Delaware PD, but only one of us can see the word laptop in it?

Eta: the repair guy has repeatedly given different stories. Relying on his word is not advisable.

JoeMorgue 22nd October 2020 08:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shuttlt (Post 13266617)
Is nobody interested in Biden's business partner? It amounts to an accusation that Joe Biden has been lying about his involvement in Hunter's business dealings and has been taking bribes from the Chinese. Plus obviously confirming that some of the emails are genuine.

We would be if there was anything on this nothingburger outside the word of a known liar and and a totally unknown dropping conveniently at the 11th hour of an election Trump has openly declared he's going to cheat to win.

TahiniBinShawarma 22nd October 2020 08:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wareyin (Post 13266606)
What laptop is the Delaware AG claiming Giuliani turned over to the Delaware PD?

You are playing semantics revolving around "the laptop." The repair guy only copied one. When people and stories mention "the laptop" they are obviously referring to the copies of the original. The FBI has THE LAPTOP.

TahiniBinShawarma 22nd October 2020 09:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JoeMorgue (Post 13266620)
We would be if there was anything on this nothingburger outside the word of a known liar and and a totally unknown dropping conveniently at the 11th hour of an election Trump has openly declared he's going to cheat to win.

The repair shop guy is a known liar?

wareyin 22nd October 2020 09:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shuttlt (Post 13266617)
Is nobody interested in Biden's business partner? It amounts to an accusation that Joe Biden has been lying about his involvement in Hunter's business dealings and has been taking bribes from the Chinese. Plus obviously confirming that some of the emails are genuine.

The Chinese deal that didn't happen? That big nothing burger?

shuttlt 22nd October 2020 09:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wareyin (Post 13266618)
Somehow we're both reading that quote of Giuliani trying to turn over a laptop to the Delaware PD, but only one of us can see the word laptop in it?

Edited by zooterkin:  <SNIP>
Edited for rule 0 and rule 12, and rule 11.


Quote:

They’ve got a hard drive or a laptop or something to that effect
It could be a laptop, or it might not. He doesn't know and doesn't say.

Given that we have the subpoena with the laptop on it, and the account from the repair shop guy where he says he handed over the laptop to the FBI.... it seems unlikely that the laptop from the shop is what is being discussed here.

wareyin 22nd October 2020 09:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shuttlt (Post 13266626)
Edited by zooterkin:  <SNIP>
Edited for rule 0 and rule 12, and rule 11.

Edited by zooterkin:  <SNIP>
Edited for rule 12.



Quote:

Originally Posted by shuttlt (Post 13266626)
It could be a laptop, or it might not. He doesn't know and doesn't say.

Given that we have the subpoena with the laptop on it, and the account from the repair shop guy where he says he handed over the laptop to the FBI.... it seems unlikely that the laptop from the shop is what is being discussed here.

Given that the repair guy has changed his story repeatedly, I've already pointed out that relying on his claims is not wise. But, when you are forced to rely on a known liar or your narrative falls apart, you have to do what you have to do, huh?

JoeMorgue 22nd October 2020 09:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TahiniBinShawarma (Post 13266622)
The repair shop guy is a known liar?

*Shrugs* Compared to Joe Biden, sure.

Not sure why you're pearl clutching over the suggestion that this guy is a liar when you're so comfortable calling Biden one.

And Giuliani absolutely is a liar.

The whole "Oh so you're calling me a liar" tough guy act is sad, even worse when it's being done third person.

Dr. Keith 22nd October 2020 09:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Keith (Post 13266568)
At this point are we to believe that Trump's FBI is working hard for the Bidens by hiding this obvious evidence of criminal conduct?

Deep State?
Trump's Best People?
Barr too distracted by Covid exposure?

Why would Trump's FBI be protecting the Bidens for so long? Why would Trump's own people hide a smoking gun of Biden corruption?

I swear, I can't wait for Trump to finally be elected so he can drain the swamp and get the Federal Government working for the Truth 'n Just-us and Lawn Order.

Quote:

Originally Posted by shuttlt (Post 13266573)
Bureaucracies don't necessarily change their politics just because the CEO changes. Short of firing the whole of the DoJ, any change is going to be gradual.

Is it you position that the FBI has had credible evidence of Biden corruption for almost a year and not done anything because individual agents are willing to risk their careers and pensions to cover this fact up?

And now that this has become public, how has the FBI not reviewed this data in the last few days, fired the duplicitous agents and revealed the obvious corruption? I mean, most of you have it all figured out without any access to the evidence at all.

At this point it has become clear that Trump's "Best People" are actually just cultist online shills, not anyone he has actually hired.

TahiniBinShawarma 22nd October 2020 09:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JoeMorgue (Post 13266637)
*Shrugs* Compared to Joe Biden, sure.

Not sure why you're pearl clutching over the suggestion that this guy is a liar when you're so comfortable calling Biden one.

And Giuliani absolutely is a liar.

The whole "Oh so you're calling me a liar" tough guy act is sad, even worse when it's being done third person.

No, I just want people to say he's lying instead of beating around the bush like you just did.

wareyin 22nd October 2020 09:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TahiniBinShawarma (Post 13266646)
No, I just want people to say he's lying instead of beating around the bush like you just did.

Which version of his story is true, and how do you know?

JoeMorgue 22nd October 2020 09:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TahiniBinShawarma (Post 13266646)
No, I just want people to say he's lying instead of beating around the bush like you just did.

Errrr.... okay. I guess we can get back to beating around the bush you want to beat around this.

*Rolls Eyes*

varwoche 22nd October 2020 09:35 AM

In the movie Independence Day, there were woeful losers welcoming the alien invasion. Of course, they're fictional characters. They don't have to look themselves in the mirror and wonder why they exert effort propping up a fascistic, racist, sociopathic, infantile, lying imbecile.

TahiniBinShawarma 22nd October 2020 09:38 AM

3 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Keith (Post 13266638)
Is it you position that the FBI has had credible evidence of Biden corruption for almost a year and not done anything because individual agents are willing to risk their careers and pensions to cover this fact up?

And now that this has become public, how has the FBI not reviewed this data in the last few days, fired the duplicitous agents and revealed the obvious corruption? I mean, most of you have it all figured out without any access to the evidence at all.

At this point it has become clear that Trump's "Best People" are actually just cultist online shills, not anyone he has actually hired.

An e-mail to Hunter Biden's partner from a top Chinese official on July 26, 2017 shows the Chinese energy company CEFC proposed a $5 million "interest-free" loan to the Biden family "based on their trust on [Biden] family[.]"

"Should CEFC keep lending more to the family?"

Less than two weeks later, on August 8, 2017, $5 million was wired from a CEFC-affiliated investment vehicle to a Delaware LLC, which spent the next year transfering nearly $4.8 million directly to Hunter Biden's firm, according to Senate investigators.

https://www.hsgac.senate.gov/imo/med...port_FINAL.pdf

Interest Free Loans are illegal (violation of IRC). Loans over $100,000 require interest payment of AFR%-any amount paid. Further, that's around 70k per year interest which Bidens would have to report on their 709. Again if true, but those are the rules.

timhau 22nd October 2020 09:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shuttlt (Post 13266617)
Is nobody interested in Biden's business partner? It amounts to an accusation that Joe Biden has been lying about his involvement in Hunter's business dealings and has been taking bribes from the Chinese. Plus obviously confirming that some of the emails are genuine.

Did that come with the $5 million emails Rudy bought in the Ukraine, or did he have to pay for this service?

Ziggurat 22nd October 2020 09:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by varwoche (Post 13266659)
In the movie Independence Day, there were woeful losers welcoming the alien invasion. Of course, they're fictional characters. They don't have to look themselves in the mirror and wonder why they exert effort propping up a fascistic, racist, sociopathic, infantile, lying imbecile.

Biden's not THAT bad.

The Great Zaganza 22nd October 2020 09:53 AM

Looks like they got Biden dead-to-rights.
No one is going to vote for him.

Trump supporters might just as well stay at home, since their victory is assured.

Beelzebuddy 22nd October 2020 09:57 AM

No, they should vote. EVERYONE should vote.

Come November 5, nothing would make me happier than seeing a long line of flag-waving Trump supporters waiting to vote outside my neighbourhood polling station.

shuttlt 22nd October 2020 10:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Keith (Post 13266638)
Is it you position that the FBI has had credible evidence of Biden corruption for almost a year

This part does seem like it is the case at the moment.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Keith (Post 13266638)
and not done anything because individual agents are willing to risk their careers and pensions to cover this fact up?

I wouldn't know about this. There seem like there are other possibilities. It doesn't seem impossible given that we know came out around Peter Strzok and altered/concealed evidence but it is way too early to say. I was disagreeing with you that just because Trump is President, the FBI is necessarily batting for him.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Keith (Post 13266638)
And now that this has become public, how has the FBI not reviewed this data in the last few days, fired the duplicitous agents and revealed the obvious corruption? I mean, most of you have it all figured out without any access to the evidence at all.

Well, if anybody is going to get fired a public announcement that they were being fired over this case would seem to conflict with not commenting on open cases. I don't know how long it would normally take for them to fire somebody, but this timescale seems very short. How long did it take for Strzok to go? Also, its one thing to find that they have sat on an investigation and another to prove that that was done for corrupt reasons.

uke2se 22nd October 2020 10:31 AM

Why are you guys giving air to this obivious pile of Russian disinformation? Two Big Dog clones are tag-team-trolling this thread just to keep the discussion going. Let it die.

shuttlt 22nd October 2020 10:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by uke2se (Post 13266738)
Why are you guys giving air to this obivious pile of Russian disinformation? Two Big Dog clones are tag-team-trolling this thread just to keep the discussion going. Let it die.

This is a sceptic forum. We pedantically argue about bigfoot, prime numbers and amanda knox. If we closed off the pointless debates the forum would be closed by tomorrow.

JoeMorgue 22nd October 2020 10:36 AM

Yeah but we don't elect Bigfoot President.

The insane, counter-intellectual trolling on this topic has bigger real world consequences.

Stacyhs 22nd October 2020 10:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shuttlt (Post 13266567)
Has this been posted yet?



Quote:

The Johnson Report connected some dots in a way that shocked me ó it made me realize the Bidens had gone behind my back and gotten paid millions of dollars by the Chinese, even though they told me they hadnít and wouldnít do that to their partners.
https://nypost.com/2020/10/22/hunter...ns-from-china/

The Johnson Report that found no wrong doing by Joe Biden. The same report that Politico found was "largely a compilation of previously public information Ö as well as news articles and strongly worded insinuations with little evidence to back them up."

shuttlt 22nd October 2020 10:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JoeMorgue (Post 13266747)
Yeah but we don't elect Bigfoot President.

The insane, counter-intellectual trolling on this topic has bigger real world consequences.

ok, but you aren't going to vote Trump on the basis of anything I can possibly say any more than the freedom of Amanda Knox depended on anything posted to that necrotic thread. There is no more real world significance to this thread than a random bigfoot thread. Do you guys think you are making a difference in the real world here?

shuttlt 22nd October 2020 10:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stacyhs (Post 13266749)
The Johnson Report that found no wrong doing by Joe Biden. The same report that Politico found was "largely a compilation of previously public information Ö as well as news articles and strongly worded insinuations with little evidence to back them up."

As he explains, the Johnson report made him aware of things that made him see what he knew in a new light.

JoeMorgue 22nd October 2020 10:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shuttlt (Post 13266754)
ok, but you aren't going to vote Trump on the basis of anything I can possibly say any more than the freedom of Amanda Knox depended on anything posted to that necrotic thread. There is no more real world significance to this thread than a random bigfoot thread. Do you guys think you are making a difference in the real world here?

Ah yes the "It doesn't matter that I'm anti-intellectual trolling conspiratorial nonsense because I'm just doing it on the internet" defense.

shuttlt 22nd October 2020 10:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JoeMorgue (Post 13266770)
Ah yes the "It doesn't matter that I'm anti-intellectual trolling conspiratorial nonsense because I'm just doing it on the internet" defense.

Naturally, I think you are in fact all of those things. Do you think you are making a real world difference on this thread?

Elagabalus 22nd October 2020 10:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shuttlt (Post 13266617)
Is nobody interested in Biden's business partner? It amounts to an accusation that Joe Biden has been lying about his involvement in Hunter's business dealings and has been taking bribes from the Chinese. Plus obviously confirming that some of the emails are genuine.

Except Joe has already released his tax returns. He doesn't have a secret China Bank account like Trump does.

shuttlt 22nd October 2020 10:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Elagabalus (Post 13266776)
Except Joe has already released his tax returns. He doesn't have secret China Bank account like Trump does.

By definition, a secret bank account won't be on his tax returns.


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