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-   -   Bill Barr and his October Surprise (http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=346780)

Giordano 20th October 2020 09:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TahiniBinShawarma (Post 13263854)
That's funny because people at fox did check and have since found two people copied on some of the emails who verified their authenticity. Then they reported on it with that supporting testimony to back it up.

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/hun...ource-verifies

There was nothing illegal for Hunter to arrange a deal with investments in China. The bigger deal would be if Joe Biden expressly traded influence in exchange for cash and your citation makes it clear that there is innuendo but no evidence that “the Big Guy” was Joe. Not enough to convince FOX News.

In fact I think the Big H is McDonald’s Special hamburger sauce🙂

shuttlt 20th October 2020 09:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Giordano (Post 13263880)
There was nothing illegal for Hunter to arrange a deal with investments in China. The bigger deal would be if Joe Biden expressly traded influence in exchange for cash and your citation makes it clear that there is innuendo but no evidence that “the Big Guy” was Joe. Not enough to convince FOX News.

In fact I think the Big H is McDonald’s Special hamburger sauce🙂

Don't Fox claim to have at least one of the recipients saying that the Big Guy is Joe?

Firestone 20th October 2020 09:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shuttlt (Post 13263883)
Don't Fox claim to have at least one of the recipients saying that the Big Guy is Joe?

They claim to have "sources" saying that Big Guy is Joe.
They also claim that they spoke to one of the people who was copied on the email, who confirmed its authenticity.

However, they don't claim that the "sources" and the people copied on the email are the same.

"Sources" could be Giuliani or Bannon, for all we know.

Quote:

Fox News spoke to one of the people who was copied on the email, who confirmed its authenticity.

Sources told Fox News that "the big guy" is a reference to the former vice president.

Segnosaur 20th October 2020 09:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TahiniBinShawarma (Post 13263854)
That's funny because people at fox did check and have since found two people copied on some of the emails who verified their authenticity. Then they reported on it with that supporting testimony to back it up.

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/hun...ource-verifies

First of all, that article mentions the emails were confirmed by "sources".... Hmmm... no names given . I thought that according to Trump, if your source didn't name names, then it was "fake news".

Secondly... the claim is that email about Biden's dealings with china were verified. But that does not mean that ALL the email was verified. Inserting the occasional 'fake' email in with real email would be a typical tactic in trying to spread disinformation.

Lastly, we do not know how exactly this email was verified.... Forensic analysis? Or did they just ask someone "Does this look legit?" "Yeah might have sent something like that".

shuttlt 20th October 2020 09:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Segnosaur (Post 13263893)
Lastly, we do not know how exactly this email was verified.... Forensic analysis? Or did they just ask someone "Does this look legit?" "Yeah might have sent something like that".

See Firestone's email. Fox claim to have been in touch with a recipient of one of the emails.

TahiniBinShawarma 20th October 2020 09:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Segnosaur (Post 13263893)
First of all, that article mentions the emails were confirmed by "sources".... Hmmm... no names given . I thought that according to Trump, if your source didn't name names, then it was "fake news".

Secondly... the claim is that email about Biden's dealings with china were verified. But that does not mean that ALL the email was verified. Inserting the occasional 'fake' email in with real email would be a typical tactic in trying to spread disinformation.

Lastly, we do not know how exactly this email was verified.... Forensic analysis? Or did they just ask someone "Does this look legit?" "Yeah might have sent something like that".

They confirmed certain email chains with participants in the chains. And it may surprise people, but I don't like the drip drip aspect. They should release the emails so the metadata can be confirmed. There could be "fake" emails inserted. That would require a fake Biden dropping the hardware off, or the repair guy lying.

TahiniBinShawarma 20th October 2020 09:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Firestone (Post 13263892)

"Sources" could be Giuliani or Bannon, for all we know.

And could be someone else.

shuttlt 20th October 2020 09:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TahiniBinShawarma (Post 13263900)
They confirmed certain email chains with participants in the chains. And it may surprise people, but I don't like the drip drip aspect. They should release the emails so the metadata can be confirmed. There could be "fake" emails inserted. That would require a fake Biden dropping the hardware off, or the repair guy lying.

Seems like a big con for some nobody repair shop guy to pull off. If it's fake, I'd find the Russian's more plausible.

TahiniBinShawarma 20th October 2020 09:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shuttlt (Post 13263906)
Seems like a big con for some nobody repair shop guy to pull off. If it's fake, I'd find the Russian's more plausible.


Same here, if anything I don't think the repair shop guy has anything to do with any fabrication. Not 100% against the Russians, but there isn't any evidence of that at this point.

The Great Zaganza 20th October 2020 09:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TahiniBinShawarma (Post 13263903)
And could be someone else.

Right.

It could also be someone sitting on their bed that weighs 400 pounds

TahiniBinShawarma 20th October 2020 09:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza (Post 13263913)
Right.

It could also be someone sitting on their bed that weighs 400 pounds

Sure, sure.

Babbylonian 20th October 2020 09:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TahiniBinShawarma (Post 13263846)
Again, someone trying to make sense of a crack and/or meth addicts actions. :rolleyes:

Again, more slander pretending to be evidence.

TahiniBinShawarma 20th October 2020 09:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Babbylonian (Post 13263923)
Again, more slander pretending to be evidence.


And you just showed you have no idea what slander is, or evidence.

Lurch 20th October 2020 10:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TahiniBinShawarma (Post 13263401)
Same with those working very hard to convince everyone it's nothing.

Who's having to work harder? The few pushing this uphill, against the indifference of the many.

kookbreaker 20th October 2020 10:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TahiniBinShawarma (Post 13263808)
I believe the repair guy said Biden was drunk when he came in. I'll check for a cite on that. To my amateur opinion, the first half looks like a match, second half seems different, but we don't go with amateur analysis. Hell, even in court I'm sure you'd get 2 experts to say the opposite of one another anyway.

This is a .pdf (of a 1965 study) that has at least one example of a drunken signature. The characteristics there are not what the receipt signature shows.

https://scholarlycommons.law.northwe...3&context=jclc

surrogate 20th October 2020 10:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TahiniBinShawarma (Post 13263911)
Same here, if anything I don't think the repair shop guy has anything to do with any fabrication. Not 100% against the Russians, but there isn't any evidence of that at this point.

If he was smart, he would have sold the data to Rudy for a lot of money. Maybe he did, I don't know. He admitted to snooping through the emails, which I would think would torpedo his business. I've fixed a fair number of computers for friends and their relatives, and never deemed it necessary to read their emails. I'm actually quite surprised he has been able to stay in business for 10 years fixing only Macs when there is an Apple Store only 15 minutes away.

fishbob 20th October 2020 10:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TahiniBinShawarma (Post 13263842)
Actually he said “can't be 100 percent sure” no where does it say the person who is assumed to be Biden that dropped the laptop off wasn't drunk. Try harder.

No where does it say the person wasn't a space alien reptoid either.

This means we need to be prepared to be invaded by the space alien reptoid fleet.

PS - any word on Barr's condition?
I mean Covid, not his transformation into a space alien reptoid.

TahiniBinShawarma 20th October 2020 10:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kookbreaker (Post 13263928)
This is a .pdf (of a 1965 study) that has at least one example of a drunken signature. The characteristics there are not what the receipt signature shows.

https://scholarlycommons.law.northwe...3&context=jclc


Well, that settles it I guess lol.

shuttlt 20th October 2020 10:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by surrogate (Post 13263930)
If he was smart, he would have sold the data to Rudy for a lot of money. Maybe he did, I don't know. He admitted to snooping through the emails, which I would think would torpedo his business. I've fixed a fair number of computers for friends and their relatives, and never deemed it necessary to read their emails. I'm actually quite surprised he has been able to stay in business for 10 years fixing only Macs when there is an Apple Store only 15 minutes away.

There is a long running battle about Apple declining to fix their own products and actively trying to frustrate the efforts of third parties to fix their products.

If the story is true, he only looked at the content of the laptop after it had become his property, and at a point where he was concerned it might contain evidence relating to the President's impeachment on it. Perhaps there will be an impact to his business, but it does seem like quite a unique set of circumstances.

TahiniBinShawarma 20th October 2020 10:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fishbob (Post 13263931)
No where does it say the person wasn't a space alien reptoid either.

This means we need to be prepared to be invaded by the space alien reptoid fleet.

PS - any word on Barr's condition?
I mean Covid, not his transformation into a space alien reptoid.

Cute, but no.

kookbreaker 20th October 2020 10:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TahiniBinShawarma (Post 13263933)
Well, that settles it I guess lol.

I never said it 'settles it'. Why are you says such a thing? I noted the characteristics are not the same as shown. Its another data point to consider.

xjx388 20th October 2020 10:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shuttlt (Post 13263936)
There is a long running battle about Apple declining to fix their own products and actively trying to frustrate the efforts of third parties to fix their products.

The second part is true; they want all service providers to be authorized. But, the first part is only true in a limited sense. They won't service items more than seven years after they stop selling it. They will continue to service items until five years after they stop selling it or longer if they have the inventory and/or are required by laws to do so. So, in 2019, Apple would definitely service a 2017 MacBook.

Quote:

If the story is true, he only looked at the content of the laptop after it had become his property, and at a point where he was concerned it might contain evidence relating to the President's impeachment on it. Perhaps there will be an impact to his business, but it does seem like quite a unique set of circumstances.
OK, but even if it's true that the laptop became legally his after X time, it's still a gross violation of privacy. The standard procedure of any legitimate shop would be to completely erase such laptops before reselling them. If it's possible that this shop makes a practice of looking through a user's files before erasing them . . . well, it's a good thing people know this now.

Basically, this guy just showed everyone that your worst fears (having your privacy violated by an unscrupulous and independent shop owner) are very very possible. An Authorized Apple shop or Apple itself isn't going to do this because the risks are too high. Apple has been very clear that they aren't in the business of turning over their user's info to law enforcement.

Firestone 20th October 2020 10:43 AM

Never mind

shuttlt 20th October 2020 10:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xjx388 (Post 13263969)
OK, but even if it's true that the laptop became legally his after X time, it's still a gross violation of privacy. The standard procedure of any legitimate shop would be to completely erase such laptops before reselling them. If it's possible that this shop makes a practice of looking through a user's files before erasing them . . . well, it's a good thing people know this now.

He didn't resell it. He doesn't say he was checking it before erasing it. He claims to have been checking it because he thought it could have evidence on it relating to the impeachment. I'm not sure whether it is more or less of a breach of trust than leaking Trump's tax records.

Quote:

Originally Posted by xjx388 (Post 13263969)
Basically, this guy just showed everyone that your worst fears (having your privacy violated by an unscrupulous and independent shop owner) are very very possible. An Authorized Apple shop or Apple itself isn't going to do this because the risks are too high. Apple has been very clear that they aren't in the business of turning over their user's info to law enforcement.

Apple may well not have done this, but it clearly happens. PC World in the UK finding child porn on Gary Glitters laptop is the obvious example. We are living in a world where Facebook and Twitter go through people's private messages. Personally, if I had evidence that could be used to undermine a candidate for the Presidency's election chances, I wouldn't trust Apple either. Are we 100% sure that if Trump Jnr took a laptop into an Apple store for data recovery, and it contained the fabled Trump pee photos, we wouldn't get to hear about it?

Skeptic Ginger 20th October 2020 10:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ziggurat (Post 13263338)
Here’s the kicker: the provenance of the laptop is actually the least interesting part of all this. The real issue is the authenticity of the emails themselves.

And Hunter isn’t claiming they aren’t real. I wonder why.

Why the **** should he? I posted this before.

You deny it and the idiots who think this story has real credibility will just call you a liar.

Next they'll say, well if this [absurdly ludicrous] story is not true, provide some evidence....

And on and on and on.

The story is crap! Why are you buying it?

fishbob 20th October 2020 10:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TahiniBinShawarma (Post 13263939)
Cute, but no.

Logic fail documented and response fail noted.

Giordano 20th October 2020 10:59 AM

I agree that it is very unlikely the computer tech initiated the scam. I think someone else, probably Russians seeking to disrupt the election, used the computer tech to implant the bogus hard drive by offering it to Rudi.

Skeptic Ginger 20th October 2020 11:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silly Green Monkey (Post 13263374)
Without Fox News bothering to verify the signature on the invoice, they are spreading mere hearsay. By linking to their hearsay, you are also spreading hearsay. Hearsay is worthless and not evidence.

Here's a clip of Maria B on Fox drawing a pizzeria-conclusion about Hunter Biden and pedophilia. This is the level these idiots operate on:

YouTube Video This video is not hosted by the ISF. The ISF can not be held responsible for the suitability or legality of this material. By clicking the link below you agree to view content from an external website.
I AGREE



Here's more for your entertainment is the unbelievable thing, "the unmasking".

YouTube Video This video is not hosted by the ISF. The ISF can not be held responsible for the suitability or legality of this material. By clicking the link below you agree to view content from an external website.
I AGREE

JoeMorgue 20th October 2020 11:15 AM

*Wheels the chalkboard into the room...*

Okay so.... the evil Jewish cabal... in associations with the NWO (both the evil global conspiracy and the 90s Wrestling Stable)... built the Denver Airport... as a place to hide Hillary's E-mail server... to cover up the fact the she killed Vince Foster... to prevent him from talking about her secret underground pizza parlor child sex dungeon... and the pieces that connect the dots where all on Hunter Biden's laptop.

TahiniBinShawarma 20th October 2020 11:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger (Post 13263987)
Why the **** should he? I posted this before.

You deny it and the idiots who think this story has real credibility will just call you a liar.

Next they'll say, well if this [absurdly ludicrous] story is not true, provide some evidence....

And on and on and on.

The story is crap! Why are you buying it?

Alternatively, you dont deny it, because they are your emails.

dirtywick 20th October 2020 11:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Giordano (Post 13263994)
I agree that it is very unlikely the computer tech initiated the scam. I think someone else, probably Russians seeking to disrupt the election, used the computer tech to implant the bogus hard drive by offering it to Rudi.

Rudy has been palling around in eastern Europe with Russian intelligence agents for a few years now. They probably just gave the laptop to Rudy and Rudy paid the computer guy to say he had it the whole time. Much easier that way imo

BStrong 20th October 2020 11:52 AM

I'll just throw this out there.

In the late 1990's our department made an arrest of an individual for sending pornograpic materials to a minor.

The minor was their employers child.

They used their work computer to download the materials and send same to the minor.

I have no idea about the particulars of Hunter Biden past what is being argued about, but computers and criminal stupidity sometimes run hand-in-hand.

surrogate 20th October 2020 12:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xjx388 (Post 13263969)
OK, but even if it's true that the laptop became legally his after X time, it's still a gross violation of privacy. The standard procedure of any legitimate shop would be to completely erase such laptops before reselling them. If it's possible that this shop makes a practice of looking through a user's files before erasing them . . . well, it's a good thing people know this now.

Basically, this guy just showed everyone that your worst fears (having your privacy violated by an unscrupulous and independent shop owner) are very very possible. An Authorized Apple shop or Apple itself isn't going to do this because the risks are too high. Apple has been very clear that they aren't in the business of turning over their user's info to law enforcement.

If he is willing to snoop through emails, chances are he would have no problem looking at pictures, videos, saved passwords, and any other documents. He also doesn't charge very much for his service. $85 to backup 3 laptops is less than I would charge if I was running a business.

StillSleepy 20th October 2020 12:12 PM

Just the cynic in me talking, but snooping through his clients' PCs is probably how he gets his rates that low.

shuttlt 20th October 2020 12:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by surrogate (Post 13264080)
If he is willing to snoop through emails, chances are he would have no problem looking at pictures, videos, saved passwords, and any other documents. He also doesn't charge very much for his service. $85 to backup 3 laptops is less than I would charge if I was running a business.

Often you have an initial charge to take a look, and then another larger charge to restore the data. This seems more in line with the initial charge to take a look. It doesn't seem to be a complete bill as it is only for labour, so the external drive would presumably be extra.

Stacyhs 20th October 2020 12:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Giordano (Post 13263994)
I agree that it is very unlikely the computer tech initiated the scam. I think someone else, probably Russians seeking to disrupt the election, used the computer tech to implant the bogus hard drive by offering it to Rudi.

I've little doubt this is a classic Russia misinformation plant using Giuliani as its useful idiot. He's proven himself to be more than a willing stooge before. And there is no lack of other Trump sycophants happy to help.

TahiniBinShawarma 20th October 2020 12:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stacyhs (Post 13264098)
I've little doubt this is a classic Russia misinformation plant using Giuliani as its useful idiot. He's proven himself to be more than a willing stooge before. And there is no lack of other Trump sycophants happy to help.


Make up your mind, is he a useful idiot or a willing stooge? You're running in circles.

TheL8Elvis 20th October 2020 12:36 PM

you know what, never mind. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes

Minoosh 20th October 2020 12:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TahiniBinShawarma (Post 13263345)
And because no where in the reported story does Andrii Derkach make an appearance.

Prove Andrii Derkach wasn't involved. Should be easy.

Quote:

Originally Posted by TahiniBinShawarma (Post 13263345)
Unless you have some inside information, the hardware was left at a repair shop by Hunter Biden. The FBI was contacted through an intermediary, then given to the FBI under a Grand Jury subpoena. A copy was given through the mediator of the repair shop guy to Robert Costello who is Giuliani's attorney.

The truth doesn't depend on whether I have inside information. But I think the likeliest explanation for what we know so far is that the FBI is probing a possible Russian disinformation campaign, such as the ones that federal investigators, U.S. intelligence agencies and bipartisan congressional committees have been warning us about for literally years, and which DJT has spent his entire presidency furiously denying.

shuttlt 20th October 2020 01:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Minoosh (Post 13264140)
The truth doesn't depend on whether I have inside information. But I think the likeliest explanation for what we know so far is that the FBI is probing a possible Russian disinformation campaign, such as the ones that federal investigators, U.S. intelligence agencies and bipartisan congressional committees have been warning us about for literally years, and which DJT has spent his entire presidency furiously denying.

The FBI had better come out with some details soon, or in your scenario, they will have known about a Russian plan to influence the election a year out and silently let it run its course.

TahiniBinShawarma 20th October 2020 01:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Minoosh (Post 13264140)
Prove Andrii Derkach wasn't involved. Should be easy.

The truth doesn't depend on whether I have inside information. But I think the likeliest explanation for what we know so far is that the FBI is probing a possible Russian disinformation campaign, such as the ones that federal investigators, U.S. intelligence agencies and bipartisan congressional committees have been warning us about for literally years, and which DJT has spent his entire presidency furiously denying.


Asked and answered, even the daily beast article says former associate, which was highlighted for you. I cant find Andrii's name on anything related to these emails. You asking to prove a negative is rich. Although that's all you have because evidence he is involved is non existant otherwise youd post it.

JoeMorgue 20th October 2020 01:13 PM

*Raises hand* Question.

Who... the... ****... cares?

Hunter Biden isn't running for President. Even if the laptop contains a map showing where Jimmy Hoffa is buried what does this have to do with Donald Trump being unfit to coach a Little League team, Joe Biden, or the cost of tea in China?

Hunter Biden can go to jail and I'll still for Joe Biden over Donald Trump.

Armitage72 20th October 2020 01:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shuttlt (Post 13264153)
The FBI had better come out with some details soon, or in your scenario, they will have known about a Russian plan to influence the election a year out and silently let it run its course.


Like they did last time?

Babbylonian 20th October 2020 01:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shuttlt (Post 13264153)
The FBI had better come out with some details soon, or in your scenario, they will have known about a Russian plan to influence the election a year out and silently let it run its course.

Except that we've been told over and over again that Russia definitely tampered with the 2016 election and that they've been working on this one for a long time, too.

Just because something isn't in Trump tweets, making headlines in The New York Post and The Washington Times, and/or the top story on Fox News and OANN doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

We need the FBI to inform us about Russian election interference about as much as we need them to inform us that water is wet.

Elagabalus 20th October 2020 01:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JoeMorgue (Post 13264164)
*Raises hand* Question.

Who... the... ****... cares?

Hunter Biden isn't running for President. Even if the laptop contains a map showing where Jimmy Hoffa is buried what does this have to do with Donald Trump being unfit to coach a Little League team, Joe Biden, or the cost of tea in China?

Hunter Biden can go to jail and I'll still for Joe Biden over Donald Trump.

But is Hunter the son of Sparkling Wine or the son of Champagne? Look over there!!!

TahiniBinShawarma 20th October 2020 01:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JoeMorgue (Post 13264164)
*Raises hand* Question.

Who... the... ****... cares?

Hunter Biden isn't running for President. Even if the laptop contains a map showing where Jimmy Hoffa is buried what does this have to do with Donald Trump being unfit to coach a Little League team, Joe Biden, or the cost of tea in China?

Hunter Biden can go to jail and I'll still for Joe Biden over Donald Trump.


As has been explained 3 or 4 times now, the emails could possibly implicate Joe Biden receiving money through his son.

TahiniBinShawarma 20th October 2020 01:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Babbylonian (Post 13264178)
Except that we've been told over and over again that Russia definitely tampered with the 2016 election and that they've been working on this one for a long time, too.

Just because something isn't in Trump tweets, making headlines in The New York Post and The Washington Times, and/or the top story on Fox News and OANN doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

We need the FBI to inform us about Russian election interference about as much as we need them to inform us that water is wet.

Do you just believe things because you're told? Or would you like to see evidence?

JoeMorgue 20th October 2020 01:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TahiniBinShawarma (Post 13264180)
As has been explained 3 or 4 times now, the emails could possibly implicate Joe Biden receiving money through his son.

Oh really.

Well I have a shoe box in my closet that could implicate you in the Black Dahlia murders.

We're a lot of proven facts down the ladder from "Joe Biden did anything."

But yes I know let's argue about the bottle that Hunter Biden didn't beat a hooker to death was champagne or sparkling whine (pun intended.)

Elagabalus 20th October 2020 01:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TahiniBinShawarma (Post 13264180)
As has been explained 3 or 4 times now, the emails could possibly implicate Joe Biden receiving money through his son.

Which just happen to be the ones with no metadata. What are the chances?

TellyKNeasuss 20th October 2020 01:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by surrogate (Post 13264080)
$85 to backup 3 laptops is less than I would charge if I was running a business.

Best Buy apparently charges $49.99 just to EVALUATE whether it would be possible to recover data from a SINGLE damaged computer. It would cost much more to actually perform the work.

https://www.bestbuy.com/site/geek-sq...at748300502324


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