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-   -   Ongoing Adventures of Kyle Rittenhouse (http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=355895)

carlitos 15th December 2021 07:46 AM

Ongoing Adventures of Kyle Rittenhouse
 
Mr. Rittenhouse is no longer on trial and moving on to his next phase in life. Here we can discuss the social issues that surround these current events.

carlitos 15th December 2021 07:48 AM

For example
 
http://www.internationalskeptics.com...a002057793.jpg

Thermal 15th December 2021 07:57 AM

That's the pic they used? He still has the world's most punchable face.

Wake me up when the Kyle Rittenhouse speed bag hits the market.

Ziggurat 15th December 2021 08:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thermal (Post 13680180)
That's the pic they used? He still has the world's most punchable face.

Wake me up when the Kyle Rittenhouse speed bag hits the market.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thermal (Post 13679035)
Truth. Dying and killing are nothing to cheer about. It's always a somber affair, even when it has to be done.

I guess physical violence that stops short of death is all fun and games.

sackett 15th December 2021 08:13 AM

Someday he'll be old enough to grow a beard. That might help.

Not much. And remember, I said "might."

carlitos 15th December 2021 08:15 AM

If he's palling around with TPUSA, I wonder if they are paying for him to get some media training, working on his stump speech, etc.

Turning Point USA needs the younger folks like Kyle. The co-founder, Bill Montgomery, died of Covid 19 last year, and Charlie Kirk is a 28-year-old Boomer who sounds like someone's angry old uncle.

Thermal 15th December 2021 08:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ziggurat (Post 13680191)
I guess physical violence that stops short of death is all fun and games.

What part of that don't you understand? Yours truly is a huge fan of busting a mother ****** in the chops, both recreationally and as a method of expounding on philosophical differences. But don't kill them. Everyone deserves the chance to reconsider their life choices, or at least to fight another day.

Ziggurat 15th December 2021 08:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thermal (Post 13680206)
What part of that don't you understand? Yours truly is a huge fan of busting a mother ****** in the chops, both recreationally and as a method of expounding on philosophical differences. But don't kill them. Everyone deserves the chance to reconsider their life choices, or at least to fight another day.

What I don't understand is why you think that, once violence starts, it's easy to keep it from escalating to the point where someone does get killed. Violence is very much a slippery slope.

Thermal 15th December 2021 08:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ziggurat (Post 13680212)
What I don't understand is why you think that, once violence starts, it's easy to keep it from escalating to the point where someone does get killed. Violence is very much a slippery slope.

Lifelong experience, and observation of others.

Note that I didn't advocate actually hitting Kyle. It's the knowledge I have that he is a coward that makes him a focal point for my distaste of cowards, hence a good speed bag image.

And yes, his utter cowardice is a matter of public record now. If you willingly insert yourself into any kind of a brawl with a high powered rifle, having no other possible means of getting out other than to shoot your way out, ya bitch ass is a sniveling coward.

Ziggurat 15th December 2021 08:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thermal (Post 13680231)
Lifelong experience, and observation of others.

Note that I didn't advocate actually hitting Kyle. It's the knowledge I have that he is a coward that makes him a focal point for my distaste of cowards, hence a good speed bag image.

And yes, his utter cowardice is a matter of public record now. If you willingly insert yourself into any kind of a brawl with a high powered rifle, having no other possible means of getting out other than to shoot your way out, ya bitch ass is a sniveling coward.

I'm not really interested in your opinions of what constitutes cowardice or bravery, it has no relevance to public policy and thus serves no purpose but to justify your emotional response. But the Rittenhouse case seems like it's a prime example of exactly what I'm talking about. You described the situation as a "brawl", suggesting the level of violence wouldn't turn lethal on its own.

And yet, it did turn lethal. Participants other than Kyle initiated violence, knowing full well that a gun was present and might be used. And sure enough, violence escalated to lethal levels. You want to blame the presence of the gun, but fatal violence can happen even in the absence of a gun. I blame the willingness to initiate violence. Fatal violence cannot occur if nobody initiates violence.

sir drinks-a-lot 15th December 2021 08:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carlitos (Post 13680167)
Ongoing Adventures of Kyle Rittenhouse

I'm more interested in the Ongoing Adventures of Jussie Smollett.

Thermal 15th December 2021 09:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ziggurat (Post 13680246)
I'm not really interested in your opinions of what constitutes cowardice or bravery, it has no relevance to public policy and thus serves no purpose but to justify your emotional response.

Funny that you think my speed bag preferences are worthy of note, then. I wasn't aware that they impacted public policy. TIL.

Quote:

But the Rittenhouse case seems like it's a prime example of exactly what I'm talking about. You described the situation as a "brawl", suggesting the level of violence wouldn't turn lethal on its own.
No, that's your imagination (although excepting Kyle, it didn't). They can turn lethal, of course, just like driving to the grocery store for milk can. But it not the reasonable intent or expectation.

Quote:

And yet, it did turn lethal.
Thanks, Rittenhouse.

Quote:

Participants other than Kyle initiated violence, knowing full well that a gun was present and might be used. And sure enough, violence escalated to lethal levels. You want to blame the presence of the gun, but fatal violence can happen even in the absence of a gun. I blame the willingness to initiate violence. Fatal violence cannot occur if nobody initiates violence.
You truly don't get how these two went hand-in-hand, do you?

Like you, I don't blame the presence of the gun. I blame the guy who brought it in as his sole means of negotiating his way through a riot. That is "the willingness to initiate violence" in a nutshell. He willingly initiated lethal violence at an unarmed man who had not touched him, and who he could effortlessly retreat from. Hell, Rosenbaum couldn't stay on his feet without stumbling.

A gun as a means of last resort is fine. As a first and only choice, not fine.

But tis the subject of another thread. This one is, I believe, you calling me out for hypocrisy or something?

plague311 15th December 2021 09:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carlitos (Post 13680168)

It's a picture and they can't even get his tie straight? Or a suit that fits? Or square his shoulders? I had some nice things to say about him recently, I take all of them back. I thought he wanted to let it go and not use the incident to garner a lot of fame. It looks like, as is common with the right wing, he's just another grifter making money from being a douche.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sir drinks-a-lot (Post 13680251)
I'm more interested in the Ongoing Adventures of Jussie Smollett.

Then start a thread....Oh! Oh, you just wanted to throw in a whataboutism. That's on par with the quality level of any other post you make.

Ziggurat 15th December 2021 09:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thermal (Post 13680309)
But tis the subject of another thread. This one is, I believe, you calling me out for hypocrisy or something?

Not hypocrisy as such. You're drawing a distinction which I don't think is really justified, but it's not actually hypocritical.

Dr. Keith 15th December 2021 09:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sir drinks-a-lot (Post 13680251)
I'm more interested in the Ongoing Adventures of Jussie Smollett.

Iím more interested in how the Winter Olympics are going to deal with Covid.

Thermal 15th December 2021 09:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ziggurat (Post 13680331)
Not hypocrisy as such. You're drawing a distinction which I don't think is really justified, but it's not actually hypocritical.

My distinction relies on mutual consent, including the implied consent of unnecessarily placing yourself in a riot.

Goofy as it sounds, it's the Fight Club philosophy (if I remember the plot correctly). Better to get violent impulses out in the conventional way, than to buy and train with firearms, fantasizing about the opportunity to take it to the nuclear option as first option. Living with a bloody nose is better than being on trial for shooting an unarmed man that you could easily trot away from, IMO.

Ziggurat 15th December 2021 09:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thermal (Post 13680349)
My distinction relies on mutual consent

There never was mutual consent, and none of the people involved ever thought there was. Nor would there be in a hypothetical case of someone punching Kyle's "punchable" face.

Thermal 15th December 2021 09:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ziggurat (Post 13680355)
There never was mutual consent, and none of the people involved ever thought there was.

What should be the expected outcome in willingly placing yourself, adversarially and alone, in a riot?

Quote:

Nor would there be in a hypothetical case of someone punching Kyle's "punchable" face.
Noting that it is in fact "punchable" does not advocate physically doing so.

Thermal 15th December 2021 09:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Keith (Post 13680338)
Iím more interested in how the Winter Olympics are going to deal with Covid.

I worry occasionally about the livelihoods of hookers and porn stars too.

Ziggurat 15th December 2021 10:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thermal (Post 13680364)
What should be the expected outcome in willingly placing yourself, adversarially and alone, in a riot?

What should be the expected outcome of going to a bar late at night with a short skirt? That's consent right there.

:rolleyes:

Thermal 15th December 2021 10:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ziggurat (Post 13680392)
What should be the expected outcome of going to a bar late at night with a short skirt? That's consent right there.

:rolleyes:

No, a bar is a meeting place for socializing, usually with more than a nodding acquaintance with compliance with law, and often security or at least 911. Regardless of skirt length, the social contract is in place. She should have no reason to expect to be raped on a poll table.

A riot is a violent place where mother ******* are off the leash. Do you have an answer to my question?

Matthew Best 15th December 2021 10:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thermal (Post 13680402)
She should have no reason to expect to be raped on a poll table.

American elections are endlessly fascinating.

carlitos 15th December 2021 10:39 AM

Just a note that, when I wrote the thread title, I thought that this could be a place where we could discuss what Kyle Rittenhouse is up to, not Jussie Smollett, rape analogies or assault fantasies. I am not a moderator, but I thank you all for your consideration.

Brainster 15th December 2021 10:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sir drinks-a-lot (Post 13680251)
I'm more interested in the Ongoing Adventures of Jussie Smollett.

There will be a lot less amused speculation around here about Juss-Juss getting gang-raped than there was about Ky-Ky.

plague311 15th December 2021 10:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brainster (Post 13680445)
There will be a lot less amused speculation around here about Juss-Juss getting gang-raped than there was about Ky-Ky.

Can you guys take that **** to the Jussie thread, as carlitos requested? Not everyone cares about Jussie and it has zero relevance to this case.

Thermal 15th December 2021 11:03 AM

Can we fantasize about who Kyle would shoot if he ran across Jussie getting adventurously and ongoingly raped?

Ziggurat 15th December 2021 11:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thermal (Post 13680402)
No, a bar is a meeting place for socializing

And for meeting people to have sex with.

Quote:

A riot is a violent place where mother ******* are off the leash.
I don't accept that riots are themselves acceptable. I don't accept that people can unilaterally choose to abrogate the social contract that you can't just assault people. I don't accept that being present and abiding by the law constitutes any form of consent to be assaulted.

And you aren't noble for thinking that it is.

Quote:

Do you have an answer to my question?
I think I've made my answer clear: I don't think it matters after the fact. Just like it's worth pondering how short a skirt you should wear BEFORE you go to the bar, but is really of no concern afterwards.

Thermal 15th December 2021 11:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ziggurat (Post 13680460)
I don't accept that riots are themselves acceptable.

I didn't say it was. But there it is: a lawless and violent situation.

Quote:

I think I've made my answer clear:.
You have not. You've answered other questions that aren't being asked.

Posit: Jussie Smollett is being ongoingly gang raped on a pool table by men who have matching t-shirts on that say "Violently Gang Raping Men Against Their Will Over Here R Us". Kyle adventurously walks in the middle of it. What can Kyle reasonably expect to happen?


Eta: we really do need a thread dedicated to the scope of self defense. This argument comes up a lot.

Ziggurat 15th December 2021 11:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thermal (Post 13680510)
Posit: Jussie Smollett is being ongoingly gang raped on a pool table by men who have matching t-shirts on that say "Violently Gang Raping Men Against Their Will Over Here R Us". Kyle adventurously walks in the middle of it. What can Kyle reasonably expect to happen?

That's too far out of my experience to judge. Perhaps you have experience in such matters.

But I am less concerned by what I should expect to happen than I am in what I think people are justified in doing. One reason is that sometimes my expectations aren't justified because I don't fully understand a situation, another is that events can violate even fully justified expectations.

People are justified in being in public obeying the law. They are justified in defending themselves if attacked. They are not justified in attacking people unprovoked.

Dr. Keith 15th December 2021 12:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thermal (Post 13680377)
I worry occasionally about the livelihoods of hookers and porn stars too.

Now youíve made me concerned. Iíll have to do some looking into that.

Dr. Keith 15th December 2021 12:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carlitos (Post 13680431)
Just a note that, when I wrote the thread title, I thought that this could be a place where we could discuss what Kyle Rittenhouse is up to, not Jussie Smollett, rape analogies or assault fantasies. I am not a moderator, but I thank you all for your consideration.

So, we can talk about if Kyle is going the Winter Olympics and how that may impact the livelihood of hookers in the area?

shemp 15th December 2021 12:24 PM

I think "Ongoing Adventures of Kyle Rittenhouse" should be a reality show. Just put him in a house with several like-minded yokels and goons, give them some loaded guns, and leave the cameras running.

shemp 15th December 2021 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Keith (Post 13680556)
So, we can talk about if Kyle is going the Winter Olympics and how that may impact the livelihood of hookers in the area?

What, has he qualified for Biathlon? I'm not sure how good a skier he is, but he's got the shooting part down pat.

SuburbanTurkey 15th December 2021 12:29 PM

How much mileage you figure he gets out of this?

I can't recall how long Zimmerman was a right wing media darling, but it wasn't too long before he was resorting to being a professional scumbag, signing confederate art and the like for pocket change.

Doesn't really seem like it's worth it, a lifetime of stigma just to eek out maybe 6 months to a year of puff pieces on fashy podcasts.

Warp12 15th December 2021 12:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SuburbanTurkey (Post 13680571)
How much mileage you figure he gets out of this?

I can't recall how long Zimmerman was a right wing media darling, but it wasn't too long before he was resorting to being a professional scumbag, signing confederate art and the like for pocket change.

Doesn't really seem like it's worth it, a lifetime of stigma just to eek out maybe 6 months to a year of puff pieces on fashy podcasts.

Well, he'll probably at least get a book deal out of it, I imagine.

It may not be "worth it" for the fame and fortune, but at least he is alive. ;)

Dr. Keith 15th December 2021 01:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shemp (Post 13680566)
What, has he qualified for Biathlon? I'm not sure how good a skier he is, but he's got the shooting part down pat.

Some patriots even go as spectators. And to check on the livelihood of the local hookers. For research. And some go to sit in a booth with a microphone and talk to like minded patriots back home about how unAmerican so many foreigners are. Surely OAN will find KyKy doing some of the above.

Thermal 15th December 2021 01:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Warp12 (Post 13680587)
Well, he'll probably at least get a book deal out of it, I imagine.

It may not be "worth it" for the fame and fortune, but at least he is alive. ;)

Will it be one of those books where you can pick alternate endings?

Warp12 15th December 2021 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thermal (Post 13680597)
Will it be one of those books where you can pick alternate endings?

A romance angle and lover's quarrel with Rosenbaum?

Dr. Keith 15th December 2021 01:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thermal (Post 13680597)
Will it be one of those books where you can pick alternate endings?

I heard it was a picture book. Thatís the vogue amongst the GQP now.

Checkmite 15th December 2021 01:18 PM

Being able to kill people (the right kind of people) and escape legal consequences for doing so is a common power-fantasy of conservative gun owners, and anyone who manages to accomplish that in real life will attain celebrity in that community as a symbol of vicarious wish-fulfillment. This isn't surprising or compelling stuff.


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