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-   -   Maybe Trump will not be such a terrible president. (http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=313782)

Mycroft 9th November 2016 09:37 AM

Maybe Trump will not be such a terrible president.
 
He used to be a Democrat, the Republican establishment fought against him, and just because he draws the racist vote doesn't mean he will be a racist president.

He may turn out to be a centrist who can get things done.

Belz... 9th November 2016 09:39 AM

This is just you trying to console yourself, right?

NoahFence 9th November 2016 09:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mycroft (Post 11580400)
He used to be a Democrat, the Republican establishment fought against him, and just because he draws the racist vote doesn't mean he will be a racist president.

He may turn out to be a centrist who can get things done.

He's a moron. He's not a centrist. He's a moron. He's not a Democrat, or a Republican. He's a moron.

This isn't going to go well, and somehow being able to say "I told you so" when spoken on top of the ashes of my country doesn't give me comfort.

Tony Stark 9th November 2016 09:40 AM

I suppose it is not impossible but I doubt it. Hope I'm wrong.

Mycroft 9th November 2016 09:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Argumemnon (Post 11580405)
This is just you trying to console yourself, right?

Mythbusters proved you could indeed polish a turd.

I'm not looking forward to it, but it's not necessarily a disaster. At least he's not George W Bush.

dudalb 9th November 2016 09:49 AM

The Million dollar question is how much of what Donald did during the campaign was what he really thinks, and how much of it was just crap he spewed to get people to vote for Him?

baron 9th November 2016 09:50 AM

I think he'll surprise me, but only because my expectations are so low he can't help but exceed them. Yet another reason to be thankful I live in the UK.

Mycroft 9th November 2016 10:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dudalb (Post 11580439)
The Million dollar question is how much of what Donald did during the campaign was what he really thinks, and how much of it was just crap he spewed to get people to vote for Him?

That's the thing, right?

He's not going to build a wall or ban Muslims. He doesn't have the power to do that. Most of what he said campaigning is nonsensical, so we really have no idea what kind of president he will be.

dudalb 9th November 2016 10:07 AM

And there is bit too much End Of the World whining in a lot of the threads here.

Belz... 9th November 2016 10:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dudalb (Post 11580496)
And there is bit too much End Of the World whining in a lot of the threads here.

You're DOOMED! You're ALL DOOMED!!!

fuelair 9th November 2016 10:12 AM

Maybe Trump will not be such a terrible president.

Maybe **** won't stink anymore.

fuelair 9th November 2016 10:13 AM

Maybe cancer will turn out to be good for us.

Spindrift 9th November 2016 10:14 AM

He has only run his businesses in dictatorial, vengeful manner.

That is not going to play well, even with the Republicans in Congress. Remember, most of them despise him. They will get alone as long as he does what they want, which won't be for long if ever.

The only way Trump could be a good president is if right after taking the oath he has a massive coronary and falls on Mike Pence snapping Pence's neck on the way down. I'll take Paul Ryan over those two.

dudalb 9th November 2016 10:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spindrift (Post 11580514)
He has only run his businesses in dictatorial, vengeful manner.

That is not going to play well, even with the Republicans in Congress. Remember, most of them despise him. They will get alone as long as he does what they want, which won't be for long if ever.

The only way Trump could be a good president is if right after taking the oath he has a massive coronary and falls on Mike Pence snapping Pence's neck on the way down. I'll take Paul Ryan over those two.

And congress, regardless of party, is very militant about protecting it's powers and rights. There is a long history of Presidents having very bloody battles with congress when their party was in control when they felt the Presidnet was muscling into their turf.

Trebuchet 9th November 2016 10:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mycroft (Post 11580400)
He used to be a Democrat, the Republican establishment fought against him, and just because he draws the racist vote doesn't mean he will be a racist president.

He may turn out to be a centrist who can get things done.

And maybe the sun will rise in the West tomorrow. It's about as likely.

Emily's Cat 9th November 2016 10:24 AM

Meh. I think it's reflective of america's general dissatisfaction with politicians. Remember when Obama first ran? All the outcry about him not having enough political experience to hold that office? But he got voted in anyway, with a fair bit of support from people who tend to lean more to the conservative side. I think a lot of the same thing is at play here. Sure, there's all the campaign bluster and asinine comments, all the perceived racism and sexism, all the idiocy. But at the end of the day he isn't a politician. I suspect that played in to the outcome more than we'd like to think.

I know that I'm completely fed up with this two-party system. I'm tired of parties pursuing party interests, instead of the interests of the citizens. I'm sick of these ideologues using our system of government as their power game. None of them are actually governing the union responsibly.

Trump wouldn't have been my first choice, but neither would Clinton have been. I want someone different.

Upchurch 9th November 2016 10:39 AM

With the GOP in control of both houses of Congress and, presumably, the Executive and Judicial branches, the ACA is probably going to be repealed with the "pre-existing conditions" clause along with it. If that happens, it will be devastating to the millions of Americans who were able to get health insurance because of the ACA and especially my friends and family with kids who have survived, or are currently fighting, cancer.

If Trump follows through with his promise to repeal the ACA without immediately replacing it with ...something that hasn't even been mentioned yet, there will be no definition where Trump would not be considered a terrible president.


ETA: Of course, there is always the possibility that Trump was merely lying about repealing the ACA, as he has done about so many other things.

Tony Stark 9th November 2016 10:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Upchurch (Post 11580595)
With the GOP in control of both houses of Congress and, presumably, the Executive and Judicial branches, the ACA is probably going to be repealed with the "pre-existing conditions" clause along with it. If that happens, it will be devastating to the millions of Americans who were able to get health insurance because of the ACA and especially my friends and family with kids who have survived, or are currently fighting, cancer.

If Trump follows through with his promise to repeal the ACA without immediately replacing it with ...something that hasn't even been mentioned yet, there will be no definition where Trump would not be considered a terrible president.

Republicans are perfectly fine with *********** over millions of people to make sure rich people pay a little less in taxes.

They won't replace the ACA with anything worth mentioning. Maybe the backlash will work against them but I doubt it.

Belz... 9th November 2016 10:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Upchurch (Post 11580595)
With the GOP in control of both houses of Congress and, presumably, the Executive and Judicial branches, the ACA is probably going to be repealed with the "pre-existing conditions" clause along with it.

That's the one thing I'm pretty sure will happen.

autumn1971 9th November 2016 10:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spindrift (Post 11580514)
He has only run his businesses in dictatorial, vengeful manner.

That is not going to play well, even with the Republicans in Congress. Remember, most of them despise him. They will get alone as long as he does what they want, which won't be for long if ever.

The only way Trump could be a good president is if right after taking the oath he has a massive coronary and falls on Mike Pence snapping Pence's neck on the way down. I'll take Paul Ryan over those two.

Damn. We have reached a place where Paul Ryan would be a nice change.

If the UK is leaving the EU, maybe they could take back a misguided former colony? An Atlantic Union, perhaps? I would totally commit to treason against the USA in order to get a little sanity back.

Emily's Cat 9th November 2016 10:47 AM

From a purely selfish PoV, with no consideration to the greater issue, I really wish they'd just leave it alone. ACA isn't exactly great, but I don't care. Let the dust settle please. It's been an immense amount of work in my field, and for me personally, figuring out how to do business in this new marketplace. It's been an immense amount of capital investment. Is it too much to ask that we quit screwing around with it for a few more years? Give it a chance to see if it's working or not before we go messing with it?

BobTheCoward 9th November 2016 10:48 AM

He will be no worse for democrats than 2008 Obama with a democratic congress was for Republicans.

Belz... 9th November 2016 10:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Emily's Cat (Post 11580620)
From a purely selfish PoV, with no consideration to the greater issue, I really wish they'd just leave it alone. ACA isn't exactly great, but I don't care. Let the dust settle please. It's been an immense amount of work in my field, and for me personally, figuring out how to do business in this new marketplace. It's been an immense amount of capital investment. Is it too much to ask that we quit screwing around with it for a few more years? Give it a chance to see if it's working or not before we go messing with it?

Sorry, no. It's gotta go.

Caper 9th November 2016 10:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mycroft (Post 11580400)
He used to be a Democrat, the Republican establishment fought against him, and just because he draws the racist vote doesn't mean he will be a racist president.

He may turn out to be a centrist who can get things done.



Do you think the circle jerkers are going to even let you contemplate such a thought? The same people that have told you what was surely going to happen over the last year and were embarrassed last night (they should be but they won't), are going to come back with just as much bombast and tell you they know who this will play out. AND ANY differing opinions from the hive mentality, that permeates this forum, will be ridiculed and eliminated until you fall back into ideological group think.

dudalb 9th November 2016 10:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tony Stark (Post 11580616)
Republicans are perfectly fine with *********** over millions of people to make sure rich people pay a little less in taxes.

They won't replace the ACA with anything worth mentioning. Maybe the backlash will work against them but I doubt it.

I disagree . The Horror stories about people losing their health coverage will be a huge story. The GOP will have to come up with SOMETHING,and it can't just be a empty measure. There will be a backlash if they try that..and a pretty big one.

Spindrift 9th November 2016 11:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Upchurch (Post 11580595)
With the GOP in control of both houses of Congress and, presumably, the Executive and Judicial branches, the ACA is probably going to be repealed with the "pre-existing conditions" clause along with it. If that happens, it will be devastating to the millions of Americans who were able to get health insurance because of the ACA and especially my friends and family with kids who have survived, or are currently fighting, cancer.

If Trump follows through with his promise to repeal the ACA without immediately replacing it with ...something that hasn't even been mentioned yet, there will be no definition where Trump would not be considered a terrible president.


ETA: Of course, there is always the possibility that Trump was merely lying about repealing the ACA, as he has done about so many other things.

Worse than this is to allow insurance companies to operate across state lines. There are a lot of states that have their own 'pre-existing condition' clause. If insurance companies can operate across state lines then that will get around the state laws as well. So many people don't understand how devastating that will be to them. You have cancer? Sorry, but we won't pay for your treatment because your spouse changed jobs and insurance plans. You child is allergic. Sorry that's a pre-existing condition and we're not paying for those $600 epi-pens. Your gall bladder needs to be taken out? Sorry we're not paying for that because you were diagnosed with gall bladder issues before you changed jobs.

Tony Stark 9th November 2016 11:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dudalb (Post 11580648)
I disagree . The Horror stories about people losing their health coverage will be a huge story. The GOP will have to come up with SOMETHING,and it can't just be a empty measure. There will be a backlash if they try that..and a pretty big one.

I hope you're right.

casebro 9th November 2016 11:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mycroft (Post 11580400)
He used to be a Democrat, the Republican establishment fought against him, and just because he draws the racist vote doesn't mean he will be a racist president.

He may turn out to be a centrist who can get things done.

Better yet, not a centrist but a pragmatist who doesn't care about politics, but just might seize any opportunity to get things fixed in this country.

Problem is that what he thinks needs fixing is not what the majority on this board think needs fixing.

Tony Stark 9th November 2016 11:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by casebro (Post 11580694)
Better yet, not a centrist but a pragmatist who doesn't care about politics, but just might seize any opportunity to get things fixed in this country.

Problem is that what he thinks needs fixing is not what the majority on this board think needs fixing.

Yes what needs fixing is that rich people don't have enough money. Obviously we need to give them tax cuts. Not like that will increase the national debt, something he claims is a big problem.

Spindrift 9th November 2016 11:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by casebro (Post 11580694)
Better yet, not a centrist but a pragmatist who doesn't care about politics, but just might seize any opportunity to get things fixed in this country.

Problem is that what he thinks needs fixing is not what the majority on this board think needs fixing.

What is he going to fix? And how?

ACA? Without a replacement millions of people lose insurance and many die.

Immigration? Still waiting to hear how Mexico is going to pay for that wall. And for those people whose land is seized to build that wall, **** em. How about an another Operation Wetback? That should please all the farmers with their crops rotting in the fields.

ISIS? The generals are waiting for Donald to tell them how they can be defeated.

China? A trade war? And when that first Christmas comes around and there are no toys on the shelves he will be the President that destroyed Christmas.

Global Climate Change? Since it's a fraud, I guess this will appeal to all those in Tennessee wanting ocean front propety.

NoahFence 9th November 2016 11:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Argumemnon (Post 11580638)
Sorry, no. It's gotta go.

No, it doesn't "gotta go"

It needs to have its flaws identified and addressed. It needs to be improved upon.

lionking 9th November 2016 11:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spindrift (Post 11580720)
What is he going to fix? And how?

ACA? Without a replacement millions of people lose insurance and many die.

Immigration? Still waiting to hear how Mexico is going to pay for that wall. And for those people whose land is seized to build that wall, **** em. How about an another Operation Wetback? That should please all the farmers with their crops rotting in the fields.

ISIS? The generals are waiting for Donald to tell them how they can be defeated.

China? A trade war? And when that first Christmas comes around and there are no toys on the shelves he will be the President that destroyed Christmas.

Global Climate Change? Since it's a fraud, I guess this will appeal to all those in Tennessee wanting ocean front propety.

All very good points, but it's the last two which will have huge global consequences. A trade war between the two largest economies? That's sure to end well.

If the US repudiates commitments to reduce greenhouse gasses, many, many other countries will follow suit. Out of control warming will be the consequence.

The only way Trump will be not such a terrible president would be if drops these dangerous policy commitments. Can you see a man of such ego say "Well I've had a look at some things I said during the campaign, and will do things differently"? I can't.

foophil 9th November 2016 11:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spindrift (Post 11580657)
Worse than this is to allow insurance companies to operate across state lines. There are a lot of states that have their own 'pre-existing condition' clause. If insurance companies can operate across state lines then that will get around the state laws as well. So many people don't understand how devastating that will be to them. You have cancer? Sorry, but we won't pay for your treatment because your spouse changed jobs and insurance plans. You child is allergic. Sorry that's a pre-existing condition and we're not paying for those $600 epi-pens. Your gall bladder needs to be taken out? Sorry we're not paying for that because you were diagnosed with gall bladder issues before you changed jobs.


But the Free Market will take care of all that! Or something. ;)

lionking 9th November 2016 11:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by foophil (Post 11580750)
But the Free Market will take care of all that! Or something. ;)

That, and the poor will simply have to save for their future health care. Simple.

Belz... 9th November 2016 11:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NoahFence (Post 11580735)
No, it doesn't "gotta go"

It needs to have its flaws identified and addressed. It needs to be improved upon.

Pfft. You and your reasonable arguments are no match for freedom logic.

Spindrift 9th November 2016 11:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lionking (Post 11580756)
That, and the poor will simply have to save for their future health care burial. Simple.

ftfy

BStrong 9th November 2016 11:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NoahFence (Post 11580409)
He's a moron. He's not a centrist. He's a moron. He's not a Democrat, or a Republican. He's a moron.

This isn't going to go well, and somehow being able to say "I told you so" when spoken on top of the ashes of my country doesn't give me comfort.

I'll take the sage words of Peter Townsend as my guide.

I'll give the man the benefit of the doubt as POTUS, but the man is a classless prick.

If anyone wants to burn me at the stake for voting third party have at it, but I could no more vote for Clinton or Trump than grow wings and fly.

ponderingturtle 9th November 2016 11:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Emily's Cat (Post 11580620)
From a purely selfish PoV, with no consideration to the greater issue, I really wish they'd just leave it alone. ACA isn't exactly great, but I don't care. Let the dust settle please. It's been an immense amount of work in my field, and for me personally, figuring out how to do business in this new marketplace. It's been an immense amount of capital investment. Is it too much to ask that we quit screwing around with it for a few more years? Give it a chance to see if it's working or not before we go messing with it?

That is impossible they have made to much effort talking about repealing it and the preexisting conditions was the counter part of mandatory coverage. So of course preexisting conditions and life time maximums of health care cost are coming back.

ponderingturtle 9th November 2016 11:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spindrift (Post 11580657)
Worse than this is to allow insurance companies to operate across state lines. There are a lot of states that have their own 'pre-existing condition' clause. If insurance companies can operate across state lines then that will get around the state laws as well. So many people don't understand how devastating that will be to them. You have cancer? Sorry, but we won't pay for your treatment because your spouse changed jobs and insurance plans. You child is allergic. Sorry that's a pre-existing condition and we're not paying for those $600 epi-pens. Your gall bladder needs to be taken out? Sorry we're not paying for that because you were diagnosed with gall bladder issues before you changed jobs.

Insurance doesn't cover $600 epipens now. Has to do with how it is classified. That is why there was outrage, the consumer saw the price of the medicine increasing instead of just their premium.

CynicalSkeptic 9th November 2016 12:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Argumemnon (Post 11580638)
Sorry, no. It's gotta go.

TRUMP: “Everybody's got to be covered. This is an un-Republican thing for me to say because a lot of times they say, 'No, no, the lower 25 percent that can't afford private. But—'”

PELLEY: “Universal health care.”

TRUMP: “I am going to take care of everybody. I don't care if it costs me votes or not. Everybody's going to be taken care of much better than they're taken care of now.”


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