• Quick note - the problem with Youtube videos not embedding on the forum appears to have been fixed, thanks to ZiprHead. If you do still see problems let me know.

Cont: The behaviour of US police officers - part 2

Status
Not open for further replies.
erlando said:
Civil forfeiture is a scandal. How a nation such as the USA has such a practice is beyond belief.
Click to expand...

Easy by its nature it targets the disenfranchised, those who don't trust the banking system and deal in cash. A money order or cashiers check is how the enfranchised deal with such issues. So as the victims are these minorities why it gives clear reason why the nation does not care.
 
Cops were probably jealous they couldn't join in.

911 transcripts filed in updated “Trump Train” lawsuit reveal San Marcos police refused to send escort to Biden bus
The highway confrontation between a Biden bus and Trump supporters made national news in the final days of the heated 2020 presidential campaign. The incident involved at least one minor collision and led to Texas Democrats canceling three scheduled campaign events.

...

The lawsuit alleges that by refusing the help, law enforcement officers violated the Ku Klux Klan Act of 1871 because they were aware of “acts of violent political intimidation” but did not take appropriate steps to prevent the Trump supporters from intimidating eligible voters.

The provision of the Klan Act that the plaintiffs are citing in the lawsuit has laid dormant for years, but saw a resurgence under the Trump administration, according to Project Democracy lawyer John Paredes, who is representing some of the plaintiffs. It was also recently cited in a federal lawsuit against Trump after the Jan. 6 insurrection.
Click to expand...

https://www.texastribune.org/2021/10/29/trump-train-texas-highway-crash-police/?utm_campaign=trib-social-buttons&utm_source=twitter&utm_medium=social

Dusting off the classics because cops still sympathize with right wing lynch mobs.

The 911 dispatcher in San Marcos put the New Braunfels dispatcher and the Biden campaign staffer who was pleading for assistance on hold and called Daenzer, the police supervisor on duty.

“I am so annoyed at New Braunfels for doing this to us,” the dispatcher tells Daenzer, who answered the call and began laughing, according to the transcribed recording in the filing. “They have their officers escorting this Biden bus, essentially, and the Trump Train is cutting in between vehicles and driving — being aggressive and slowing them down to like 20 or 30 miles per hour. And they want you guys to respond to help.”

“No, we’re not going to do it. We will ‘close patrol’ that, but we’re not going to escort a bus,” Daenzer responds.

The transcript shows that the 911 dispatcher passes along information about the sense of danger expressed by the Biden campaign staffer who called for assistance as he was trying to caravan behind the bus in a white SUV.
Click to expand...

Of course, once facing scrutiny the cops decided to lie:

Yet in the days afterward, after news of the melee spread, officers started calling the event a “debacle” in internal emails and braced for a “political fire storm” after officers realized that what happened in San Marcos “might lead to political and legal consequences,” the complaint alleges.

When Daenzer wrote the report of the incident four days later, he said “due to the staffing issues, lack of time to plan, and lack of knowledge of the route, we were unable to provide an escort.”

A spokesperson for the city of San Marcos told The Texas Tribune last year that police responded to requests to assist the bus, but traffic prevented officers from catching up before the bus left the city limits.
Click to expand...
 
Last edited:
Yet in the days afterward, after news of the melee spread, officers started calling the event a “debacle” in internal emails and braced for a “political fire storm” after officers realized that what happened in San Marcos “might lead to political and legal consequences,” the complaint alleges.

When Daenzer wrote the report of the incident four days later, he said “due to the staffing issues, lack of time to plan, and lack of knowledge of the route, we were unable to provide an escort.”

A spokesperson for the city of San Marcos told The Texas Tribune last year that police responded to requests to assist the bus, but traffic prevented officers from catching up before the bus left the city limits.
Click to expand...

If only there was some way for police vehicles to get through traffic faster, say, with sirens and flashing blue lights? I think we should get to work inventing that, the poor chaps certainly could use the help.
 
shemp said:
If only there was some way for police vehicles to get through traffic faster, say, with sirens and flashing blue lights? I think we should get to work inventing that, the poor chaps certainly could use the help.
Click to expand...

To be fair, there probably was pretty heavy traffic considering a bunch of CHUDs in trucks were driving erratically on the freeway trying to intimidate a political campaign.
 
Experts contend that female cops are less violent and more effective than men.
A growing number of police reform advocates say the way to fix the policing problem in America might be to hire more female police officers. In fact, they say gender parity was a key item missing from the conversation when, in the wake of a series of high-profile police shootings of Black Americans in 2020, a federal police reform bill made its way this year to the halls of Congress. That bill tanked in September.
....
This difference has profound consequences. Earlier studies concluded that “the average male officer is over eight and a half times more likely than his female counterpart to have an allegation of excessive force sustained against him,” and that “female officers are less personally challenged by defiant suspects and feel less need to deal with defiance with immediate force or confrontational language.”
Click to expand...
https://slate.com/news-and-politics...ling-is-it-time-to-hire-more-female-cops.html
 
SuburbanTurkey said:
Veteran Inglewood police officer arrested for trafficking narcotics



https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2021-10-29/inglewood-police-officer-arrested-faces-federal-drug-trafficking-charges
Click to expand...

more info on this:

This guy, the vice president of the local police union, was driving a ferrari with no license plate delivering samples of cocaine to a federal undercover.

Five days later, on April 26, the informant followed law enforcement instructions to meet with Baca to discuss the police officer providing a sample of cocaine. The buyer would then deliver this sample to his “buyer” — the federal government, unbeknownst to Baca. Baca also stated he had five kilograms of “China White,” a type of heroin, “that’s still lingering around.” The informant asked for the going price, to which Baca responded “Sell it to them for ******* 10,” meaning $10,000. Three days later, Baca delivered the cocaine sample driving a dark grey Ferrari California with no license plate, which are required in the state of California. According to the complaint, GPS data indicates that Baca visited Ekonomo’s home shortly before he delivered one kilogram of cocaine to the informant one week later, and at least seven additional times between May and August of 2021. Baca was also recorded discussing marijuana cultivation operations in the Lucerne Valley.
Click to expand...

https://knock-la.com/john-baca-inglewood-police-officer-arrested-narcotics-fbi/

Doesn't seem to have been trying to hide his moonlight career very hard, but I guess the good apples didn't notice.
 
SuburbanTurkey said:
more info on this:

This guy, the vice president of the local police union, was driving a ferrari with no license plate delivering samples of cocaine to a federal undercover.



https://knock-la.com/john-baca-inglewood-police-officer-arrested-narcotics-fbi/

Doesn't seem to have been trying to hide his moonlight career very hard, but I guess the good apples didn't notice.
Click to expand...

Is the vice president of the police union elected by the members of the union? If so this is who the good apples deem to be an even better apple.
 
Another guilty plea thrown out when video of the cop planting the drugs becomes public. (Yahoo link)

When I say 'another', I mean 'another from the same officer.' Prosecutors withheld from the defense not just the body cam video that shows Erickson planting drugs, but that Erickson had done so before.

In a sane system Erickson and the prosecutors would be up on criminal charges. Guess what punishment this NYPD officer will get? (If you said 'nothing substantive' you'd be right.)
 
tyr_13 said:
Another guilty plea thrown out when video of the cop planting the drugs becomes public. (Yahoo link)

When I say 'another', I mean 'another from the same officer.' Prosecutors withheld from the defense not just the body cam video that shows Erickson planting drugs, but that Erickson had done so before.

In a sane system Erickson and the prosecutors would be up on criminal charges. Guess what punishment this NYPD officer will get? (If you said 'nothing substantive' you'd be right.)
Click to expand...

You'd think committing a Brady violation is something that would result in the prosecutor responsible having their license revoked and cast out of their office in shame, but that's not the kind of accountability we have in this country for law enforcers.
 
tyr_13 said:
Another guilty plea thrown out when video of the cop planting the drugs becomes public. (Yahoo link)

When I say 'another', I mean 'another from the same officer.' Prosecutors withheld from the defense not just the body cam video that shows Erickson planting drugs, but that Erickson had done so before.

In a sane system Erickson and the prosecutors would be up on criminal charges. Guess what punishment this NYPD officer will get? (If you said 'nothing substantive' you'd be right.)
Click to expand...

The most effective consequences I've seen is when things like this suddenly jeopardize a whole bunch of past prosecutions. Every person ever put away by this guy suddenly demanding a case review. That's quite a deterrent to allowing such things to go on.
 
gnome said:
The most effective consequences I've seen is when things like this suddenly jeopardize a whole bunch of past prosecutions. Every person ever put away by this guy suddenly demanding a case review. That's quite a deterrent to allowing such things to go on.
Click to expand...

More frequently, it seems to be an incentive for a coverup.
 
tyr_13 said:
Another guilty plea thrown out when video of the cop planting the drugs becomes public. (Yahoo link)

When I say 'another', I mean 'another from the same officer.' Prosecutors withheld from the defense not just the body cam video that shows Erickson planting drugs, but that Erickson had done so before.

In a sane system Erickson and the prosecutors would be up on criminal charges. Guess what punishment this NYPD officer will get? (If you said 'nothing substantive' you'd be right.)
Click to expand...

What do you want from the police - they didn't stomp on him and kill him!

Shesh the public!
 
Two former Oklahoma police officers convicted of second-degree murder

CARTER COUNTY, Okla. (KFOR) – Two former Oklahoma police officers have been convicted of murder in connection with the death of a 28-year-old man.

Shortly before midnight on July 4, 2019, officers from the Wilson Police Department were called to a disorderly conduct investigation.

Authorities say 25-year-old Joshua Taylor and 34-year-old Brandon Dingman, both officers with the Wilson Police Department, responded to the scene.

When they arrived, they saw 28-year-old Jared Lakey.

Investigators say when Lakey would not comply with commands from the officers, Taylor and Dingman used their tasers 53 times.

A Carter County deputy also responded to the scene and was able to help get Lakey into custody.

A short time later, Lakey stopped breathing and became unresponsive. He later died.
Click to expand...

"Your Honor, we're innocent, he threw himself at our tasers 53 times!"
 
No charges for cop who killed a good Samaritan who stopped an active shooter:

“Though the acts of John Hurley were nothing short of heroic, the facts must be viewed as they appeared to Officer Brownlow at the time and future developments are irrelevant to the legal analysis,” King wrote in her letter. “Officer Brownlow did not know, and could not have known from his vantage point, of the murder of Officer Beesley or of Hurley’s role in eliminating the threat posed by the man in black. Rather, based upon information known to Brownlow, the presence of a mass shooter, and the potential for a second mass shooter in a red shirt carrying a rifle and a handgun turned toward a hub of community activity, warranted deadly force and no lesser degree of force would eliminate the potential threat.”

Brownlow did not issue a warning or commands before opening fire, King said Monday. Brownlow attended a training on how to respond to an active shooter on March 31, she wrote in her letter.
Click to expand...

https://www.denverpost.com/2021/11/08/olde-town-arvada-shooting-johnny-hurley/

The shooter ambushed a cop with a shotgun, killing him, before being shot himself by a bystander, who was later gunned down by responding police. Remember kids, if a madman starts killing cops, don't intervene.
 
SuburbanTurkey said:
No charges for cop who killed a good Samaritan who stopped an active shooter:



https://www.denverpost.com/2021/11/08/olde-town-arvada-shooting-johnny-hurley/

The shooter ambushed a cop with a shotgun, killing him, before being shot himself by a bystander, who was later gunned down by responding police. Remember kids, if a madman starts killing cops, don't intervene.
Click to expand...
Pretty much the exact scenario I talk about every time I hear someone go on about the "good guy with a gun" theory.
 
Checkmite said:
Louisiana man who had life savings seized by DEA agents without being charged with a crime, wins legal battle to get the money returned

Kermit Warren, a New Orleans man, brought nearly $30,000 cash with him in his carry-on luggage on a flight to Columbus, Ohio last November, intending to buy a tow truck there. The money represented his life savings, and as he had lost his shoe-shine job due to the pandemic, he wanted the truck to supplement a new living collecting and selling scrap. The sale of the truck was not completed, however; and on his way through the airport to catch his return flight, he was stopped by DEA agents who seized the money when he panicked and gave unsatisfying answers to their questions about it, including one false offhand remark about having been a former police officer. Warren was never charged with anything at any point - or even arrested - he was allowed to continue on his flight; but the money was summarily confiscated. It has taken him and his lawyer all year to prove his innocence to a point that satisfied the government enough to order the return of the money.

Law enforcement at all levels of government are empowered to seize money and property found during "investigations" that never lead to charges, under the argument that even if an actual crime is never found and nobody is ever charged with anything, there are certain amounts of cash money and/or certain ways of carrying it that law enforcement officers "just know" can only reasonably be explained by drug criminality and any other reasoning given by someone in possession of such an amount is inherently absurd and dishonest (an argument that has been made unironically by some in this very forum, it must be said); and thus, the money can be unilaterally declared criminal proceeds without any known crime attached to it and seized by law enforcement authorities.

Since the money is at once "criminal" in nature but not technically "evidence" in any case, the agency that seizes the money is not required to keep it, but (with some superficial restrictions that vary from jurisdiction to jurisdiction) is generally free to spend that money however they wish.
Click to expand...

It doesn't say, but I'm going to guess they worked it out to give the money back without admitting they did anything wrong, and without changing any rules about when police can do that. So that the next sucker has to fight the same fight.
 
Delphic Oracle said:
Pretty much the exact scenario I talk about every time I hear someone go on about the "good guy with a gun" theory.
Click to expand...

Every concealed weapons course I've ever taken has really emphasized that, in the event of a defensive shooting, you really, really don't want to have a gun in your hand or even near you when the cops show up. It's generally understood that the cops will shoot first and ask questions later, even among this mostly right wing crowd.
 
gnome said:
It doesn't say, but I'm going to guess they worked it out to give the money back without admitting they did anything wrong, and without changing any rules about when police can do that. So that the next sucker has to fight the same fight.
Click to expand...

It's not so the next sucker has to fight. It's so the next 4/5 suckers won't even try to fight.
 
A cop slapped a handcuffed man dying of a drug overdose. Called him a “bitch.” Shoved a baton in his mouth. That cop got suspended 6 days. But the cop who revealed the cruelty was expelled from the cop union. Now faces 20 years prison for whistleblowing.

Members of the Joliet Illinois Police Union voted 35-1 to expel Javier Esqueda for exposing footage of police abuse. “In a letter informing him of the vote, union leaders described his conduct as “reprehensible.” Not the cops though who shoved a baton down a dying man’s throat.

https://usatoday.com/story/news/inv...today-behind-the-blue-wall-series/6396601001/
 
JoeMorgue said:
But unions are our friends and gave us the weekend and labor day...
Click to expand...

Do you still have the receipt for your unions? They might not be working properly. Our unions got us parental leave, 6 weeks of vacation, a liveable minimum wage, a 37 hour workweek, and the weekend.. ;):p
 
Last edited:
SuburbanTurkey said:
No charges for cop who killed a good Samaritan who stopped an active shooter:



https://www.denverpost.com/2021/11/08/olde-town-arvada-shooting-johnny-hurley/

The shooter ambushed a cop with a shotgun, killing him, before being shot himself by a bystander, who was later gunned down by responding police. Remember kids, if a madman starts killing cops, don't intervene.
Click to expand...

Tragic though it maybe, I am not sure that given the scanty information available the decision was wrong.

If there was a fault it is likely to be with policy and training, blaming the foot soldier, avoids putting the responsibility where it should lie with the commanders. There should be a charge more akin to corporate manslaughter, where the people in the dock are the bosses, not the worker. This is far more likely to result in a culture change.
 
Captain_Swoop said:
A cop slapped a handcuffed man dying of a drug overdose. Called him a “bitch.” Shoved a baton in his mouth. That cop got suspended 6 days. But the cop who revealed the cruelty was expelled from the cop union. Now faces 20 years prison for whistleblowing.

Members of the Joliet Illinois Police Union voted 35-1 to expel Javier Esqueda for exposing footage of police abuse. “In a letter informing him of the vote, union leaders described his conduct as “reprehensible.” Not the cops though who shoved a baton down a dying man’s throat.

https://usatoday.com/story/news/inv...today-behind-the-blue-wall-series/6396601001/
Click to expand...

Just cruel. Incompetent. Had they followed policy and taken an unconscious man who they suspected swallowed drugs to hospital rather than the police station he would probably have lived.
 
erlando said:
Do you still have the receipt for your unions? They might not be working properly. Our unions got us parental leave, 6 weeks of vacation, a liveable minimum wage, a 37 hour workweek, and the weekend.. ;):p
Click to expand...


Coincidentally, I've just gotten around to watching "The Nevers" (Victorian-era science fiction). At one point, a group of organized workers stop working because they feel they aren't being paid enough to handle the explosives they're working with. The owner of the company says "Banding together instead of standing alone? I expected more courage from Englishmen." Only cowards need a union to fight for them. :D
 
A judge on Friday convicted a white Kansas City police officer of involuntary manslaughter and armed criminal action in the fatal shooting of a Black man, in a case in which prosecutors said police planted evidence.

https://apnews.com/article/crime-po...-kansas-city-933d3aba9b37c83145fba5818d557c02

After the verdict, police escorted DeValkenaere and his family from the building. An officer said they wouldn’t be commenting
 
Prosecutor drops charges against officer in rare case of restorative justice mediation

CNN -Criminal charges against a St. Louis County police officer who shot a Black woman were dropped Monday after the victim requested a restorative justice mediation that focuses on repairing the harm caused by an offense.

The St. Louis County Prosecuting Attorney's Office said Ashley Fountain Hall asked that assault charges be dropped against former Ladue, Missouri, police officer Julia Crews, 39. The charges stemmed from a dispute that took place on April 23, 2019, outside a Schnucks grocery store.

Crews mistakenly drew her firearm instead of using her Taser to restrain Hall and shot her in the torso, leading to critical injuries, the office said. Hall lost part of her spleen and suffers with post-traumatic stress disorder, prosecutors said.
Click to expand...

CNN: https://www.cnn.com/2021/11/22/us/missouri-police-restorative-justice/index.html
 
Babbylonian said:
Great. Definitely what restorative justice is supposed to be about. Nothing better than validating a cop's bald-faced lie.
Click to expand...

Did you read the article?

The prosecutor's office said Crews immediately realized she drew her gun when she intended to use her Taser, then administered aid and apologized "profusely." Crews, who was captured crying in her booking photo, immediately resigned, and her response to the shooting "all played a part in the push for mediation," the office said.

Hall, who has since recovered, received a $2 million settlement and pushed for a restorative justice program.The prosecutor's office said Hall and Crews voluntarily participated in a "successful" face-to-face meeting with a mediator, Seema Gajwani, the chief of the Restorative Justice Program for Karl Racine, Attorney General for the District of Columbia.
Click to expand...

When someone immediately recognizes and takes responsibility for their mistake, sometimes it makes sense to accept it at face value.

Also, $2M doesn't hurt.
 
TomB said:
Did you read the article?



When someone immediately recognizes and takes responsibility for their mistake, sometimes it makes sense to accept it at face value.

Also, $2M doesn't hurt.
Click to expand...

A person who takes responsibility and shows remorse for their actions is a rarity nowadays. The common reaction is to lie, stonewall and lawyer up.
 
TomB said:
Did you read the article?



When someone immediately recognizes and takes responsibility for their mistake, sometimes it makes sense to accept it at face value.

Also, $2M doesn't hurt.
Click to expand...
When someone immediately realizes they drew a gun instead of a taser, they don't pull the ******* trigger. I don't believe it was a mistake. I believe she lied.
 
Babbylonian said:
When someone immediately realizes they drew a gun instead of a taser, they don't pull the ******* trigger. I don't believe it was a mistake. I believe she lied.
Click to expand...

That depends on where you read the word "immediately" to mean relative to the sequence.

You apparently, read it to mean "immediately after drawing."
I read it to mean "immediately after pulling the trigger."

It doesn't happen a lot, but mistakenly drawing the wrong one has happened before. This article mentions that in training, motor memory for drawing the gun the gun is more developed than for drawing the taser:
For many experts, the biggest issue when it comes to weapon confusion is inadequate training on Tasers.

"On average a recruit will draw their firearm about 5,000 times in the police academy, but maybe at most draw their Taser 10 times," said Peters, president of the Nevada-based Institute for the Prevention of In-Custody Deaths.

As a result, in stressful situations a officer's "motor memory" can kick in "and you go for your gun," Peters said.
Click to expand...
https://www.reuters.com/business/aerospace-defense/taser-vs-gun-mix-up-raises-concerns-about-training-design-after-minnesota-2021-04-13/

Now, it's possible you are right and she is lying, but I see nothing in her behavior described in the article that is inconsistent with her being truthful.

ETA: This is an interesting article about how the current design of the TASER is conducive to confusion: https://qz.com/1996551/daunte-wright-the-problematic-design-of-taser-stun-guns/
 
Last edited:
TomB said:
Did you read the article?



When someone immediately recognizes and takes responsibility for their mistake, sometimes it makes sense to accept it at face value.

Also, $2M doesn't hurt.
Click to expand...

She's doing quite well for herself if she has $2 million for the payout on a police officers salary.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Back
Top Bottom