You mean, this isn't satire?
Merged No Ayers Today?
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You mean, this isn't satire?
boloboffin
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It is satire, but the wrong way round. It's not meant to mock the idea of Bill Ayers as Supervillain, but to mock the idea of Bill Ayers as human.
Dr Adequate
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It is, but not intentionally.
BeAChooser
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Despite denials from Obama supporters, there is plenty to suggest Obama and William Ayers had a close relationship. Obama and the Obama campaign have been blatantly dishonest in claiming they were "just neighbors", that (as first claimed) they first met at the gathering in Ayers' home which kicked off Obama's political career, that (as later claimed) they met in 1995 during the Chicago Annenberg Challenge (CAC) and, most recently, that Obama didn't know about Ayers' violent past until this year.
So since the election is near, let's summarize that relationship and the reasons why this matters ... just to see if his supporters at JREF will even attempt to offer a credible defense of this behavior, or just continue their stonewall and partisan denials.
Let's start with the fact that Obama and Ayers were both in New York City at the same time back in the early eighties. Obama was a student at Columbia University from 1981-1983. Ayers was attending Bank Street College a quarter mile from Columbia, working on his Masters in Education degree which he completed in 1984. Is it inconceivable, given their similar politics, that they first met at this time?
In any case, Obama stayed in NYC for two years after graduation, working for two different firms, before moving to Chicago. Meanwhile, Ayers began a second education degree (at Columbia), which he completed in 1987, before also moving to Chicago to become a professor there.
Once both were in Chicago, they both became active in the school reform movement. Obama was the Executive Director of the Developing Communities Project (DCP) while William Ayers organized the Alliance for Better Chicago Schools (ABCS) group ... of which DCP was a member. According to the New York Times (http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/04/u...2000&en=97a61d8ecb16e341&ei=5087 &oref=slogin ), Ayers and Obama met in 1987 at a luncheon meeting about school reform in a Chicago Skyscraper.
Meanwhile, in 1987 Michelle Robinson (Obama's eventual wife) was hired as a summer associate by the law firm Sidley and Austin in Chicago. From 1988 to 1991, she worked as an associate at the firm. Now curiously enough, Sidley and Austin's managing partner was a well known personal friend of Ayers' father, Thomas Ayers. Furthermore, Bernadette Dohrn (William Ayer's wife) worked at this firm as a para-legal. Presumably, Michelle would have met Bernadette Dohrn during that time since the firm wasn't *that* big.
In 1989, while Barack was attending Harvard, Michelle met Barack. She was assigned to mentor him when he was a summer associate at Sidley and Austin. One wonders what coincidence brought him to work for the firm where Dohrn worked ... a firm whose managing partner was a friend of Ayers' father? And note that in 1991, Michelle quit the law firm to work for Chicago Mayor Richard M. Daley. Mayor Daley recently said he knew Ayers and also said that Obama and Ayers were "friends".
Why couldn't they be friends? They've lived in the same neighborhood in Chicago the entire time they've been in Chicago. They share the same politics. They seemed to hang out with the same people. They worked on related projects.
After graduating from Harvard, Barack and Michelle got married. Barack worked for the law firm Davis, Miner and Barnhill from 1992-1995. Again a coincidence ... Judson Miner was a personal friend and law school classmate of Dohrn, where they were both involved in anti-war activities.
In 1995, Obama was picked to chair the Chicago Annenberg Challenge (CAC). Is it reasonable to think that Ayers had nothing to do with this selection (as claimed by Obama supporters) given that it was Ayers who initiated and obtained the first $50 million funding for this project?
Obama collaborated closely with Ayers (who was co-chair of CAC) over a 5 year period (raising another $60 million). Eventually, the two wasted over 100 million dollars on a left-leaning education reform experiment whose leadership had to admit produced no noticeable improvement in student performance. Is it reasonable to think that co-chairs on a 100 million dollar project would hardly know one another? Would not socialize? Yet, that's what Obama and his supporters want you to believe.
Obama reviewed a book written by Ayers' giving it a glowing recommendation. If they hardly knew each other, how did Obama come to be chosen as a reviewer?
Obama appeared with Ayers on numerous academic panels, including one organized by Michelle Obama to discuss Ayers' book. Yes, even Michelle had an interest and familiarity with Ayers.
Obama and Ayers served together on the board of directors of the Woods Fund in the late 90's and early 2000's. But if one believed the Obama campaign, one might think this was their only contact. But you can see it wasn't.
Obama started his journey into politics at a meeting in the home of Ayers and Dohrn. Obama was identified as a "friend" of Ayers by Dr Quentin Young who attended that meeting.
Obama got an "official endorsement" from Ayers several times in his campaigns for political office. Does Ayers endorse people he doesn't know or trust?
Obama chose as his education advisor a woman (Gloria Ladson-Billings) who was president of the American Education Research Association (AERA) when she proposed a "reparations" approach to education that Ayers endorsed (and Ayers is now the Vice President-elect of AERA). How convenient.
Obama got endorsements from radical organizations, such as Movement for a Democratic Society (MDS), which have direct links (via it's members) to the 60's radical group, SDS, and it's terrorist offshoot, the Weather Underground.
Obama allowed a long time communist friend of Bill Ayers (from back in the days of SDS, Ayers school reform effort and now MDS), named Mike Klonsky, to run a blog on the official Obama campaign website. It was only shut down when this association is exposed.
Obama's chief strategist David Axelrod claimed while on on CNN that Obama didn't even know about Ayers' radical past. And then Obama communications Chief Robert Gibbs confirmed that. http://weblogs.newsday.com/news/loc...g/2008/10/video_obama_didnt_know_about_a.html Do rank and file democrats really buy this nonsense? Are they so gullible to think that Obama, with all the connections I noted above, didn't know about Ayers past? Especially when this "I didn't really know him" claim is the same claim made about Wright and Tony Rezko, when their pasts were exposed? Is Obama is really this clueless about those closest to him? If so, should we rely on him to negotiate with dictators in Iran and Venezuala?
While Obama and Ayers served on the Woods Fund together, Ayers posed standing on an American flag for an article in Chicago Magazine titled "No Regrets." Are we to believe Obama doesn't subscribe to that magazine?
And why is a relationship with Ayers important?
Well ... he was a terrorist.
Obama supporters want us to believe that William Ayers knew nothing about the nail bomb that went off in a Greenwich Village Apartment, killing Diana Oughton and 2 other Weatherman. But he did know about it. And he knew about it's purpose ... to hopefully kill hundreds of men and women at a military dance.
The bomb was so powerful that it demolished a large section of the building and literally shredded Diana Oughton, a "Peace Corp" veteran, into tiny pieces. After the explosion, police found four more unexploded nail bombs (each 12" in diameter and packed with dynamite) in the rubble along with 57 still unexploded sticks of dynamite.
It's worth noting that Oughton worked at the Children’s Community School (CCS), as a teacher of young children, when she and Ayers first met. Keep that in mind the next time Obama supporters say Ayers is reformed because he's a teacher. Now Oughton fell in love with Ayers and they began living together. So Obama supporters want you to believe that Ayers was unaware of the bomb his girlfriend was helping to build. But he was aware of it.
In his book Fugitive Days, Ayers apparently discusses what happened at length and claims he was not at the Greenwich Village Apartment when the bomb went off. He was at some "desert location". And in his book, he claims that Diana Oughton was not a victim of misplaced wires but a savior of the lives of the bomb's intended victims. He claims that she purposefully set off the bomb to prevent the awful act that was planned. Are we really to believe that Oughton was trying to save lives? Are we really to believe that having slept with Oughton for years, he didn't know what was going on in that townhouse where they were building nail bombs ... and what those bombs were for? In my opinion, only a fool (or someone blinded by a political agenda) would believe such nonsense. Besides, National Review quotes Ayers in his book, Fugitive Days, saying the bomb would have done serious damage, "tearing through windows and walls and, yes, people too." Make no mistake. Ayers knew.
Keep in mind that Ayers summarized the Weatherman's ideology as follows (http://www.chicagomag.com/Chicago-Magazine/August-2001/No-Regrets/index.php?cp=2&si=1 ):
And now says they didn't do enough. Really, folks ... is it likely that Ayers knew about the bomb but condemned what was planned? If so, why didn't he turn the bombers in? Why didn't he warn the military so they could at least cancel the dance? I think you know the answer.
Ayers' not too long ago (just before 9/11) told an interviewer ”I don’t regret setting bombs. I feel we didn’t do enough.” When asked in that same interview (http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=25166 ) if he would set more bombs today, his response was, "I don't want to discount the possibility." And we are to believe that with such outspokenness, Obama was unaware of Ayers' violent past all those years they worked and spoke and lobbied side by side?
And let's not forget that Ayers married Dohrn knowing she is a murderer. She murdered a police officer in the bombing of a San Francisco police station, as well as injured a number of other policemen. According to AIM (http://www.aim.org/aim-column/tribune-covers-for-obamas-terrorist-friends/ ) Larry Grathwohl, a former member of the Weatherman Underground testified under oath before a Senate Subcommittee in 1974 that Ayers told him that Dorhn had to plan, develop and carry out the bombing. Here are some quotes from Cliff Kincaid's article:
That's the man that Obama willingly associated with for all those years. And even now, the woman he's chosen as his education advisor associates with him. So if Obama gets elected and things don't turn out to be this utopia he's promised you folks, don't pretend later you didn't know the truth about him. Because we told you.
So since the election is near, let's summarize that relationship and the reasons why this matters ... just to see if his supporters at JREF will even attempt to offer a credible defense of this behavior, or just continue their stonewall and partisan denials.
Let's start with the fact that Obama and Ayers were both in New York City at the same time back in the early eighties. Obama was a student at Columbia University from 1981-1983. Ayers was attending Bank Street College a quarter mile from Columbia, working on his Masters in Education degree which he completed in 1984. Is it inconceivable, given their similar politics, that they first met at this time?
In any case, Obama stayed in NYC for two years after graduation, working for two different firms, before moving to Chicago. Meanwhile, Ayers began a second education degree (at Columbia), which he completed in 1987, before also moving to Chicago to become a professor there.
Once both were in Chicago, they both became active in the school reform movement. Obama was the Executive Director of the Developing Communities Project (DCP) while William Ayers organized the Alliance for Better Chicago Schools (ABCS) group ... of which DCP was a member. According to the New York Times (http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/04/u...2000&en=97a61d8ecb16e341&ei=5087 &oref=slogin ), Ayers and Obama met in 1987 at a luncheon meeting about school reform in a Chicago Skyscraper.
Meanwhile, in 1987 Michelle Robinson (Obama's eventual wife) was hired as a summer associate by the law firm Sidley and Austin in Chicago. From 1988 to 1991, she worked as an associate at the firm. Now curiously enough, Sidley and Austin's managing partner was a well known personal friend of Ayers' father, Thomas Ayers. Furthermore, Bernadette Dohrn (William Ayer's wife) worked at this firm as a para-legal. Presumably, Michelle would have met Bernadette Dohrn during that time since the firm wasn't *that* big.
In 1989, while Barack was attending Harvard, Michelle met Barack. She was assigned to mentor him when he was a summer associate at Sidley and Austin. One wonders what coincidence brought him to work for the firm where Dohrn worked ... a firm whose managing partner was a friend of Ayers' father? And note that in 1991, Michelle quit the law firm to work for Chicago Mayor Richard M. Daley. Mayor Daley recently said he knew Ayers and also said that Obama and Ayers were "friends".
Why couldn't they be friends? They've lived in the same neighborhood in Chicago the entire time they've been in Chicago. They share the same politics. They seemed to hang out with the same people. They worked on related projects.
After graduating from Harvard, Barack and Michelle got married. Barack worked for the law firm Davis, Miner and Barnhill from 1992-1995. Again a coincidence ... Judson Miner was a personal friend and law school classmate of Dohrn, where they were both involved in anti-war activities.
In 1995, Obama was picked to chair the Chicago Annenberg Challenge (CAC). Is it reasonable to think that Ayers had nothing to do with this selection (as claimed by Obama supporters) given that it was Ayers who initiated and obtained the first $50 million funding for this project?
Obama collaborated closely with Ayers (who was co-chair of CAC) over a 5 year period (raising another $60 million). Eventually, the two wasted over 100 million dollars on a left-leaning education reform experiment whose leadership had to admit produced no noticeable improvement in student performance. Is it reasonable to think that co-chairs on a 100 million dollar project would hardly know one another? Would not socialize? Yet, that's what Obama and his supporters want you to believe.
Obama reviewed a book written by Ayers' giving it a glowing recommendation. If they hardly knew each other, how did Obama come to be chosen as a reviewer?
Obama appeared with Ayers on numerous academic panels, including one organized by Michelle Obama to discuss Ayers' book. Yes, even Michelle had an interest and familiarity with Ayers.
Obama and Ayers served together on the board of directors of the Woods Fund in the late 90's and early 2000's. But if one believed the Obama campaign, one might think this was their only contact. But you can see it wasn't.
Obama started his journey into politics at a meeting in the home of Ayers and Dohrn. Obama was identified as a "friend" of Ayers by Dr Quentin Young who attended that meeting.
Obama got an "official endorsement" from Ayers several times in his campaigns for political office. Does Ayers endorse people he doesn't know or trust?
Obama chose as his education advisor a woman (Gloria Ladson-Billings) who was president of the American Education Research Association (AERA) when she proposed a "reparations" approach to education that Ayers endorsed (and Ayers is now the Vice President-elect of AERA). How convenient.
Obama got endorsements from radical organizations, such as Movement for a Democratic Society (MDS), which have direct links (via it's members) to the 60's radical group, SDS, and it's terrorist offshoot, the Weather Underground.
Obama allowed a long time communist friend of Bill Ayers (from back in the days of SDS, Ayers school reform effort and now MDS), named Mike Klonsky, to run a blog on the official Obama campaign website. It was only shut down when this association is exposed.
Obama's chief strategist David Axelrod claimed while on on CNN that Obama didn't even know about Ayers' radical past. And then Obama communications Chief Robert Gibbs confirmed that. http://weblogs.newsday.com/news/loc...g/2008/10/video_obama_didnt_know_about_a.html Do rank and file democrats really buy this nonsense? Are they so gullible to think that Obama, with all the connections I noted above, didn't know about Ayers past? Especially when this "I didn't really know him" claim is the same claim made about Wright and Tony Rezko, when their pasts were exposed? Is Obama is really this clueless about those closest to him? If so, should we rely on him to negotiate with dictators in Iran and Venezuala?
While Obama and Ayers served on the Woods Fund together, Ayers posed standing on an American flag for an article in Chicago Magazine titled "No Regrets." Are we to believe Obama doesn't subscribe to that magazine?
And why is a relationship with Ayers important?
Well ... he was a terrorist.
Obama supporters want us to believe that William Ayers knew nothing about the nail bomb that went off in a Greenwich Village Apartment, killing Diana Oughton and 2 other Weatherman. But he did know about it. And he knew about it's purpose ... to hopefully kill hundreds of men and women at a military dance.
The bomb was so powerful that it demolished a large section of the building and literally shredded Diana Oughton, a "Peace Corp" veteran, into tiny pieces. After the explosion, police found four more unexploded nail bombs (each 12" in diameter and packed with dynamite) in the rubble along with 57 still unexploded sticks of dynamite.
It's worth noting that Oughton worked at the Children’s Community School (CCS), as a teacher of young children, when she and Ayers first met. Keep that in mind the next time Obama supporters say Ayers is reformed because he's a teacher. Now Oughton fell in love with Ayers and they began living together. So Obama supporters want you to believe that Ayers was unaware of the bomb his girlfriend was helping to build. But he was aware of it.
In his book Fugitive Days, Ayers apparently discusses what happened at length and claims he was not at the Greenwich Village Apartment when the bomb went off. He was at some "desert location". And in his book, he claims that Diana Oughton was not a victim of misplaced wires but a savior of the lives of the bomb's intended victims. He claims that she purposefully set off the bomb to prevent the awful act that was planned. Are we really to believe that Oughton was trying to save lives? Are we really to believe that having slept with Oughton for years, he didn't know what was going on in that townhouse where they were building nail bombs ... and what those bombs were for? In my opinion, only a fool (or someone blinded by a political agenda) would believe such nonsense. Besides, National Review quotes Ayers in his book, Fugitive Days, saying the bomb would have done serious damage, "tearing through windows and walls and, yes, people too." Make no mistake. Ayers knew.
Keep in mind that Ayers summarized the Weatherman's ideology as follows (http://www.chicagomag.com/Chicago-Magazine/August-2001/No-Regrets/index.php?cp=2&si=1 ):
And now says they didn't do enough. Really, folks ... is it likely that Ayers knew about the bomb but condemned what was planned? If so, why didn't he turn the bombers in? Why didn't he warn the military so they could at least cancel the dance? I think you know the answer.
Ayers' not too long ago (just before 9/11) told an interviewer ”I don’t regret setting bombs. I feel we didn’t do enough.” When asked in that same interview (http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=25166 ) if he would set more bombs today, his response was, "I don't want to discount the possibility." And we are to believe that with such outspokenness, Obama was unaware of Ayers' violent past all those years they worked and spoke and lobbied side by side?
And let's not forget that Ayers married Dohrn knowing she is a murderer. She murdered a police officer in the bombing of a San Francisco police station, as well as injured a number of other policemen. According to AIM (http://www.aim.org/aim-column/tribune-covers-for-obamas-terrorist-friends/ ) Larry Grathwohl, a former member of the Weatherman Underground testified under oath before a Senate Subcommittee in 1974 that Ayers told him that Dorhn had to plan, develop and carry out the bombing. Here are some quotes from Cliff Kincaid's article:
That's the man that Obama willingly associated with for all those years. And even now, the woman he's chosen as his education advisor associates with him. So if Obama gets elected and things don't turn out to be this utopia he's promised you folks, don't pretend later you didn't know the truth about him. Because we told you.
boloboffin
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And told us and told us and told us and told us and told us and told us and told us. We get it. You don't like him. Thanks. We'll call you if we need anything else. What's your number? Leave it with the receptionist. Thank you. Buh-bye.
Tricky
Briefly immortal
<circumstantial "friend of a friend of a friend" babbling snipped>
When Obama is president and the country continues on, still with problems, but without any of the calmaties you predict, will you be willing admit you were wrong?
And I'll bet you just about anything that Ayers will not have any post in Obama's administration, nor will he be a frequent visitor to the White House. Certainly he'll be less of a presence than Ken Lay was in the early days of the Bush Admin.
Nobody expects a utopia. Obama has not promised a utopia. You haven't told us any "truth" about him that is in the least bit scary.
When Obama is president and the country continues on, still with problems, but without any of the calmaties you predict, will you be willing admit you were wrong?
And I'll bet you just about anything that Ayers will not have any post in Obama's administration, nor will he be a frequent visitor to the White House. Certainly he'll be less of a presence than Ken Lay was in the early days of the Bush Admin.
But it will be interesting who winds up getting pardons from Obama during his administration. That's one thing he will be spared giving Ayres since there was no conviction.
We will just have to wait and see if Bush uses last minute pardons for Randy Cunningham, Edwin W. Edwards, John Walker Lindh, Marion Jones, Michael Milken, in the way that Clinton did with Rich, his brother Roger Clinton, McDougal, Reynolds, MacDonald, the Greogory's, etc.....
MattusMaximus
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Wow. I'm going to need some serious fiber to digest and pass that latest text-bomb from BAC
ETA: BAC, Snopes.com is your friend.
Last edited:
BeAChooser
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Snopes isn't always accurate. This is one instance. Let's see some of the statements made by Snopes that are false or incomplete as well as note what Snopes left out of their description of the relationship between Obama and Ayers.
Why no mention of Ayers first live-in girlfriend ... the one killed in the nail bomb explosion ... a nail bomb that was supposed to have killed hundreds at a military DANCE?
According to the New York Times, Ayers and Obama met in 1987, not 1995, and worked on projects that would have brought them into contact many times before 1995. And why no mention of the fact that prior to that time Obama worked for a law firm whose general partner was a close friend of Ayers father ... or that Ayers' wife worked for that law firm?
Attendees at the gathering and Mayor Daley described Ayers and Obama as "friends". So how does Snopes know they weren't? Because Obama says they weren't?
They didn't just "work with the same" ... "organizations", they CO-CHAIRED a 100+ million dollar effort over a period of 5 years ... ample time to have developed a very close relationship. At least most CO-CHAIRS would have during such a time and project.
As one can see by reading my post above, that is not the limit of what Ayers did. Snopes has left out a great deal. And Ayers could have easily given a great deal more money to Obama's campaign given the way Obama has been raising money and his unconcern about identifying who is giving money.
Perhaps not in this campaign, but in earlier campaigns Obama did get the endorsement of Ayers. And we know for a fact that individuals who do support Obama are deliberately not saying so in public (like Clooney) because they feel it would hurt Obama's chances of winning.
Obama is playing with the truth. Prior to running for President, Obama did exchange ideas with Ayers on a regular basis. Are we just to believe him now? Does he dump his friends that easily when they become inconvenient? Israel beware.
There is no possible way that Snopes can know that. The fact is we don't know Obama and Ayers relationship during the 5 years they co-chaired a very large project. One can only think that it would have been close since most co-chairs would have been close in similar circumstances. Espeically if they see eye to eye on education and reparations ... as Obama and Ayers do.
This is very misleading. Prior to this year's campaign, Obama never said one negative thing about Ayers (quite the opposite) ... despite the fact that Ayers was a well known terrorist and extreme radical. Only after the Obama/Ayers relationship came to light did Obama try to distance himself from Ayers by denouncing him. And only very recently has his campaign claimed Obama didn't know Ayers was a radical all those years. A claim that is extremely hard to believe.
Again, Snopes has no way of knowing this (they certainly haven't provided any sources to back up the claim). The fact is that Obama worked closely with Ayers for over 5 years on education policy and projects. The fact is (a fact that Snopes just forgets to mention) that Obama's top education advisor is a women who promotes an radical approach to education that Ayers endorses (and in fact helped develop). Snopes doesn't mention that Ayers and that advisor recently wrote two books together. So are we really expected to believe that Obama hasn't been influenced by Ayers views?
Snopes doesn't know that. How can they? All they have to support that is the claim of Obama. Ayers won't comment. We don't know how often Obama and wife dined with Ayers and Dohrn. They did live very close together and work on projects of mutual interest for many years. Others who knew them said they were "friends", including Mayor Daley.
And how does Snopes know this? Do they have phone and email records between the two? No. They could have talked daily and Snopes wouldn't know it. We don't even know how often Obama went to Wright's church, as public as that issue has been. If you believed Obama and his campaign supporters now, you'd think it was hardly ever. Yet Obama once told the press he went to church every single week.
Nice spin. Only thing is that Obama didn't say that about him until after his relationship with Ayers came to light during this campaign. Prior to that, he had nothing but praise for Ayers. Was Obama really so clueless that he didn't know Ayers' past? The rest of us did. So is Obama's claim a lie? I think so.
LaBolt's claims are not proof of anything. He's like a lawyer, paid to defend his client no matter what the real truth. And LaBolt has been caught making other statements during the campaign that are false. Why does Snopes believe him, that being the case?
Which we know is false since the NYTimes said they met in 1987. Furthermore, the Obama campaign initially claimed they didn't meet until that gathering in Ayers house to introduce him to politics. Why did their story change over time?
Snopes' spin on this and other issues leads me to believe that Snopes is not unbiased where this election is concerned, Max. You need to be more skeptical.
Why no mention of Ayers first live-in girlfriend ... the one killed in the nail bomb explosion ... a nail bomb that was supposed to have killed hundreds at a military DANCE?
According to the New York Times, Ayers and Obama met in 1987, not 1995, and worked on projects that would have brought them into contact many times before 1995. And why no mention of the fact that prior to that time Obama worked for a law firm whose general partner was a close friend of Ayers father ... or that Ayers' wife worked for that law firm?
Attendees at the gathering and Mayor Daley described Ayers and Obama as "friends". So how does Snopes know they weren't? Because Obama says they weren't?
They didn't just "work with the same" ... "organizations", they CO-CHAIRED a 100+ million dollar effort over a period of 5 years ... ample time to have developed a very close relationship. At least most CO-CHAIRS would have during such a time and project.
As one can see by reading my post above, that is not the limit of what Ayers did. Snopes has left out a great deal. And Ayers could have easily given a great deal more money to Obama's campaign given the way Obama has been raising money and his unconcern about identifying who is giving money.
Perhaps not in this campaign, but in earlier campaigns Obama did get the endorsement of Ayers. And we know for a fact that individuals who do support Obama are deliberately not saying so in public (like Clooney) because they feel it would hurt Obama's chances of winning.
Obama is playing with the truth. Prior to running for President, Obama did exchange ideas with Ayers on a regular basis. Are we just to believe him now? Does he dump his friends that easily when they become inconvenient? Israel beware.
There is no possible way that Snopes can know that. The fact is we don't know Obama and Ayers relationship during the 5 years they co-chaired a very large project. One can only think that it would have been close since most co-chairs would have been close in similar circumstances. Espeically if they see eye to eye on education and reparations ... as Obama and Ayers do.
This is very misleading. Prior to this year's campaign, Obama never said one negative thing about Ayers (quite the opposite) ... despite the fact that Ayers was a well known terrorist and extreme radical. Only after the Obama/Ayers relationship came to light did Obama try to distance himself from Ayers by denouncing him. And only very recently has his campaign claimed Obama didn't know Ayers was a radical all those years. A claim that is extremely hard to believe.
Again, Snopes has no way of knowing this (they certainly haven't provided any sources to back up the claim). The fact is that Obama worked closely with Ayers for over 5 years on education policy and projects. The fact is (a fact that Snopes just forgets to mention) that Obama's top education advisor is a women who promotes an radical approach to education that Ayers endorses (and in fact helped develop). Snopes doesn't mention that Ayers and that advisor recently wrote two books together. So are we really expected to believe that Obama hasn't been influenced by Ayers views?
Snopes doesn't know that. How can they? All they have to support that is the claim of Obama. Ayers won't comment. We don't know how often Obama and wife dined with Ayers and Dohrn. They did live very close together and work on projects of mutual interest for many years. Others who knew them said they were "friends", including Mayor Daley.
And how does Snopes know this? Do they have phone and email records between the two? No. They could have talked daily and Snopes wouldn't know it. We don't even know how often Obama went to Wright's church, as public as that issue has been. If you believed Obama and his campaign supporters now, you'd think it was hardly ever. Yet Obama once told the press he went to church every single week.
Nice spin. Only thing is that Obama didn't say that about him until after his relationship with Ayers came to light during this campaign. Prior to that, he had nothing but praise for Ayers. Was Obama really so clueless that he didn't know Ayers' past? The rest of us did. So is Obama's claim a lie? I think so.
LaBolt's claims are not proof of anything. He's like a lawyer, paid to defend his client no matter what the real truth. And LaBolt has been caught making other statements during the campaign that are false. Why does Snopes believe him, that being the case?
Which we know is false since the NYTimes said they met in 1987. Furthermore, the Obama campaign initially claimed they didn't meet until that gathering in Ayers house to introduce him to politics. Why did their story change over time?
Snopes' spin on this and other issues leads me to believe that Snopes is not unbiased where this election is concerned, Max. You need to be more skeptical.
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