Merged Apollo "hoax" discussion / Lick observatory laser saga

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There are some anomalies that are simply too clear to obfuscate and you maintain they aren't anomalies.

The tip of Collins' jacket corner is not being held down by the bottle on his chest.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6fqdB1b53jc
(00:52 time mark)

It bends when it goes from side to side as he jogs in place so we know it's not stiff. There is no identifiable force making it stay down and behave in a way that's one hundred percent consistent with its being in strong gravity execpt the gravity explanation. Betamax's contention that the bottle is keeping it there is clearly wrong.

Then, there's the flag anomaly.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ymwE1sNm82Y
(2:30 time mark)

MythBusters tried to obfuscate this but ended up confirming it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I7yc2rVOs00


There is a point at which things are so clear that sophistry becomes ineffective and those two anomalies are well beyond that point. Normal intelligent objective people simply know that footage was faked as soon as they see it. The ones who go into denial because they're experiencing cognitive dissonance usually slink away. Those are such clear anomalies that anyone who says they're not anomalies and continuously argues that they're not can't believe what he or she is saying. The only people you might be swaying with your attitudes are viewers who don't take the time to look at the videos; some of them may be swayed by rhetoric.

Jay Windley has refused to even address those anomalies as he knows that anyone who tries to obfuscate them will just end up looking silly. It's better to duck the issue and try to bury it deep in the thread to at least reduce the number of people who see it and then go on as if nothing had happened.

You also maintain that the Chinese spacwalk was real which totally discredits all of you (see post #8506). You also agreed with Jay Windley when he said this...
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8144391&postcount=7990

...in response to this.
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8135606&postcount=7907

You can pretend all you want but none of you has any credibility.

I keep telling you what I think of your poll and the fact that there are about twenty posters here who don't agree with me. Here's the quote from post #8364.

You know I'm not going to risk getting banned by clearly stating what I think is going on here on this thead so you'll just have to infer what I think from the above as I'm taking a risk just by posting that; I don't dare go beyond that and you know it.

Let's hear Jay Windley's rebuttal to my rebuttal to BetaMax's analysis of Collins' swinging jacket corner.

Then seeing as you are too much of a coward and don't want to get banned I'll state it for you.

You believe most of the different posters in this thread are the work or very few people acting in concert to discredit you, the true hero of the anti-Apollo movement. You believe that those posters know that Apollo is fake and are desperate to cover up the truth.

Close enough? Bit rich coming from someone who spams under many guises no?

Let me make this clear, just in case I haven't done so before: I have never acted with anyone else to post in defence of Apollo. I have never agreed a party line. I believe completely and totally that the landings happened as documented. I have invested a considerable amount of my own personal time and money in learning about them and researching new ways of proving them to be true. Accusations to the contrary are false, unfounded, and have no basis in reality.

Clear? If you have proof that the above is not true, post it. The truth is more important than the niceties of forum etiquette. Actual evidence that what I have stated there is a lie, and you will have your little victory.

Now, how about answering the questions that have been put to you instead of dipping in to your lucky bag of spam and regurgitating the same old tired nonsense.
 
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Let's hear Jay Windley's rebuttal to my rebuttal to BetaMax's analysis of Collins' swinging jacket corner.

Please get over your sick fixation on me. I have told you multiple times that I will not debate you on any point as long as you dismiss everything I say on the grounds that I must be a paid disinformation agent who secretly knows the Moon landings weren't real.

You have carried on an unhealthy obsession over me across the web for the past 5 years, and I will not indulge you further. Is that clear?
 
...And after all that, you can't do me even the most basic courtesy of accepting that I actually might believe what I say? Even if you are sure I'm wrong?
There are some anomalies that are simply too clear to obfuscate and you maintain they aren't anomalies.
In other words, the answer is "No, I will not accept that you mean anything you say."

The tip of Collins' jacket corner is not being held down by the bottle on his chest...
I haven't, as far as I recall, said anything about Collins' jacket corner, nor have I followed the argument. There are plenty of people arguing with you about it already.

... Why is that - in your original words, without links to your canned responses?...
..., you completely disregarded my request for an original answer without any links to your canned replies. Are you at all capable of an original answer?

In other words, the answer is "no".

There is a point at which things are so clear that sophistry becomes ineffective and those two anomalies are well beyond that point. Normal intelligent objective people simply know that footage was faked as soon as they see it.

In other words, people are honest if they agree with your interpretations, and are liars if they do not.

Jay Windley...
I don't care. I'm not Jay Windley.

It's better to duck the issue and try to bury it deep in the thread to at least reduce the number of people who see it and then go on as if nothing had happened.

In other words, "you keep trying to bury my links", even though I repeat your Great Wall of Links constantly.

You also maintain that the Chinese spacwalk was real which totally discredits all of you (see post #8506)...
Post 8506 has nothing to do with what I said, which was that the ISS spacewalks looked nothing like underwater EVA training. It's bad enough that you keep calling me a liar, without any evidence whatsoever, at least please stop misrepresenting what I say. (By the way, as noted I have actually seen underwater astronaut training facilities and training in person. How about you?)

I keep telling you what I think of your poll and the fact that there are about twenty posters here who don't agree with me.
First, I have no idea where you've stated such a number, but if you would care to cite a specific post where you have done so, and provide the means by which you calculated such a number, that would be helpful.

Second, yes, you keep insisting that almost all of the respondents are sock-puppets, and that all who are against you are liars; but since you haven't provided any evidence whatsoever for either one, the poll results stand. Last time I checked, it was about 295-1 against you. Stop whining about it; you asked for it.

You know I'm not going to risk getting banned by clearly stating what I think is going on here on this thead so you'll just have to infer what I think from the above as I'm taking a risk just by posting that; I don't dare go beyond that and you know it.

Spare us the breathless adolescent melodrama. You aren't taking any risks at all, Mr. Safely Anonymous Somewhere on the Internet. You keep saying everyone who doesn't agree with you is a liar, and you keep spamming your links - hell, I even spam them for you as well - and you're still able to keep repeating yourself.

You people keep repeating this because you know my sincere answer might get me banned. I won't say it directly. I'll post this and you can try to infer my answer from it.
http://www.opposingdigits.com/forums...
Glass houses, rocky - you fit the "disinformation agent" profile very nicely. But unlike you, I have the common decency to actually accept that you mean what you say, no matter how wrong I think you are.

Here is what I observe from your answer, or rather your failure to answer:

1. You are a boor. You will not even extend to me the same courtesy I extend to you. You refuse to even accept the possibility that I might simply be wrong; instead, you insist I am a liar without any evidence whatsoever.

2. You clearly are not capable of an original answer, and you cannot answer without endlessly spamming your links. I suspect you may, in fact, not even be an actual human being but rather a computer program. Or perhaps you're autistic. Or perhaps you're just too lazy and rude.

3. You are a hypocrite. You rail endlessly against the Powers That Be and their tools of oppression, but the bedrock of your argument is that pernicious tool of oppression, the loyalty test: If you don't agree with my views, you are a liar. Shame on you.

4. You are disingenuous and ungrateful; you constantly whine about how I try to bury your poor links, even though I constantly repeat them for you, and you can't even cough up a word of thanks for this free service.

My courtesy to you ends at this point; you have abused it long enough.

Some people might be embarrassed by such a sorry record, but I do not believe you're capable of being embarrassed. So, at this point, I have only one question left for you:


You've previously said you live in Madrid. So you're not at all far from Fresnedillas, right?
 
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Please get over your sick fixation on me. I have told you multiple times that I will not debate you on any point as long as you dismiss everything I say on the grounds that I must be a paid disinformation agent who secretly knows the Moon landings weren't real.

You have carried on an unhealthy obsession over me across the web for the past 5 years, and I will not indulge you further. Is that clear?

Can it really be considered sick when it looks more and more like he isn't real? I've asked "him" directly again if "he" is a computer program designed to respond with canned responses and no response or acknowledgment whatsoever. One would think a real person would at the very least deny such an accusation after being accused multiple times across multple forums. There has never been an acknowledgment at all. I think it is just doing what it is programmed to do. The sick one is the person who programmed it in the first place.
 
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Can it really be considered sick when it looks more and more like he isn't real?

I'm not yet convinced that this is the best explanation for his behavior.

One would think a real person would at the very least deny such an accusation after being accused multiple times across multple forums.

"Real person" includes a broad spectrum of human behavior, some of it abnormal. Conclusions drawn on the basis of expected, but absent behavior merit closer scrutiny and greater patience.
 
I don't think FF88 fails the Turing test. He fails to post anything original, or anything remotely convincing, but his responses are not entirely copy/pasted. Part of his screed is usually in-context with the posts he replies to.

So, no, despite his having nothing new or useful to say, I don't believe he's an automaton.
 
<snip> You can pretend all you want but none of you has any credibility. <snip>

That’s hilarious. Your entire knowledge of the subject matter is based on You Tube videos, while other posters have actual experience in the field and can prove it.

Who would a reasonable clear thinking individual listen to? You, or Jay and the others who have been involved in the space program for years. I think the answer is quite evident.

So, FF88, if you want to talk about credibility, you have your work cut out for you. So far, you have failed… drastically.
 
<snip> You can pretend all you want but none of you has any credibility. <snip>
-------------------------
That’s hilarious. Your entire knowledge of the subject matter is based on You Tube videos, while other posters have actual experience in the field and can prove it.
Why don't you post the whole quote so people who haven't looked on the other page will know what you're referring to?
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8450100&postcount=8520

Who would a reasonable clear thinking individual listen to? You, or Jay and the others who have been involved in the space program for years. I think the answer is quite evident.
It's possible for people who have been involved in the space program for years to tell lies. I posted one and you're playing dumb about it so I'll post it again.

Jay said this...
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8144391&postcount=7990

...in his response to this.
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8135606&postcount=7907

Let's hear your analysis of that issue.
 
Jay offered an explanation for why the transportation of aggregate/sand is going to create dust, based practical experience, which contradicted the theory the unknown geologist posited.

Protip for dealing with the real world Fred - go to the scientist for theory and the engineer for how theory is applied in practice.
 
Then seeing as you are too much of a coward and don't want to get banned I'll state it for you.

You believe most of the different posters in this thread are the work or very few people acting in concert to discredit you, the true hero of the anti-Apollo movement. You believe that those posters know that Apollo is fake and are desperate to cover up the truth.

Close enough? Bit rich coming from someone who spams under many guises no?
Let me make this clear, just in case I haven't done so before: I have never acted with anyone else to post in defence of Apollo. I have never agreed a party line. I believe completely and totally that the landings happened as documented. I have invested a considerable amount of my own personal time and money in learning about them and researching new ways of proving them to be true. Accusations to the contrary are false, unfounded, and have no basis in reality.

Clear? If you have proof that the above is not true, post it. The truth is more important than the niceties of forum etiquette. Actual evidence that what I have stated there is a lie, and you will have your little victory.

Now, how about answering the questions that have been put to you instead of dipping in to your lucky bag of spam and regurgitating the same old tired nonsense.

People always project what they're guilty of onto others.
 
Either present your evidence that I am a paid government disinformationist or retract the claim. Do so immediately.
I did. Look at my last post. That issue is simply too basic. Only a liar would say what you said. I urge all people who doubt to talk to geologists and engineers about it.

You also maintain that the Chinese spacewalk was real because that's NASA's position. No one in his right mind would do that after having seen the proof that it was faked.
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8139186&postcount=7954
(click on bottom link)

Hey Border Reiver-

Do you maintain that the Chinese spacewalk was real?
 
Why don't you post the whole quote so people who haven't looked on the other page will know what you're referring to?
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8450100&postcount=8520


It's possible for people who have been involved in the space program for years to tell lies. I posted one and you're playing dumb about it so I'll post it again.

Jay said this...
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8144391&postcount=7990

...in his response to this.
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8135606&postcount=7907

Let's hear your analysis of that issue.

He posted an answer and you ignored it.
 
He posted an answer and you ignored it.
He totally discredited himself when he backed Jay Windley. That issue is simply too basic. Tell us what you think. Also, tell us whether you maintain that the Chinese spacewalk was real. I'm still waiting Border Reiver. Do you maintain that the Chinese spacewalk was real?
 
He totally discredited himself when he backed Jay Windley.

Why do you repeat this "mantra" over and over?...and you DO understand that no one here agrees with that, right?

Need we do another poll?, or would you just deny the results?


Why are we still bothering with this irrationality? Reasoning will not work on those who stubbornly refuse to see reason.

The only thing that will end this, is when FF is banned...
 
Do you maintain that the Chinese spacewalk was real?

What part of the Chinese having a spacewalk was impossible for them to do? Can they get to orbit? Can they buy or manufacture an airtight suit? Can they open doors? How racist are you to think they can't do something that simple?

Where do square bubbles fit into your "faked spacewalk" theory? How about mythical waveblowers?
 
I urge all people who doubt to talk to geologists and engineers about it.

You mean, OTHER than the ones here on this thread who have told you how wrong you are?

Actual geologists and engineers DO NOT AGREE WITH YOU.

Must I continuously repeat this?...you don't seem to be listening/comprehending.



Do you maintain that the Chinese spacewalk was real?

You've given absolutely no reason to think otherwise...then again, the only argument you have seems to be declaritive. You make a statement as if it were fact, and ignore all else.

Do you really believe anyone here takes you seriously?....
 
I did. Look at my last post. That issue is simply too basic. Only a liar would say what you said. I urge all people who doubt to talk to geologists and engineers about it.

You also maintain that the Chinese spacewalk was real because that's NASA's position. No one in his right mind would do that after having seen the proof that it was faked.

The NASA space missions from Mercury through to the present have all been real and yes the Chinese have been in orbit and performed a spacewalk.

FF88, now is the time to reveal where Jay Windley gets his disinfo paycheque, or the office from which it is lssued,as well as some proof of the claim.
Having made the statement i made above I require this in order to apply for an entry level disinfo position. I could use the extra income
 
He totally discredited himself when he backed Jay Windley. That issue is simply too basic. Tell us what you think. Also, tell us whether you maintain that the Chinese spacewalk was real. I'm still waiting Border Reiver. Do you maintain that the Chinese spacewalk was real?

Of course it was real. Physics says so.
 
FatFreddy has no answer to the evidence other than call people liars.

I've posted this elsewhere but not everyone visits DIF, so people might like to see it.

I found this video on youtube http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VrFFbyuQqt4&feature=relmfu It's a rather awesome unedited collection of Apollo TV broadcasts.

The first quarter of an hour is a one take shot broadcast on the 16th of July. It has a beautiful view of Hurricane Bernice that only appeared in that configuration on that date. I digress. Over the course of 15 minutes of footage the Earth should rotate by a noticeable amount. Does it? You be the judge:

july16terminator.jpg


I also came across this:

moon_p38_x600.jpg


in this article:

http://www.technologyreview.com/news/414431/a-reporters-moon-trip/3/

It's on sale on ebay and is clearly marked with the date - July 17th.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1969-Mission-Control-Manned-Spacecraft-Center-Houston-Texas-Press-Photo-/190699396022

There's Earth right there on the screen. In that same youtube clip above there is another TV broadcast, and Armstrong tells the world he is going to turn it upside down.

Here is a screen capture of the moment when the Earth is in the same configuration as it is on the big screen in the photo:

apollomocr2.jpg


How did I do Freddy? What part of any of that is a lie? I think I've posted more credible evidence to defend my position in this one post than you ever have, anywhere.

The other videos in the Apollo 11 facts series on that youtube site are also very good - well worth a watch.
 
and you DO understand that no one here agrees with that, right?
Here's a pro-Apollo person who finally agreed with me when he saw he couldn't tire me out and bury the issue.
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8141778&postcount=7982

What part of the Chinese having a spacewalk was impossible for them to do? Can they get to orbit? Can they buy or manufacture an airtight suit? Can they open doors? How racist are you to think they can't do something that simple?
I didn't say it was impossible. I said this particular spacewalk was faked. The evidence is too clear. Here it is.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://es.youtube.com/watch?v=NVbBFwdmldA
http://es.youtube.com/watch?v=kG4Z_r38ZDE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lBL98p0wZ7g
http://en.epochtimes.com/n2/content/view/8332/
http://www.theepochtimes.com/n2/content/view/5809/

In this video the safety cable is obviously buoyant. It has a distinct tendency to to upward.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?gl=ES&hl=es&v=gMxQEHfU6hM

Watch it at these time marks.
0:50
2:10
3:00
3:10
6:08
6:44
6:53

It's going upward because it's slightly lighter than water.

At the thirty second mark in this clip the astronaut moves the flag from right to left.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MvpPknmHGAM

The flag flutters the way it would in a medium such as water.

The fast flag movement can be explained by sped-up video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lBL98p0wZ7g
(1:55 time mark)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Tell us if you agree with BetaMax's explanation for the buoyant safety cables. Click on this link...
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8139186&postcount=7954

...and click on the bottom link of the post. Go to page 12 of that thread and read his explanation.

Part of my evidence that you people don't even believe your own arguments about Apollo is that you maintain that this spacewalk was real. This was so obviously faked that only a sophist would try to make people think it was real.

Here's my quote from post #8364 again.
You people keep repeating this because you know my sincere answer might get me banned. I won't say it directly. I'll post this and you can try to infer my answer from it.
http://www.opposingdigits.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=1222
(excerpt)
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Planting of provocateurs (and sleeper agents, etc.). These people will vary from the posters who suddenly show up one day under an alias attacking regular posters, to people who seem like regular posters themselves. They may work in teams, supporting each other and giving the illusion of popular support on the net. (Remember, net IDs are basically free, and one person can have many.)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Now try to infer what I think is going on here. You know I dare not say it directly.

edit-
-----------------------
Regarding the above post–photos and video can be taken by unmanned craft so your photos and video don't prove there were people at that distance from the earth.
 
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~spam removed@

Regarding the above post–photos and video can be taken by unmanned craft so your photos and video don't prove there were people at that distance from the earth.

and you're a seven year old girl.

Your reply is useless. I've asked you before and you didn't answer: How? Not what - how?

Which probe?

What camera capabilitiies did it have?

When was it launched?

Where was it controlled?

How was it controlled?

Who controlled it?

The shots that go from filming people in zero gravity to shots of a distant earth - how was that done?

Stop waving your arms, you're causing a draught and you aren't answering the questions people have put to you.
 
Which probe?

What camera capabilitiies did it have?

When was it launched?

Where was it controlled?

How was it controlled?

Who controlled it?
These are pretty lame questions which are hardly worth the time, as if I had access to classified info. Are you saying it was impossible? Are you saying NASA didn't have the capability to do all of that? If they had the capability, it's plausible and photos from space therefore can't be used as proof that there were people in space. They also don't make the mountain of hoax proof go away.
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8033032&postcount=1
(bottom link)

The shots that go from filming people in zero gravity to shots of a distant earth - how was that done?
Are you saying it was impossible to fake. Please link to one of those shots so we can discuss what we actually see. Also, please tell us whether you agree with BetaMax's analysis of the buoyant safety cables which I mentioned earlier.
 
These are pretty lame questions which are hardly worth the time, as if I had access to classified info. Are you saying it was impossible? Are you saying NASA didn't have the capability to do all of that? If they had the capability, it's plausible and photos from space therefore can't be used as proof that there were people in space. They also don't make the mountain of hoax proof go away.
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8033032&postcount=1
(bottom link)


Are you saying it was impossible to fake. Please link to one of those shots so we can discuss what we actually see. Also, please tell us whether you agree with BetaMax's analysis of the buoyant safety cables which I mentioned earlier.

Even if you had shown the possibility that the entirity of the Nasa missions could be faked(which you have certainly not done) you cannot then declare that all of the various required operations in that fakery were performed without some definitive proof of that.

The fact that you conflate supposition with evidence/proof also explains your inability to explain your proof that persons disagreeing with you are agents sent to counter you.
 
The fact that you conflate supposition with evidence/proof also explains your inability to explain your proof that persons disagreeing with you are agents sent to counter you.
When I put the flag anomaly forward as proof of a hoax, I'm not conflating anything.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ymwE1sNm82Y
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I7yc2rVOs00

Nor am I conflating anything when I say that the movement of the tip of Collins' jacket corner is this clip is consistent with gravity.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6fqdB1b53jc
(00:52 time mark)

When I say that the movement of Collins' jacket corner is obviously in the same environment as this guy's jacket corner...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DTNGNW5Evs4

...and obviously in a very different environment from that in these two videos...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ofwzby1c7o
(3:17 time mark)

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=TejsnPThmd4

...I'm not conflating anything.

Tell us whether you agree with BetaMax's analysis of the buoyant safety cables.
 
FF88 you really can't grasp it can you? It is you who have no credibility. You continue to accuse people of lying for no better reason than that you cannot conceive that you could possibly be wrong even when multiple posters have taken the time to explain how badly flawed your arguments are. There is no silent majority applauding your efforts; you are all alone in your beliefs, an Apollo Don Quixote.
 
FF88 you really can't grasp it can you? It is you who have no credibility. You continue to accuse people of lying for no better reason than that you cannot conceive that you could possibly be wrong even when multiple posters have taken the time to explain how badly flawed your arguments are. There is no silent majority applauding your efforts; you are all alone in your beliefs, an Apollo Don Quixote.
All you people can do now is post empty rhetoric and, when I finally disappear because I get tired or banned, you'll go on as if nothing had happened.
None of you dares to say whether you agree with BetaMax's analysis of the buoyant safety cables that I keep requesting that you do because you know he's so obviously wrong that you'll just end up looking silly if you agree with him.
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8452301&postcount=8545

You can pretend all you want but you've lost this debate. Your behavior would get you laughed out of the debating hall.
 
When I put the flag anomaly forward as proof of a hoax, I'm not conflating anything.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ymwE1sNm82Y
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I7yc2rVOs00

Nor am I conflating anything when I say that the movement of the tip of Collins' jacket corner is this clip is consistent with gravity.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6fqdB1b53jc
(00:52 time mark)

When I say that the movement of Collins' jacket corner is obviously in the same environment as this guy's jacket corner...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DTNGNW5Evs4

...and obviously in a very different environment from that in these two videos...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ofwzby1c7o
(3:17 time mark)

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=TejsnPThmd4

...I'm not conflating anything.

Tell us whether you agree with BetaMax's analysis of the buoyant safety cables.

I do not see the same interpretation, or arrive at the same conclusions as you do.
In all cases you have been shown to be in error , after which you often resort to the "do you deny it could be faked" which essentially has you equating 'possibility' with "proof"

I simply cannot accept such illogic nor can I comprehend that anyone would.
 
how would agreeing or disagreeing with Betamax prove the fakery you insist must have occured?
Agreeing with BetaMax would show that you are less-than-objective and therefore not fit to analyze Apollo hoax evidence.

In all cases you have been shown to be in error , after which you often resort to the "do you deny it could be faked" which essentially has you equating 'possibility' with "proof"
But I haven't been shown to be in error. You people just have the attitude that I have. I pointed out that the tip of Collins' jacket corner was below where the bottle was attached to his torso and that part of the jacket corner behaved the way it would in gravity and nobody took it beyond that.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6fqdB1b53jc
(00:52 time mark)

You haven't shown that to be wrong. Go ahead and do it now. Also, please say whether you agree with BetaMax in his analysis of the buoyant safety cables.
 
These are pretty lame questions which are hardly worth the time, as if I had access to classified info. Are you saying it was impossible? Are you saying NASA didn't have the capability to do all of that? If they had the capability, it's plausible and photos from space therefore can't be used as proof that there were people in space. They also don't make the mountain of hoax proof go away.

[spam removed]


Are you saying it was impossible to fake. Please link to one of those shots so we can discuss what we actually see. Also, please tell us whether you agree with BetaMax's analysis of the buoyant safety cables which I mentioned earlier.

Yes, I am saying it is impossible to fake. I am saying that people took that footage, and they took that footage where they said they took it, when they said they took it. The totality of evidence supports that. You have provided nothing to prove otherwise.

The footage you ask for is in the link I posted and the companion videos on the same youtube channel. If you believe it was possible then you need to answer the questions I asked, which you clearly haven't done. You haven't done this because you have no answers and no proof. You might as well be claiming it was done by santa claus. That's how much proof you have. Made up spooks.

There is no mountain of proof of a hoax. There is not even a molehill. Not a hill of beans, not even a single bean. You claim there is evidence of a hoax, then provide the evidence that proves what I have posted is a false. Put up or shut up.

Everything you post alleging the hoax is a lie. it is a lie because it is not true. That's all there is to it.
 
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FF88, is it possible that you can write posts which don't contain links - especially links to your previous posts containing links to outside forums (as links to other forums are forbidden in this thread per the moderator, some pages earlier)?

If you cannot defend your position (an untenable position, anyway) in your own words and without linking to reams of the same tired linkspam, youtube videos and accusations of the whole world lying, one is forced to wonder whether even you believe the nonsense you post.
 
how would agreeing or disagreeing with Betamax prove the fakery you insist must have occured?

you have not answered this question FF

if I disagreed with him how would that prove fakery?

You assume your interpretations are correct and extrapolate that to meaning all others are unworthy of consideration
that is illogical
 
Yes, I am saying it is impossible to fake. I am saying that people took that footage, and they took that footage where they said they took it, when they said they took it. The totality of evidence supports that. You have provided nothing to prove otherwise.
Sorry, but that was fakable.
http://www.veoh.com/watch/v17299829n75qtFtS?h1=Apollo+XI:+The+Little+Gem

Also, you have refused to say whether or not you agree with BetaMax which shows that you are less-than-objective and therefore unfit to analyze Apollo footage and pictures. Please say whether you agree with BetaMax.
 
Sorry, but that was fakable.
http://www.veoh.com/watch/v17299829n75qtFtS?h1=Apollo+XI:+The+Little+Gem

Also, you have refused to say whether or not you agree with BetaMax which shows that you are less-than-objective and therefore unfit to analyze Apollo footage and pictures. Please say whether you agree with BetaMax.

You haven't denied you're a seven year old girl. Therefore you are a seven year old girl.

No evidence again. No answers to questions again. If you are refusing to do so then I'm not playing your games. I have no idea who Betamax is or what he claims.

Jarrah's piece of garbage? That opening shot of the Earth photographed over the LM? Hey guess what, the Earth in that shot matches exactly every satellite image taken on that day,before the satellite images were actually taken. Likewise all the video footage matches exactly the satellite images. The first transmission made on the 16th shows a hurricane that can only have been taken on that day and can only have been taken in cislunar space. Jarrah's claims are lies.
 
FF88, is it possible that you can write posts which don't contain links - especially links to your previous posts containing links to outside forums (as links to other forums are forbidden in this thread per the moderator, some pages earlier)?

If you cannot defend your position (an untenable position, anyway) in your own words and without linking to reams of the same tired linkspam, youtube videos and accusations of the whole world lying, one is forced to wonder whether even you believe the nonsense you post.

Having been an avid reader of this thread, it seems to me that FF88 is in the position of wearing the Emperor's New Clothes, and his constant links back to other things he has written and youtube videos is an attempt to show he really has 'the finest cloth'. He has to believe, really, otherwise he has to face up to the fact that he's gone out into the world naked.

I'm one of the crowd, laughing.
 
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