Is there a legitimate reason to question the official narrative*?

Is there a legitimate reason to question the official narrative?

  • Total voters
    153
Jango said:
Just the way things happened, I suppose. Like the way the Twin Towers looked when they collapsed (add WTC #7 to that too, although I didn't know about that building's collapse until late 2011) and that Orio Palmer (a marathon running firefighter who reached the impact zone of the South Tower) called over the radio that he needed two lines to fight a few pockets of fire maybe a minute or so before the building collapsed.
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The fire fighter never made it past the impact zone; and the fires were not a few, they were several floors. With things like this 911 truth built a fantasy world of CD and BS.

Jango said:
... some of it looked odd to me. ...
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What else was odd?
 
Jango said:
Just the way things happened, I suppose. Like the way the Twin Towers looked when they collapsed (add WTC #7 to that too, although I didn't know about that building's collapse until late 2011) and that Orio Palmer (a marathon running firefighter who reached the impact zone of the South Tower) called over the radio that he needed two lines to fight a few pockets of fire maybe a minute or so before the building collapsed.
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To say that something "looked odd" is a signature of the esteemed members of cluelessforum. Are you one of them, by chance?

The way things happened? Can you be any more vague? What, PRECISELY looked "odd" and why? For example, is it your impression that because a firefighter who could only see the area immediately around him wanted 2 lines, that there were only ACTUALLY 2 little fires, despite what you can see from the videos taken from outside the building? Are you unable to distinguish between what a firefighter inside one floor can perceive and what a camera outside an entire building can record? Or are you seeing and hearing what YOU want to see and hear?
 
beachnut said:
The fire fighter never made it past the impact zone; and the fires were not a few, they were several floors. With things like this 911 truth built a fantasy world of CD and BS.


What else was odd?
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Palmer radioed "two isolated pockets of fire" and "we should be able to knock it down with two lines" from the 78th floor.
 
sylvan8798 said:
To say that something "looked odd" is a signature of the esteemed members of cluelessforum. Are you one of them, by chance?

The way things happened? Can you be any more vague? What, PRECISELY looked "odd" and why? For example, is it your impression that because a firefighter who could only see the area immediately around him wanted 2 lines, that there were only ACTUALLY 2 little fires, despite what you can see from the videos taken from outside the building? Are you unable to distinguish between what a firefighter inside one floor can perceive and what a camera outside an entire building can record? Or are you seeing and hearing what YOU want to see and hear?
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1. Unfortunately for you, no I am not.

2. I was specific with at least one item -- the way the buildings looked when they collapsed. And re: Orio Palmer -- it isn't so much the fires themselves that is odd but the supposed heat which allowed for sagging and that not very long after his radio transmission the South Tower fell as though nothing was supporting it.
 
Jango said:
...odd but the supposed heat which allowed for sagging and that not very long after his radio transmission the South Tower fell as though nothing was supporting it.
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And your qualifications in structural engineering of high-rise buildings and forensic engineering of fire-damaged structures are...?
 
Jango said:
Lol. Do you want to have a conversation or not?
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It's unclear what type of conversation you seek.

Are you here to seek information because there are things you don't know and want to understand better? Then ask, and be prepared to accept the answers.

Or are you here to make claims? Then make claims, present evidence, and be prepared to defend them.


And please, no random walk from issue to issue. Structure!

Jango said:
Or boredom.
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That's ok, I figure many here spend time in this and other forums because they are bored.
Shouldn't mean you can't put in a serious effort to learn something.
 
Jango said:
Palmer radioed "two isolated pockets of fire" and "we should be able to knock it down with two lines" from the 78th floor.
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He was wrong. And you failed to study it past the BS statement. Then you will make a silly claim, "as if nothing was supporting it".
The Gish Gallop of repeating junk from 911 truth. With the purpose of "discussing", yet you fail to stop long enough to discuss and say what is odd; or list what is "legit". You move to the next "tagline" from 911 truth, and quote mines that built 911 truth into the failed fantasy machine of woo it is today, now in reruns.

The sad part is the water system was hit, and he would have no water. What floor did the aircraft hit? I am ready to discuss, what do you bring to the table?

What time did he make his transmission, and what time did the tower fall? Why is it odd a firefighter does not have x-ray vision to see through the floor to the top floors where the biggest office fires in history were propagating up.

You only came with the one statement, no time line, not more info?
 
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Jango said:
Just the way things happened, I suppose. Like the way the Twin Towers looked when they collapsed (add WTC #7 to that too, although I didn't know about that building's collapse until late 2011)
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Crikey, talk about uninformed. I knew about Building 7's collapse on the 11th September 2001. Did you really remain unaware until 2011?

Dunno about the U.S, but it was reported on British TV news channels on the day, and in the following morning's newspapers.


Jango said:
and that Orio Palmer (a marathon running firefighter who reached the impact zone of the South Tower) called over the radio that he needed two lines to fight a few pockets of fire maybe a minute or so before the building collapsed.
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Here's an idea...


Stop being clueless and start using the search function, then you can stop wasting your time and everyone else's time:

http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?p=2035359#post2035359

http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?p=2033951#post2033951

http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=95123

and

http://www.debunking911.com/fire.htm
 
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Jango said:
Palmer radioed "two isolated pockets of fire" and "we should be able to knock it down with two lines" from the 78th floor.
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ETA: Sorry, I thought you were talking about WTC7 for a sec there, but clearly you were not as it did not have a 78th floor. I'll just leave my response below as a preemptive one regarding WTC7's fires in case that would've been raised as an issue (as it usually seems to be).

"We walked over by number Seven World Trade Center as it was burning and saw this 40-plus story building with fire on nearly all floors"
-FDNY Lieutenant Robert LaRocco

"Just when you thought it was over, you're walking by this building and you're hearing this building creak and fully involved in flames. It's like, is it coming down next? Sure enough, about a half an hour later it came down"
-FDNY Lieutenant James McGlynn

"It was fully englufed, that whole building. [...] you could see the flames going straight through from one side of the building to the other. That's an entire block."
-Firefighter Tiernach Cassidy

"[...] I reported to Frank [Cruthers]. He said, we're moving the command post over this way, that building's coming down. At this point, the fire was going virtually on every floor[...]"
-FDNY Deputy Chief Nick Visconti

"You see the white smoke, you see the thing leaning like this? It's definitely going. There's no way to stop it. 'Cause you have to go up in there to put it out, and it's already, the structural integrity is not there."
-FDNY Miller of Engine 15

"I was standing right next to the building, probably right next to it.
There was a huge gaping hole and it was scattered through there. It was a huge hole. I would say it was probably a third of it, right through the middle of it."
FDNY Captain Chris Boyle

"At this point, 7, which is right there on Vesey, the whole corner of the building was missing. I was thinking to myself we are in a bad place, because it was the corner facing us."
-FDNY Fred Marsilla

"...we were pretty sure that 7 World Trade Center would collapse. Early on, we saw a bulge in the southwest corner between floors 10 and 13, and we had put a transit on that and we were pretty sure she was going to collapse. You could see there was a visible bulge, it ran up about three floors. It came down about 5 o'clock in the afternoon, but by about 2 o'clock in the afternoon we realized this thing was going to collapse."
-FDNY Deputy Chief Peter Hayden

"We heard reports all day long of 7 World Trade possibly coming down...We heard that all day long, all the warnings."
-FDNY Firefighter Christopher Patrick Murray

"At this point Seven World Trade was going heavy, and they weren't letting anybody get too close. Everybody was expecting that to come down. ... Later on in the day it was getting close that they were more concerned about seven coming down...as we were waiting for seven to come down they kept backing us up vesey almost like full block they were concerned about seven coming down and they kept changing us establishing collapse massa 18 zone and backing us up."
-FDNY Fred Marsilla

"I issued the orders to pull back the firefighters and define the collapse zone. It was a critical decision; we could not lose any more firefighters."
-FDNY Chief Daniel Nigro

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Jango said:
Palmer radioed "two isolated pockets of fire" and "we should be able to knock it down with two lines" from the 78th floor.
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From which we can conclude nothing about fires on the 79th floor and up. You know, like where the plane actually hit, rather than the floor that was just clipped by a wingtip.

Dave
 
I think I may have spotted a small error here:

Jango said:
78th floor was the impact zone on the South Tower, so I don't know what yer trying to peddle.
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So, once again. Let's see if anything goes in and stays in:

http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?p=2035359#post2035359

http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?p=2033951#post2033951

http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=95123

and

http://www.debunking911.com/fire.htm
 
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Jango said:
Lol. Do you want to have a conversation or not?
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I do, but I don't accept layman's impressions as an argument on a subject that requires licensed expertise. I assume from your deflection that you have no appropriate qualifications and that your personal judgments, e.g., "as though nothing was supporting it," are not evidence.

And I agree with Oystein -- while this particular thread is fairly broad in the scope of discussion it could cover (i.e., the panoply of reasons to "question" the 9/11 narrative), please do not jump from one subject to another in the manner of evading discussion some topic you get stuck on.
 
Jango said:
1. Unfortunately for you, no I am not.

2. I was specific with at least one item -- the way the buildings looked when they collapsed. And re: Orio Palmer -- it isn't so much the fires themselves that is odd but the supposed heat which allowed for sagging and that not very long after his radio transmission the South Tower fell as though nothing was supporting it.
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Not specific enough. What about them looked "odd" to you? Had you any previous experience whatsoever by which to judge how such an event SHOULD look versus how it actually DID look?

Complete the following sentence: A firefighter on the 78th floor said he needed two lines to put out some small fires there, from which I conclude __________.
 
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