Getaway driver arrested for murder.

Vixen said:
No, I did not say that. I said, in the UK news, when a person is said to be armed, people generally take it to mean armed with a gun, unless it's qualified by 'armed with knives', or whatever the weapon.
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This is what you said in post 328:
Vixen said:
Armed usually means with a loaded gun.
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Then you said this in post in post 358:
Armed robbery means = with a gun or imitation gun in the UK.
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All of which means you were ignorant of what the legal definition of "going armed" is in the U.S. Myself and several others have posted that definition with several links, so if you like, you can go back, read them, and become better informed.
 
Dr. Keith said:
Generally, I agree. I just know that I would have to be quite certain before I pulled a trigger. So, I may not shoot when I legally could and that may cost me my life.
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What you described happened to me. I didn't shoot and I'm glad I didn't, for the reason you mentioned.
 
marplots said:
What you described happened to me. I didn't shoot and I'm glad I didn't, for the reason you mentioned.
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I told a guy trying to break in I had a gun and I would shoot him if he came in; he actually kept fussing with the door for a second before hoofing it.

If he'd continued, I would have had to hoof it to the basement to find my weapon as I'd recently moved and hadn't unpacked it.
 
Argumemnon said:
This is what you tell them as they get down to business?

You probably wish you had grabbed your gun when you had the chance rather than chit-chat with the intruders, right?
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Terrible logic. As of the moment you hear someone break in, you have no idea of their motive, other than the obvious one of burglary.

Your fantasy scenario is a hypothetical what-if, and I do not waste time answering hypothetical questions.

What if they wore dresses? Then they could be your grandmother.
 
Vixen said:
Terrible logic. As of the moment you hear someone break in, you have no idea of their motive, other than the obvious one of burglary.
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That's exactly my argument!

Are you going to acknowledge that your solution, to talk to people who just broke in your home and whose intentions you don't know, is stupid?
 
Argumemnon said:
That's exactly my argument!

Are you going to acknowledge that your solution, to talk to people who just broke in your home and whose intentions you don't know, is stupid?
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Being British, I feel sure I would politely but firmly demand to know what they were doing, and invite them to leave.
 
Resume said:
This is what you said in post 328: Then you said this in post in post 358:
All of which means you were ignorant of what the legal definition of "going armed" is in the U.S. Myself and several others have posted that definition with several links, so if you like, you can go back, read them, and become better informed.
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Fwiw, as someone originally from the uk, when we say "armed" it just means "has a weapon" (including knives). I have no idea what vixen is going on about.
 
Vixen said:
No, I did not say that. I said, in the UK news, when a person is said to be armed, people generally take it to mean armed with a gun, unless it's qualified by 'armed with knives', or whatever the weapon.
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So far I think that "people" in your claim is limited to you and no one else.
 
Vixen said:
Being British, I feel sure I would politely but firmly demand to know what they were doing, and invite them to leave.
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There is logic to this ... with one caveat (I'll add)

Since I assume (same as me) even if you had access to firearms you would not have them ready for the extremely unlikely event of a home invasion.

And assuming you were home alone (in the UK)

Yelling at intruders to get out might work, most of the time ... the caveat I'll add is to do so with one hand on the opposite exit door and get ready to run away, very fast.
 
Vixen said:
Being British, I feel sure I would politely but firmly demand to know what they were doing, and invite them to leave.
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Being British or any other nationality, anyone should figure that breaking into property that does not belong to you is actually a very convincing invitation to leave. Pointing a gun at the perp is also another very convincing invitation to leave. It seems the three dead men could not take a hint.

Still waiting to see who the 1% in this thread other than you and me who are not so happy these guys are dead. Going to give us a hint?
 
Ranb said:
Being British or any other nationality, anyone should figure that breaking into property that does not belong to you is actually a very convincing invitation to leave. Pointing a gun at the perp is also another very convincing invitation to leave. It seems the three dead men could not take a hint.

Still waiting to see who the 1% in this thread other than you and me who are not so happy these guys are dead. Going to give us a hint?
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We have been told 'it is illegal to point a gun at somebody'.

Maybe the other solution is to call the police before descending the stairs with your AR 15.
 
Vixen said:
We have been told 'it is illegal to point a gun at somebody'.

Maybe the other solution is to call the police before descending the stairs with your AR 15.
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In Canada it's illegal to even have a firearm loaded unless it's in a location where it can be legally used ... of course a home invasion (or literally, foxes in the hen house) certainly qualify as a location.
 
Vixen said:
Maybe the other solution is to call the police before descending the stairs with your AR 15.
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A perfect solution is to stay the **** out of other's homes. To not break in, twice. They had time to think about things and they thought the best idea was to commit another crime wearing masks and carrying weapons.
 
Vixen said:
Being British, I feel sure I would politely but firmly demand to know what they were doing, and invite them to leave.
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You're dodging the point, constantly. It's beginning to appear that you're doing so deliberately.

How do you know that they do not have violent intentions? Can you take that chance, since they just broke into your home?
 
Inside Edition said:
She recalled: "I heard the gunshots and I waited and I waited, waiting for them and then Jake came out. I seen him by the gate and he slid across my car. All I could hear him say was, 'I got hit.' He fell down in the driveway."

Rodriguez sped off but surrendered to police just hours later. She revealed that there was somebody else in the car with her who is believed to be a 15-year-old girl.

"I took her where I knew she could be safe," Rodriguez said.

She says she and the three teens committed several carjackings and home invasions together.

"I guess we kind of got used to not getting caught. We made bad choices," she said...
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http://www.insideedition.com/headli...me-invasion-case-has-a-lot-of-regrets-defends
 
Argumemnon said:
You're dodging the point, constantly. It's beginning to appear that you're doing so deliberately.

How do you know that they do not have violent intentions? Can you take that chance, since they just broke into your home?
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Apparently British criminal thugs are much more effetely ineffectual than our American variety, and simply wilt in the face of a stern talking-to. That would certainly fit in with the stereotypes most people have of the British.
 
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Vixen said:
No, I did not say that. I said, in the UK news, when a person is said to be armed, people generally take it to mean armed with a gun, unless it's qualified by 'armed with knives', or whatever the weapon.
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Were talking about OK, not UK in this thread.
 
When I lived in the "back woods" the police station closed and all officers were off duty, between midnight and Seven AM .

If there was an emergency, someone had to phone them at home and they had to get dressed to go to the call (at least they let them keep the cruiser at home! :)

So average case (if you were far away from the offices house) ... and no other emergencies were happening, it was 45 minutes to get there.

Worst case? ... a couple hours!
 
Vixen said:
That's to change the subject. The Westminster atrocity was neither a robbery or a breaking and entry nor a stand your ground. He was shot by armed police trained to apprehend terrorists committed to violating security measures.
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Oh, please, they are still criminals.
The UK debate on the subject goes back further than the Tony Martin case.

You presume to speak for all Britons and declare that none of them "applaud" those that kill in defence of their homes.

You are wrong.
 
Yeggster said:
There's an old American Saying ...

"When you are seconds from death ... the police are only minutes away"
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You know seconds and minutes are just units used to measure time, right? And using one or the other doesn't imply any particular quantity relationship.

It reminds me of what we used to tell patients about the flu. "If you take antibiotics, it will only last seven days. If you go without antibiotics it lasts a whole week."
 
Vixen said:
Terrible logic. As of the moment you hear someone break in, you have no idea of their motive, other than the obvious one of burglary.

Your fantasy scenario is a hypothetical what-if, and I do not waste time answering hypothetical questions.

What if they wore dresses? Then they could be your grandmother.
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Mine are long dead - and they would not have broken in!!!!!
 
Vixen said:
Armed robbery means = with a gun or imitation gun in the UK. A knife, baton or a cosh is merely 'an offensive weapon'.

If referring to a knife, a newsreader might say, 'armed with a knife', but if he or she just says, 'armed' it is taken to mean, with a gun.
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Apparently you know nothing about the UK

http://www.derbytelegraph.co.uk/der...nience-store/story-29808595-detail/story.html

http://www.bucksfreepress.co.uk/new...ty_to_knifepoint_Marlow_bank_robbery_attempt/

http://www.gazette-news.co.uk/news/15071553.Man_charged_over_knifepoint_newsagents_robbery/

That's three. That's enough.
 
Matthew Best said:
Presumably if they're British too, you can just take it on trust.
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Especially if they are obviously teenage boys - possibly drunk - they do tend to have an immature readiness to defer to parents, adults and teachers.

The young thugs in my area, politely make way for me on the pavement, which they probably wouldn't for a fellow teen.

My American friend's son was the epitome of Southern politeness when I visited the USA, a really charming young man, so imagine how shocked I was when my son told me he was spitting over CD's in the Mall shop if he didn't like the artiste and uprooting his Mom's confederate flag off the lawn when she wasn't looking.
 
EHocking said:
Oh, please, they are still criminals.
The UK debate on the subject goes back further than the Tony Martin case.

You presume to speak for all Britons and declare that none of them "applaud" those that kill in defence of their homes.

You are wrong.
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I didn't say that. I dare say the average Brit would say, 'Hang 'em and flog 'em'.
 
Noztradamus said:
Apparently you know nothing about the UK

http://www.derbytelegraph.co.uk/der...nience-store/story-29808595-detail/story.html

http://www.bucksfreepress.co.uk/new...ty_to_knifepoint_Marlow_bank_robbery_attempt/

http://www.gazette-news.co.uk/news/15071553.Man_charged_over_knifepoint_newsagents_robbery/

That's three. That's enough.
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Are sensationalist-style local papers all you could find?

In addition, as I said:

Harry B***, of High Street, Marlow, also pleaded guilty at Aylesbury Crown Court to one count of possession of a knife blade/sharp pointed article in a public place.
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ETA In England & Wales, armed robbery is not a separate offence from Robbery. However, as above, you will be charged with possession of an offensive weapon in a public place.

England and Wales[edit]
Robbery is a statutory offence in England and Wales.[5] It is created by section 8(1) of the Theft Act 1968 which reads:

A person is guilty of robbery if he steals, and immediately before or at the time of doing so, and in order to do so, he uses force on any person or puts or seeks to put any person in fear of being then and there subjected to force.[6]

Aggravated theft

Robbery is the only offence of aggravated theft.[7]

Aggravated robbery

There are no offences of aggravated robbery.[7]
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robbery
 
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dudalb said:
I suspect there are unofficial exceptions to the Knife law;otherwise you would have to arrest just about every costume Participant at a Renfair or SCA Event.....
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The unlawful carry law (21-1272) was amended last November to remove all reference to knives. Knives are legal to carry now. However, a knife still falls under the definition of a "deadly or dangerous weapon". Both the knife and the brass knuckles in the burglary would be deadly or dangerous weapons.

As long as we seem to be going through the entirety of the Oklahoma criminal statutes, I did notice that Oklahoma still has laws against blasphemy and profane swearing (21-901 to 21-905):

Profane swearing consists in any use of the name of God, or Jesus Christ, or the Holy Ghost, either in imprecating divine vengeance upon the utterer, or any other person, or in light, trifling or irreverent speech.
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If you dare trifle with Jesus in the great state of Oklahoma you might find yourself a dollar short:

Every person guilty of profane swearing is punishable by a fine of One Dollar ($1.00) for each offense.
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marplots said:
You know seconds and minutes are just units used to measure time, right? And using one or the other doesn't imply any particular quantity relationship.

It reminds me of what we used to tell patients about the flu. "If you take antibiotics, it will only last seven days. If you go without antibiotics it lasts a whole week."
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That's not correct ... you are not taking into account any sort of reality.

The object was MICRONS tall ...

The object was MILES tall ...

Yes you COULD measure a man's hight in fraction of a Parsec ... or the distance to the nearest sun in Attometers ... but nobody does that.
 
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