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Tags cold reading , mediums , psychics

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Old 30th August 2019, 09:21 AM   #281
Myriad
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Originally Posted by isissxn View Post
Well, I think a baby that dies just dies. The end. Very sad, but just the way it is.

And when it's an infant dying at birth, the reason it's sad is because it's so traumatic for the parents and others whose hopes and expectations for the life-to-be are so cruelly dashed. I don't believe it's sad for the infant, because the infant has not yet formed a mind, which is something that only emerges from the interaction of an organism with the world.

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But let's go with my boyfriend's worldview for a minute, since he believes in reincarnation, and we've discussed it a number of times.

According to him, a baby that dies (or anything that dies) releases its spirit and re-joins the collective spiritual consciousness of the world. Some time later (as "time," the way we understand it, has no meaning in the spirit world), the spirit comes into something else that is being born. It could be another human baby, an animal, a plant, or whatever. It could happen instantaneously (again, from our human perspective of time), or it could happen thousands of years later. Spirits do not have "lives" and singular consciousness during that period, they are just part of a collective whole.

While there are still some obvious logical problems with this framework, it makes a hell of a lot more sense than spirit primary schools and backwards aging and whatever else you're proposing. I find your view needlessly complicated, and I almost wonder if you are joking.

Your boyfriend's worldview is a kind of free-form version of the reincarnation narrative. Most versions (including in the Asian cultures that originated the idea) are somewhere in between your boyfriend's and Scorpion's spirit-world-as-afterlife-movie-set view. (You know, all those movies and shows, like RIPD and Six Feet Under and The Magicians and Harry Potter, where the afterlife looks and works like a train station, or a gigantic office floor, or some other way of depicting it as ironically mundane as possible. Usually with the caveat, "this is just how it appears to you in your limited mind.")

So, most would agree with Scorpion that the trend in incarnations is purposeful and generally progressive; a spirit incarnated in human form might (in most versions if not in Scorpion's) have previously been incarnated in animal form but would not go back to such a form unless perhaps it screwed up incredibly badly; that would be like having to be sent back to a remedial class. But they'd agree with your boyfriend that spirits in the spirit world do not have spirit bodies that are just like humans except for being sexless; they're higher beings with astral and mental bodies (the etheric body being left behind shortly after the material one); they don't drive spirit cars or work at spirit jobs or attend spirit grade schools.

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ETA - At any rate, I'm glad you're feeling okay mentally now, and that you're so willing to talk about your experiences. That is valuable.

Me too. For me Scorpion's always a pleasure to talk to, no matter how much we disagree.
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Old 30th August 2019, 09:33 AM   #282
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Originally Posted by isissxn View Post
Is the idea that when we die our consciousness just ends really that awful? I've always found it a bit comforting.

I recall what was probably my first existential crisis. I was really young, probably 4 at the oldest, and the memory is fuzzy, but still emotionally powerful. My parents had just finished giving me what was supposed to be a comforting spiel about heaven and people living there forever after they die, and I suddenly found myself filled with a horror I couldn't even begin to articulate. I thought about what living forever truly meant. Just the idea of something going on forever, WITHOUT END, was terrifying to me. I started to cry and freak out, running around the house and refusing to go to bed. My folks honestly couldn't understand why I was scared. They still probably couldn't.
The very idea of spirits as represented by TV ghost-hunters, mediums and spiritualists . . . well, I would absolutely hate to be such a spirit. That's horrifying! Roaming the places I lived/died/loved . . . unable to interact with stuff except making doors close, tables tilt, etc . . . almost no one can see me or hear me and when they can they can only make out vague stuff like, "I'm getting an R . . . a male . . . " And if the medium said that I was happy in the afterlife or some other comforting ********, it would obviously be a blatant lie! It would be a horrifyingly, lonely and eternal existence.

It would very much be like having locked-in syndrome -totally conscious but unable to move much or speak and communication is by subtle eye movements or such so that it's difficult to communicate big ideas like, "Please! Kill me!" I've had nightmares about it.
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Old 30th August 2019, 09:49 AM   #283
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Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
What else do you think could happen to a baby that dies? It must slowly develop mentally in the spirit world, and its body grows to the prime of life.
I've seen you say elsewhere that spirits don't have bodies or that they are advanced forms of mind or whatever. So if a spirit is a higher form independent of physicality, then why would it matter if the spirit incarnated a baby? Given that it's been reincarnated many times, what would the purpose of a spiritual kindergarten be for baby spirits. There's no such thing as baby spirits if all spirits are eternal and subject to many reincarnations.

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Old people who die grow backward to the prime of life and remain in that status.
This is similarly inconsistent with the idea of eternal spirits.

Thinking on this more, it sounds very much like L Ron Hubbard's craziness about when a thetan (spirit) leaves the body, it is snatched up by an electromagnetic ribbon and transported to galactic implant stations for indoctrination and readying for reincarnation (which is the name of my new album, I think). What happens at the implant stations is that thetans are brainwashed into having certain beliefs by various alien races in Hubbard's space fantasy religion. These implants are responsible for the idea of Heaven and Jesus, for example. Your spiritual kindergarten is not far off . . .
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Old 30th August 2019, 10:05 AM   #284
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Originally Posted by xjx388 View Post
I've seen you say elsewhere that spirits don't have bodies or that they are advanced forms of mind or whatever. So if a spirit is a higher form independent of physicality, then why would it matter if the spirit incarnated a baby? Given that it's been reincarnated many times, what would the purpose of a spiritual kindergarten be for baby spirits. There's no such thing as baby spirits if all spirits are eternal and subject to many reincarnations.
The occult theory is we have several bodies, the lowest of which is the physical body. We have higher bodies, such as the astral body, and the mental body. These bodies do not have the organs of the mortal body, but are vehicles of consciousness that contain the spirit. When a human baby dies its spirit returns to the higher worlds as a baby in form, and it has to grow to maturity, and be guided to develop awareness. It may choose to reincarnate when it reaches a sufficient level of understanding.
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Old 30th August 2019, 10:20 AM   #285
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Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
The occult theory is we have several bodies, the lowest of which is the physical body. We have higher bodies, such as the astral body, and the mental body. These bodies do not have the organs of the mortal body, but are vehicles of consciousness that contain the spirit. When a human baby dies its spirit returns to the higher worlds as a baby in form, and it has to grow to maturity, and be guided to develop awareness. It may choose to reincarnate when it reaches a sufficient level of understanding.
You keep using that word (and so on...). It may be useful to you to think of a "theory" as "something I can make up to answer objections to other things I've made up," but utility to your "Truth" doesn't make things true, or ideas about them into actual, testable theory.
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Old 30th August 2019, 10:27 AM   #286
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Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
As Penn Jillette said in their psychic episode another weird factor is... a lot of these so called psychics start to believing in their own bull. A lot of these tricks, especially cold reading, are things you can start doing by accident.

But, as Penn says, lying to yourself does not make lying to others okay.
Yes, but I think Teller summed up the value of psychics best when he said
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Old 30th August 2019, 12:28 PM   #287
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Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
The occult theory is we have several bodies, the lowest of which is the physical body. We have higher bodies, such as the astral body, and the mental body. These bodies do not have the organs of the mortal body, but are vehicles of consciousness that contain the spirit. When a human baby dies its spirit returns to the higher worlds as a baby in form, and it has to grow to maturity, and be guided to develop awareness. It may choose to reincarnate when it reaches a sufficient level of understanding.
This makes no sense. The spirit of a dead baby has to go to spirit kindergarten and reach a certain level of awareness . . . only to have to discard that awareness in order to revert to an "awareness-less" baby spirit form to get reincarnated into a new baby body?

What's the point of a spirit reaching a sufficient level of awareness if they don't get to retain that awareness? And then: What about adult spirits?


ETA: Your ideas about spirits are not internally consistent. The whole scheme makes no sense and seems to accomplish nothing. How is this appealing to you?
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Old 30th August 2019, 12:42 PM   #288
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Originally Posted by xjx388 View Post
This makes no sense. The spirit of a dead baby has to go to spirit kindergarten and reach a certain level of awareness . . . only to have to discard that awareness in order to revert to an "awareness-less" baby spirit form to get reincarnated into a new baby body?

What's the point of a spirit reaching a sufficient level of awareness if they don't get to retain that awareness? And then: What about adult spirits?


ETA: Your ideas about spirits are not internally consistent. The whole scheme makes no sense and seems to accomplish nothing. How is this appealing to you?
I think a baby that dies and grows up in the spirit world has to reach a sufficient level of understanding before becoming capable of realising its further spiritual evolution can only be achieved by reincarnating again.

All memory of past lives is stored in the soul body, which is formless and the seat of consciousness. But the soul body cannot be accessed by an incomplete soul. Only when we achieve enlightenment and can sustain a high level of spiritual consciousness will we remember the details of past incarnations.
Nothing is lost and nothing is wasted. All experience both in this world and the time we spend in the spirit world between incarnations will ultimately be accessible to us at the end of our cycle of lives.
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Even in the valley of the shadow of death two and two do not make six.
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Old 30th August 2019, 12:50 PM   #289
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Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
My mother did not want me to get involved with spiritualists, and she shut her mind to it. She was probably a little shocked when I told her I got a message from her baby, who said he had grown up in the spirit world. I think she tried to put it out of her mind. But in later years she came to believe.

No I have no evidence, and I did not make any note of the mediums name because I only saw her once. I remember the names of other mediums, like 'Gay Muir' who told me how to close my aura, to protect myself from negative psychic energy. Trevor Williams, who's developing circle I sat in.
Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
I believe there are kindergarten schools in the spirit world where babies are looked after until they grow to maturity. Spirits do not remember their previous incarnations until the end of their cycle of reincarnations.

By this time, my brother may have chosen to reincarnate, and maybe I will never meet him when I die. I do not know because I no longer attend church, so I don't get any new messages.
Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
I appreciate the sarcasm, but the answer is sex is neutral in the spirit world.
We do not have physical desires in the spirit body. Sex is primarily for reproduction, and spirits do not reproduce.
Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
What else do you think could happen to a baby that dies? It must slowly develop mentally in the spirit world, and its body grows to the prime of life.
Old people who die grow backward to the prime of life and remain in that status.

You do not have to tread carefully with regard to my mental status. I have been through mental hell on earth and survived it.
Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
Funny, I was always scared of death when I was a child. But after what I have been through, the idea of permanent death does not scare me any more.

However the things I have experienced lead me to believe we survive death.
But we do not go on as we are for eternity. We incarnate many, many times in a long cycle of rebirths until reaching a perfected status of mind and spirit. Then we end our cycle of reincarnations and continue to evolve as immortal spirits. We are not ready to face eternity as the limited human beings we are now, but as enlightened beings who have reached a state of grace, we will continue to evolve in the spirit world, reaching ever higher levels of consciousness.

We are not yet at the level of maturity of soul that will come in future times, and I have heard a spirit guide say our present level of evolution is something like early childhood of the race. It may take another million years for us to be complete.
Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
The spirits I have heard from state they survive as individuals, not as a collective. It may be that in the end of our cycle of reincarnations and after we evolve some more as immortals, we will eventually merge back into God.

But there is no place in that theory for us to regress into animals. I specifically asked a spirit guide who was speaking through a trance medium the question,' do animals evolve to become human' and she said 'no' We are all separate species that evolve to perfection in our own spiritual family. Or soul group
Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
Myriad, Diseases of the brain are cured by death. The spirit mind works without physical limitations of the earthly brain.

Spirits who die remember only their last lifetime, not all their previous incarnations. Those memories are stored in the soul body, which can only be accessed when we reach an enlightened state.

We may keep getting mind wiped, but the state of evolution of our soul shines through.
I heard the spirit guide of the late medium 'Ursula Roberts' say if we remembered our past lives before we were ready it might drive us mad. We could not deal with the things we may have done. Because we have been at lower levels of spiritual evolution in past lives, and may have done things then that would horrify us now.
Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
The occult theory is we have several bodies, the lowest of which is the physical body. We have higher bodies, such as the astral body, and the mental body. These bodies do not have the organs of the mortal body, but are vehicles of consciousness that contain the spirit. When a human baby dies its spirit returns to the higher worlds as a baby in form, and it has to grow to maturity, and be guided to develop awareness. It may choose to reincarnate when it reaches a sufficient level of understanding.
Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
I think a baby that dies and grows up in the spirit world has to reach a sufficient level of understanding before becoming capable of realising its further spiritual evolution can only be achieved by reincarnating again.

All memory of past lives is stored in the soul body, which is formless and the seat of consciousness. But the soul body cannot be accessed by an incomplete soul. Only when we achieve enlightenment and can sustain a high level of spiritual consciousness will we remember the details of past incarnations.
Nothing is lost and nothing is wasted. All experience both in this world and the time we spend in the spirit world between incarnations will ultimately be accessible to us at the end of our cycle of lives.
You post all of this as though you know these things for a fact. How do you "know" these things?

And if you post that the mediums or spirits told you so, you will be in a very stupid circular argument.
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Old 30th August 2019, 12:58 PM   #290
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Originally Posted by abaddon View Post
You post all of this as though you know these things for a fact. How do you "know" these things?

And if you post that the mediums or spirits told you so, you will be in a very stupid circular argument.
Well I will just have to go round in circles then, because what I believe came from attending many trance lectures in the spiritualist association in London during the 1970's. I cannot remember much of the details of what was said in many lectures I attended. But what I say is largely views I formed from listening to the mediums speaking.
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Even in the valley of the shadow of death two and two do not make six.
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Old 30th August 2019, 01:08 PM   #291
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Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
I believe there are kindergarten schools in the spirit world where babies are looked after until they grow to maturity.
I have to wonder then... Do ghosty kids eat paste and pick their noses?
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Old 30th August 2019, 01:19 PM   #292
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Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
Well I will just have to go round in circles then, because what I believe came from attending many trance lectures in the spiritualist association in London during the 1970's. I cannot remember much of the details of what was said in many lectures I attended. But what I say is largely views I formed from listening to the mediums speaking.
Wait. You believe that evil doctrine on the basis of lectures you cannot even remember? Yet you also claim that your memory is perfectly clear? Which is it?
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Old 30th August 2019, 01:31 PM   #293
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Originally Posted by abaddon View Post
Wait. You believe that evil doctrine on the basis of lectures you cannot even remember? Yet you also claim that your memory is perfectly clear? Which is it?
I said my memory of the message I received about my brother was clear.

I cannot possibly remember everything that was said in many hours of lectures. Just the essence of what I came to believe in listening to them.
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Even in the valley of the shadow of death two and two do not make six.
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Old 30th August 2019, 01:38 PM   #294
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Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
I think a baby that dies and grows up in the spirit world has to reach a sufficient level of understanding before becoming capable of realising its further spiritual evolution can only be achieved by reincarnating again.
But this kind of system makes no sense. See, it might make more sense if the idea was that a soul gains this awareness through many lifetimes of reincarnation -much like the Hindu and Buddhist systems. In those cases it's the incarnations of the spirit that give it the understanding and awareness to reach the final state of Nirvana or whatever. Don't get me wrong -those systems are ridiculous as well but at least there is some logic and internal consistency.

What you have described is a mish-mash of different ideas that don't really cohere.

Quote:
All memory of past lives is stored in the soul body, which is formless and the seat of consciousness. But the soul body cannot be accessed by an incomplete soul. Only when we achieve enlightenment and can sustain a high level of spiritual consciousness will we remember the details of past incarnations.
Nothing is lost and nothing is wasted. All experience both in this world and the time we spend in the spirit world between incarnations will ultimately be accessible to us at the end of our cycle of lives.
This is exactly what I mean. What you are saying here doesn't really cohere with other stuff you've said before. And the system you describe as a whole is completely illogical. And none of what you have said would account for mediums and their ability to talk to spirits that are presumably still grounded here on earth somehow . . .
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Old 30th August 2019, 01:52 PM   #295
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Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
I said my memory of the message I received about my brother was clear.

I cannot possibly remember everything that was said in many hours of lectures. Just the essence of what I came to believe in listening to them.
Then you agree that your memory is unreliable?
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Old 30th August 2019, 01:57 PM   #296
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Originally Posted by Dave Rogers View Post
...wait, what?

Dave (a physicist)
LOL I guess there's not a market for physicists talking about physics (typo, I meant talking about physics not physicists).

Let me give a different example. I know some engineers who make their living as engineers examining what happened to cause a failure and issuing a report, verbal or written. They are giving engineering scientific opinions that they believe to be true, and that are true (leaving aside disputes between experts). That they charge for their time including a profit doesn't make them fraudsters nor their beliefs untrue. Similarly if e.g. a dowser charges for their time visiting land, wandering around, advising where to dig a well, they could be fraudsters, or merely wrong/mistaken about the efficacy of dowsing. They could be honest but wrong or dishonest and wrong. But it's not the charging of money that proves a deceitful motive.
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Old 30th August 2019, 11:19 PM   #297
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Originally Posted by xjx388 View Post
But this kind of system makes no sense. See, it might make more sense if the idea was that a soul gains this awareness through many lifetimes of reincarnation -much like the Hindu and Buddhist systems. In those cases it's the incarnations of the spirit that give it the understanding and awareness to reach the final state of Nirvana or whatever. Don't get me wrong -those systems are ridiculous as well but at least there is some logic and internal consistency.

What you have described is a mish-mash of different ideas that don't really cohere.

This is exactly what I mean. What you are saying here doesn't really cohere with other stuff you've said before. And the system you describe as a whole is completely illogical. And none of what you have said would account for mediums and their ability to talk to spirits that are presumably still grounded here on earth somehow . . .
It all reads to me like the worst kind of fan fic. Scorpion is like a fan of a cheap third rate SF series trying to cobble together a coherent storyline out of numerous episodes written by different writers who neither noticed, nor cared about, the plot holes and inconsistences themselves. The only difference is that in that case noone is pretending the story is anything but pure fiction.
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Old 31st August 2019, 12:28 AM   #298
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Scorpion why don't you join a forum with other spiritualist? Why be on a forum where people just don't believe in what you do? It's strange. It's like me being on a Christian website even though I don't believe in it what so ever! Is it attention you seek?
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Old 31st August 2019, 12:30 AM   #299
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I've just received the rubber duck book in the post, I can't wait to read it :-)
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Old 31st August 2019, 12:32 AM   #300
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Originally Posted by isissxn View Post
I totally understand! It always gave me anxiety too. I half-blame my OCD on religion, in fact. My earliest exhibitions of those kinds of looping thoughts and obsessions and rituals were all centered around religion and fears about going to hell. The Bible story about Abraham being told to kill his son Isaac, in particular, scared me ****-less, because it made me think, "Wow. God will go that far to test people, that is pretty hardcore. How can I ever relax?" I always worried that God was trying to test me in different ways and developed all these rituals to try and prevent failing. It's hard to explain, but I think I definitely know what you mean about deep anxiety from that kind of spiritual stuff. I felt SO much better once I'd moved away from it entirely.

Of course, as a skeptic (), I do feel compelled to note that I could be confusing correlation and causation with regard to religion "giving" me OCD. Perhaps I'd have developed OCD regardless, and religious anxieties were just what my original symptoms centered around since that's what I was surrounded by as a kid. After all, I still have the OCD symptoms (though they're much more under control these days) - they just concern different types of things now. Either way, though, religion and spirituality can be stressful stuff. I think they can **** kids up, especially if they're presented too intensely in childhood.
Thank you for your comments, I too have OCD, religion can cause it I am so sure.
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Old 31st August 2019, 01:35 AM   #301
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I am wondering, when you pay someone via pay pal are they able to view your full name and address? This reading has scared me somewhat about how she knew I love others more than myself and how I should help people who are in pain. As previously stated I would like a job in mental health/counselling sector. I am wondering if she was able to track down my Facebook account? My name is Amy Welch and I live on Leicester, UK. Is it easy to find me on Facebook?
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Old 31st August 2019, 02:56 AM   #302
Matthew Best
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Are you originally from Poole, Dorset?
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Old 31st August 2019, 03:01 AM   #303
AmyW
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Yes I am, what else can you see about me and can you grasp quite a bit of info from it?
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Old 31st August 2019, 03:10 AM   #304
AmyW
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Originally Posted by Pixel42 View Post
The JREF million dollar challenge has been wound up but there are other organizations who offer prizes which also remain unclaimed. This one, for example, with which I am peripherally involved, offers $100,000:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indepe...igations_Group
This is awesome, just been on the website, looks great!
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Old 31st August 2019, 03:18 AM   #305
Matthew Best
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Well, I'm sensing what primary school you went to, what your favourite TV shows are, what bands you like, what books you've read, what you thought of Twycross Zoo.

If I had to guess I'd say you were about 32 or 33.
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Old 31st August 2019, 03:38 AM   #306
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Originally Posted by AmyW View Post
Scorpion why don't you join a forum with other spiritualist? Why be on a forum where people just don't believe in what you do? It's strange. It's like me being on a Christian website even though I don't believe in it what so ever! Is it attention you seek?
You don't expect me to leave all these atheists in peace do you. If the likes of me did not post here they would just go on patronising each other.
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Old 31st August 2019, 04:57 AM   #307
Darat
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Originally Posted by AmyW View Post
Scorpion why don't you join a forum with other spiritualist? Why be on a forum where people just don't believe in what you do? It's strange. It's like me being on a Christian website even though I don't believe in it what so ever! Is it attention you seek?
Scorpion is as welcome here as anyone else. Whilst I make no effort to hide my horror at what he believes in, for example 3 year olds being repeatedly raped is in the larger scheme of things a good thing as they can learn something or pay off a "karma debt" it is still interesting to me to learn about other people and what they believe in.
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Old 31st August 2019, 05:44 AM   #308
AmyW
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Originally Posted by Matthew Best View Post
Well, I'm sensing what primary school you went to, what your favourite TV shows are, what bands you like, what books you've read, what you thought of Twycross Zoo.

If I had to guess I'd say you were about 32 or 33.
Yes can you see quite a lot then?
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Old 31st August 2019, 05:45 AM   #309
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Not much on your timeline, just a few pictures of you and (presumably) your children. But everything in "About You" is public.
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Old 31st August 2019, 05:46 AM   #310
AmyW
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Originally Posted by Darat View Post
Scorpion is as welcome here as anyone else. Whilst I make no effort to hide my horror at what he believes in, for example 3 year olds being repeatedly raped is in the larger scheme of things a good thing as they can learn something or pay off a "karma debt" it is still interesting to me to learn about other people and what they believe in.
Of course he is, I am just a little perplexed, if he isn't a skeptic then why go on a skeptic forum? Bit weird
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Old 31st August 2019, 05:48 AM   #311
AmyW
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Originally Posted by Matthew Best View Post
Not much on your timeline, just a few pictures of you and (presumably) your children. But everything in "About You" is public.
Yes I do :-) so you can see that I used to be a carer and my work experience? Maybe this medium searched for me on Facebook, if she can see my work experiences, there you can see I was a carer
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Old 31st August 2019, 05:48 AM   #312
alfaniner
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Originally Posted by AmyW View Post
I am wondering, when you pay someone via pay pal are they able to view your full name and address?
The Paypal financial info is anonymous, but considering the seller has to send you an item, you have to provide your name and address, right? I know when I sell something on eBay, I just get the payment directly to my account, but I have to create a label to send so I do see those details.
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Old 31st August 2019, 05:49 AM   #313
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Scorpion you are welcome anywhere, I guess I just feel on the defence because I am trying to search a life without religion (because it really triggered a lot of anxiety for me) nothing personal against you as a human being :-)
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Old 31st August 2019, 05:58 AM   #314
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Originally Posted by Scorpion View Post
I think a baby that dies and grows up in the spirit world has to reach a sufficient level of understanding before becoming capable of realising its further spiritual evolution can only be achieved by reincarnating again.
I think you think that because your 'theory' requires continual ad hoc fudging to handwave away the glaring holes in it.

Every time someone lays out a valid objection to your spiritualist beliefs, you just respond by saying "Well, I think that..." and what follows is just some free from, evidence-free, mental gymnastics designed to brush the problem under the carpet.

None of it has any evidence or makes any sense, and has been pointed out, isn't even internally consistent.
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Old 31st August 2019, 06:17 AM   #315
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Originally Posted by AmyW View Post
Of course he is, I am just a little perplexed, if he isn't a skeptic then why go on a skeptic forum? Bit weird
We get a steady stream of believers here, determined to teach us the error of our ways. They almost always refuse to consider the possibility (a) that we've heard it all before and (b) that they might be the one who has something to learn.
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Old 31st August 2019, 07:00 AM   #316
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Originally Posted by alfaniner View Post
I have to wonder then... Do ghosty kids eat paste and pick their noses?
Ghist kids pick their noses for BOO! gers......



I'll get my coat.
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Old 31st August 2019, 07:01 AM   #317
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Originally Posted by AmyW View Post
...snipped... This reading has scared me somewhat about how she knew I love others more than myself and how I should help people who are in pain. ...snipped..
This part of the reading is easy to figure out. Any normally decent person will feel this is true. We like to think of ourselves as generous and caring. And, of course you should help people who are in pain, we all should.

The medium telling you are a loving and giving person makes you feel good. It's like telling a new parent "That's a beautiful baby!"
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Old 31st August 2019, 07:06 AM   #318
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Originally Posted by P.J. Denyer View Post
Ghist kids pick their noses for BOO! gers......



I'll get my coat.
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Old 31st August 2019, 07:24 AM   #319
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Originally Posted by Cosmic Yak View Post
The key point -IMHO- is this: we only have your own account of what happened.
That's part of the rhetoric. There is an informal rule of debate that says, "If you're explaining, you're losing." Claimants of the supernatural pepper their critics with anecdotes in order to keep them on the hook to provide explanations. Naturally since these anecdotes invariably occurred far away and long ago -- if they even occurred at all -- the critic has no chance of success. What the claimant has to account for is why these purported gifts wholly disappear when they occur under conditions in which we can acquire a multitude of evidence that would eventually let us reason between various possible explanations. The rhetoric is built entirely around keeping the claims practicably untestable. Any time the critics try to get out in front of all the problems with anecdotal testimony, the spiritualists scramble to declare themselves exempt. This is how we know what they know they're relying on.

Quote:
Memory is, as I'm sure you're aware by now, very fallible. What you have here is your recollection of what happened, which may not be accurate. We've seen this in this very thread: AmyW said that the medium knew her mother was dead, but, when the actual words were examined, that isn't what the medium said at all.
And that phenomenon has been repeatedly observed. The claimant remembers the encounter with the medium far more favorably than an objective record of the encounter reveals. This is why mediums generally want to interact only with people who already predisposed to believe their claims. This rosy recollection appears to be one of the psychological factors that practitioners rely on.
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Old 31st August 2019, 07:26 AM   #320
P.J. Denyer
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Originally Posted by AmyW View Post
I am wondering, when you pay someone via pay pal are they able to view your full name and address? This reading has scared me somewhat about how she knew I love others more than myself and how I should help people who are in pain. As previously stated I would like a job in mental health/counselling sector. I am wondering if she was able to track down my Facebook account? My name is Amy Welch and I live on Leicester, UK. Is it easy to find me on Facebook?
Again you're missing what we're trying to tell you, she didn't know this, it's a general Barnum statement, everybody thinks they're a good person, everybody thinks they put others ahead of themself, this statement is not in any way special to you, she's not sending out emails to anyone else saying "you're a malignant narcissist who needs to love yourself less". If someone had told Adolf Hitler he was a good person who loved too much and put other people first he'd have agreed it.

We all* think we're good, we all think we're generous people, we all think we have talent and potential, we're all the hero of our own stories and we cherry pick the evidence to prove it to ourselves.

*all in this case being pretty much anyone without very serious issues.
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