The Trump Presidency: Part 18

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Again.

*Deadpan* Oh no. Not tapes. What will Trump ever do when we again prove he's done the things we've already proven he did and he's admitted he's done already and it hasn't made a difference? If we prove he did it again it might... not make a difference again. Oh no.
 
JoeMorgue said:
He'll probably call it a Coup, the over-dramatic ponce. And his followers will agree.
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I’d heard the word pounce before but never knew the precise definition. Apparently it can mean a pimp or a man given to effeminate or ostentatious display in manners, speech, or dress; a fussy dresser.

Yes, as they say in Texas, there will be hunting from the specified dog. Or something like that.
 
Minoosh said:
Not to sound anti-democratic but other than maybe some generalities I don't presume any "people's right to know" the president's health status.

Bernie released his own info; Bernie's call.
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The President is our employee, invested with unique powers. We are entitled to know whether he is up to the job.

I note that both Reagan and GW Bush formally made their VPs Acting President for a few hours while they were under anesthesia, taking the office back after they recovered. They never said "It's nobody's business."
 
Arcade22 said:
Yeah I kinda realized that might be a part of reasoning behind it, but does that kind of thing work with car insurance? I assume that car insurance is mandatory, so can people get car insurance that doesn't offer any real coverage just so they can say that their car is insured?
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Car insurance is largely a standardized product, with options as to what's covered and by what amount. Some people hold down their premiums by choosing the minimum coverage with the lowest legal limits. But their policy specifies exactly what they're getting/not getting. Health insurance is different on multiple levels.
 
JoeMorgue said:
Again.

*Deadpan* Oh no. Not tapes. What will Trump ever do when we again prove he's done the things we've already proven he did and he's admitted he's done already and it hasn't made a difference? If we prove he did it again it might... not make a difference again. Oh no.
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What do you think _would_ change anything?
 
Belz... said:
What do you think _would_ change anything?
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Nothing, at least not in this context.

We have to give Trumpers an alternative to Trump we can live with. Sorry. I don't like it either.

The "win" state at the end of all of this is going to involve some compromise, as dirty as it feels.
 
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Delphic Oracle said:
.....
Full disclosure: I'm one of those really bad progressives who dislikes the ACA and the whole health care debate circa 2009/10 is when I lost all respect for most dem leadership. I even tried to reform towards the end, but then the celebratory attitude for presenting us with a highly polished turd sealed the deal. It still gets reflexively protected (sometimes even venerated) and I sort of understand, but then that also ends up cutting us off at the knees when we talk about needing to reform the system...anyways, I digress.
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The ACA was an attempt to make health insurance available to people who couldn't get it through an employer. It built on the existing system that everybody is familiar with. There might have been other ways to accomplish the same goal incrementally: letting people buy into Medicare at a younger age, expanding Medicaid by itself, creating a public option to compete with commercial insurance, etc. The ACA is the relatively conservative program that Obama was able to get through Congress, and even then the Repubs spent the next six years trying to kill it. But it did give health coverage to 20+ million people who didn't have it before. I doubt they want to give it up. The choice 10 years ago wasn't the ACA or single-payer; the choice was ACA or the existing system.
 
Bob001 said:
The President is our employee, invested with unique powers. We are entitled to know whether he is up to the job.

I note that both Reagan and GW Bush formally made their VPs Acting President for a few hours while they were under anesthesia, taking the office back after they recovered. They never said "It's nobody's business."
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I see it as more binary. If they're going to be out of commission entirely they put No. 2 in charge, but otherwise they are the president by virtue of the electoral process.

I never assume any of them are being completely candid. And really, I think there can be pretty good reasons for not disclosing everything.
 
Sarah Sanders Claims Donald Trump Reads 'More than anybody I know'

Former White House press secretary Sarah Sanders has defended President Donald Trump over claims in a new book by a White House insider that aides to the commander-in-chief have to "dumb down" briefings.

Hitting back at the suggestion in the book A Warning, penned by an anonymous senior White House official, that the president was unable to focus his attention on more than one point at a time, Huckabee Sanders claimed that Trump read "more than anybody I know."
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https://www.newsweek.com/sarah-sanders-donald-trump-reading-1473850
 
On the Trump health thing.

Is it telling that he hasn't played golf since October?
 
Captain_Swoop said:
Sarah Sanders Claims Donald Trump Reads 'More than anybody I know'
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I don’t like being called a liar. The other stuff bothered me far less.
- Sarah Sanders
https://www.marketwatch.com/story/s...witter-users-were-quick-to-respond-2019-11-25

Hmmm... perhaps if you didn't want to be called a 'liar' perhaps you might want to, I don't know... stop lying so much.

Unless of course she's telling the truth. But the only way that that could be is if Trump keeps a collection of "Where's Waldo" books at his desk.
 
Minoosh said:
I see it as more binary. If they're going to be out of commission entirely they put No. 2 in charge, but otherwise they are the president by virtue of the electoral process.

I never assume any of them are being completely candid. And really, I think there can be pretty good reasons for not disclosing everything.
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Like what? We know that Presidents have concealed their health problems in the past. But the secrecy has served their own interests, not ours. FDR was re-elected at a time when everyone around him knew he was at death's door, and he did die a few months after the election. JFK -- the public picture of health and vigor -- had severe medical problems all his life. Reagan was showing symptoms of Alzheimer's that his staff worked hard to conceal. Everything the President does affects public policy and government action. We need -- and are entitled -- to know about potential and actual problems.
 
Segnosaur said:
I don’t like being called a liar. The other stuff bothered me far less.
- Sarah Sanders
https://www.marketwatch.com/story/s...witter-users-were-quick-to-respond-2019-11-25

Hmmm... perhaps if you didn't want to be called a 'liar' perhaps you might want to, I don't know... stop lying so much.

Unless of course she's telling the truth. But the only way that that could be is if Trump keeps a collection of "Where's Waldo" books at his desk.
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He hasn't the patience to find Waldo.
 
Sanders doesn't mind being a liar, just being called one.
Same with Miller, Trump and all the other Republicans who are happy being racists but resent being labeled as such.
 
Bob001 said:
Like what? We know that Presidents have concealed their health problems in the past. But the secrecy has served their own interests, not ours. FDR was re-elected at a time when everyone around him knew he was at death's door, and he did die a few months after the election. JFK -- the public picture of health and vigor -- had severe medical problems all his life. Reagan was showing symptoms of Alzheimer's that his staff worked hard to conceal. Everything the President does affects public policy and government action. We need -- and are entitled -- to know about potential and actual problems.
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How far do you take that, though? Should all of their health records be posted online? They’re all going to have something wrong, sooner or later. They’re all going to die, sooner or later. Should their every frailty be broadcast for the world to see? Asthma, eczema, erectile dysfunction?

I don’t know if it would have been such a hot idea to announce Reagan had Alzheimer’s while in office. Should FDR not have been re-elected? I don’t actually know. Both the USSR and WWII situations were obviously very delicate, but at the time they both seemed to turn out well for the U.S. I think ideally you elect someone who appears robust and has a competent running mate, and hope that you can trust the process. That’s more critical than the variable health of a given individual, IMO.

As someone pointed out above, his absence from the golf course may tell us what we want to know.
 
Minoosh said:
How far do you take that, though? Should all of their health records be posted online? They’re all going to have something wrong, sooner or later. They’re all going to die, sooner or later. Should their every frailty be broadcast for the world to see? Asthma, eczema, erectile dysfunction?

I don’t know if it would have been such a hot idea to announce Reagan had Alzheimer’s while in office. Should FDR not have been re-elected? I don’t actually know. Both the USSR and WWII situations were obviously very delicate, but at the time they both seemed to turn out well for the U.S. I think ideally you elect someone who appears robust and has a competent running mate, and hope that you can trust the process. That’s more critical than the variable health of a given individual, IMO.

As someone pointed out above, his absence from the golf course may tell us what we want to know.
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I agree with Minoosh on this. Ther are as many good reasons not to require full disclosure on health conditions as there are for. Whereas I strongly believe full financial disclosure should be required.
 
Holy moly! From the lips of Rick Perry:

"God's used imperfect people all through history. King David wasn't perfect. Saul wasn't perfect. Solomon wasn't perfect,” Perry said in the clip.
“And I actually gave the president a little one-pager on those Old Testament kings about a month ago and I shared it with him,” he continued. “I said, 'Mr. President, I know there are people that say you said you were the chosen one and I said, 'You were.’ "

"I said, 'If you're a believing Christian, you understand God's plan for the people who rule and judge over us on this planet in our government,’ ” he added.
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https://thehill.com/homenews/administration/471868-rick-perry-says-trump-is-the-chosen-one

People who rule and judge over us are appointed by God is the "Divine right of kings" philosophy which is directly opposite of the principles the US was founded on. This negates the core principle of a democracy where the people decide on who governs (not rule and judge) us. Why bother voting at all if God already has a "chosen one" all lined up? I already knew Perry was a moron but this is just unbelievable.
 
Stacyhs said:
Holy moly! From the lips of Rick Perry:


https://thehill.com/homenews/administration/471868-rick-perry-says-trump-is-the-chosen-one

People who rule and judge over us are appointed by God is the "Divine right of kings" philosophy which is directly opposite of the principles the US was founded on. This negates the core principle of a democracy where the people decide on who governs (not rule and judge) us. Why bother voting at all if God already has a "chosen one" all lined up? I already knew Perry was a moron but this is just unbelievable.
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Yeah, that's pretty un-American.

I wonder if the Trumpsters' "burn it all" philosophy isn't supplemented with a heavy dose of "lead us, master!"
 
Stacyhs said:
Holy moly! From the lips of Rick Perry:

"God's used imperfect people all through history. King David wasn't perfect. Saul wasn't perfect. Solomon wasn't perfect,” Perry said in the clip.
“And I actually gave the president a little one-pager on those Old Testament kings about a month ago and I shared it with him,” he continued. “I said, 'Mr. President, I know there are people that say you said you were the chosen one and I said, 'You were.’ "

"I said, 'If you're a believing Christian, you understand God's plan for the people who rule and judge over us on this planet in our government,’ ” he added.
Click to expand...
https://thehill.com/homenews/administration/471868-rick-perry-says-trump-is-the-chosen-one

People who rule and judge over us are appointed by God is the "Divine right of kings" philosophy which is directly opposite of the principles the US was founded on. This negates the core principle of a democracy where the people decide on who governs (not rule and judge) us. Why bother voting at all if God already has a "chosen one" all lined up? I already knew Perry was a moron but this is just unbelievable.
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Perry is not long for that job. Or he is entirely oblivious to the impeachment proceedings going on, in which Trump is being shown to be an inveterate, incorrigible and totally venal liar and admitting it.
 
Norman Alexander said:
Perry is not long for that job. Or he is entirely oblivious to the impeachment proceedings going on, in which Trump is being shown to be an inveterate, incorrigible and totally venal liar and admitting it.
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I wonder how long after getting the job as secretary of energy did he find out he was in charge of the nuclear arsenal?
 
Minoosh said:
How far do you take that, though? Should all of their health records be posted online? They’re all going to have something wrong, sooner or later. They’re all going to die, sooner or later. Should their every frailty be broadcast for the world to see? Asthma, eczema, erectile dysfunction?

I don’t know if it would have been such a hot idea to announce Reagan had Alzheimer’s while in office. Should FDR not have been re-elected? I don’t actually know. Both the USSR and WWII situations were obviously very delicate, but at the time they both seemed to turn out well for the U.S. I think ideally you elect someone who appears robust and has a competent running mate, and hope that you can trust the process. That’s more critical than the variable health of a given individual, IMO.

As someone pointed out above, his absence from the golf course may tell us what we want to know.
Click to expand...

Medical conditions that do not directly affect the ability to govern are none of our business. I don't care if s/he's got asthma, eczema, mild heart disease etc. What I do care about is if they have a serious medical condition such as Alzheimer's. Of course we should have known that Reagan had Alzheimer's in office (if he did; it's never been confirmed).

FDR was in a unique position due to WWII. His physical health was not good, but his mental health was fine. His capacity to lead the country during the final months of the war was intact.
 
Stacyhs said:
Holy moly! From the lips of Rick Perry:


https://thehill.com/homenews/administration/471868-rick-perry-says-trump-is-the-chosen-one

People who rule and judge over us are appointed by God is the "Divine right of kings" philosophy which is directly opposite of the principles the US was founded on. This negates the core principle of a democracy where the people decide on who governs (not rule and judge) us. Why bother voting at all if God already has a "chosen one" all lined up? I already knew Perry was a moron but this is just unbelievable.
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Amen. ;)
 
Stacyhs said:
Medical conditions that do not directly affect the ability to govern are none of our business. I don't care if s/he's got asthma, eczema, mild heart disease etc. What I do care about is if they have a serious medical condition such as Alzheimer's. Of course we should have known that Reagan had Alzheimer's in office (if he did; it's never been confirmed).
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But any medical condition could affect his fitness for office, especially if he's on medication that has potential side effects. The Presidency is probably the most public position in the world. Secrecy is always a bad thing.

Stacyhs said:
FDR was in a unique position due to WWII. His physical health was not good, but his mental health was fine. His capacity to lead the country during the final months of the war was intact.
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But FDR didn't. He died in April 1945, before D-Day, before Hiroshima, and by most accounts Truman was thoroughly unprepared to step into the role. If FDR had stepped aside after three terms and allowed a normal transition, instead of stunning the nation with his abrupt unanticipated death, it would have been better for the country.
 
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Bob001 said:
But FDR didn't. He died in April 1945, before D-Day, before Hiroshima, and by most accounts Truman was thoroughly unprepared to step into the role. If FDR had stepped aside after three terms and allowed a normal transition, instead of stunning the nation with his abrupt unanticipated death, it would have been better for the country.
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D-Day was june 7 1944, so 10 months before he died by most calendars. He did die before 9th of may 1945 when germany surrendered which of course was 11 months after D-day.
 
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