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Old 2nd April 2020, 10:32 PM   #81
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Originally Posted by novaphile View Post
Well in Canberra maybe, but in lots of other places ships can unload directly onto trains. (And load directly from)
Lots of ships being loaded here in Canberra.

But I was referring to driving a train into a ship, which as I acknowledged a lot of posts ago wasn't what was happening anyway.
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Old 2nd April 2020, 10:40 PM   #82
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Originally Posted by arthwollipot View Post
The engineer is the person who operates the engine.

Funny how it works like that.
Just like people who operate pions, mountains, buccans, and mousekets.
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Old 2nd April 2020, 10:44 PM   #83
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Originally Posted by Ladewig View Post
I think it is easy to understand this guy; just imagine that Donald Trump’s father had been a fireman on a steam engine instead of a multi-millionaire.
Now imagine that Donald Trump’s father had been a fireman on a steam engine and a multi-millionaire. It would explain a few things.
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Old 2nd April 2020, 10:45 PM   #84
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Originally Posted by catsmate View Post
...he was suspicious of the Mercy and believing it had an alternate purpose related to COVID-19 or a government takeover.
That Mercy ship is here to WRECK OUR TRAINS!!!
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Old 2nd April 2020, 10:49 PM   #85
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Originally Posted by SpitfireIX View Post
Sorry to derail the thread (so to speak), but I really wish the US would adopt the UK and Commonwealth parlance and start referring to locomotive operators as "drivers," rather than "engineers." Of course, that will never happen.
Let's just settle on "locomotiveeringerdrivers" and keep things simple.
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Old 2nd April 2020, 11:01 PM   #86
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Here's the video of the accident!

YouTube Video This video is not hosted by the ISF. The ISF can not be held responsible for the suitability or legality of this material. By clicking the link below you agree to view content from an external website.
I AGREE
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Old 2nd April 2020, 11:02 PM   #87
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Originally Posted by arthwollipot View Post
Seriously, this discussion is reminding me of how I once chastised my electrical-engineer father for using the word "current" when there was no water involved.
I assume he was talking about jelly.
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Old 2nd April 2020, 11:38 PM   #88
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Originally Posted by arthwollipot View Post
Still not getting it. Train tracks don't end at ships.
In Picton (not far from where I live) railway tracks run right onto ships. They literally shunt the rolling stock directly onto the ship using a shunting engine.
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Old 3rd April 2020, 07:32 AM   #89
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I feel like there's a trolley problem joke just begging to be made here.

I wonder if a person was tied to the track and that news just hasn't hit yet?
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Old 3rd April 2020, 07:37 AM   #90
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Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
I feel like there's a trolley problem joke just begging to be made here.

I wonder if a person was tied to the track and that news just hasn't hit yet?
America itself was tied, not to the track, but to the pier. This brave engineer pilot driver loco-man crashed his train trying to save the country from the boat. Less trolley problem, more Speed 2.
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Old 3rd April 2020, 07:38 AM   #91
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Originally Posted by DevilsAdvocate View Post
Let's just settle on "locomotiveeringerdrivers" and keep things simple.
Trainswain (pronounced train-sen)
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Old 3rd April 2020, 08:21 AM   #92
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I'm still just broken up and sitting on the fence about this whole situation.
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Old 3rd April 2020, 08:22 AM   #93
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I don't know why he did this but I'm sure he had a loco motive.
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Old 3rd April 2020, 08:45 AM   #94
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Originally Posted by BobTheCoward View Post
Trainswain (pronounced train-sen)
Tra'sun, surely.
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Old 3rd April 2020, 09:00 AM   #95
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Doesn't sound like a great new entry in the series, but I guess Keanu and Sandra need the cash!
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Old 3rd April 2020, 09:11 AM   #96
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Originally Posted by P.J. Denyer View Post
Doesn't sound like a great new entry in the series, but I guess Keanu and Sandra need the cash!
Keanu seems to be doing just fine without the franchise.
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Old 3rd April 2020, 09:31 AM   #97
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Originally Posted by P.J. Denyer View Post
Doesn't sound like a great new entry in the series, but I guess Keanu and Sandra need the cash!
So about 10 years back there was a halfway decent but forgettable disaster film called Unstoppable about a runaway freight train loaded with hazardous material that will derail in a major populated area if it isn't stopped. Standard disaster movie fair; evil businessman that wants to save the company money, one of our hero's estranged wife and daughter just so happen to live in the populated area, scene were heroic guy has to get on the moving train, all very good and well.

Well it was mentioned in some of the reviews for the film that it was based on a "real life incident" which intrigued me so I read up on it.

In May of 2001 locomotive CXS 8888 did in fact leave an Ohio under power but without control and was out of control for 2 hours, reaching speeds of over 50 mphs and was indeed carrying several traincars of toxic chemicals, not the "Kill thousands and ecological disaster" of the stuff in the film but surely stuff you wouldn't want a big area to take a bath in for sure and while everything was very highly dramatized for the film a lot of beats where the same, including failed attempts at using protable derailing devices to slow/stop the train and the police shooting out the tires.

It's just so weird to see the film, shot in Tony Scott's patented (and missed) high energy action movie style and the real world footage, like comparing Chris Pine in the film having to jump onto the uncontrolled train from another train and the real world footage of "They got the train to slow down enough that a chubby, middle aged rail engineer at a light job was able to catch up with and climb on board and take control."
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Old 3rd April 2020, 10:10 AM   #98
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Keanu seems to be doing just fine without the franchise.
Check out unstoppable.
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Old 3rd April 2020, 10:49 AM   #99
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Originally Posted by BobTheCoward View Post
Check out unstoppable.
The train movie that doesn't have Keanu Reeves in it? Did you mean Unbreakable, the superhero movie that doesn't have Keanu Reeves in it? Or possibly Unforgettable, the psychological thriller move that doesn't have Keanu Reeves in it?

Why would I be checking out any of these, in the context of Keanu Reeves' career success?
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Old 3rd April 2020, 03:01 PM   #100
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
The train movie that doesn't have Keanu Reeves in it? Did you mean Unbreakable, the superhero movie that doesn't have Keanu Reeves in it? Or possibly Unforgettable, the psychological thriller move that doesn't have Keanu Reeves in it?

Why would I be checking out any of these, in the context of Keanu Reeves' career success?
I believe the title of the movie referred to is Unwatchable. It started a trend that a lot of movies followed.
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Old 3rd April 2020, 03:16 PM   #101
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Originally Posted by Norman Alexander View Post
People are trying to engineer it as that. But they went off the rails.





[next contestant, please!]
This is literally a train wreck.

What?

Too obvious?
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Old 3rd April 2020, 03:43 PM   #102
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Originally Posted by TragicMonkey View Post
I believe the title of the movie referred to is Unwatchable. It started a trend that a lot of movies followed.
If it didn't have Keanu Reeves in it, then of course it was unwatchable.
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Old 3rd April 2020, 04:07 PM   #103
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Tra'sun, surely.
Nah; trainswain isn't going to work because -swain indicates a command/management position. Engineers literally just operate the engine. The person "in command" as it were of the train is the conductor.
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Old 3rd April 2020, 05:18 PM   #104
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Originally Posted by Checkmite View Post
Nah; trainswain isn't going to work because -swain indicates a command/management position. Engineers literally just operate the engine. The person "in command" as it were of the train is the conductor.
or, using the more usual understanding of swain, just a very ardent trainspotter?
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Old 3rd April 2020, 05:26 PM   #105
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Originally Posted by EHocking View Post
or, using the more usual understanding of swain, just a very ardent trainspotter?
That's actually the etymology of the word. The boat swain was (and is) the person whose main responsibility is knowledge of and care for the boat itself. I'm thinking it must have started as poking fun at the boat maintenance guy, and evolved into an honorable name for an honorable profession.

"Guy who operates the train" can totally be a train swain in my book.
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Old 3rd April 2020, 05:28 PM   #106
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Train whip?
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Old 3rd April 2020, 05:56 PM   #107
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Multi track drifting?
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Old 3rd April 2020, 05:57 PM   #108
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
That's actually the etymology of the word. The boat swain was (and is) the person whose main responsibility is knowledge of and care for the boat itself. I'm thinking it must have started as poking fun at the boat maintenance guy, and evolved into an honorable name for an honorable profession.

"Guy who operates the train" can totally be a train swain in my book.
Still doesn't work - the engineer doesn't operate the train, just the engine. I know that may sound semantic but it really isn't: the conductor operates the train. He tells the engineer what to do with the engine specifically, and does everything else manually - so uncoupling or decoupling cars, operating track switches if required, handling communications and etc. Way back a long time ago train crews had another position called the brakeman and the conductor gave him orders too, but in modern trains that job is automated.

Interestingly, I don't think the guys who operate small locomotives just to shunt cars around a railyard get called engineers (though I forget what they ARE called).
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Old 3rd April 2020, 06:56 PM   #109
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Originally Posted by Checkmite View Post
Still doesn't work - the engineer doesn't operate the train, just the engine. I know that may sound semantic but it really isn't: the conductor operates the train. He tells the engineer what to do with the engine specifically, and does everything else manually - so uncoupling or decoupling cars, operating track switches if required, handling communications and etc. Way back a long time ago train crews had another position called the brakeman and the conductor gave him orders too, but in modern trains that job is automated.

Interestingly, I don't think the guys who operate small locomotives just to shunt cars around a railyard get called engineers (though I forget what they ARE called).

During the middle part of the Age of Steam, most American freight trains had five crew members: the conductor, engineer, fireman, flagman (senior brakeman, also responsible for signaling), and brakeman. One of the brakemen's jobs when the train was moving was to watch along the cars for any problems with the equipment. One of the brakemen also usually prepared the crew's meals in the caboose ("brake van" or "guard's van," for you British and Commonwealth types) when necessary, so conductors generally tried to get at least one who was a good cook.

Also, the driver of a switch engine ("shunting engine") is still referred to as an engineer, though there may be a qualifier such as "yard" attached. Possibly you are thinking of a hostler, who is authorized to move a locomotive from one location to another within a yard, usually to or from a maintenance area. See here.
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Old 3rd April 2020, 07:06 PM   #110
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Originally Posted by Checkmite View Post
Still doesn't work - the engineer doesn't operate the train, just the engine. I know that may sound semantic but it really isn't: the conductor operates the train. He tells the engineer what to do with the engine specifically, and does everything else manually - so uncoupling or decoupling cars, operating track switches if required, handling communications and etc. Way back a long time ago train crews had another position called the brakeman and the conductor gave him orders too, but in modern trains that job is automated.

Interestingly, I don't think the guys who operate small locomotives just to shunt cars around a railyard get called engineers (though I forget what they ARE called).
I know a guy that does this for a job.


Most people think he’s a real shunt.

(I’m sorry, I can’t pronounce the letter sh)
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Old 3rd April 2020, 09:12 PM   #111
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So a train tried to sink a ship.

Hasn't anyone here geeked out enough to reference the time a submarine attacked a train?
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Old 3rd April 2020, 09:24 PM   #112
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Originally Posted by crescent View Post
So a train tried to sink a ship.

Hasn't anyone here geeked out enough to reference the time a submarine attacked a train?
The crew of a sub went ashore and attacked a train, not quite the same as the sub itself launching an overt attack on a train, which, we have to agree, would be pretty impressive.

That's not to short change the impressive naval maneuver they pulled off before the crew's on shore anti-rail antics by any means.
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Old 3rd April 2020, 10:39 PM   #113
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Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
So about 10 years back there was a halfway decent but forgettable disaster film called Unstoppable about a runaway freight train loaded with hazardous material that will derail in a major populated area if it isn't stopped. Standard disaster movie fair; evil businessman that wants to save the company money, one of our hero's estranged wife and daughter just so happen to live in the populated area, scene were heroic guy has to get on the moving train, all very good and well.

Well it was mentioned in some of the reviews for the film that it was based on a "real life incident" which intrigued me so I read up on it.

In May of 2001 locomotive CXS 8888 did in fact leave an Ohio under power but without control and was out of control for 2 hours, reaching speeds of over 50 mphs and was indeed carrying several traincars of toxic chemicals, not the "Kill thousands and ecological disaster" of the stuff in the film but surely stuff you wouldn't want a big area to take a bath in for sure and while everything was very highly dramatized for the film a lot of beats where the same, including failed attempts at using protable derailing devices to slow/stop the train and the police shooting out the tires.

It's just so weird to see the film, shot in Tony Scott's patented (and missed) high energy action movie style and the real world footage, like comparing Chris Pine in the film having to jump onto the uncontrolled train from another train and the real world footage of "They got the train to slow down enough that a chubby, middle aged rail engineer at a light job was able to catch up with and climb on board and take control."
That incident probably was not the only one it was inspired by. In 1989 there was an incident near San Bernardino in which a train was unable to slow down on a long downward gradient due to the wagons being overweight and several of the locomotives having faulty dynamic brakes. The train could not stop and derailed on a bend in the track, ploughing through a residential area killing four people including two crews. This was actually a double disaster, as the clean-up crew damaged gas pipes with earthmoving equipment, and that lead to a gas explosion two weeks later which killed another two residents.
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Old 3rd April 2020, 10:41 PM   #114
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Originally Posted by EHocking View Post
I know a guy that does this for a job.


Most people think he’s a real shunt.

(I’m sorry, I can’t pronounce the letter sh)
Try it with the letter "k".
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Old 3rd April 2020, 10:51 PM   #115
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Originally Posted by smartcooky View Post
That incident probably was not the only one it was inspired by. In 1989 there was an incident near San Bernardino in which a train was unable to slow down on a long downward gradient due to the wagons being overweight and several of the locomotives having faulty dynamic brakes. The train could not stop and derailed on a bend in the track, ploughing through a residential area killing four people including two crews. This was actually a double disaster, as the clean-up crew damaged gas pipes with earthmoving equipment, and that lead to a gas explosion two weeks later which killed another two residents.
This one from 1959 in New Jersey was thrilling for me to read as a kid.
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Old 3rd April 2020, 11:45 PM   #116
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Originally Posted by Norman Alexander View Post
Try it with the letter "k".
What.
Spell shunt with a k?



Oh! I never thought of that before! What a silly shunt!
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Old 4th April 2020, 08:24 AM   #117
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Originally Posted by Checkmite View Post
Still doesn't work - the engineer doesn't operate the train, just the engine. I know that may sound semantic but it really isn't: the conductor operates the train. He tells the engineer what to do with the engine specifically, and does everything else manually - so uncoupling or decoupling cars, operating track switches if required, handling communications and etc. Way back a long time ago train crews had another position called the brakeman and the conductor gave him orders too, but in modern trains that job is automated.

Interestingly, I don't think the guys who operate small locomotives just to shunt cars around a railyard get called engineers (though I forget what they ARE called).
I mean, it works just fine for me. Natural languages aren't systems of formal logic. I'm content just to see a line of kinship, in the meanings of related words, and the meanings of the same word in different times and places.

Last edited by theprestige; 4th April 2020 at 08:26 AM.
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Old 4th April 2020, 09:13 AM   #118
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Originally Posted by Norman Alexander View Post
This one from 1959 in New Jersey was thrilling for me to read as a kid.

Although, this one postdates Joe's movie by three years it's as if it has cast a large Mégantic cloud over the entire industry.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lac-M%..._rail_disaster
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Old 4th April 2020, 10:07 AM   #119
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Originally Posted by Norman Alexander View Post
This one from 1959 in New Jersey was thrilling for me to read as a kid.

Thanks for sharing that; I remember my dad's telling me about this episode when I was a kid. The detail about the attempt to throw a flare into the cab to see if there was anyone in it jogged my memory. I wonder if he read that particular article, because that seems like a detail that might not have been reported by most newspapers.
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Old 4th April 2020, 03:56 PM   #120
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Originally Posted by Norman Alexander View Post
This one from 1959 in New Jersey was thrilling for me to read as a kid.
Thrilling for me to read as an adult.
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