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20th May 2020, 10:18 AM | #161 |
Penultimate Amazing
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Oh, I can do these in.
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When our club was closing, we had several extreme angry members, high emotions with the associates, and towards the end a cop standing right by us at the Membership desk. There were people being much more belligerent while associates and management were literally crying. No one was cuffed. EDIT: I don't think I mentioned it yet, but an electronics associate MUST check in electronics returns. This includes inspecting for damage, completeness, and troubleshooting so the member doesn't get another product that doesn't solve their problem (the number of returns I saved by informing people you don't get HD through a coaxial cable or composite (RCA) cables is large). |
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Circled nothing is still nothing. "Nothing will stop the U.S. from being a world leader, not even a handful of adults who want their kids to take science lessons from a book that mentions unicorns six times." -UNLoVedRebel Mumpsimus: a stubborn person who insists on making an error in spite of being shown that it is wrong |
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20th May 2020, 10:21 AM | #162 |
Penultimate Amazing
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20th May 2020, 10:24 AM | #163 |
Penultimate Amazing
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20th May 2020, 10:24 AM | #164 |
"más divertido"
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20th May 2020, 10:37 AM | #165 |
Penultimate Amazing
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For an item still in the POS, it is literally as easy as typing in their membership number, going to the purchases screen, and typing in the item number. Then waiting the 30 seconds unjustifiably old/bad system takes to bring up the purchase. It isn't actually the receipt, but it's good enough for the return because the receipt number is there, and the register system will have the rest. If information is needed from the receipt that is not there, the receipt number can be used in a different even older MSDOS prompt system to bring up a copy of the receipt going back about two years.
EDIT: This will also show if and what items from that purchase have already been returned. |
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Circled nothing is still nothing. "Nothing will stop the U.S. from being a world leader, not even a handful of adults who want their kids to take science lessons from a book that mentions unicorns six times." -UNLoVedRebel Mumpsimus: a stubborn person who insists on making an error in spite of being shown that it is wrong |
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20th May 2020, 10:37 AM | #166 |
Philosopher
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So, if he's doing it by divine means, I can only tell him this: 'Mr. Geller, you're doing it the hard way.' --James Randi |
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20th May 2020, 01:56 PM | #167 |
The Clarity Is Devastating
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Heh. Lowes used to accept returns unconditionally. Even when a return was an obvious scam the associates weren't allowed to refuse it. Five gallon drums of deck stain would be returned full of water. Christmas trees, natural and artificial, would be returned for a full refund, in January.
They've changed their return policies since then. |
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20th May 2020, 02:03 PM | #168 |
Penultimate Amazing
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One of my favorites was seeing a customer try to return a toilet in its box at Home Depot. The associate opened the cellophane taped box, and it contained the old toilet. Guy said 'put that down as reason for return, used'. The return was denied.
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20th May 2020, 02:36 PM | #169 |
Penultimate Amazing
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20th May 2020, 02:36 PM | #170 |
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The weakness of all Utopias is this, ... They first assume that no man will want more than his share, and then are very ingenious in explaining whether his share will be delivered by motorcar or balloon. -G.K. CHESTERTON |
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20th May 2020, 02:39 PM | #171 |
Penultimate Amazing
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It seems to me that all of those things are potentially issues, even under the Sam's Club policy.
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Ż\(ş_o)/Ż ETA: Here's an actual question for you. Aren't you even the least bit curious, just in terms of having a complete story, what was the nature of the dispute at the returns counter, that resulted in the cops showing up and throwing beatings at people? |
20th May 2020, 02:49 PM | #172 |
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20th May 2020, 03:29 PM | #173 |
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I used to work for a department store that had one of those no questions asked return policies. Employees were told to issue a slight challenge like "This brand isn't and has never been sold by this store" and if the customer didn't leave then either issure a refund based on the price tag, or make them an offer.
One big scam was in fragrances. A customer buys ( or steals ) a plastic wrapped bod with a bottle of perfume in it, somehow opens the plastic wrapper. takes out the box and bottle, removes the bottle and replaces it with something of similar weight as the bottle, usually a rock, reseals the plastic wrapper and returns the box with the rock in it for a full refund. Sales associates wouldn't examine the wrapping and issue a full refund. Later someone else some back with the actual bottle of perfume and returns it saying " I tried it for a week and I hate it, sorry I threw out the box" and gets a refund. Stealing things and returning them was par for the course. Then there was the buy an expensive item of clothing, wear it for a while then return it for a refund with the insistence that" No, it's never been worn" scam. Thieves and scammers knew how store security worked and store security knew that thieves and scammers knew how store security worked so there was this constant dance with both groups trying to stay one step ahead of each other. Got a really obvious thief scoping the place out ? Don't pay too that person because they're a distraction for the real thief whose no too far behind. Sometimes store security would act and look like thieves so the real thieves would relax and ply their trade confident that the other thief will have store securities attention. |
20th May 2020, 03:35 PM | #174 |
Penultimate Amazing
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I am not sure that the reason for the altercation is important. We know that it was not a fraudulent return because the police took possession of the television at the shop and returned it to the Grays. If it had been an old television set that they were trying to fraudulently return then the police would have kept it as evidence.
So here is an idea. The Grays come in with the television to return it for the reasons they give, because of the false accusation by the store that the son was trying to steal it. They also say they want to cancel their membership. The on duty manager comes out to see if he can sort the issue out, given it is a long time member. They start to discuss the issue and it turns into an argument about who did what and why it was unreasonable. The argument becomes heated. |
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20th May 2020, 03:51 PM | #175 |
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The reason for the return is about as relevant as the color of the guy's socks. Nobody has a reasonable explanation for how or why the police got involved.
Why is the violence being questioned less than shopping habits? |
20th May 2020, 03:59 PM | #176 |
Trigger Warning
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Bingo. Now imagine a society that is full of people who are either white and trying desperately hard to be as non-racist toward blacks as possible (and distance themselves from their ancestors in this regard), giving them the benefit of the doubt automatically whenever they claim to be the victims of a racist incident OR black people who automatically side with other black people in such claims.
Now, if your society is that - or even vaguely like that, do we think such false claims become more, or less likely? Hmm. L.L. Bean recently changed a very unconditional return system too. These are all symptoms of moving from a homogeneous, high trust society to... this mess. |
20th May 2020, 03:59 PM | #177 |
Muse
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I used to work at Hills Department Stores (regional chain, they went out of business decades ago) and covered the service desk on occasion. The most frustrating part of the job was telling a customer that I couldn't accept a return because of our store policies, having them complain to a manager, then being told to process the return anyway. Everyone knew that management would accept anything, but we still had to go through the motions every time. |
20th May 2020, 04:13 PM | #178 |
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20th May 2020, 04:19 PM | #179 |
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20th May 2020, 04:33 PM | #180 |
Penultimate Amazing
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"Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect" -Mark Twain "Half of what he said meant something else, and the other half didn't mean anything at all" -Rosencrantz, on Hamlet |
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20th May 2020, 07:19 PM | #181 |
Penultimate Amazing
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It seems to me that you and others are very willing to dream up all sorts of scenarios for what the Grays were doing, such as returning an old television to commit fraud, although we know that this is not the case.
But you are not willing to ask why the cops rush straight in to grab the son without getting an explanation of what is going on or trying to de-escalate. |
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We all hate poverty, war, and injustice Unlike the rest of you squares. Tom Lehrer - Folk Song Army |
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20th May 2020, 07:57 PM | #182 |
Penultimate Amazing
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20th May 2020, 07:59 PM | #183 |
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I am not aware of any evidence that any crime was committed by the customers. If I'm missing something, let me know.
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20th May 2020, 08:09 PM | #184 |
Penultimate Amazing
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20th May 2020, 09:47 PM | #185 |
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We all hate poverty, war, and injustice Unlike the rest of you squares. Tom Lehrer - Folk Song Army |
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20th May 2020, 09:51 PM | #186 |
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We all hate poverty, war, and injustice Unlike the rest of you squares. Tom Lehrer - Folk Song Army |
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20th May 2020, 10:49 PM | #187 |
Penultimate Amazing
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Yes, we have store security video of it, did you not watch it or read my previous post summarizing what happened in it?
The first cop to arrive walks over to where Derek and his mother are talking with the employee. Derek and the cop exchange words (sorry not a lip reader) and then the cop tries to grab Derek's arm in an attempt to cuff him. So yes, the cop walks in and immediately determines that the agitated black guy need to be in handcuffs, an action that started the entire incident. This is the same cop that decided that since the black guy didn't allow him to put on those cuffs and was now walking away from him back to where his mother was, that the black guy needed to be tackled forcefully into a wall where a fire extinguisher was hanging, and then suplexed into the concrete floor of the store. |
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It must be fun to lead a life completely unburdened by reality. -- JayUtah I am not able to rightly apprehend the kind of confusion of ideas that could provoke such a question. -- Charles Babbage (1791-1871) |
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20th May 2020, 10:53 PM | #188 |
Penultimate Amazing
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The police did claim that Derek pulled the fire extinguisher from the wall in an attempt to attack the cop with it, though strangely he was never charged with it. Probably because the store video clearly shows that what really happened was that after being slammed into the wall and fire extinguisher by a cop tackling him from behind, Derek grabbed the fire extinguisher to try and prevent the cop from suplexing him into the concrete floor, an action that failed when the extinguisher simply came loose from its housing.
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It must be fun to lead a life completely unburdened by reality. -- JayUtah I am not able to rightly apprehend the kind of confusion of ideas that could provoke such a question. -- Charles Babbage (1791-1871) |
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20th May 2020, 11:24 PM | #189 |
Nitpicking dilettante
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20th May 2020, 11:42 PM | #190 |
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Remember, this happened in America, land of the free and home of the brave -
- where a white cop can harass and detain a black man for picking up trash outside his home; - where a white cop can walk into a black man's apartment and gun him down while he is sitting on his sofa eating ice-cream - where white cops can bust into wrong house (and by "wrong", I mean 10 miles away from the one they were looking for), looking for a black suspect they already had in custody and shot the black woman owner eight times in her bed, killing her - where two white rednecks (one an ex-Cop) can gun down and kill black jogger in cold blood, and it takes a leaked video months later, and a public outcry before law enforcement are shamed into taking action. So, what the **** ever gave you the idea that a cop even needs a good reason to intervene when a black man is having an argument in a shop - he's ******* black isn't he? Hell yeah!!! That is the only ******* reason he thinks he needs!! |
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21st May 2020, 12:07 AM | #191 | |||
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I can't see the video due to the sites lazy approach to GDPR regs in Europe. Is there any video of the moments before the cops turn up or does it start with the cops walking in?
Is this the video?
I believe the full 27 minute video is available at this location I can't access it though. If it is 27 minutes long that suggests a fair bit of "something" before the cops became involved. Can somebody go over and have a looksee? |
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21st May 2020, 01:26 AM | #192 |
Bandaged ice that stampedes inexpensively through a scribbled morning waving necessary ankles
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While ST's overcome with excitement at finally having a fan fiction scenario where the black guy is in the wrong to get his teeth into, let's remember, of course, that even if this had happened, it was after Derek Grey had been accused by a police officer of committing a crime that had occurred only in that officer's imagination. There's literally no way Grey could be seen to be in the wrong in the encounter that led to the later incident (as well as, of course, not a shred of evidence that either Grey did a single thing illegal, immoral or even vaguely questionable at any point in the entire proceedings).
Dave |
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21st May 2020, 01:50 AM | #193 |
Penultimate Amazing
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That is it, though it's a bit chopped up. It doesn't show the initial grab which happened prior to first part of the video shown starting, and then later on for some reason they jump over it with an edit. It does show the tackle and "supplex" with Derek vainly grabbing hold of the fire extinguisher to stop himself from being thrown backwards.
The rest of the 27 minutes really is just the two on the ground with the cops holding them down before they are taken out as is shown in this edited version. Most of the "action" happens in the first couple of minutes. |
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21st May 2020, 03:14 AM | #195 |
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21st May 2020, 03:18 AM | #196 |
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21st May 2020, 06:44 AM | #197 |
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21st May 2020, 06:48 AM | #198 |
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21st May 2020, 07:06 AM | #199 |
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21st May 2020, 07:11 AM | #200 |
Penultimate Amazing
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I've read PW's summary, which I trust to be accurate.
We don't know what happened before the beginning of that clip. We don't have any audio of what was said, before or during the clip. So no, I don't think we can be sure that "without getting an explanation of what is going on or trying to de-escalate" is exactly what happened. But okay, whatever. We can still question why what happened in that video happened in that video. Why did it happen? Do you know? |
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