Has Anyone Seen A Realistice Explanation For Free Fall Of The Towers?

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Christophera said:
You need to show the diagonal braces of the interior box columns from the demo images. Your ability to interprete constuction images is minimal. There are many images of the interior box columns after the perimeter steel and flors have fallen away. See if you can find one in there that shows the diagonal bracing you suggest is there.

Keep in mind that the moment frames were heavily braced with diagonals but they are obvious.

Here is the moment frame on the center left.

http://911research.wtc7.net/wtc/evidence/photos/docs/ssm/dsc00169.jpg
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The link you provided does not show a picture, just the welcome page.

Your moving the goal posts again. The pictures available of the core structure after the collapse only shows a small portion of the whole structure. So, as you put it, your request is unreasonable and a shining example of your avoidance of the facts.
 
TellyKNeasuss said:
By your own estimate, what you claim to be the concrete core wall is about 4 feet thick. Yet 500 feet is at only little more than a third the height of the tower. Would the core really taper from 17 feet to 4 feet in the bottom third of the tower?
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Dude, there is no concrete structure there. I see only steel. There were probbably block walls to fireproof the stairwells, and maybe precast concrete stairs.

And your 'explosives coated rebar' idea is patently absurd. The concrete would not adhere to the rebar and the structure would fall down before it was finished. Also I dont know anything about explosives but drying concrete gets REALLY hot and it is also corrosive it will burn a hole in your foot if it falls in your boot and you leave it there. Literally burn through your skin.

So Navy man how does plastique react to that kind of environment?

No core, no explosions , no steering just hundreds of thousands of tons of building taking the quick way to the ground and spitting out dust and debris in the process.
 
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To be totaly honest this picture may show what Chris is calling the "moment frame" but the picture also clearly shows the cross connect beams.
 

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There is only one realistic explantion

The only realistic explanation of the fall of the three WTC structures are a control demolition. You dont even need to read any expert ......it is all so evident. Three buildings falling down due to an open fire just dont cut it.
One added thought........Conspiracies are how criminals work....Criminals do not go around openly claiming what they are going to do........they work in secrecy, they hide things. Conspiracies are a normal part of human nature.
Most of the anti-conspiracy people are really not about the obvious but about a problem with their personalities. Some of them doubt that Operation Northwood ever existed or that it is just exageration, or that there really is a law that requires most people to pay income tax. Their kind of world is very restrictive. Be very careful with these people.
 
se7ensnakes said:
The only realistic explanation of the fall of the three WTC structures are a control demolition. You dont even need to read any expert ......it is all so evident. Three buildings falling down due to an open fire just dont cut it.
One added thought........Conspiracies are how criminals work....Criminals do not go around openly claiming what they are going to do........they work in secrecy, they hide things. Conspiracies are a normal part of human nature.
Most of the anti-conspiracy people are really not about the obvious but about a problem with their personalities. Some of them doubt that Operation Northwood ever existed or that it is just exageration, or that there really is a law that requires most people to pay income tax. Their kind of world is very restrictive. Be very careful with these people.
Click to expand...

...I read this, and I jumped to comment. But I just can't think of a single thing to say...
 
Christophera said:
The documentary explained the "special plastic coating" had to be stripped and the margins shielded. That is all that was known until later when it was revealed to a welding contractor who was about ready to sue because he was told his welders would be able to do those welds then they were not allowed. He was paying out big $ to keep them in town while they were layed off so they would be there for the next level of interior box column butt welds after the core was cast up another 40 feet.

As far as "right mind".

Examine America for the last 40 years paying for the "mutually assured destruction policy" of the cold war.

The C4 coated rebar in the sub bases and missile silos was a part of that, so the technology, and the welders were all well developed.
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Chris I was in the USAF and in nuclear silos they were not wired for demolition.
 
DHR said:
Chris I was in the USAF and in nuclear silos they were not wired for demolition.
Click to expand...

Some of the silos have actually been sold and people even live inside a few of them. "Enjoy your new home. Just be sure to NEVER push that red button that is labelled 'SELF DESTRUCT'. Better train your dog to stay away from it".
 
hcmom said:
...I read this, and I jumped to comment. But I just can't think of a single thing to say...
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I knew there was a law that we had to pay income taxes. With what authority does the IRS have to incarcerate you for tax evasion?
 
TellyKNeasuss said:
Some of the silos have actually been sold and people even live inside a few of them. "Enjoy your new home. Just be sure to NEVER push that red button that is labelled 'SELF DESTRUCT'. Better train your dog to stay away from it".
Click to expand...

"Mom, Dad blowed up the house again!"
 
TellyKNeasuss said:
Some of the silos have actually been sold and people even live inside a few of them. "Enjoy your new home. Just be sure to NEVER push that red button that is labelled 'SELF DESTRUCT'. Better train your dog to stay away from it".
Click to expand...

Well we did plan to demo the world. Just never thought the plan went so deep.
 
Christophera said:
The cross supports you indicate are a part of the crane platform. The crane towers could be independantly moved around, up and down, inside the platform.

Note, the diagonal braces you arrow in green ARE INSIDE the interior box columns. And, are never seen in the demo images.
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Oh good lord, Chris, I don't know a thing about construction and even *I* can see what he's talking about. You're being intentionally obtuse here, aren't you? Will someone please post a blown up photo with the stupid diagonal cross-supports clearly labelled so that Chris knows just what the heck we're referring to?

Christophera said:
JimBenArm, please explain why you would NEED to know about the self destruct capabilities of sub bases and missile silos. Or why your superiors would inform you.
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Right. Those serving at the base don't know. But you do. From a magazine. Right.

My wife's cousin was commander of the first nuclear sub (I forget the name of it). He has spoken quite freely about his experiences in the Navy, and he is most certainly not an advocate of the current administration. At no time has he even hinted at such an absurd theory as having C-4 coated rebar in the bases. And this guy was a commander, who knew all kinds of things that no one else was allowed to know.

se7ensnakes said:
Conspiracies are a normal part of human nature.
Click to expand...

So is paranoia, apparently.
 
se7ensnakes said:
The only realistic explanation of the fall of the three WTC structures are a control demolition. You dont even need to read any expert ......it is all so evident. Three buildings falling down due to an open fire just dont cut it.
One added thought........Conspiracies are how criminals work....Criminals do not go around openly claiming what they are going to do........they work in secrecy, they hide things. Conspiracies are a normal part of human nature.
Most of the anti-conspiracy people are really not about the obvious but about a problem with their personalities. Some of them doubt that Operation Northwood ever existed or that it is just exageration, or that there really is a law that requires most people to pay income tax. Their kind of world is very restrictive. Be very careful with these people.
Click to expand...


Yeah never ask an expert, that's simply foolish. I get all my medical advice from a kid who stares at googled photos of body parts.


In other words...yeeesh.
 
Hi Chris!

I was just wondering if you could post a link to a site that supports your theory, but that ISN'T your site?

Thanks!
 
NobbyNobbs said:
My wife's cousin was commander of the first nuclear sub (I forget the name of it).

quote]

That would have been the USS Nautilus SSN-571. It's actually a floating museum piece in Groton, CT, part of the Submarine Force Museum.
Click to expand...
 
Mobyseven said:
Hi Chris!

I was just wondering if you could post a link to a site that supports your theory, but that ISN'T your site?

Thanks!
Click to expand...

Let's stick wth the simple stuff. The demo scenario I've assembled is for the experts, and they are terrified or paid off. Later you will get what you ask for.

I've been asking for a site that simply substantiates the FEMA core of 47, 1300 foot columns, for over six months now. I mean there are 4 different floor plans, no structural plans showing how the supposed core columns were connected or braced, nothing on this falacious structure.

Guess what, there is no web site supporting this official lie, still. You would think some of the competent people here would have assembled images of the towers demise showing clearly, many columns in the core area, bent, falling shattered, toppling, leaning etc. NOT EVEN ONE IMAGE of the supposed steel core columns has ever been produced. What do the people here produce? A sites called noconcrete core. Why? Because they cannot prove the steel core columns. They produce ridicule ad nauseum, but no proof from the best opportunity ever to get images of the steel core columns.

Sure, .......... there have been many attempts to pass off misinterpretations of construction images as "core columns", but if there were steel core columns, they would be easy to see in the images of the towers coming down, but they never are.

Let us stick with the simple stuff.

What is seen is concrete and America has been lied to. The site documenting the concrete core would show the steel core coumns if they existed, but they did not.

http://algoxy.com/conc/core.html
 
se7ensnakes said:
The only realistic explanation of the fall of the three WTC structures are a control demolition. You dont even need to read any expert ......it is all so evident. Three buildings falling down due to an open fire just dont cut it.
One added thought........Conspiracies are how criminals work....Criminals do not go around openly claiming what they are going to do........they work in secrecy, they hide things. Conspiracies are a normal part of human nature.
Most of the anti-conspiracy people are really not about the obvious but about a problem with their personalities. Some of them doubt that Operation Northwood ever existed or that it is just exageration, or that there really is a law that requires most people to pay income tax. Their kind of world is very restrictive. Be very careful with these people.
Click to expand...

Wow, a breath of fresh air. Simple logic, how refreshing, dynamic even. reaching to human nature, psychology and simple sociology.

Thanks for your words here!

Christopher
 
Christophera said:
Let's stick wth the simple stuff. The demo scenario I've assembled is for the experts, and they are terrified or paid off. Later you will get what you ask for.

I've been asking for a site that simply substantiates the FEMA core of 47, 1300 foot columns, for over six months now. I mean there are 4 different floor plans, no structural plans showing how the supposed core columns were connected or braced, nothing on this falacious structure.

Guess what, there is no web site supporting this official lie, still. You would think some of the competent people here would have assembled images of the towers demise showing clearly, many columns in the core area, bent, falling shattered, toppling, leaning etc. NOT EVEN ONE IMAGE of the supposed steel core columns has ever been produced. What do the people here produce? A sites called noconcrete core. Why? Because they cannot prove the steel core columns. They produce ridicule ad nauseum, but no proof from the best opportunity ever to get images of the steel core columns.

Sure, .......... there have been many attempts to pass off misinterpretations of construction images as "core columns", but if there were steel core columns, they would be easy to see in the images of the towers coming down, but they never are.

Let us stick with the simple stuff.

What is seen is concrete and America has been lied to. The site documenting the concrete core would show the steel core coumns if they existed, but they did not.

http://algoxy.com/conc/core.html
Click to expand...

So, in other words you have no corroborating evidence outside of your own myopian world?
 
uruk said:
The link you provided does not show a picture, just the welcome page.

Your moving the goal posts again. The pictures available of the core structure after the collapse only shows a small portion of the whole structure. So, as you put it, your request is unreasonable and a shining example of your avoidance of the facts.
Click to expand...

This link goes directly to an image for me.

http://911research.wtc7.net/wtc/evidence/photos/docs/ssm/dsc00169.jpg

There are many, many images of the demise of the towers. You should be able to find exactly what you are looking for, if it existed.
 
TellyKNeasuss said:
By your own estimate, what you claim to be the concrete core wall is about 4 feet thick. Yet 500 feet is at only little more than a third the height of the tower. Would the core really taper from 17 feet to 4 feet in the bottom third of the tower?
Click to expand...

At the 43rd floor the core walls got thinner because the walls below that level supported the heavy mechanical room at the 43rd. That image is probably around 100 feet over the 43rd. WTC 1 came down with much irregularity compared to WTC 2 and so the spire and that concrete shear wall was left standing.
 
JimBenArm said:
NobbyNobbs said:
My wife's cousin was commander of the first nuclear sub (I forget the name of it).

quote]

That would have been the USS Nautilus SSN-571. It's actually a floating museum piece in Groton, CT, part of the Submarine Force Museum.
Click to expand...

That's the one. He's offered me a personal tour, but I haven't been up there in awhile.

Christophera said:
Do you have a reason to know about secret, self destruct policy? Can you docuement this?
Click to expand...


Same question, right back at you.
Click to expand...
 
Christophera said:
Guess what, there is no web site supporting this official lie, still. You would think some of the competent people here would have assembled images of the towers demise showing clearly, many columns in the core area, bent, falling shattered, toppling, leaning etc. NOT EVEN ONE IMAGE of the supposed steel core columns has ever been produced. What do the people here produce? A sites called noconcrete core. Why? Because they cannot prove the steel core columns. They produce ridicule ad nauseum, but no proof from the best opportunity ever to get images of the steel core columns.
Click to expand...

Am I the only one who sees steel columns in Christophera's images?

I'm still interested in how they managed to get a 400 foot core wall into a 218 foot building. I'm sure this was all covered in the documentary, so you should have no trouble explaining this.
 
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Christophera said:
At the 43rd floor the core walls got thinner because the walls below that level supported the heavy mechanical room at the 43rd. That image is probably around 100 feet over the 43rd. WTC 1 came down with much irregularity compared to WTC 2 and so the spire and that concrete shear wall was left standing.
Click to expand...

This explanation is totally ridiculous. The core still would have had to support something approximating half the weight of the building. And "100 feet over the 43rd" would not be at around 500 feet AGL.
 
Christophera said:
This link goes directly to an image for me.

http://911research.wtc7.net/wtc/evidence/photos/docs/ssm/dsc00169.jpg

There are many, many images of the demise of the towers. You should be able to find exactly what you are looking for, if it existed.
Click to expand...

Everytime i click on the link I get sent to this page:
http://911research.wtc7.net/re911/welcome.html

But all that is beside the point. The diagnal cross beams are clearly visible in the pictures posted. You asking me to show you pictures of the cross beams in the portion that remains from the collapse is silly. Your clearly tring to dance around the facts.
 
You also haven't finished adressing this issue:

Originally Posted by Christophera
All your images are over 4 floors and the steel surrounded the concrete core after that. A person on the street would not have been able to see anything happening.

You forgot to post an image of some of the 47, 1300 foot steel core columns inside the core area at some elevation over the ground from the demo images. Do that soon please.
Click to expand...

So then are you saying that Joberson was wrong?
According to Tony Jebson and you WTC 1 had the concrete core go up several floors ahead of the steel. The construction pictures of WTC 1 show no concrete core ahead of the steel work.

Quite obfuscating and dancing, I'm not talking about interior steel core columns at the moment in this post. I'm talking about Joberson's e-mail.
 
Christophera said:
What do you think a linear shape charge is?
Click to expand...
These are linear shaped charges:
http://www.corelab.com/owen/Products/Linear.asp
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shaped_charge

The charge is designed so that the metal in the inside of the V-shape is converted to a hot vaporized metal gas that does the actual cutting. Explosive coated the outside of a cylinder would not have the same effect since it completely surrounds the cylinder. It might vaporize the rebar, but then there would not be any rebar left to be photographed. So if that is the case the picture you keep saying is a picture of rebar would be incorrectly interpreted.
 
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TellyKNeasuss said:
Am I the only one who sees steel columns in Christophera's images?
Click to expand...

In fact, in frames 12-16 of the "North Tower collapse from west" video there is something that appears to be a column sticking up above the debris cloud near the center where the core should be. Which one of the videos shows a concrete core?
 
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Mobyseven said:
So, in other words you have no corroborating evidence outside of your own myopian world?
Click to expand...

The fact that you identify with a proven fallacy makes your evaluation meaningless.

If the fallacy is not proven, then show us images of steel core columns exposed during the demise of the towers.
 
uruk said:
These are linear shaped charges:
http://www.corelab.com/owen/Products/Linear.asp
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shaped_charge

The charge is designed so that the metal in the inside of the V-shape is converted to a hot vaporized metal gas that does the actual cutting. Explosive coated the outside of a cylinder would not have the same effect since it completely surrounds the cylinder. It might vaporize the rebar, but then there would not be any rebar left to be photographed. So if that is the case the picture you keep saying is a picture of rebar would be incorrectly interpreted.
Click to expand...

My point is that linear shape charges work and the amount of explosive is very small with the explosive connectivity folowing the shape of the metal reflective container. A coating around a cylinder would be perfect for fracturing and pulverizing a uniform mineral material around it.
 
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