Alec Baldwin blasts both sides for mess.

I'm with Alec



Oh, and get Bill's priceless point. The Republicans wouldn't pass the bill because $700 billion was too much but they went for it at $800 billion.

We got screwed folks. Let's be honest here. We got screwed by the Repubs and the Dems.

RandFan said:

I'm with Alec



Oh, and get Bill's priceless point. The Republicans wouldn't pass the bill because $700 billion was too much but they went for it at $800 billion.

We got screwed folks. Let's be honest here. We got screwed by the Repubs and the Dems.

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and.....



$480,000.00 per household!?!?

RandFan said:

I'm with Alec



Oh, and get Bill's priceless point. The Republicans wouldn't pass the bill because $700 billion was too much but they went for it at $800 billion.

We got screwed folks. Let's be honest here. We got screwed by the Repubs and the Dems.

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You make an interesting point by saying we've been screwed by the Democrats and Republicans. This is a classic illustration of how "we the people" do not feel that either party is by the people and for the people. So what have our 2 parties done for you lately Mr. & Ms. American citizen?

Crowlogic said:

You make an interesting point by saying we've been screwed by the Democrats and Republicans. This is a classic illustration of how "we the people" do not feel that either party is by the people and for the people. So what have our 2 parties done for you lately Mr. & Ms. American citizen?

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You make a great point. Still, if we were honest enough we would concede that we screwed ourselves. We get the government we are are smart enough to elect.

I can´t help but point out that you guys keep electing these people, or not voting at all which does even less to keep them out of office.

I might even be tempted to ask with which justification you keep bitching about them if you don´t do a thing to get rid of them.

And don´t tell me "there is no good third party to vote for". Sure, there isn´t, tell me, whose fault is that, if not that of you, the people?

Chaos said:

I can´t help but point out that you guys keep electing these people, or not voting at all which does even less to keep them out of office.

I might even be tempted to ask with which justification you keep bitching about them if you don´t do a thing to get rid of them.

And don´t tell me "there is no good third party to vote for". Sure, there isn´t, tell me, whose fault is that, if not that of you, the people?

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There are a number of laws that make it difficult for third party candidates to win. Federal matching funds are given only to candidates belonging to parties that received at least 5% in the previous election. Similarly, Democrats and Republicans will debate only people belonging to parties that that received at least 5% in the previous election. Presidential candidates can get on the ballot if the gather enough signatures, but in some states people who vote in the primaries are ineligible to sign such petitions. Furthermore, some states have outlawed write-in votes.

I would love to see a viable third party, but I don't expect to anytime in the next 10 years.

Chaos said:

I can´t help but point out that you guys keep electing these people, or not voting at all which does even less to keep them out of office.

I might even be tempted to ask with which justification you keep bitching about them if you don´t do a thing to get rid of them.

And don´t tell me "there is no good third party to vote for". Sure, there isn´t, tell me, whose fault is that, if not that of you, the people?

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Well, let's be honest here. America has done pretty damn well over the years. We've made some mistakes. It's the nature of the beast and the forefathers expected it. No nation is immune from error. Not even Germany.

Chaos said:

And don´t tell me "there is no good third party to vote for". Sure, there isn´t, tell me, whose fault is that, if not that of you, the people?

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According to the overwhelming Meme: "They. Are. Nuts. Period."

RandFan said:

You make a great point. Still, if we were honest enough we would concede that we screwed ourselves. We get the government we are are smart enough to elect.

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Or more accurately, we get the government that is elected by the highly-motivated left-wingers, single-issue voters, Christian fundamentalists and few upright responsible citizens who actually get out and vote on Election Day.

RandFan said:

No nation is immune from error. Not even Germany.

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Imagine getting political advice from a country that spawned a political system with nearly a dozen parties in the Weimar era where hyperinflation was customary, and then gave the word a bellyful of National Socialism.

Cicero said:

Imagine getting political advice from a country that spawned a political system with nearly a dozen parties in the Weimar era where hyperinflation was customary, and then gave the word a bellyful of National Socialism.

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Alec Baldwin is German?

Oliver said:

Alec Baldwin is German?

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Chaos is, try to keep up.



Anyhow, I think I'll go entirely against the consensus and say that I like having two mutually mistrustful and ponderously slow political parties. Call me provincial, but I like a large government that makes changes slowly and in small steps. I like a government that can't make huge mistakes on a whim and yet is able to respond to steady pressure over time. Compared to most countries, the U.S.A. is a very young country, but it's also been extremely stable. We have managed to shift like clay into new forms rather than being broken, melted down, and recast over and over. I'm looking at you, France and Germany.

I've often thought that the best possible compromise is a compromise no one is happy with. If someone is happy with a compromise, and someone else isn't, then that breeds resentment and fuels changing the compromise, even if the compromise is for everyone's benefit. I thin people are most content with the political system they're in when those they percieve as their competitors are not better off than they are. I'm no expert on game theory, but I think that a system where everyone is equally dissatisfied to a small extent is more stable than a system where some people are extremely unhappy, and others are content.

Ladewig said:

I would love to see a viable third party, but I don't expect to anytime in the next 10 years.

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Three parties are not a stable arangement in the US political system. It could change the views of one of the two parties or surplant one, but the constitution leads to a two party system.

I don't necessarily disagree with Baldwin -- and it's nice to see a Hollywood celebrity who isn't a "the evil Republicans did it" ranter -- but seriously, since when are Hollywood celebrities any guide to politics?

Anyhow, I think I'll go entirely against the consensus and say that I like having two mutually mistrustful and ponderously slow political parties.

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You are 100%, totally, completely correct (surprised you there, didn't I?)

A government by incompetents is annoying. And expensive. And raises your blood pressure. But it is far, far better than a government by people who have a plan to save the country and will push it through no matter what.

$800,000,000,000 you say it cost you this time around? Because Congress is made up, seemingly, of a bunch of incompetent fools? That's NOTHING compared to what the other type of government costs.

That type usually results either in a dictatorship, or else (if democracy survives) in seventeen different parties, each one led by a genius who is our last hope to save the country.

Believe me. I live in Israel. You have no idea how lucky you are.

Just that you guys will have some perspective... Republicans and Democrats hate each other, you say? Well, in Israel, we've got people in the parliament whose official party goal is to do war with, and expell, some of the other folks in the parliament, due to ethnic differences. Beat that.

P.S.

For the record, those folks (a) usually sit together in the parliament's cafeteria (for years, for historical reasons, the parliament had a cafeteria which was a few notches below the average roadside diner in cuisine, but I digress) and (b) vote together when it comes to the really important stuff (e.g., getting more taxpayer's money to their pet projects). Which shows you how serious the whole thing is.

So count your lucky stars on your system of government. Folks -- the whole point of the US Constitution, and what made it such an amazing thing, is precisely that it obviously assumes elected people will often be selfish, incompetent jerks, and takes care in advance to minimize the damage they do.

When you have, however, a "great man" who is leading the country and can do what he will, no matter what the stupid, outdated Constitution says...