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Old 22nd June 2009, 04:55 AM   #1
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4 9/11 planes grounded for at least 9 months prior 9/11

Here a potential breakthrough of the same magnitude as the nano-thermate research discussed elsewhere: truther Aidan Monaghan (specialized on the subject of planes and remote control) had the luminous idea of requesting flight data of all 4 9/11 planes on the basis of the freedom of information act. Shattering result: all planes had been grounded for 9 months or more prior to 9/11:

http://www.911blogger.com/node/20456

The reasonable argument as put forward by several debunkers here was that the 9/11 planes were no fly-by-wire planes and that it was always possible for pilots to overrule by hand an 'autopilot-gone-wild', thus making the remote control hypothesis unlikely.

But as it turns out now these 9 months should be more than enough to carry out 'maintenance' such that manual overrule could be blocked.

This of course is not proven. However the fact that all 4 planes were grounded for 9 months or more prior to 9/11 makes it abundantly clear that something special was going on with these planes.

It's not going to be fun being a 9/11-debunker in the second half of 2009.

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Old 22nd June 2009, 05:00 AM   #2
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You have no idea about aircraft servicing and now you are accusing the airlines maintenance staff of being acomplices in murder.

Nice work cowboy.

How about you ask some of the experts here how long it takes to carry out major services and what they involve?
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Old 22nd June 2009, 05:02 AM   #3
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The previous flights for 77 was on the FDR.

Epic fail by Monaghan.
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Old 22nd June 2009, 05:11 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by 9/11-investigator View Post
Here a potential breakthrough of the same magnitude as the nano-thermate research discussed elsewhere: truther Aidan Monaghan (specialized on the subject of planes and remote control) had the luminous idea of requesting flight data of all 4 9/11 planes on the basis of the freedom of information act. Shattering result: all planes had been grounded for 9 months or more prior to 9/11:

http://www.911blogger.com/node/20456

The reasonable argument as put forward by several debunkers here was that the 9/11 planes were no fly-by-wire planes and that it was always possible for pilots to overrule by hand an 'autopilot-gone-wild', thus making the remote control hypothesis unlikely.

But as it turns out now these 9 months should be more than enough to carry out 'maintenance' such that manual overrule could be blocked.

This of course is not proven. However the fact that all 4 planes were grounded for 9 months or more prior to 9/11 makes it abundantly clear that something special was going on with these planes.

It's not going to be fun being a 9/11-debunker in the second half of 2009.
Why an autopilot? bin Laden went to no small expense to get adequate pilots and other manpower on each of the 4 hijacked planes.

Do autopilots speak Arabic and fight with pilots?

I look forward to you being shown wrong on the facts of your claim.
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Old 22nd June 2009, 05:13 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by funk de fino View Post
You have no idea about aircraft servicing and now you are accusing the airlines maintenance staff of being acomplices in murder.
Please provide link to post where I accuse airlines maintenance staff of being murderers. I do not do that.

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How about you ask some of the experts here how long it takes to carry out major services and what they involve?
A long time for sure, but all 4 of them is a bit too much of a coincidence, would you not agree?
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Old 22nd June 2009, 05:16 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by funk de fino View Post
The previous flights for 77 was on the FDR.
Well, according to the perpetrator of 9/11 that is.

Nice try, epic fail.
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Old 22nd June 2009, 05:16 AM   #7
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So now United and American are a part of the conspiracy that nearly ruined them (United had to file Chapter 11 and American was in the red for four years)? Yeah, makes perfect sense.

I wonder if jooos run (or ran) United and American. You better get on that, nazi.
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Old 22nd June 2009, 05:19 AM   #8
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Just because someone is late for something does not mean he is up to something. That is like me being late for school, then the teacher says i was up to something.

That being said, we do not know what happened to the planes.
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Old 22nd June 2009, 05:19 AM   #9
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Originally Posted by 9/11-investigator View Post
Well, according to the perpetrator of 9/11 that is.

Nice try, epic fail.
The FBI and NTSB did 9/11? I thought it was the jooos? Oh, that's right, the jooos control the entire US government. My bad.
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Old 22nd June 2009, 05:22 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by dtugg View Post
The FBI and NTSB did 9/11? I thought it was the jooos? Oh, that's right, the jooos control the entire US government. My bad.
apparently anyone who isnt part of the "truth?" is in on it
me, you, your grandmother etc etc etc
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Old 22nd June 2009, 05:23 AM   #11
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Furthermore, was it those four planes alone or were there more than four planes.

Another example: four robbers enrol in a nine month course. Does that mean the head of the course is in on a conspiracy?
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Old 22nd June 2009, 05:28 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by dtugg View Post
So now United and American are a part of the conspiracy that nearly ruined them (United had to file Chapter 11 and American was in the red for four years)? Yeah, makes perfect sense.
That's just poor little you jumping to conclusions again. Nobody claims that airlines were complicit. Of course they were not. The next thing to find out is where exactly (in what hangar or airstrip) these planes were located and who had access to them and why they were not operational.

BTW, nobody needs an official investigation. We do not want an official investigation. The new reality anno 2009 is that mega-crimes like 9/11 are going to be solved as a sort of 'global open source project' using the internet.

Now we have to wait for witnesses to come forward and post more information somewhere in the global info-cloud.

Cannot be stopped.

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Old 22nd June 2009, 05:31 AM   #13
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N612UA aka Flight 175 at JFK in April 2001: http://www.airliners.net/photo/168079/L/
Same plane at LAX, August 2001: http://www.airliners.net/photo/Unite...-222/0188174/L

N334AA aka Flight 11 at O'Hare in July 2001: http://www.airliners.net/photo/Ameri...c888d91580af0c
In Stockholm, August 2001: http://www.airliners.net/photo/Ameri...c888d91580af0c

N644AA aka Flight 77 at Miami in Feb 2001: http://www.airliners.net/photo/Ameri...59d15d0403332a
At Boston in August 2001: http://www.airliners.net/photo/Ameri...59d15d0403332a

N591UA aka Flight 93 at Newark on September 8th, 2001: http://www.airliners.net/photo/Unite...73503bd76519a9


Awwww, silly twoofer was so excited as well.
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Old 22nd June 2009, 05:32 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by 9/11-investigator View Post
Here a potential breakthrough of the same magnitude as the nano-thermate research discussed elsewhere:
On that, I suspect, most debunkers will agree with you.

Originally Posted by 9/11-investigator View Post
The reasonable argument as put forward by several debunkers here was that the 9/11 planes were no fly-by-wire planes and that it was always possible for pilots to overrule by hand an 'autopilot-gone-wild', thus making the remote control hypothesis unlikely.

But as it turns out now these 9 months should be more than enough to carry out 'maintenance' such that manual overrule could be blocked.
In case anyone was wondering, the above two paragraphs strongly suggest an accusation of complicity in murder against the maintenance staff of AA and UA. At the very least, they amount to a definite accusation of widespread complicity amongst administrative staff; an airliner is an expensive asset, and no sane management accounting system could hide the failure to utilise such an asset for so long a period of time.

Originally Posted by 9/11-investigator View Post
This of course is not proven. However the fact that all 4 planes were grounded for 9 months or more prior to 9/11
This of course is not proven. What is proven is that the Department of Transportation was unable to find records of these planes for 2001. To a sane person, this looks like a record-keeping issue.

Dave

ETA: In the light of Mancman's post, it's almost certainly a record-keeping issue, and yet another example of the good old 9/11 revisionist "sacred list" fallacy.
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Old 22nd June 2009, 05:35 AM   #15
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I recall some troofer on another board a while ago making claims along similar lines, one quirk was that AA flight tail numbers appeared differently to the true tail numbers in the BTS logs.

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Old 22nd June 2009, 05:35 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by 9/11-investigator View Post
Well, according to the perpetrator of 9/11 that is.
What, did KSM decode the FDR data?

Dave
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Old 22nd June 2009, 05:38 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by 9/11-investigator View Post
That's just poor little you jumping to conclusions again. Nobody claims that airlines were complicit. Of course they were not. The next thing to find out is where exactly (in what hangar or airstrip) these planes were located and who had access to them and why they were not operational.
Oh, I see. The super-jooos gained access to $100 million dollar aircraft and made major alterations without the owners or anybody else noticing a single thing during or after the fact. Makes 100% perfect sense.

Quote:
BTW, nobody needs an official investigation. We do not want an official investigation. The new reality anno 2009 is that mega-crimes like 9/11 are going to be solved as a sort of 'global open source project' using the internet.

Now we have to wait for witnesses to come forward and post more information somewhere in the global info-cloud.

Cannot be stopped.
Yeah, good luck with that, nazi.
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Old 22nd June 2009, 05:38 AM   #18
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Originally Posted by Dave Rogers View Post
This of course is not proven. What is proven is that the Department of Transportation was unable to find records of these planes for 2001. To a sane person, this looks like a record-keeping issue.
For 3 planes they could produce records until 9 months prior to 9/11 but none after that. Hmmm.


Quote:
ETA: In the light of Mancman's post, it's almost certainly a record-keeping issue, and yet another example of the good old 9/11 revisionist "sacred list" fallacy.
Would you care to share your insight with us as to why this 'almost certainly is a record-keeping issue'?
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Old 22nd June 2009, 05:42 AM   #19
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Originally Posted by 9/11-investigator View Post

It's not going to be fun being a 9/11-debunker in the second half of 2009.
scary


will you grant us immunity from prosecution if we recant our sins and convert now?
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Old 22nd June 2009, 05:43 AM   #20
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Originally Posted by 9/11-investigator View Post
For 3 planes they could produce records until 9 months prior to 9/11 but none after that. Hmmm.




Would you care to share your insight with us as to why this 'almost certainly is a record-keeping issue'?
maybe the records were misfiled
after all the planes were involved in a terrorist attack
im sure they were looked at
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Old 22nd June 2009, 05:45 AM   #21
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if the federal government was part of the conspiracy..why do they keep releasing info. that implicates them in a conspiracy?

why do 9-11 Deniers think the government is sooooo stupid?

oh, and btw, I stepped all over Peter Stuyvesant's grave at St. Mark's Church in Manhattan.

hahahaha!!!

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Old 22nd June 2009, 05:51 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by Dave Rogers View Post
What, did KSM decode the FDR data?
You mean that poor chap that got waterboarded for 200 times? Watch 'the Hitch':

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4LPubUCJv58

The world is going to be liberated from Anglosphere soon.

Glenn Beck is right about 9/11-truth and the fate of America:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BQnfJeUzzKk

9/11 means the end of the American empire and globalisation.
Thank god.

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Old 22nd June 2009, 05:52 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by 9/11-investigator View Post
Here a potential breakthrough of the same magnitude as the nano-thermate research discussed elsewhere: truther Aidan Monaghan (specialized on the subject of planes and remote control) had the luminous idea of requesting flight data of all 4 9/11 planes on the basis of the freedom of information act. Shattering result: all planes had been grounded for 9 months or more prior to 9/11:
For how long do airlines keep this kind of data?

Did your "investigator" try asking for data for a similar plane that didn't crash on 9/11?
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Old 22nd June 2009, 05:54 AM   #24
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Originally Posted by 9/11-investigator View Post
Here a potential breakthrough of the same magnitude as the nano-thermate research discussed elsewhere
In other words, very, very small.
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Old 22nd June 2009, 05:57 AM   #25
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Originally Posted by 9/11-investigator View Post

9/11 means the end of the American empire and globalisation.
Thank god.
shaking in our boots.

we will be having this exact same discussion in 5 years.

9-11 truth is going the way of all the other conspiracy theories; i.e. JFK, Bigfoot, Lincoln, Titanic, Fed, etc.

enjoy the ride. its gonna be a long one.

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Old 22nd June 2009, 05:58 AM   #26
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Originally Posted by parky76 View Post
if the federal government was part of the conspiracy..why do they keep releasing info. that implicates them in a conspiracy?
Not the government, 'just' rogue elements.
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Old 22nd June 2009, 05:59 AM   #27
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The 9/11 Blogger FOIA letter asks for the final arrival times for the hijacked planes. The printout provided lists no flights in the year 2000, hence the poster concludes "U.S. BTS: Last Known Flights Of 9/11 Planes Took Place Nine Months Before 9/11". And so he gets his big headline. But is it true? There's an easy way to find out.

Go to the BTS inquiry page.

Check "All statistics".

Flight 175 regularly flew out of San Francisco, so choose that as the Origin Airport.

Choose United Airlines as the airline.

Check September for the month.

Check All Days to see information for all of September.

Check 2001 for the year.

Click Submit. And wait (that's a big query).

When it comes back, use your browser to search for Flight 175's tail number, N612UA. And look! It flew out of SF on the 1st, the 5th, the 7th, and the 10th, and (surprise surprise) there are no further flights.

So, the BTS database tells us that there were recorded flights for Flight 175 after 2000. There's no evidence this plane was "grounded" at all. I've not checked the other flights, but does anyone want to bet there aren't records of September 2001 flights for those, too?

Last edited by MikeW; 22nd June 2009 at 06:01 AM.
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Old 22nd June 2009, 06:00 AM   #28
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Originally Posted by BigAl View Post
For how long do airlines keep this kind of data?

Did your "investigator" try asking for data for a similar plane that didn't crash on 9/11?
Nope, just passing through what Aidan found out plus some benevolent comments by me. All for free.
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Old 22nd June 2009, 06:02 AM   #29
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Originally Posted by dtugg View Post
The FBI and NTSB did 9/11? I thought it was the jooos? Oh, that's right, the jooos control the entire US government. My bad.
Not your average joos, silly! It was the super-duper dancing joos that have complete knowledge of every aspect of the planet.
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Old 22nd June 2009, 06:02 AM   #30
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Originally Posted by 9/11-investigator View Post
Not the government, 'just' rogue elements.
The idea that "rogue elements" could design and install cutting edge remote control in planes and not have it noticed by the pilot and maintenance crew is silly.

The FDRs we have recovered show real people in control of the planes right up to impact.
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Old 22nd June 2009, 06:03 AM   #31
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Originally Posted by MikeW View Post
The 9/11 Blogger FOIA letter asks for the final arrival times for the hijacked planes. The printout provided lists no flights in the year 2000, hence the poster concludes "U.S. BTS: Last Known Flights Of 9/11 Planes Took Place Nine Months Before 9/11". And so he gets his big headline. But is it true? There's an easy way to find out.

Go to the BTS inquiry page.

Check "All statistics".

Flight 175 regularly flew out of San Francisco, so choose that as the Origin Airport.

Choose United Airlines as the airline.

Check September for the month.

Check All Days to see information for all of September.

Check 2001 for the year.

Click Submit. And wait (that's a big query).

When it comes back, use your browser to search for Flight 175's tail number, N612UA. And look! It flew out of SF on the 1st, the 5th, the 7th, and the 10th, and (surprise surprise) there are no further flights.

So, the BTS database tells us that there were recorded flights for Flight 175 after 2000. There's no evidence this plane was "grounded" at all. I've not checked the other flights, but does anyone want to bet there aren't records of September 2001 flights for those, too?
OK, this is an informative answer. Let's wait for the discussion and comments on 911blogger. I am sure they read this fantastic resource as well.
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Old 22nd June 2009, 06:05 AM   #32
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May I refer everyone back to post #13? All 4 planes were photographed in operation in 2001 prior to 9/11.
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Old 22nd June 2009, 06:07 AM   #33
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Originally Posted by Mancman View Post
May I refer everyone back to post #13? All 4 planes were photographed in operation in 2001 prior to 9/11.
Yes, that's even better evidence as it's independent. (Although it was still worth pointing out the flights are recorded in the BTS database, as the 911blogger post was saying they were not.)
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Old 22nd June 2009, 06:07 AM   #34
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Originally Posted by BigAl View Post
The idea that "rogue elements" could design and install cutting edge remote control in planes and not have it noticed by the pilot and maintenance crew is silly.

The FDRs we have recovered show real people in control of the planes right up to impact.
The argument was not about the presence of remote control via autopilot in the planes; it was about the possibility of manual interruption of the autopilot. Several well-informed people here made the credible argument that these Boeings were not fly-by-wire planes but old-fashioned ones controlled with mechanical cables. And as a consequence, according to you debunkers, autopilot controlled flight is always interruptable manually.

Last edited by 9/11-investigator; 22nd June 2009 at 06:09 AM.
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Old 22nd June 2009, 06:07 AM   #35
NWO Sentryman
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Originally Posted by 9/11-investigator View Post
You mean that poor chap that got waterboarded for 200 times? Watch 'the Hitch':

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4LPubUCJv58

The world is going to be liberated from Anglosphere soon.

Glenn Beck is right about 9/11-truth and the fate of America:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BQnfJeUzzKk

9/11 means the end of the American empire and globalisation.
Thank god.
As usual, the "death to america", Kommunizm4eva and all that in the twoofer mind.

And the Chinese are any better? Look at Falun gong and all that.

BTW, the West is winning in Iraq and Afghanistan. The insurgents ahve been routed, the Taliban are on the retreat and there is no suhc thing as the American Empire.
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Old 22nd June 2009, 06:12 AM   #36
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Wink

Originally Posted by parky76 View Post
oh, and btw, I stepped all over Peter Stuyvesant's grave at St. Mark's Church in Manhattan.

hahahaha!!!
That's much more civilised than what you originally intented to do.
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Old 22nd June 2009, 06:17 AM   #37
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Originally Posted by 9/11-investigator View Post
That's much more civilised than what you originally intented to do.
wait till tonight. i'll drink a whole gallon of apple juice.

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Old 22nd June 2009, 06:18 AM   #38
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Originally Posted by 9/11-investigator View Post
OK, this is an informative answer. Let's wait for the discussion and comments on 911blogger. I am sure they read this fantastic resource as well.

Thank you so much for posting this info today. You could not have made this investigator for the "Truth" appear more stupid than he already is. It's not going to be fun being Aidan Monaghan the rest of this week. What a joke!
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Old 22nd June 2009, 06:19 AM   #39
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Originally Posted by NWO Sentryman View Post
Furthermore, was it those four planes alone or were there more than four planes.

Another example: four robbers enrol in a nine month course. Does that mean the head of the course is in on a conspiracy?
Originally Posted by BigAl View Post
For how long do airlines keep this kind of data?

Did your "investigator" try asking for data for a similar plane that didn't crash on 9/11?
Excellent questions that I was going to ask as well. I notice 911Investigator seems to have ignored them.

In any given year, what percentage of planes would be grounded for maintenance? How long does maintenance take? What is meant by maintenance in this respect?
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Old 22nd June 2009, 06:19 AM   #40
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Originally Posted by Mancman View Post
N612UA aka Flight 175 at JFK in April 2001: http://www.airliners.net/photo/168079/L/
Same plane at LAX, August 2001: http://www.airliners.net/photo/Unite...-222/0188174/L

N334AA aka Flight 11 at O'Hare in July 2001: http://www.airliners.net/photo/Ameri...c888d91580af0c
In Stockholm, August 2001: http://www.airliners.net/photo/Ameri...c888d91580af0c

N644AA aka Flight 77 at Miami in Feb 2001: http://www.airliners.net/photo/Ameri...59d15d0403332a
At Boston in August 2001: http://www.airliners.net/photo/Ameri...59d15d0403332a

N591UA aka Flight 93 at Newark on September 8th, 2001: http://www.airliners.net/photo/Unite...73503bd76519a9


Awwww, silly twoofer was so excited as well.
hahah!!!! busted!!

i love it when 9-11 Deniers get egg on their face.
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