Is Bended Space = Contracted Space ?

I have shown you the principles.
Read post 289 and 296
Read them. Only an idiot would think that those posts contain any calculations or even "principles". Calculation = plugiing numbers into an equation to produce numbers.
1 + 1 = 2 is a calculation.
"Thingy + whatever is a widget" (as in your posts) is an unsupported assertion.

First asked 2 November 2009: (3 November and counting)
Bjarne's idea is proven wrong.
 
We can fast measure from floor 30 to 15, the tidal effect change will be insignificant.
Steep 2 can start by flor 15 to ground. Again the tidal can not destroy the “picture”

Exactly how long will you take to measure 15 floors, and exactly how much will the tide change in that time? Unless you calculate it, you cannot dismiss it as insignificant.

How long between step 1 and step 2? How much will gravity change due to tide during that interval? This is absolutely crucial since you expect to find a step interval between suite 1 and 2 of measurements. If you find a step, how will you show that it is not due to tide?

Off course the building height is taken into consideration, - it’s only to sort out the deviation.

Frankly, I don't believe you had thought about it. We are talking about an effect that is more than 30 times stronger than the gravity field of your building. So the difference between each floor is larger than the gravity of the entire building! You cant just "sort out the deviation". You must know the exact height of each floor (no, you can't just assume they are the same height).

And I have allready told I do not accept this religion.
Its not build to measure deceleration exactly as you car is not when you forget to release you handbrake, or the metro or a power station is not build to measure when the staff is are coking coffee etc.

So, explain how a syncro-cyclotron is built, and how it compensates for an unknown deceleration.

If I am a dreamer I am not the only one, I will say you are a bigger want. I have suggested to contact you layer and we can bet what ever you want?

Could you translate that into some language?

ALLREDY NOW you (or other comrades) could visit NASA and say listen cowboys; here are the equations what you are looking for.
Allready now NASA could use the equations and test it on all the data they allready have.

Why don't you do it yourself? Don't you want the credit for yourself?

I am sure they will listen, but first priority is to measure gravity centrally in a building.
After 2012 the data will probably be 100 % exact.

Yeah, fumbling around with an instrument you don't know how to use, without having calculated your error sources in advance. I'm sure you will get fabulous results.


Hans said:
I don't think we have had any retrograde satellites, but many of the spy photo satellites are in polar orbits; that means that their orbit is perpendicular to the ecliptica. Since they will not benefit from a hypothetical spacewind, we should have noticed deceleration.

Bjarne said:
Remember many satellites have special missions, many of them you have “only” radio contact, you can send instruction and receive data, the most are not build to test GR or SR. You will not know if these are e.g; 10 meter off course.

You are simply too naive. First of all you don't know a thing about those satellites. Secondly, some of the early ones took real pictures on film (back during the cold war, CCD chips were crap) and dropped a capsule with it. You can bet your ass, they needed to know exactly where they were (we are not talking about 10 meters, after all; if a satellite has a constant speed loss, it will run into big differences in no time).


Now imaging that some retograd moons orbit was measured 20 years ago and when measure today the orbit seems to have change. What will we believe ?

We are not talking about imagination here, we are talking about the real world. That is the one you will encounter if you get up from your computer and walk out your front door. You should try it sometime.


(snipped: incoherent rant)

Hans
 
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Exactly how long will you take to measure 15 floors, and exactly how much will the tide change in that time? Unless you calculate it, you cannot dismiss it as insignificant.
I will count the time too. Don’t worry

How long between step 1 and step 2? How much will gravity change due to tide during that interval? This is absolutely crucial since you expect to find a step interval between suite 1 and 2 of measurements. If you find a step, how will you show that it is not due to tide?
No.
You can see step 1 and 2 as independent.
But I don’t think we need.
This two steps should both show the same, but just opposite to each other.

Frankly, I don't believe you had thought about it.
Both the buildings height and the height of each floor will be measured
We are talking about an effect that is more than 30 times stronger than the gravity field of your building.
What effect ?

So the difference between each floor is larger than the gravity of the entire building!
No way ..

You cant just "sort out the deviation".
Of course you can.

You must know the exact height of each floor (no, you can't just assume they are the same height).
It can be measured, and why should a residential property not have same height at each floor?

Lister near the center of the building, e.g; floor 17 you expect the buildings gravity (in the height to be almost zero). I expect it to be the same as at floor 30, or floor 0 (-) .

So, explain how a syncro-cyclotron is built, and how it compensates for an unknown deceleration.
+ kW - or rather + w.

Could you translate that into some language?
If you believe that CERN or any other similar accelerator ever have been used to register or disprove that resistances against acceleration doesn’t applies by constants velocity, lets bet. – But you will have to prove it.

Why don't you do it yourself? Don't you want the credit for yourself?

Because:
1.) I have the past year learned that most people carry 22 centimetre dick crackpot glasses.
2.) And even those that can see this could be correct are afraid for the majority. – Everybody are afraid from there “reputation” – Let’s say the editor by nature really understand this theory, and 95% believes it’s correct. - 5% doubt is enough to he do not publish, because what would happen with the famous brand “NATURE” when he was wrong. And what about he job when it was wrong etc…
3.)NASA is anyway not the fastest way to prove the theory. NASA will wake very suddenly don’t worry. And so will the dark meter sect, the CERN people etc…Buy who know how many already can see the logic and “use” these thoughts. But everybody knows we are up against fanaticism, everybody must be very carefully what they say and think. It’s always like this. Think about Stephen Hawking when he claimed everything comes from nothing etc etc etc....

Yeah, fumbling around with an instrument you don't know how to use, without having calculated your error sources in advance. I'm sure you will get fabulous results.
Do you speak of the triangulating device?
Don’t underestimate it, it’s a great step forwards.

First of all you don't know a thing about those satellites.
Do you ?
No right ?
Or ?
So how many percent are orbitting about 35000 meters altitude?
And how many percent lower than that ?

Secondly, some of the early ones took real pictures on film (back during the cold war, CCD chips were crap) and dropped a capsule with it.
And how did they know EXCACTLY where these was back in the 70 and 80´ties , - do you think?

they needed to know exactly where they were (we are not talking about 10 meters, after all; if a satellite has a constant speed loss, it will run into big differences in no time).
And ?
Do you think there were serveral attemps ?
Anyway , - I am not talking about a satellites is losing 15 meter per day comrade.

If we talk about the communication satellite and all kind of satellites in 20 – to 40.000 km altitude, these are not or VERY weakly affected because the forces in that altitude equalize each other.
I guess we here talk about the main parts of the satellites are not affected or VERY weakly.

http://www.science27.com/english/Sattelites.htm

So the space wind doesn’t affect these comrade or so weak that it can not be determinate anyway with now day’s methods.

Satellites in much lower orbit, e.g; those in 1000 km e.g: measuring the Earth magnetic field, are affected by space wind.

How old is the GPS – 10 years? - Keep that in mind comrade OK?.

The new triangular devise is the first device ever that makes it possible for a space probes to know exactly where it is and will first be tested live in 2011. It has until now been a BIG problem to know where space probes are...

Don’t be surprises when you suddenly one day wake up to the news some satellites is more of course than expected. Remember my words: - this will happen, and it will happen because we first now begin to be ready to track fast flying objects exactly.

One more point, - satellites are affected by many conditions, - the Sun and the Moon, GR and SR as well as the atmosphere. Many are also regularly forced back to the wanted orbit. How sure can you be that all these factors is perfectly understood ?

And the last point, only relative few satellites are used to scientifically purposes. If commercial satellites are off course these are probably just forced back, - without to asking, - because what counts is to serve people, to earn money, not always to serve scientist..

I can guarantee you that surprises according to (low altitude) orbiting satellites will come, and it could be soon. Simply because first now a days we are much more prepared to discover exactly if, when, and what is wrong, (as long as a satellites is all right equipped), if not then forget it, you will not know anything. (Advise: be more carefully to bet you ass away comrade).
 
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PS!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_Positioning_System
Special and general relativity
According to the theory of relativity, due to their constant movement and height relative to the Earth-centered, non-rotating approximately inertial reference frame, the clocks on the satellites are affected by their speed. Special relativity predicts that atomic clocks moving at GPS orbital speeds will tick more slowly than stationary ground clocks by about 7.2 μs per day.

For the GPS satellites, general relativity predicts that the atomic clocks at GPS orbital altitudes will tick more rapidly, by about 45.9 μs per day, because they have a higher gravitational potential than atomic clocks on Earth's surface.

When combined, the discrepancy is about 38 microseconds per day; a difference of 4.465 parts in 1010. To account for this discrepancy, the frequency standard on board each satellite is given a rate offset prior to launch, making it run slightly slower than the desired frequency on Earth; specifically, at 10.22999999543 MHz instead of 10.23 MHz.[63] Since the atomic clocks on board the GPS satellites are precisely tuned, it makes the system a practical engineering application of the scientific theory of relativity in a real-world environment. Placing atomic clocks on artificial satellites to test Einstein's general theory was proposed by Friedwardt Winterberg in 1955.[64]

Also notice:
http://www.science27.com/english/Sattelites.htm

We can see that the moon (orbit 384.000km) is supported with a space net wind about 8.00 * 10-11 m/s. But this value is not precise, since the constant is only temporary.

We can also see that satellite in low altitude e.g.; 1.000km and 10.000km are affected with relative much stronger space wind than resistance, but notice that the angle velocity in these cases are much lower than the satellite velocity. Hence it far from sure that satellite in low altitude are affected stronger compared to satellites orbit further out. Only experiment and measurement can make that clear.

The average mass rotation of the Sun is unknown. The distribution of the the mass (density) inside the Sun and inside the Earth is very unlike and can not be compared. The correct average mass velocity / rotation must be known to get a exact result.
 
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Loose guessing

Until it is proven you can believe so.
But notice that much in science that in facts only are wild guess, are often of a majority believes to be facts.

I have reconsidered the chapter “Satellites”, www.science27.com/english/Sattelites.htm and have also come to the conclusion that all the rotation astronomic objects must have their own constant.
Hence the deviations velocities in satellites orbit are now insignificant.

This also have leaded me to a better understanding how the transmission of KE mechanism works:

To understand the KE transmission correctly we must look at the forces involved.
Between the Moon and the Earth space is stronger contracted The space winds from the Earth’s rotation transmit KE to the Moon through the "matter-space" (contracted space) connection, between the Earth and the Moon.

This make it possible for the the Moon to overcome its own resistance against orbit motion. But this also gives the Earth angular momentum.

The angular momentum causes the rotation of the Earth, and make it possible for the Earths to overcome the resistance against rotation. This is possible also even though the obit velocity of the Moon is slower than the rotation velocity of the Moon.

The stronger contracted space between the Earth and the Moon is also affected by "friction" against rotation, because the Moon pulls matter in the direction away from the Earth (and towards the Moon). This causes weak resistance against the Earth's rotation, but much weaker than the opposite forces (angular momentum) that causes the Earths rotation.

This phenomenon is already known, but only according to friction at the ocean bottoms. The friction force also applies for matter because the Moon to a certain (weak) degree resists matter to follow the Earth's rotation. Resistance against rotation only applies for Moons with orbit velocity slower than the planets rotation velocity.


It's important to notice: - that the force (used to overcome resistances against orbit motion) transmitted to the secondary orbiting objects (e.g; the Moon around the Earth) is properly always 50%. - the last 50% is used to overcome resistance against rotation of the primary rotating object.

The energy used to overcome the resistance against motion and rotation, comes from the strong force. Gravity and the strong force is united. (read the chapter: Quantum Physics).
Shortly spoken: The force of gravity spins space together. The strong force (Interaction) keeps space together.

Exsample:
Jupiter's moons Io have volcanic activity and Europa probably water within.
Astronomer believes the inner heat is caused by stretching the moon due to the strong gravity (tidal effect) between the Moon and Jupiter. This is fare from the whole truth.

According to this theory the elementary particle is working harder, simply because space must be harder contracted.

Space between two object contracts space stronger. This mean that the force of interaction does a harder job (use more energy) to keep space contracted. This explains why heat also occurs when gravity does a strong work..

Chrank2.jpg

The rotation of the Sun (or the Earth) etc. is always inseparable connected with the orbiting objects.
 
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Curved space is not contracted space.

First asked 11 November 2009:
Have you grasped the simple fact that curved space is not contracted space yet?

In flat space the sum of the angles inside a triangle is 180 degrees.
This is no longer true in curved space.
Uniform contraction of space does not produce any curvature of space since it is uniform and preserves shapes. Thus a triangle in flat space which has a sum of 180 degrees still has the same sum after uniform contraction.

Uniform contraction of space does not produce forces when compared to flat space (no GR gravity). This is because straight paths in it remain as straight paths. Newton's laws then show that there is no force.

Nonuniform contraction of space needs sinks and sources of space which has other problems as sol victus has mentioned:
That's not entirely wrong, but it's incomplete because it has a major problem. Where does the flow originate? If mass is a drain, what's the source? There's no such thing as negative mass, after all.

For example, suppose you have a single point mass somewhere in otherwise empty space. Then the flow points towards that mass. If you follow one of the flow lines out away from the mass, it can't end anywhere or loop back, so it must go all the way to infinity - and there must be an infinity for the line to "end" on; the space cannot be compact.

That's more or less OK, until you try to understand what happens in a universe like ours. Our universe might be infinite, but observation indicates that it's full of a more or less homogeneous mass density everywhere. So, where are all those flow lines coming from? Infinity is no help, because it's full of mass (this is the gravitational version of Olbers' paradox).

That's actually a completely intractable problem - it has no solution - unless you allow space itself, even away from the mass, to deform in response to these flows. Interestingly, you're more or less inevitably led to something like general relativity purely based on the observation that there is no negative mass and that the universe is homogeneous (of course that's not how Einstein arrived at it, he used the much more powerful principle of general covariance).

My objection to nonuniform contraction of space is more physical (and perhaps wrong). As I see it a point mass acting as a drain of spacetime will create an infinite curvature at its position. In other words it will be a black hole with all the consequences, e.g. instantly exploding because of Hawking radiation.
 
*Snipped: Fictional parts*
.

Bjarne, you are just fabulating. Total waste of time. Why don't you go out and study facts instead?

Come back and discuss when you have learned and understood basic physics.

.... If there is still anything to discuss then.

Hans
 
Bjarne, can you show us the calculation that you did for a homogeneous, solid sphere with a core that demonstrates that the Greenland ice core experiment's result is wrong?

First at all I hope you have understood why I claim that ADG will be constant towards the centre of the Earth.

I also hope you have understood that any ASG inside Earth is based on the assumption that the measurement depends on:

1.) Local density / gravity anomalies.
2.) Homogeneous Mass above the point or measurement “should” according to our believe cancel out component wise.
3.) That we believe that can measure gradually stronger effect from the core the deeper we get the centre of the Earth.

It is obviously that you operate with two very hypothetically factors, that only are build on how we believe these gravity properties works.

Exsample
You will measure 9.8 M/s at the surface and the same 2000 meter below the surface. Now you can blame the positive effect from the core and the negative effect from the (homogeneous) mass above to cancel out each other. But this is an assumption based on what you believe.
And should you get a different result you can include density difference in the rock under you.

You will never be able to prove how central gravity properties works except when systematically measuring e.g; measure central ADG e.g: inside a building
Prepare you self that the prevailing superstition overloads will overturns before the vernal equinox.

Have you grasped the simple fact that curved space is not contracted space yet?

In flat space the sum of the angles inside a triangle is 180 degrees.
This is no longer true in curved space.
Uniform contraction of space does not produce any curvature of space since it is uniform and preserves shapes. Thus a triangle in flat space which has a sum of 180 degrees still has the same sum after uniform contraction.

Uniform contraction of space does not produce forces when compared to flat space (no GR gravity). This is because straight paths in it remain as straight paths. Newton's laws then show that there is no force.

Nonuniform contraction of space needs sinks and sources of space which has other problems as sol victus has mentioned:

Now promise me used 5 minutes of your live to do some serious contemplation:

  • WHAT is space?
  • What is bended space?

Unless you get some kind of understanding so that you can put better expression on that as “bended”, - you will never be able to reach a deeper understanding of space or gravity.

If you want to understand more about space, you must in you mind be flexible exactly like space is. Unless there certainly is no hope for you.
Sorry not more I can do..
 
Boys and girls,we'll just have to face facts,Bjarne is a genius and we're all idiots.Never mind,when he wins his Nobel Prize we can all boast that we knew him.
 
Can Bjarne answer his own questions?

First asked 11 November 2009
Bjarne:
Now promise me used 5 minutes of your live to do some serious contemplation:

  • WHAT is space?
  • What is bended space?
Unless you get some kind of understanding so that you can put better expression on that as “bended”, - you will never be able to reach a deeper understanding of space or gravity.
If you cannot answer these questions then obviously you do not have a deeper understanding of space or gravity
 
First at all I hope you have understood why I claim that ADG will be constant towards the centre of the Earth.
...snip....
Exsample
You will measure 9.8 M/s at the surface and the same 2000 meter below the surface. Now you can blame the positive effect from the core and the negative effect from the (homogeneous) mass above to cancel out each other. But this is an assumption based on what you believe.
And should you get a different result you can include density difference in the rock under you.
That is your next basic mistake - you believe that the positive effect from the core negative effect from the (homogeneous) mass cancel out exactly at all points from the surface of the core to the surface.
This is a delusion until you show your calculation.

Now promise me used 5 minutes of your live to do some serious contemplation:

  • WHAT is space?
  • What is bended space?
I do not know. I do not think that anyone knows.


I do know that I have a deeper understanding of gravity than you:
  1. I know that mathematicians and scientists have been modeling space and bended space for over a century and that the universe acts as if bended space is gravity.
  2. I am not idiotic enough to think that I can assign arbitrary units to physical quantities, e.g. calculate a "kinetic resistance" without units and assign it m/s^2.
  3. I know how to use simple math to use Newton's law of gravitation to calculate the force of gravity.
  4. I know that Curved space is not contracted space.
 
First asked 2 November 2009:
Test of Newton's inverse-square law in the Greenland ice cap
Bjarne's assertion is that the Greenland ice core experiment did not measure a gravity gradient because of the variation of gravity below the Earth as predicted by Newton. He seems to think that this is some sort of effect from the core's gravity.

Bjarne, can you show us the calculation that you did for a homogeneous, solid sphere with a core that demonstrates that the Greenland ice core experiment's result is wrong?

IMO: The variation of g with raduis above the core is gr/rE + GMc/r^2


where
  • r is the distance above the core (e.g 3487 kilometers).
  • rE is the radius of the Earth.
  • g is the acceleration of gravity at the surface of the Earth.
  • Mc is the effective mass of the core due to its different density.
Anyone who knows basic mathematics can see that this equation is not a constant. It varies with r.
Your idea fails yet again :jaw-dropp!
 
Can Bjarne answer his own questions?

  • WHAT is space?
  • What is bended space?


I have done
We know that space have the property that it can expand, hence it can also contracts. That is all we know about space properties.

This is enough to understand what bended space really is; - the whole site www.science27.com is one long list of arguments that supoort that conclution.

What is bended space?
Well, - its a only clumsy expression that really means: contracted space.
 
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I have done
We know that space have the property that it can expand, hence it can also contracts. That is all we know about space properties.

This is enough to understand what bended space really is; - the whole site www.science27.com is one long list of arguments that supoort that conclution.

What is bended space?
Well, - its a only clumsy expression that really means: contracted space.
What is contracted space?
 
The opposite of expanding space

The opposite of contracting space
A clear circular definition. This is equal to not having any definition at all. How are you going to get the Nobel Prize without any definition of your most crucial concepts?

Remember, you are the one chiding science for not being able to explain what space is, and now you are not able to explain what expanding or contracting space is.
 

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