Dark Tower fans, possible 8th book

Pinkymcfatfat

ban-hammered
Joined
Dec 6, 2009
Messages
577
Ol' Steve has said that he's had a possible idea for an 8th Dark Tower book, so far title is tenatively 'The Wind Through The Keyhole'.

I'm intrigued to say the least. My mind keeps going over all the little 'Easter Eggs' he's placed in various non-D.T. books over the years. Mind you a lot are probably dead ends, but I think this new book might bring in something from 'The Colorado Kid' considering that was his first book after D.T. 7. The reason I think that is because there are two time line 'errors' he insists are 'not errors'.

Commela, come, come, perhaps the journey is not yet done...

Your feelings, hopes, theories, etc. fellow D.T. junkies?
 
I am one of those who thinks that the whole saga fell apart in the last three books, so another book does not thrill me at all.
 
I'm at least betting D.T. 8 starts out, "The man in black fled across the desert and the gunslinger followed.":D
 
Dude, the ending to that series was such a rip-off. The only reason I might read this is in the hopes that he fixes it.

"You screwed up. Do it again!"

Feh. All that set-up about Size for nothing.
 
I am one of those who thinks that the whole saga fell apart in the last three books, so another book does not thrill me at all.

Yep. And I don't trust he will be able to fix anything with another book. So, no thanks.
 
I'm all for another book. He can't possibly make it worse, right?

Right?

;)
 
I think a story about Roland, Cuthbert and Alain that spans the time after Mejis through Jericho Hills would be interesting. There's a lot of story there to tell.

My first reading of the series left me a bit disappointed, but I recently re-read the series and enjoyed it much more the second time around. The scene in Wizard and Glass where Cuthbert comes to the aid of Sheemie is one of the best things King has ever written.
 
CJW, while I'd love to see Cuthbert and Alain again, I'm kind of hoping it's Jamie De Curry if Steve does an 'early' story. All we ever really got to know about the guy was that he had a birth-mark...
 
I am one of those who thinks that the whole saga fell apart in the last three books, so another book does not thrill me at all.


I'm going to have to agree with that. That, and I feel that he crapped all over a lot of his previous stories with this load of crap.
 
I'll read it because I'm a sucker.

And yeah, the last DT book was quite the letdown. It was like he couldn't figure out an ending that could live up to all those years of buildup so he just decided on "do-over!".
 
I'm at least betting D.T. 8 starts out, "The man in black fled across the desert and the gunslinger followed.":D

You read the afterward, didn't you? YOU WERE SUPPOSED TO STOP!

I would like to see Eye of the Dragon tied in to the whole story more. That was my favorite as a kid.
 
The only thing I liked in the last few books was the epilog to Salem's Lot. One of those books could easily have been eliminated (my vote is for Song of Susannah).

The graphic novels have been pretty good as a continuation or companion to the series and his recent novel the epic Under the Dome was very good (I read all 1072 pages in less than a week). So, I would probably buy a book 8.
 
The graphic novels have been pretty good as a continuation or companion to the series and his recent novel the epic Under the Dome was very good (I read all 1072 pages in less than a week). So, I would probably buy a book 8.

Seconding the graphic novels. Beautiful artwork too.

I have Under the Dome on the bookshelf (got it from Amazon for 9 bucks) but I'm currently working on Duma Key which is so-so but I'm only 100 pages in.
 
I'm getting the graphic novels for Christmas...I've been really good and haven't peeked at them to much on the net.

A good friend of mine from the Dark Tower site thinks there will be a Talisman tie-in...she's been pretty right in the past at predicting what may come next. Maybe there will be a little 'Travelin' Jack'.
 
LOl, you might have seen me there then...

The same friend just gave me a link to the "Discordia" on-line Dark Tower game. I put a link over in the 'games' section.
 
Seconding the graphic novels. Beautiful artwork too.

I have Under the Dome on the bookshelf (got it from Amazon for 9 bucks) but I'm currently working on Duma Key which is so-so but I'm only 100 pages in.
That's where I got it. I couldn't believe how cheap it was compared to retail stores.

When the box came I thought they had sent something else with it. Nope it was just a large book.
 
Yeah, I think it's been murdered enough.

1-4 = awesome

5-7 = wtf?

Exactly. I was a huge fan of the first four book, but halfway through Book Five I thought "King has jumped the shark with this one."
And it got even worse when King tried to tie in every other book he ever wrote with the Dark Tower Universe. I gave up when Randall Flagg showed up.
 
I wonder if it wouldn't be a tale from the universe itself, rather than a continuation of the storyline. Perhaps a tale of Roland's past.

That would be about the only thing that would work, considering how badly King screwed up the main storyline in the last 3 books.
 
I'm getting the graphic novels for Christmas...I've been really good and haven't peeked at them to much on the net.

A good friend of mine from the Dark Tower site thinks there will be a Talisman tie-in...she's been pretty right in the past at predicting what may come next. Maybe there will be a little 'Travelin' Jack'.

A lot of us think that King's attempt to tie in the real world with the Dark Tower Universe was one of the things that ruined the series.
 
That's fine. Put down his books then and stop reading them. If you already have, then don't give them any further thought.

I personally have loved putting together the pieces of the giant DT puzzle over the years. We were warned quite some time ago that Steve saw DT as his "Jupiter of worlds" and that everything seemed to revolve around it.

If this had been a straight forward series where I didn't have to stop and wonder about where I had heard something before, or actually think about the fact that everything I thought I had figured out was probably terribly wrong, I wouldn't have enjoyed it so much. Mind you, I enjoyed "Harry Potter", but I had it's mysteries figured out pretty quickly. The certain level of thrill I wanted wasn't there. I LIKE to be tricked and fed red herrings.

I know a lot of people didn't like the ending...the general feeling among many of it's readers is that there should have been some macho shoot-em-up with the Crimson King, Roland should have been hero of the Universe, Lord of the Tower and that Eddie and Susannah would open a bed and breakfast in Mid-World and live happily ever after.

WTF? It's a Stephen King novel! Who in their right mind expected a 'happy ending'? I could tell things were going to go seriously awry back in book 1.

Did I like the ending? No. Did I think it was fitting? Yes. I knew sometime Steve would pull out the sledge hammer and wack my brain a good one and the ending did not disappoint in that respect.

Yeah, I will buy the new book. I'll debate it with junkies and compare copious notes.
 
About the 'real world' in DT...was it the real world? Yes, some object to Steve showing up in his own work, but was it Steve writing in a fictional Steve, Steve writing in the real Steve?

The time lines in the book were already wonky. Steve showing up was one of my few predictions for the series that DID come to pass (yay me). Then again, he's been obsessing on the world of DT since he was nineteen.

Metafiction isn't to everyone's taste, I know that. Many more prefer a straight forward A+B=C story to a surreal turn of events in which the narrator shows up (this is also why Disney movies make a LOT more than a David Lynch movie). I myself like metafiction quite a bit. In fact, my youngest child is named after one of it's most famous users, "St." Kurt Vonnegut.
 
I'm getting the graphic novels for Christmas...I've been really good and haven't peeked at them to much on the net.

A good friend of mine from the Dark Tower site thinks there will be a Talisman tie-in...she's been pretty right in the past at predicting what may come next. Maybe there will be a little 'Travelin' Jack'.

Talisman has to be one of my favourite novels. I could tell when SK was writing and when PS was writing. Was SK writing the Dark Towers series at the same time he was collaborating with Straub on the Talisman?

OT - thank science and technology for this internert - it's -45 C with the windchill and I am not going outside.
 
About the 'real world' in DT...was it the real world? Yes, some object to Steve showing up in his own work, but was it Steve writing in a fictional Steve, Steve writing in the real Steve?

The time lines in the book were already wonky. Steve showing up was one of my few predictions for the series that DID come to pass (yay me). Then again, he's been obsessing on the world of DT since he was nineteen.

Metafiction isn't to everyone's taste, I know that. Many more prefer a straight forward A+B=C story to a surreal turn of events in which the narrator shows up (this is also why Disney movies make a LOT more than a David Lynch movie). I myself like metafiction quite a bit. In fact, my youngest child is named after one of it's most famous users, "St." Kurt Vonnegut.

Fanboy wank at it's best.
 
Debaroo, yeah, "The Talisman" was written during "DT".

I've read rumors that it has been optioned and is in pre-production as a film. I hope it gets a good treatment. There's a fan trailer on youtube that's actually pretty good, but like I said, it's just a fan trailer.

Speaking of options, Steve sold the option to make "DT" as a series to J.J. Abrams for $19.99. Think there's something up with that number?
 
I don't mind the real world in it. Heck, I can even forgive the obvious Deus Ex Machina. I can almost forgive Dr. Doom with Lightsabers.

But the problem with where it went isn't that the real world is in it. Nor that it links to other books.

It's that we have 4 books pre-accident that clearly, even if it was only nebulous in King's mind, did not envision him in it and his accident.

So when we get to the later books, they swerve into self-indulgence at the expense of whatever story started the journey. I can forgive a lot. Heck, I can even forgive the ending. But cramming the accident in... nope. Because it doesn't belong. We know it doesn't belong. He might not have plotted out the entire series, but we know he wasn't thinking of that. And not only that, but it becomes far too prominent.

It's his story, though, so he can do what he wants with it. I'm entitled to disagree and criticize. I bought that right when I bought the books. I think he broke his own rules, and not the rules of the story but the rules of writing he established. He let self-indulgence violate the writer/reader contract and however awesome I think King is (and the entire bookcase devoted to him says it's very awesome indeed) he rightly deserves a roasting for this murdered opus.

He didn't owe me the ending that I wanted, or the story I wanted. But he did owe his readers better work and more respect than to sacrifice a great story on the altar of indulgence, and he owed us that because he preaches the same.
 
One of the things I discussed long ago in the DT forum was the inclusion of Steve's accident. I wondered about it then, and I wonder about it now. He did say that when he nearly died, the entire direction of the series fundamentaly changed forever.

I've often wondered if he was close to losing his mind when he wrote the section about Jake taking his place in death...really. Something was just so incredibly wrong with the whole thing. I wish he'd write a piece explaining what was going through his head during his recovery.

Is his decision to go on with the series something he's doing now in hind-sight to 'fix' something he wrote during a horrible and painful part of his life? I actually think this is the case. Remember, Roland is back in the desert again at the end of book 7, this time in possession of the Horn.

If he fixes anything, I'd hope it would be most if not all of "Song of Susannah" (my LEAST favorite of the series).
 
Last edited:
Debaroo, yeah, "The Talisman" was written during "DT".

I've read rumors that it has been optioned and is in pre-production as a film. I hope it gets a good treatment. There's a fan trailer on youtube that's actually pretty good, but like I said, it's just a fan trailer.

Speaking of options, Steve sold the option to make "DT" as a series to J.J. Abrams for $19.99. Think there's something up with that number?

I think the Talisman was supposed to be a miniseries, but it looks like its been scrapped for a movie version.

The Talisman.

Have you read Black House? THE DT Tie-in is more explicit in this one.
 
I don't mind the real world in it. Heck, I can even forgive the obvious Deus Ex Machina. I can almost forgive Dr. Doom with Lightsabers.

But the problem with where it went isn't that the real world is in it. Nor that it links to other books.

It's that we have 4 books pre-accident that clearly, even if it was only nebulous in King's mind, did not envision him in it and his accident.

So when we get to the later books, they swerve into self-indulgence at the expense of whatever story started the journey. I can forgive a lot. Heck, I can even forgive the ending. But cramming the accident in... nope. Because it doesn't belong. We know it doesn't belong. He might not have plotted out the entire series, but we know he wasn't thinking of that. And not only that, but it becomes far too prominent.

It's his story, though, so he can do what he wants with it. I'm entitled to disagree and criticize. I bought that right when I bought the books. I think he broke his own rules, and not the rules of the story but the rules of writing he established. He let self-indulgence violate the writer/reader contract and however awesome I think King is (and the entire bookcase devoted to him says it's very awesome indeed) he rightly deserves a roasting for this murdered opus.

He didn't owe me the ending that I wanted, or the story I wanted. But he did owe his readers better work and more respect than to sacrifice a great story on the altar of indulgence, and he owed us that because he preaches the same.

The first time I read the series, I agreed with you. Although I enjoyed the meta-fictional aspect of the series and the various "easter eggs" in his other works, King's inclusion of himself in the DT series seemd like extreme self indulgnece and was a bit of a turn off. It kept me away for the series for a while.

But I fnally reread the series end to end this past year and I feel much less put off by the self-inclusion. For one thing, when Roland and Eddie meet up with King, he addresses the nature of an author's use of dues ex machina head-on. Additionally, there was a subtle point I had missed the first time around and that is this: in the DT series, the fictional King that shows up is not really author of the story, but merely a conduit put in place by greater forces to thwart the destruction of the Tower.

Also, the second time around, I got a sense that King, the real author, wanted the DT series to be about the act of writing and the mysteries of the creative process - I think he was trying to answer a question that he may have asked himself many times, "Where does inspiration come from".

Chris
 
I don't mind the real world in it. Heck, I can even forgive the obvious Deus Ex Machina. I can almost forgive Dr. Doom with Lightsabers.

But the problem with where it went isn't that the real world is in it. Nor that it links to other books.

It's that we have 4 books pre-accident that clearly, even if it was only nebulous in King's mind, did not envision him in it and his accident.

So when we get to the later books, they swerve into self-indulgence at the expense of whatever story started the journey. I can forgive a lot. Heck, I can even forgive the ending. But cramming the accident in... nope. Because it doesn't belong. We know it doesn't belong. He might not have plotted out the entire series, but we know he wasn't thinking of that. And not only that, but it becomes far too prominent.

It's his story, though, so he can do what he wants with it. I'm entitled to disagree and criticize. I bought that right when I bought the books. I think he broke his own rules, and not the rules of the story but the rules of writing he established. He let self-indulgence violate the writer/reader contract and however awesome I think King is (and the entire bookcase devoted to him says it's very awesome indeed) he rightly deserves a roasting for this murdered opus.

He didn't owe me the ending that I wanted, or the story I wanted. But he did owe his readers better work and more respect than to sacrifice a great story on the altar of indulgence, and he owed us that because he preaches the same.

King showing up in the DT was,franky, a self indulgent gimmick that impresses the easily impressed. Which includes a lot of King's fanboys.

King is at he best when he is a pure storyteller. When he tries to get fancy and tries to make his novels into some kind of mediation on writing he is terrible. Some writers can pull that off, he is not one of them.
I like an awful lot of what King writes. But I aslo thing he wrote a lot of crap along the way.
ANd, frankly, the accident and it's aftermath has had a bad effect on King's writing. I understand it had to have some effect, but I wish King had been smart enough to be careful about the effect it might had. He should have obeyed his own teaching about how a writer must "Kill His Darlings".
ANd King needs a really good editor.
 
I can remember the first King book I read. The Shining. I can also remember the first one I hated. The Dark Half.

I think (but I'm not sure) that The Dark Half was the first one he wrote after he quit smoking, drinking, and drugs. I didn't know this at the time, I just thought it sucked. I suppose if he did it under those circumstances it isn't half bad. He gradually got back into his groove in the 90's, I thought, and the culmination in my opinion was Wizard and Glass.

But then he got hit by the van. The first post-accident book would be, I suppose, From a Buick 8 though some of this had been completed pre-accident. It's not bad, but a little uneven. Then we get into the Dark Tower finals and it just goes completely off the rails. I think the reasons for this are probably fairly complex even if the basic suckage is evident. I think the self-indulgence is a big part of it. Not even so much the metafiction itself, it's just got this weird vibe going. It doesn't work.

Sometimes I think his meditation on writing works better. I absolutely loved Lysey's Story. Heck, I think it's his best work. Even better than The Shining and The Stand (formerly my favourites).

But you know... I don't think I could tell you why. I don't know why I liked it so much. If pressed, I'd guess it just happened to be something I read in the right time and place and it clicked. I love it, but simultaneously I know I cannot objectively say it's a good book. I don't think it's that kind of book. It's one that different people will take differently. I lent it to a friend and she returned it with ill-disguised disgust. Guess she didn't love it like I did.


Some of what's going on in the Dark Tower later books might be like this for readers, if we're a bit generous (by this I mean that the visible majority I encounter seem to fall on the side of 'it sucks'). Some of it might be bits of fanboy, too. What I do know is that for me reading them was an awful experience, and I can articulate some of why that was so but a lot of it I can't. It could be said with some fairness that I just didn't "get it".

I find it difficult to be purely objective about Stephen King's work in a way that I don't experience with other writers. I can, for example, point out where Tom Clancy took a precipitous nose-dive into complete garbage and never came back (The Bear and The Dragon remains for me the single most disappointing book ever, and the only one that upon completion I unceremoniously dumped in the trash, $40 hardcover or not).

Where King is different is that the man is just so passionate about writing. The process, the love of the craft. As Dudalb points out, this sometimes acts to taint the well he draws from, but it also introduces a weird layer of complexity. Should I read the Dark Tower series as story, or as exploration? Is it better if the latter? Equally important, is that a fair expectation to make of a reader or does it signify a failure in the writing? That's a question I can't answer, and this thread shows that we fall on all sides of that issue.

As objective as I can be on it, I think it was a mistake. Perhaps it served him therapeutically to go where he did with it. Perhaps it was just coasting with the wheels off. Maybe this is even, in basic substance if not in specifics, where it was always intended to go and our expectations would have set us up for disappointment anyways.


For the most part, I'm with Dudalb. I can see the other side of things too, but I think it stretches the forgiveness factor quite a bit. I'm willing to take another crack at them with an open mind and try to see them as something more, but I have a strong suspicion I'll still come away thinking of them as an exercise in literary autoeroticism.
 
King's appearance in the DT series really kind of threw me out of "the story", as it were; but once I accepted the (tremendous) change I was satisfied with the way the books eventually turned out. Not really all that thrilled, to be honest; but satisfied. I would buy an 8th book.

I suppose the reason I could accept the shift, by the way, is that it was still consistent with the way the world worked as shown in the first three books. I guess if "Hey Jude" and Topeka, or versions of them, had places in the story, any given real-life writer could make it as well. The only reason I guess I wouldn't call it self-indulgent is that it seems to me King uses the DT story more for self-depreciation. Stephen King the DT character is not a good person, and the fact is almost overemphasized a few times.
 
Last edited:
I actually liked the ending. It was sort of telegraphed a mile away that it would be the way it was. In some ways, I think the story sort of stole the thunder from the wheel of time series.
 

Back
Top Bottom