Split Thread Michael Mozina's thread on Dark Matter, Inflation and Cosmology

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(Note: [MM has] already stated the "EM did it" hypothesis. We have ruled out the "EM did it" hypothesis by doing the actual EM calculations that you're presently ignoring.)
You're much too polite.

The objective, independently verifiable, evidence is consistent with:

'MM cannot do EM calculations because he does not understand the underlying math'

Indeed, AFAIK, there is no data whatsoever that is inconsistent with this hypothesis.
 
Those cosmic rays have a "charge", and they are moving, and they therefore generate a magnetic field around the 'current flow' RC. Magnetic fields in light plasma are not sterile tangible things as your industry portrays them. They are *ELECTRO*magnetic fields in space, not "magnetic fields" without the presence of moving charged particles!
Cosmic rays do have an electric charge and do all sorts of electromagnetic stuff.
So what?

My industry is IT. But I do know enough about sicience from my physics degree to know that your ignorance of physics has deluded you.

Scientists are well aware that magnetic fields in light plasma are *ELECTRO*magnetic fields in space.
Magnetic fields in "light plasma" are not sterile tangible things. They move and do other fertile tangible things.

You guys dream up "magic magnets" that do things normal magnets do not do, namely disconnect and reconnect from any other magnetic line. You don't comprehend that in order to have all those powerful magnetic fields, you must also have "current flow' to sustain them, particularly in light plasmas, where solids cannot even factor into the discussion.
That is really ignorant.
  1. Magnetic reconnection is a simple consequence of Maxwell's equations. The complexity comes when you also have a plasma.
  2. Magnetic fields do not need a current flow to sustain them. Ferromagnets do not have currents in them and are magnetics.
    Coronal loops are loops of magnetic flux that were created by the magnetic field of the Sun. They are not sustained by it and move in the photosphere (and out of it).
 
Alfven also called '"magnetic reconnection' a form of "pseudoscience', because it's "pseudo-correct". Circuits reconnect, not magnetic lines! If you understood currents in plasma, you wouldn't be stuck in the B orientation when Alfven clearly and intentionally switched to the E orientation in all things related to light space plasmas.
Alfven also called Magnetohydrodynamics a from of science, because it is scientific. Magnetic firleds reconnect (as defined by scientists which is not your simple idea of broken lines joining together) and ciircuits reconnect! If you understood magnetic fields in plasma, you you wouldn't be stuck in the E orientation when Alfven clearly and intentionally used the B orientation in all things related to the appropriate plasmas.
 
First of all, what I'm proposing is not some "off in the distance magnetic field" pushing things apart. I'm talking about material objects being embedded *IN* an expanding/moving particle/EM field that is full of charged moving particles, that equate to "current flow" at near light speed.

I know what your theory is supposed to be, and my post is 100% relevant to it. I also know that your theory changes from moment to moment, so I wanted to go through the possible force laws one by one and exclude all possible EM-did-it variants, since I don't know which one you will pull out next time.

You realize, of course, that "particle/EM fields" are just collections of point masses/charges that obey Maxwell's Equations and Newton's Laws. I told you what those laws do. They do the same thing for plasma-generated E and B sources as for bar-magnet-like sources or for unspecified E and B sources.

You are proposing, as I said, a low mass source (some plasma structure with its own internal currents) trying to exert a force on a high mass object. The Coulomb calculation cannot produce a large force. The Lorentz calculation cannot produce a large force.

Let's look again at the dipole. The dipole is different---if you put the source very close, then the gradient can be larger compared with a source far away, so my 1/r^3 calculation wasn't quite the right one. Fortunately I gave you all the relevant numbers, so let's go all the way. You want an exact dipole force calculation for a super-nearby source---like current loops in this imaginary "entraining" plasma? You would get a 10^20N force on the solar dipole if there's a magnetic field which rises from 0 on one side to 10^7 T on the other side. I.e., if there were a young magnetar parked in the orbit of Mercury, maybe it could exert a 10^20 N force on the Sun. And the Sun would exert a -10^20 N force on it.

Does your "embedding" field have a strength like that? If not it's not going to exert 10^20 N on the Sun, period. No combination of such forces is going to "fake" the appearance of a uniformly-attractive central force law (in the Galaxy) nor a cosmological expansion law.

"Maybe the field is that strong", perhaps you wonder, "and we haven't looked for it yet". Look for it yourself! Take a strong refrigerator magnet and hold it over your head. Did it get torn out of your hand and accelerated towards the constellation Sagittarius? No? Then there is not a 100 g/m field gradient in the inner solar system.

To conclude, MM, your mental picture of "embedding" things in plasma is unphysical and totally wrong The standard picture of things "embedded" in a plasma and following it around applies exclusively to high-charge, low-mass objects. That's what the Solar Wind is, that's where Alfven waves act like waves, that's what Perratt simulated. High-mass objects, even ones with small excess charges, complex surface currents and fields, etc., simply pass through plasmas subject to the small forces that Newton and Maxwell tells you about. To the extent that there is an object/plasma interaction at all, it consists mostly of the massive object pushing the plasma aside---this, of course, requires only a small force, and small forces are exactly what you keep citing.

You cannot crank up the plasma-sourced field strengths high enough to "entrain" high-mass, low-charge objects. You seem to daydream that it works, but the laws of physics disagree with you. We have given you the relevant numbers dozens of times, including here. Stop daydreaming and do some physics.
 
You guys dream up "magic magnets" that do things normal magnets do not do, namely disconnect and reconnect from any other magnetic line. You don't comprehend that in order to have all those powerful magnetic fields, you must also have "current flow' to sustain them, particularly in light plasmas, where solids cannot even factor into the discussion.

MM, take a couple of refrigerator magnets (the flat rectangular business card or credit card company types), they have alternating north south stripes (generally running vertically). If you place two back to back and slide them across each other you will feel those magnetic stripes alternately repelling and attracting each other. When you feel it switching from resisting the sliding to that sliding being easier (and being pulled in that direction) that is magnetic reconnection as field lines from the stripes on one refrigerator magnet reconnect to the next stripes on the other refrigerator magnet. No “magic magnets”, just what magnets do and reconnection that you can experience in your own kitchen or home. You could do the same thing with a compass and a magnet, the compass needle being itself a small magnet. When the magnet is far from the compass the needle is connected to the earths magnetic field as you bring the magnet closer to the compass at some point the felid of the needle reconnects to that of the magnet and the compass points at the magnet. Move the magnet away from the compass and the field of the needle will reconnect to the magnetic field of the earth. Repeat as many times as you feel necessary until you stop believing in "magic magnets".
 
What exactly do we call a 'dead legend' that goes something like "in the beginning, "fill-in-metaphysical garbarge-or-deity-of-choice did it, and died, never to be seen again by human beings"?

I dunno...

But it isnt science...

and it also is not inflation if that is what this comment is aimed at.


But I will ask again....

Does it have to be an experiment here on the Earth to qualify under your scheme?
 
Dark energy is not classical electromagnetism III

Mozina has ignored the real issue altogether. This is "Michael Mozina's thread on Dark Matter, Inflation and Cosmology". What better place to support his own assertion that "dark energy" is a manifestation of classical electromagnetism?
The "physics" lesson I am going to teach you personally is related to "induction/circuit reconnection" which you keep describing as "magnetic reconnection" Tim. Let's see you respond to Alfven's first paper please. Notice that part where he describes the amount of current flow in terms of Curl H(B)?
See, I was right! You really did ignore the real issue altogether. In fact, now you are desperately trying to change the subject. You know & I know & everybody else knows that dark energy cannot be any manifestation of classical electromagnetism. That's why you do not answer either ben_m or me.

And so I repeat:

Myself & ben_m have presented objective & quantitative arguments to support the assertion that "dark energy" cannot be any manifestation of classical electromagnetism. Mozina has ignored the opportunity to present equally qualified objective & quantitative argument to the contrary. As far as I am concerned, that ends the discussion on the electromagnetic nature of "dark energy". It has been proven to my satisfaction that "dark energy" cannot be any manifestation of classical electromagnetism and Mozina is either unwilling or unable to directly address the issue. It is time therefore to move on to other topics.

As for your lesson on reconnection, I will not answer in this thread because the question of magnetic reconnection is not relevant in any way to dark energy, dark matter, or inflationary cosmology. I will answer later and put my answer in the magnetic reconnection discussion.
 
Dark energy is not classical electromagnetism IV

The "physics" lesson I am going to teach you personally is related to "induction/circuit reconnection" which you keep describing as "magnetic reconnection" Tim. Let's see you respond to Alfven's first paper please. Notice that part where he describes the amount of current flow in terms of Curl H(B)?

No. I will not read anything by Alfven until you meet my demands for you to read. See my post Magnetic Reconnection is Real in the relevant magnetic reconnection thread.

I don't want to discuss magnetic reconnection in this thread because it is not relevant to dark energy and inflationary cosmology. I don't want it to be so easy for you to deflect the conversation of this thread away from the real issue. Dark energy is not any manifestation of classical electromagnetism, and there is enough evidence on the table now to support this claim. If you cannot provide a quantitative physical argument in opposition to the quantitative physical arguments already presented, then the discussion is over, isn't it?
 
Dark energy is not any manifestation of classical electromagnetism, and there is enough evidence on the table now to support this claim.

I second that statement, and I want to clarify that MM has invoked electromagnetism in three different cosmology questions: dark matter, dark energy, and inflation.

My particular force calculations were done so as to emphasize why E&M is irrelevant to dark matter, and it's trivial to make explicit that E&M is also not relevant to dark energy. E&M is irrelevant to inflation as well; the reasons are clear enough to physicists (wrong equation of state) but generally unrelated to my calculations above.
 
Does GR (i.e., our only theory of gravity) tell us "IF dark energy THEN acceleration"? YES IT DOES.

Quote Einstein using the term "dark energy" in reference to GR. You're intentionally, and willfully stuffing metaphysics into a perfectly good physics theory, and claiming it's exactly the same theory it was before your change! BS.

Gravity doesn't do repulsive tricks. Let's see you jump off the planet.
 
MM, take a couple of refrigerator magnets (the flat rectangular business card or credit card company types), they have alternating north south stripes (generally running vertically). If you place two back to back and slide them across each other you will feel those magnetic stripes alternately repelling and attracting each other. When you feel it switching from resisting the sliding to that sliding being easier (and being pulled in that direction) that is magnetic reconnection as field lines from the stripes on one refrigerator magnet reconnect to the next stripes on the other refrigerator magnet.

I've read many of your post TM, and I respect you a great deal, but magnetic attraction and magnetic repulsion are not "magnetic reconnection". These are not the same processes and I know that you know that.
 
An EM field is not "high energy current flows".
An EM field is ... an electromagnetic field!

The EM field is *CREATED BY THOSE MOVING CHARGED PARTICLES*. You people really have a serious cognitive disassociation problem with it comes to understanding the cause of a sustained magnetic field in light plasma. You treat the "magnetic field line" as though it is "primary", when it fact it is a "by product" of the "current flow" that sustains that magnetic field. The "magnetic rope" is constricted by the magnetic field, but the presence of that field is directly related to the "current flow" through the "magnetic rope". It is that current flow that generates the magnetic field that then acts to constrict the current flow into a 'tube'. Two of these current carrying "circuits" interact, they form a "double layer" between them, and its all an *ELECTROmagnetic* process, none of which involves "magnetic reconnection", just "circuit reconfiguration" and "induction".
 
No. I will not read anything by Alfven until you meet my demands for you to read.

I cited one paper for you Tim, and a specific line of that paper. I didn't hand you a reading list. You don't even have to take it personally. I ask everyone that same question. It's more for my own information than anything else, and I'm stunned how few have read his work.

See my post Magnetic Reconnection is Real in the relevant magnetic reconnection thread.

Whatever. We can split up the topics if you prefer.

Dark energy is not any manifestation of classical electromagnetism,...

Dark energy isn't even "real" Tim. It can't "be" anything. Electromagnetism is real, and it has a real affect on real things, including the ability to accelerate plasma.

If you cannot provide a quantitative physical argument in opposition to the quantitative physical arguments already presented, then the discussion is over, isn't it?

Likewise if you can't produce a physical empirical demonstration that "dark energy" isn't simply a figment of your overactive imagination, and an ad hoc gap filler of epic proportions, the discussion is over isn't it? When did "dark energy" ever cause even a single atom to "accelerate" in a lab Tim?
 
I dunno...

But it isnt science...

and it also is not inflation if that is what this comment is aimed at.


But I will ask again....

Does it have to be an experiment here on the Earth to qualify under your scheme?

It seems to me that there has to be some hope of empirically validating or falsifying the claim, otherwise the best it can ever be is "creation mythology". "In the beginning was a lump. Inflation saw the lump and was not pleased. Inflation said "let their be light", and died, never to be seen again".

That's not "science", that's "myth making with math". It's no better than a dead deistic religion with a mathematical window dressing.
 
Michael Mozina said:
How about a quick show of hands, how many of the following individuals have actually read "Cosmic Plasma" by Hannes Alfven? ... Tim Thompson ...
You have asked this question about a bazillion times, keep getting the same answers, and then just ask it again like it's the first time. How many times do I have to tell you ... YES ... I have read the book and I have two copies of it in my physics library. I used the book as a reference when I was a graduate student.

[...]
This is as good an anchor as any, and as good a time as any ...

An interesting, empirical, experiment might be to see what happens when a curious, general, reader takes up MM's challenge (if that's what it can be called), obtains "Cosmic Plasma" by Hannes Alfvén, and reads it (well, the interesting part would be what this reader has to say after reading it!).

Turns out something like this did, in fact, happen.

Someone with the handle DrRocket, who had engaged MM in a very lengthy series of exchanges at space.com, not only read Cosmic Plasma, but also "his earlier book Cosmical Electrodynamics, Fundamental Principles, written with Carl-Gunne Falthammar", and he wrote up his experience in a very lengthy SDC post (it's well worth a read, for any regular or lurker who has not already seen it).

DrRocket's conclusion? Here it is (it's just over a year old):
DrRocket said:
It is now 45 years since the publication of Cosmical Electrodynamics, Fundamental Principles. Nevertheless, it can still be recommended as good source of information with regard to plasma physics, written by a master of the subject.

It is 27 years since the publication of Cosmic Plasma. That book is speculative and contains no physics not better explained in Cosmical Electrodynamics or other books on plasma physics. The cosmological and astrophysical speculation in the book is largely discredited. One cannot recommend this book for any serious scientific purpose, but it is perhaps of interest for historical reasons.

Perhaps more importantly, Alfven’s speculative hypotheses of 27 years ago do not in any way support the pseudoscience that has been built from them and called “EU Theory”. EU theory seems to be the result of wild extrapolation of Alfven’s speculations by a group that lacks both the knowledge of real physics and the intelligence to apply it properly. The utter pseudoscience that has arisen from the misinterpretation, misapplication, and misunderstanding of Cosmic Plasma is in some ways tragic, but mostly just plain silly.
 
I second that statement, and I want to clarify that MM has invoked electromagnetism in three different cosmology questions: dark matter, dark energy, and inflation.

Yes, because all we have to do is change a couple of initial conditions, and the EM field replaces the need for inflation and "dark energy" immediately. All we have to do is charge your "lump" relative to "space", accept the existence of "flying ions and flying electrons) and we can do away with all three (well, probably not all DM) of your invisible metaphysical friends. Pure coincidence?
 
DrRocket's conclusion? Here it is (it's just over a year old):

FYI, IMO Dr Rocket has infinitely more scientific integrity than you ever will have. At least he's bothered to read the book. He did not represent the "average reader" at Space.com, in fact he was the single most vocal critic of EU theory on that website at that moment in time. It would be akin to Tim in his current mindset reading the book. It may not change his personal opinion right this minute, but at least Dr Rocket had the integrity to read it. Did you ever personally do that?
 
Yes, because all we have to do is change a couple of initial conditions, and the EM field replaces the need for inflation and "dark energy" immediately.

NO IT DOESN'T. I just showed you it doesn't. You only guess it does because you haven't done the actual EM calculation.
 
Alfven also called Magnetohydrodynamics a from of science, because it is scientific. Magnetic firleds reconnect (as defined by scientists which is not your simple idea of broken lines joining together) and ciircuits reconnect! If you understood magnetic fields in plasma, you you wouldn't be stuck in the E orientation when Alfven clearly and intentionally used the B orientation in all things related to the appropriate plasmas.

This statement is so ignorant and so false it's hard to know where to start. Alfven read Parker's 'reconnection' theory RC. He called it "pseudoscience" because it is only "sort of" right. He personally talks about the "appropriate" use of E and B orientations but of course you wouldn't know because you've never bothered to read any of it yourself.

In "DENSE" plasmas (plasmas that don't move much), Alfven often used a B orientation to describe events, because the particles weren't moving around anyway. In "light" plasmas, and "current carrying" plasmas, Alfven immediately talked about boundary conditions and switched to a E orientation and talked in terms of "circuits".

You guys took the first B field semester orientation of MHD theory and never took the second semester or E field orientation. Instead you blindly attempt to use the B field orientation like a sledghammer to everything, including light, and even "current carrying" plasmas. Since all of space is filled with light speed charged particles, the whole of space is better suited to an "E field" orientation, which is exactly why Alfven did that and why he was the father of EU/PC theory, and the application of MHD theory to objects in space!
 
DrRocket's review is the first post of an SDC thread that is, currently, 105 posts long.

About half-way down the third page is another post by DrRocket, who seems very frustrated at MM's apparent refusal to engage in discussion of the physics in either of the Alfvén books DrRocket reviewed^:
michaelmozina said:
Where in the solar atmosphere is Curl B = 0 DrRocket?
Aha, a rare event indeed. A succint post by Mr. Mozina with an understandable question. Therefore I can provide an answer.

If you would look a the complete Ampere's equation or if you understood page 7 of Cosmic Plasma, which you apparently don't you would see that curl B = mu I, where I is current and one has either neglected the displacement current, dD/dt or lumped in to the current term. So curl B is zero where the current is zero. Edit: This is slightly oversimplified to be consistent with page 7 of Alfven's book -- I is really current density, but there should be no serious confusion.

To apply this you would also have to recognize, which you have in the past demonstrated that you do not, that current is not just the movement of charged particles, but is in fact the transport of NET charge. So movement of a neutral plasma is NOT current. And as Alfven has often stated, many and probably most plasmas can be regarded as neutral. The exception occurs where there is charge separation caused by some outside force.

Don't you READ Cosmic Plasma ? Do you just throw words around with no concept of their meaning ? You really do need to learn some physics. Perhaps if you did you might be able to understand what Alfven has written in your favoroite book. It is not even possible to understand the pictures if you don't understand the basic physics. Cheez !!
Seems familiar, doesn't it?


^ this is, of course, just one additional piece of objective, independently verifiable evidence that MM cannot, in fact, understand the math involved in classical electromagnetism
 
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I've read many of your post TM, and I respect you a great deal, but magnetic attraction and magnetic repulsion are not "magnetic reconnection". These are not the same processes and I know that you know that.

The magnetic field between TM's magnets is a reconnecting field, as you are welcome to discuss in the reconnection thread.
 
Electromagnetism is real, and it has a real affect on real things, including the ability to accelerate plasma.

Yes, it accelerates "real things" according to the simple force laws I told you about. The force laws tell you that EM does not accelerate massive objects like stars.
 
DrRocket's review is the first post of an SDC thread that is, currently, 105 posts long.

About half-way down the third page is another post by DrRocket, who seems very frustrated at MM's apparent refusal to engage in discussion of the physics in either of the Alfvén books DrRocket reviewed^:

Seems familiar, doesn't it?


^ this is, of course, just one additional piece of objective, independently verifiable evidence that MM cannot, in fact, understand the math involved in classical electromagnetism

The irony of course is that Alfven himself talked about "circuits" in space, and used the term "wires" in fact. Dr. Rocket and I went round on round on the Curl B issue. The "correct" answer is that *NOWHERE IN SPACE IS CURL B = 0.
 
Yes, it accelerates "real things" according to the simple force laws I told you about. The force laws tell you that EM does not accelerate massive objects like stars.

You and I might have to revisit that "gas pressure" comment you made in relationship to those light speed "current flows" we see in space. What effect might that "gas pressure" have on physical objects inside the fields?
 
You and I might have to revisit that "gas pressure" comment you made in relationship to those light speed "current flows" we see in space. What effect might that "gas pressure" have on physical objects inside the fields?

a) If you're referring my characterization of your cosmic rays as an ideal gas: yes, it's very easy to calculate the force generated by such a gas on an object embedded in it; just like for any ideal gas, there's a force generated by zillions of cosmic rays impacting your surface and changing momentum. The net force depends only on the imbalance. The force due to cosmic rays hitting the Sun---or even cosmic rays hitting the heliospheric magnetic fields---is utterly, utterly negligible. Really comically tiny.

b) You're really just rooting around for random non-dark forces at this point. Cosmic ray kinetic pressure? What the heck? A field that's not in Alfven, not in Perratt, and which to all appearances you invented this week, is now (in your mind) such an attractive cosmological feature that you're ignoring the actual EM-law-calculations of the model you've been arguing for for years?
 
FYI, IMO Dr Rocket has infinitely more scientific integrity than you ever will have. At least he's bothered to read the book. He did not represent the "average reader" at Space.com, in fact he was the single most vocal critic of EU theory on that website at that moment in time. It would be akin to Tim in his current mindset reading the book. It may not change his personal opinion right this minute, but at least Dr Rocket had the integrity to read it. Did you ever personally do that?

Isn't that like insisting people read books on astrology before rejecting it? If one has an adequate understanding of science, astrology is simply ruled out without the need for further reading or thought.
Similarly, the physicists you are debating on this forum do not need to read Alfven's discredited ideas to know they are wrong.
 
DrRocket's review is the first post of an SDC thread that is, currently, 105 posts long.

About half-way down the third page is another post by DrRocket, who seems very frustrated at MM's apparent refusal to engage in discussion of the physics in either of the Alfvén books DrRocket reviewed^:

Seems familiar, doesn't it?


^ this is, of course, just one additional piece of objective, independently verifiable evidence that MM cannot, in fact, understand the math involved in classical electromagnetism


Thanks for the link, DeiRenDopa. I did like the point made by DrRocket here...

DrRocket at the Space.com forum said:
No. And I have no intention whatever of trying any further to explain Alfven's theories to you or anyone else. If you want to discuss YOUR theories you will have to define them and defend them. If you think I will turn into a host for an EU parasite you are sorely mistaken. Your attempt to shift the onus for explanation of your personal delusions onto mainstream science will not work.


An "EU parasite". That's rich. :D

Apparently DrRocket agrees with the consensus view of the rantings of the crackpot. His review and comments go directly to the point that Michael doesn't even understand the material he waves around in his effort to bolster his fantasy. Obviously it's ridiculous for him to continue to demand that everyone read Alfven's book when he clearly doesn't even understand it himself.
 
Isn't that like insisting people read books on astrology before rejecting it?

Not many people have a Nobel Prize in astrology. :)

If one has an adequate understanding of science, astrology is simply ruled out without the need for further reading or thought.

Why doesn't that work for me and say something like "inflation"?

Similarly, the physicists you are debating on this forum do not need to read Alfven's discredited ideas to know they are wrong.

How do they know they are "wrong" and "discredited" if they haven't read them and don't understand them?

For instance, what part of Alfven's work has been "discredited" and how was it "discredited"?
 
Apparently DrRocket agrees with the consensus view of the rantings of the crackpot. His review and comments go directly to the point that Michael doesn't even understand the material he waves around in his effort to bolster his fantasy.

And Themis shows us that DrRocket's position is a gross oversimplification of the process GM, and it is *DrRocket* that doesn't (didn't) properly comprehend the pocesses. Gee, you got "crackpot" and "fantasy" in the same paragraph. Were you verbally abused as a child or what?
 
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a) If you're referring my characterization of your cosmic rays as an ideal gas: yes, it's very easy to calculate the force generated by such a gas on an object embedded in it; just like for any ideal gas, there's a force generated by zillions of cosmic rays impacting your surface and changing momentum. The net force depends only on the imbalance. The force due to cosmic rays hitting the Sun---or even cosmic rays hitting the heliospheric magnetic fields---is utterly, utterly negligible. Really comically tiny.

b) You're really just rooting around for random non-dark forces at this point. Cosmic ray kinetic pressure? What the heck? A field that's not in Alfven, not in Perratt, and which to all appearances you invented this week, is now (in your mind) such an attractive cosmological feature that you're ignoring the actual EM-law-calculations of the model you've been arguing for for years?

You're sort of sidestepping my point. If we drop a few positively charged test particles into that field, will they have the tendency to "expand" away from from each other, or 'clump'?
 
Originally Posted by Perpetual Student
Isn't that like insisting people read books on astrology before rejecting it?


Not many people have a Nobel Prize in astrology. :)

You see, this is a typically nonsensical response from you. Alfven's Nobel prize had little to do with astronomy or cosmology. Your comment is exactly equivalent to supporting Linus Pauling's crackpot notions about vitamin C because he won a Nobel prize in chemistry. Do we accept Newton's ideas about alchemy because of his contributions to physics?
Please, don't test our intelligence that way!
 
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How's an "adequate understanding of science" going to change the fact that inflation no longer exists in nature and is "mythical/imaginary" (as in one specific human imagination) in origin?

The fact that inflation is no longer occurring doesn't need changing.
The fact that it is "mythical/imaginary" doesn't need changing either because it quite simply isn't a fact. Its a label you've decided to give to it which, for some very bizarre reason, you have chosen to put in quotation marks.
 
You're sort of sidestepping my point. If we drop a few positively charged test particles into that field, will they have the tendency to "expand" away from from each other, or 'clump'?
Oh MM this is so easy that even you should get it.
Positive charges repel so the charges repel!

First asked 27 January 2010
Michael Mozina.
You're sort of sidestepping the scientific point. If we drop a few positively, negatively and neutral charged test particles into that EM field, will they have the tendency to expand away from from each other, or clump on a cosmological scale?

Show your working.
 
You're sort of sidestepping my point. If we drop a few positively charged test particles into that field, will they have the tendency to "expand" away from from each other, or 'clump'?

That's easy to answer. A charged test particle in this field will execute Brownian motion, like any particle interacting with a gas. The size of the Brownian steps depends on things like the charge-to-mass ratio, temperature, density, and the ratio of the CR mass to the test particle mass. Care to compute how far the Sun moves due to a single cosmic-ray impact, MM?

What part of cosmology do you think is well-described by Brownian motion, MM?

If you want the test particles to interact with each other as well as with the gas---well, first, stop calling them test particles. Then, compute the classical force that the test particles exert on one another---or, wait! This is the force I already computed for you, repeatedly. (In the relativistic gas you described, this force is completely independent of whether or not there is a gas there at all. In the nonrelativistic limit you start to see charge screening which makes the force even smaller.)

ETA: But, sure, a small number of particles all with the same sign will repel one another. That's why I went through and gave you an exact calculation of the Coulomb force on the Sun due to any electric field you care to plug in. Go ahead, plop down 10 test particles; compute the electric field due to the first 9 and use my calculations to derive the force on the 10th. Don't just tell me, "look, I made two things repel, I'm done and I win"---do the math. Tell me the masses and charges of several of your test particles and use E&M to compute the magnitudes and directions of the accelerations.

Or---I'll help you out here---perhaps you want to ignore the test particles and look at the evolution of the gas itself? Sure, that's even easier---the gas you describe is exactly what the middle stages of the Big Bang would have looked like; its expansion decelerates due to gravitational self-attraction; the short-range E&M attractions and repulsions cancel out to give no net effect except a (positive pressure) EM energy density which itself gravitates and helps with the deceleration. We've been through this a dozen times also---either you forget easily, or you continue vaguely hoping that the answer will be different if you ask again.
 
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It is physically impossible for an EM field to be dark energy.

First asked 27 January 2010
Micheal Mozina,
You have an idea that the cause of the measured increase in the rate of expansion of the universe (the scientific term for this is dark energy) is a cosmological EM field.

You are persisting in this idea despite it being easy to demonstrate that it is false. So before calling this persistent belief in a wrong idea a delusion, I will recap the reasons why it is physically impossible for an EM field to be dark energy.

Firstly it has the opposite effect to what is observed.

Any cause of the acceleration of the expansion of the universe ("dark energy") exerts pressure. Even your impossible EM field will do this (ever hear of photons and light pressure?).
That pressure will contribute to the stress-energy tensor in General Relativity. It turns out that positive acceleration requires negative pressure, i.e. dE/dV is positive (pressure is defined as -dE/dV).

For example, if we allow the cosmological constant to be non-zero then


here are a couple of derivations of the consequences:

Secondly it cannot fit the observed Hubble curve - but you can easily prove all of us wrong by answering:
First asked 13 January 2010
The force on a charged object, due to an EM field is F = qE + qvxB. v, B, and E are time- and position-dependent vectors. You cannot find---I dare you to try---any values of q, E(r), and B(r), which result in forces that account for the observed Hubble curve. (Don't forget F=ma.)

Remember: you asked me what my dark energy force was. I gave you the complete equation-of-motion including all of the "new physics", including the only plausible numerical value in g/cm^3 of the one parameter. Go ahead, do the same for electromagnetic cosmic acceleration. Give me some set of q, E, and B values that you think exerts the acceleration-causing force that explains the Hubble curve.

Thirdly there is a post that shows that such an EM field would cause free electrons to accelerate to relativistic speeds in seconds.
 
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I've read many of your post TM, and I respect you a great deal, but magnetic attraction and magnetic repulsion are not "magnetic reconnection". These are not the same processes and I know that you know that.


The reconnection is when the refrigerator magnets switch from repulsion to attraction as you slide them. You do not know what you would like to think you know, particularly about me. Although I do appreciate your expression of respect it is mired by your apparent inability to understand even the most basic physics, further exacerbated by your tendency to completely misinterpret what you read, exemplified by your assertion above. Also, unfortunately, those aspects leave me incapable of expressing any kind of respect for you or your understanding and that just makes me sad. I whish you could gain that respect and I could reciprocate, but whether your misinterpretation above was intentional or not it is certainly not respectable.
 
The magnetic field between TM's magnets is a reconnecting field, as you are welcome to discuss in the reconnection thread.

You’re right ben m, that would be the appropriate place. I have quote that post into that thread for possible discussion there.
 

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