Possibility of blowing up Mars? - Page 3

Craig4 · 21st February 2012, 12:56 PM

Originally Posted by Andrew Wiggin

You'll need to crash a spaceship equipped with a molecular disruption device into it. It helps to have a fleet of such ships, in case there are planetary defenses, in which case most of the fleet can do a zerg rush as a distraction while one ship makes a suicide bombing run.

Great book, but I can tell you already think so.

Craig4 · 21st February 2012, 01:00 PM

Originally Posted by autumn1971

I thought the center of a Mars was creamy nougat.

You know what would be like totally awesome? If the mantel was chocolate and the center was nougat. It would be like a big... big... MARS BAR!!!! OMG that would be so cool...

DeathDart · 21st February 2012, 02:06 PM

What is it with you Earthlings?

358 Million years ago it was the Cephalopods, getting all cold eyed and gangsta.

65 Million years ago it was the Dinosaurs, gonna do the lizard stomp on us.

Now its the primates.

Lets see what do we have to work with in the "shut the monkeys up storage bin", which you call the asteroid belt.

WhatRoughBeast · 21st February 2012, 03:46 PM

Originally Posted by Ziggurat

I mean bring it to a dead stop. If you just slow it down, you'll put it in an elliptical orbit and it will still miss the sun. Technically, one could just slow it down enough that the apogee of the eliptical orbit was less than the radius of the sun (so Mars would still hit the sun, but at an angle), but that's so much slower than its current velocity that the difference between that slow and a dead stop aren't really important to us.

Actually, there is an amazing coincidence here. The energy required to boost all of Mars' matter to escape velocity is almost exactly equal to the energy required to stop it in its orbit (and let it fall into the sun). By "almost equal" I mean within 1 per cent.

Who'd have thought?

Ziggurat · 21st February 2012, 03:53 PM

Originally Posted by WhatRoughBeast

Actually, there is an amazing coincidence here. The energy required to boost all of Mars' matter to escape velocity is almost exactly equal to the energy required to stop it in its orbit (and let it fall into the sun). By "almost equal" I mean within 1 per cent.

Who'd have thought?

Huh. Now we have a real dilemma on our hands. Since they cost about the same, which would be more awesome? I lean towards the sun myself, but it's a tough call.

Ladewig · 21st February 2012, 04:00 PM

Originally Posted by Olowkow

The Newtster beat you to it.

Surprisingly, that is one thing I like about N. Gingrich. I don't support all his ideas, but I believe they should be discussed before they are dismissed. He sometimes thinks too far outside the box, but Congress is tragically myopic and the government would do better to explore unconventional options before deciding on a plan.

Ladewig · 21st February 2012, 04:02 PM

Originally Posted by WhatRoughBeast

Actually, there is an amazing coincidence here. The energy required to boost all of Mars' matter to escape velocity is almost exactly equal to the energy required to stop it in its orbit (and let it fall into the sun). By "almost equal" I mean within 1 per cent.

Who'd have thought?

Shhhhhh. The numerologists might hear you.

Ladewig · 21st February 2012, 04:04 PM

Originally Posted by Horatius

That's more "Boiling Mars".

I don't think so. The Sun gives off microwaves and I remember quite distinctly the results of my putting an egg in a microwave oven. It most assuredly "blowed up." It blowed up real good.

jhunter1163 · 21st February 2012, 04:11 PM

How much antimatter would it take to make a bomb that would vaporize Mars?

DeathDart · 21st February 2012, 04:58 PM

Originally Posted by jhunter1163

How much antimatter would it take to make a bomb that would vaporize Mars?

The joules from the previous posts divided by the speed of light squared.

Half that amount since an equal amount of normal matter will be converted.

Olowkow · 21st February 2012, 05:45 PM

Originally Posted by Ladewig

Surprisingly, that is one thing I like about N. Gingrich. I don't support all his ideas, but I believe they should be discussed before they are dismissed. He sometimes thinks too far outside the box, but Congress is tragically myopic and the government would do better to explore unconventional options before deciding on a plan.

I just never know when people here are joking, unless there is a smilie. Please put a smilie on that.

CapelDodger · 21st February 2012, 07:02 PM

Originally Posted by WhatRoughBeast

Mars delenda est.

I just knew the Cato Institute had a hidden agenda.

CapelDodger · 21st February 2012, 07:09 PM

Originally Posted by phunk

But I guess really the amount of energy is going to depend on how you blow it up. A bomb on the surface will require much more energy than one at the core.

If that bomb was carefully positioned we could hit Jupiter with a lot of debris. If carelessly positioned it could make for some interesting nights down here.

Looking far enough into the future this might be what passes for performance art.

CapelDodger · 21st February 2012, 07:13 PM

Originally Posted by Ziggurat

Huh. Now we have a real dilemma on our hands. Since they cost about the same, which would be more awesome? I lean towards the sun myself, but it's a tough call.

How close should we have it come by us? A neat trick would be for it to take our Moon with it - that would be awesome. It would make wrapping Mons Olympus in tinfoil look like child's play.

Ziggurat · 21st February 2012, 07:26 PM

Originally Posted by CapelDodger

How close should we have it come by us? A neat trick would be for it to take our Moon with it - that would be awesome. It would make wrapping Mons Olympus in tinfoil look like child's play.

That close and we might be looking at some serious tidal problems, but even more importantly possibly large permanent perturbations to our orbit.

CapelDodger · 21st February 2012, 07:28 PM

Originally Posted by Horatius

I suspect most people who want to blow up Mars would be more than happy with just creating a bunch of rubble that forms a new asteroid belt.

The main thing is not to vote for them.

CapelDodger · 21st February 2012, 07:33 PM

Originally Posted by Ziggurat

That close and we might be looking at some serious tidal problems, but even more importantly possibly large permanent perturbations to our orbit.

Yup. One heck of a performance.

This does assume almost terminal boredom and effectively unlimited energy available.

WhatRoughBeast · 21st February 2012, 07:39 PM

Originally Posted by CapelDodger

I just knew the Cato Institute had a hidden agenda.

Oh, I say. Well done.

h.g.Whiz · 21st February 2012, 07:52 PM

Originally Posted by CapelDodger

The main thing is not to vote for them.

lopeyschools · 21st February 2012, 08:02 PM

I think we are all in agreement?

If mars can be destroyed, it should be.

Foster Zygote · 21st February 2012, 08:04 PM

Originally Posted by KingMerv00

The internet being what it is, you shouldn't be surprised that there is a website on the ways one could destroy Earth. Pretty sure it has energy estimates too. You just need to adjust for the fact Mars is about half as big and you are all set to go.

Not the Earth! That's where I keep all my stuff!!!

Complexity · 21st February 2012, 08:13 PM

Originally Posted by lopeyschools

I think we are all in agreement?

If mars can be destroyed, it should be.

Nonsense.

(I live to prevent unanimity.)

grokinhaze · 21st February 2012, 08:36 PM

Tell the NeoCons there are terrorists with WMDs on Mars

DeathDart · 21st February 2012, 08:40 PM

If we need to protect Earth from asteroids we need to test what we have to see if it works.

Have one of our nukes hit an asteroid on the 4th of July. Make sure it will be visible in the night sky from North America.

Go get the squirrel boy! say with a southern accent.

WhatRoughBeast · 21st February 2012, 09:10 PM

Originally Posted by lopeyschools

I think we are all in agreement?

If mars can be destroyed, it should be.

Only if it can be done in a cool way. Like, for instance, if you drop it into the sun; it's only cool if it comes out the other side.

Ziggurat · 21st February 2012, 09:14 PM

Originally Posted by WhatRoughBeast

Only if it can be done in a cool way. Like, for instance, if you drop it into the sun; it's only cool if it comes out the other side.

It wouldn't come out the other side, but it would make one hell of a splash.

Ladewig · 21st February 2012, 09:55 PM

Originally Posted by CapelDodger

If that bomb was carefully positioned we could hit Jupiter with a lot of debris.

There would be a certain irony to that. Immanuel Velikovsky proved over 60 years ago that the planet Venus was ejected from the planet Jupiter.

jk

tsig · 21st February 2012, 10:08 PM

Originally Posted by Complexity

Nonsense.

(I live to prevent unanimity.)

One way or the other we're going to have to deal with the Martian problem so I say we fight them there so we don't have to fight them in our streets.

DeathDart · 22nd February 2012, 12:49 AM

Originally Posted by tsig

One way or the other we're going to have to deal with the Martian problem so I say we fight them there so we don't have to fight them in our streets.

Too late.

Complexity · 22nd February 2012, 06:58 AM

Originally Posted by tsig

One way or the other we're going to have to deal with the Martian problem so I say we fight them there so we don't have to fight them in our streets.

I haven't decided which side I'm on.

If it comes down to Tom Cruise vs. The Tripods, I've got to side with The Tripods.

h.g.Whiz · 22nd February 2012, 08:00 AM

Originally Posted by Complexity

I haven't decided which side I'm on.

If it comes down to Tom Cruise vs. The Tripods, I've got to side with The Tripods.

May I ask why? Something tells me your reason will be most interesting.

Complexity · 22nd February 2012, 09:54 AM

Originally Posted by h.g.Whiz

May I ask why? Something tells me your reason will be most interesting.

(geez! - the pressure is excruciating!)

Non-serious answer*: Cruise used to be cute, then he opened his mouth. Cuteness betrayed!

Also, I really like the way that Orson Welles played with peoples' heads. People haven't gotten any smarter - that could sooooo happen again.

Serious answer: It depends on what the martians would do with earth once they conquered/obliterated humans.

I don't necessarily value human life over other life (more than cockroaches, less than cats; varies by individual**) and I have a good sense of the ill effects on other life of human life (if it continues as it has, which I regard as very likely).

Without any foreknowledge of the character and purposes of martians***, I might feel compelled to oppose the martians, but I would certainly take care of some particularly annoying humans in the process.

* Actually, I'm serious about both of these answers, too.

** Many people are worse than cockroaches, while a very few are better than some cats.

*** Particularly with regard towards their policy on cats.

Beerina · 22nd February 2012, 10:12 AM

Originally Posted by KingMerv00

The internet being what it is, you shouldn't be surprised that there is a website on the ways one could destroy Earth. Pretty sure it has energy estimates too. You just need to adjust for the fact Mars is about half as big and you are all set to go.

In The Forge of God, Greg Bear estimates a 100 million ton nugget of neutron star colliding with a similar nugget of anti-neutrons at the center of the Earth would impart sufficient energy to cause the Earth to blow apart AKA make its mass blow itself out of its common gravity well.

IIRC, curiously that is also about how much mass the sun converts to energy every second, by one account I have read. Seems a bit high to me.

WhatRoughBeast · 22nd February 2012, 03:37 PM

Originally Posted by WhatRoughBeast

Actually, there is an amazing coincidence here. The energy required to boost all of Mars' matter to escape velocity is almost exactly equal to the energy required to stop it in its orbit (and let it fall into the sun). By "almost equal" I mean within 1 per cent.

Ack! Who let me make that claim, anyway? Why don't you people check on claims like this?

I just redid my calculations, and it seems that "mistakes were made".

Actually, to stop Mars in its orbit takes nearly 40 times as much energy as blowing it up.

Sorry, all.

Well, at least we don't have to worry about the numerologists.

Stereolab · 22nd February 2012, 03:58 PM

Over 100 responses, and no one has mentioned Alexander Abian?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexander_Abian

Complexity · 22nd February 2012, 05:08 PM

Originally Posted by Beerina

In The Forge of God, Greg Bear estimates a 100 million ton nugget of neutron star colliding with a similar nugget of anti-neutrons at the center of the Earth would impart sufficient energy to cause the Earth to blow apart AKA make its mass blow itself out of its common gravity well.

IIRC, curiously that is also about how much mass the sun converts to energy every second, by one account I have read. Seems a bit high to me.

I remember The Forge of God. The font used on the cover (possibly only that used on the spine) caused me to read it as "The Force of Goo".

Ladewig · 22nd February 2012, 11:05 PM

Originally Posted by h.g.Whiz

May I ask why? Something tells me your reason will be most interesting.

My answer would be that I always root for the underdog. Tom Cruise is a certified Level 8 Operating Theatan. He has control of time, space, matter, life, death, health and a host of other things that can be controlled by the mind of an OT VIII.
.

although apparently dignity is not on that list.

h.g.Whiz · 13th January 2013, 04:20 AM

Originally Posted by KingMerv00

The internet being what it is, you shouldn't be surprised that there is a website on the ways one could destroy Earth. Pretty sure it has energy estimates too. You just need to adjust for the fact Mars is about half as big and you are all set to go.

Thanks for the link.

21st February 2012, 03:53 PM	#85
Ziggurat Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 38,209	Originally Posted by WhatRoughBeast Actually, there is an amazing coincidence here. The energy required to boost all of Mars' matter to escape velocity is almost exactly equal to the energy required to stop it in its orbit (and let it fall into the sun). By "almost equal" I mean within 1 per cent. Who'd have thought? Huh. Now we have a real dilemma on our hands. Since they cost about the same, which would be more awesome? I lean towards the sun myself, but it's a tough call.
	__________________ "As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law

21st February 2012, 04:04 PM	#88
Ladewig I lost an avatar bet. Join Date: Dec 2001 Posts: 25,926	Originally Posted by Horatius That's more "Boiling Mars". I don't think so. The Sun gives off microwaves and I remember quite distinctly the results of my putting an egg in a microwave oven. It most assuredly "blowed up." It blowed up real good.
	Last edited by Ladewig; 21st February 2012 at 04:05 PM.

21st February 2012, 04:11 PM	#89
jhunter1163 beer-swilling semiliterate Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Connecticut, or King Arthur's Court. Hard to tell sometimes. Posts: 24,906	How much antimatter would it take to make a bomb that would vaporize Mars?
	__________________ A møøse ønce bit my sister

21st February 2012, 05:45 PM	#91
Olowkow Philosopher Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 8,230	Originally Posted by Ladewig Surprisingly, that is one thing I like about N. Gingrich. I don't support all his ideas, but I believe they should be discussed before they are dismissed. He sometimes thinks too far outside the box, but Congress is tragically myopic and the government would do better to explore unconventional options before deciding on a plan. I just never know when people here are joking, unless there is a smilie. Please put a smilie on that.
Olowkow Philosopher Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 8,230

21st February 2012, 07:02 PM	#92
CapelDodger Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Cardiff, South Wales Posts: 22,416	Originally Posted by WhatRoughBeast Mars delenda est. I just knew the Cato Institute had a hidden agenda.
	__________________ It's a poor sort of memory that only works backward - Lewis Carroll (1832-1898) God can make a cow out of a tree, but has He ever done so? Therefore show some reason why a thing is so, or cease to hold that it is so - William of Conches, c1150

21st February 2012, 12:56 PM	#81
Craig4 Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Next door to Florida Man, world's worst superhero. Posts: 14,339	Originally Posted by Andrew Wiggin You'll need to crash a spaceship equipped with a molecular disruption device into it. It helps to have a fleet of such ships, in case there are planetary defenses, in which case most of the fleet can do a zerg rush as a distraction while one ship makes a suicide bombing run. Great book, but I can tell you already think so.

21st February 2012, 01:00 PM	#82
Craig4 Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Next door to Florida Man, world's worst superhero. Posts: 14,339	Originally Posted by autumn1971 I thought the center of a Mars was creamy nougat. You know what would be like totally awesome? If the mantel was chocolate and the center was nougat. It would be like a big... big... MARS BAR!!!! OMG that would be so cool...

21st February 2012, 02:06 PM	#83
DeathDart Graduate Poster Join Date: Jun 2011 Posts: 1,251	What is it with you Earthlings? 358 Million years ago it was the Cephalopods, getting all cold eyed and gangsta. 65 Million years ago it was the Dinosaurs, gonna do the lizard stomp on us. Now its the primates. Lets see what do we have to work with in the "shut the monkeys up storage bin", which you call the asteroid belt.

21st February 2012, 03:46 PM	#84
WhatRoughBeast Graduate Poster Join Date: Apr 2011 Posts: 1,218	Originally Posted by Ziggurat I mean bring it to a dead stop. If you just slow it down, you'll put it in an elliptical orbit and it will still miss the sun. Technically, one could just slow it down enough that the apogee of the eliptical orbit was less than the radius of the sun (so Mars would still hit the sun, but at an angle), but that's so much slower than its current velocity that the difference between that slow and a dead stop aren't really important to us. Actually, there is an amazing coincidence here. The energy required to boost all of Mars' matter to escape velocity is almost exactly equal to the energy required to stop it in its orbit (and let it fall into the sun). By "almost equal" I mean within 1 per cent. Who'd have thought?

21st February 2012, 04:00 PM	#86
Ladewig I lost an avatar bet. Join Date: Dec 2001 Posts: 25,926	Originally Posted by Olowkow The Newtster beat you to it. Surprisingly, that is one thing I like about N. Gingrich. I don't support all his ideas, but I believe they should be discussed before they are dismissed. He sometimes thinks too far outside the box, but Congress is tragically myopic and the government would do better to explore unconventional options before deciding on a plan.

21st February 2012, 04:02 PM	#87
Ladewig I lost an avatar bet. Join Date: Dec 2001 Posts: 25,926	Originally Posted by WhatRoughBeast Actually, there is an amazing coincidence here. The energy required to boost all of Mars' matter to escape velocity is almost exactly equal to the energy required to stop it in its orbit (and let it fall into the sun). By "almost equal" I mean within 1 per cent. Who'd have thought? Shhhhhh. The numerologists might hear you.

21st February 2012, 04:58 PM	#90
DeathDart Graduate Poster Join Date: Jun 2011 Posts: 1,251	Originally Posted by jhunter1163 How much antimatter would it take to make a bomb that would vaporize Mars? The joules from the previous posts divided by the speed of light squared. Half that amount since an equal amount of normal matter will be converted.

21st February 2012, 07:09 PM	#93
CapelDodger Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Cardiff, South Wales Posts: 22,416	Originally Posted by phunk But I guess really the amount of energy is going to depend on how you blow it up. A bomb on the surface will require much more energy than one at the core. If that bomb was carefully positioned we could hit Jupiter with a lot of debris. If carelessly positioned it could make for some interesting nights down here. Looking far enough into the future this might be what passes for performance art.
	__________________ It's a poor sort of memory that only works backward - Lewis Carroll (1832-1898) God can make a cow out of a tree, but has He ever done so? Therefore show some reason why a thing is so, or cease to hold that it is so - William of Conches, c1150

21st February 2012, 07:13 PM	#94
CapelDodger Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Cardiff, South Wales Posts: 22,416	Originally Posted by Ziggurat Huh. Now we have a real dilemma on our hands. Since they cost about the same, which would be more awesome? I lean towards the sun myself, but it's a tough call. How close should we have it come by us? A neat trick would be for it to take our Moon with it - that would be awesome. It would make wrapping Mons Olympus in tinfoil look like child's play.
	__________________ It's a poor sort of memory that only works backward - Lewis Carroll (1832-1898) God can make a cow out of a tree, but has He ever done so? Therefore show some reason why a thing is so, or cease to hold that it is so - William of Conches, c1150

21st February 2012, 07:26 PM	#95
Ziggurat Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 38,209	Originally Posted by CapelDodger How close should we have it come by us? A neat trick would be for it to take our Moon with it - that would be awesome. It would make wrapping Mons Olympus in tinfoil look like child's play. That close and we might be looking at some serious tidal problems, but even more importantly possibly large permanent perturbations to our orbit.
	__________________ "As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law

21st February 2012, 07:28 PM	#96
CapelDodger Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Cardiff, South Wales Posts: 22,416	Originally Posted by Horatius I suspect most people who want to blow up Mars would be more than happy with just creating a bunch of rubble that forms a new asteroid belt. The main thing is not to vote for them.
	__________________ It's a poor sort of memory that only works backward - Lewis Carroll (1832-1898) God can make a cow out of a tree, but has He ever done so? Therefore show some reason why a thing is so, or cease to hold that it is so - William of Conches, c1150

21st February 2012, 07:33 PM	#97
CapelDodger Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Cardiff, South Wales Posts: 22,416	Originally Posted by Ziggurat That close and we might be looking at some serious tidal problems, but even more importantly possibly large permanent perturbations to our orbit. Yup. One heck of a performance. This does assume almost terminal boredom and effectively unlimited energy available.
	__________________ It's a poor sort of memory that only works backward - Lewis Carroll (1832-1898) God can make a cow out of a tree, but has He ever done so? Therefore show some reason why a thing is so, or cease to hold that it is so - William of Conches, c1150

21st February 2012, 07:39 PM	#98
WhatRoughBeast Graduate Poster Join Date: Apr 2011 Posts: 1,218	Originally Posted by CapelDodger I just knew the Cato Institute had a hidden agenda. Oh, I say. Well done.

21st February 2012, 07:52 PM	#99
h.g.Whiz Illuminator Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Egoville Posts: 3,582	Originally Posted by CapelDodger The main thing is not to vote for them.
	__________________ Reading this sentence is ineluctable.

21st February 2012, 08:02 PM	#100
lopeyschools Critical Thinker Join Date: Aug 2010 Posts: 397	I think we are all in agreement? If mars can be destroyed, it should be.

21st February 2012, 08:04 PM	#101
Foster Zygote Dental Floss Tycoon Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 16,917	Originally Posted by KingMerv00 The internet being what it is, you shouldn't be surprised that there is a website on the ways one could destroy Earth. Pretty sure it has energy estimates too. You just need to adjust for the fact Mars is about half as big and you are all set to go. Not the Earth! That's where I keep all my stuff!!!
	__________________ Counterbalance in the little town of Ridgeview, Ohio. Two people permanently enslaved by the tyranny of fear and superstitution, facing the future with a kind of helpless dread. Two others facing the future with confidence - having escaped one of the darker places of the Twilight Zone.

21st February 2012, 08:13 PM	#102
Complexity Philosopher Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 9,242	Originally Posted by lopeyschools I think we are all in agreement? If mars can be destroyed, it should be. Nonsense. (I live to prevent unanimity.)
Complexity Philosopher Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 9,242

21st February 2012, 08:36 PM	#103
grokinhaze New Blood Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 24	Tell the NeoCons there are terrorists with WMDs on Mars
grokinhaze New Blood Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 24

21st February 2012, 08:40 PM	#104
DeathDart Graduate Poster Join Date: Jun 2011 Posts: 1,251	If we need to protect Earth from asteroids we need to test what we have to see if it works. Have one of our nukes hit an asteroid on the 4th of July. Make sure it will be visible in the night sky from North America. Go get the squirrel boy! say with a southern accent.

21st February 2012, 09:10 PM	#105
WhatRoughBeast Graduate Poster Join Date: Apr 2011 Posts: 1,218	Originally Posted by lopeyschools I think we are all in agreement? If mars can be destroyed, it should be. Only if it can be done in a cool way. Like, for instance, if you drop it into the sun; it's only cool if it comes out the other side.

21st February 2012, 09:14 PM	#106
Ziggurat Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 38,209	Originally Posted by WhatRoughBeast Only if it can be done in a cool way. Like, for instance, if you drop it into the sun; it's only cool if it comes out the other side. It wouldn't come out the other side, but it would make one hell of a splash.
	__________________ "As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law

21st February 2012, 09:55 PM	#107
Ladewig I lost an avatar bet. Join Date: Dec 2001 Posts: 25,926	Originally Posted by CapelDodger If that bomb was carefully positioned we could hit Jupiter with a lot of debris. There would be a certain irony to that. Immanuel Velikovsky proved over 60 years ago that the planet Venus was ejected from the planet Jupiter. jk

21st February 2012, 10:08 PM	#108
tsig a carbon based life-form Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 39,049	Originally Posted by Complexity Nonsense. (I live to prevent unanimity.) One way or the other we're going to have to deal with the Martian problem so I say we fight them there so we don't have to fight them in our streets.

22nd February 2012, 12:49 AM	#109
DeathDart Graduate Poster Join Date: Jun 2011 Posts: 1,251	Originally Posted by tsig One way or the other we're going to have to deal with the Martian problem so I say we fight them there so we don't have to fight them in our streets. Too late.

22nd February 2012, 06:58 AM	#110
Complexity Philosopher Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 9,242	Originally Posted by tsig One way or the other we're going to have to deal with the Martian problem so I say we fight them there so we don't have to fight them in our streets. I haven't decided which side I'm on. If it comes down to Tom Cruise vs. The Tripods, I've got to side with The Tripods.
Complexity Philosopher Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 9,242

22nd February 2012, 08:00 AM	#111
h.g.Whiz Illuminator Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Egoville Posts: 3,582	Originally Posted by Complexity I haven't decided which side I'm on. If it comes down to Tom Cruise vs. The Tripods, I've got to side with The Tripods. May I ask why? Something tells me your reason will be most interesting.
	__________________ Reading this sentence is ineluctable.

22nd February 2012, 09:54 AM	#112
Complexity Philosopher Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 9,242	Originally Posted by h.g.Whiz May I ask why? Something tells me your reason will be most interesting. (geez! - the pressure is excruciating!) Non-serious answer: Cruise used to be cute, then he opened his mouth. Cuteness betrayed! Also, I really like the way that Orson Welles played with peoples' heads. People haven't gotten any smarter - that could sooooo happen again. Serious answer: It depends on what the martians would do with earth once they conquered/obliterated humans. I don't necessarily value human life over other life (more than cockroaches, less than cats; varies by individual) and I have a good sense of the ill effects on other life of human life (if it continues as it has, which I regard as very likely). Without any foreknowledge of the character and purposes of martians*, I might feel compelled to oppose the martians, but I would certainly take care of some particularly annoying humans in the process. Actually, I'm serious about both of these answers, too. Many people are worse than cockroaches, while a very few are better than some cats. * Particularly with regard towards their policy on cats.
Complexity Philosopher Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 9,242

22nd February 2012, 10:12 AM	#113
Beerina Sarcastic Conqueror of Notions Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 28,833	Originally Posted by KingMerv00 The internet being what it is, you shouldn't be surprised that there is a website on the ways one could destroy Earth. Pretty sure it has energy estimates too. You just need to adjust for the fact Mars is about half as big and you are all set to go. In The Forge of God, Greg Bear estimates a 100 million ton nugget of neutron star colliding with a similar nugget of anti-neutrons at the center of the Earth would impart sufficient energy to cause the Earth to blow apart AKA make its mass blow itself out of its common gravity well. IIRC, curiously that is also about how much mass the sun converts to energy every second, by one account I have read. Seems a bit high to me.
	__________________ "Great innovations should not be forced [by way of] slender majorities." - Thomas Jefferson The government should nationalize it! Socialized, single-payer video game development and sales *now!* More, cheaper, better games, right? Right? Last edited by Beerina; 22nd February 2012 at 10:13 AM.

22nd February 2012, 03:37 PM	#114
WhatRoughBeast Graduate Poster Join Date: Apr 2011 Posts: 1,218	Originally Posted by WhatRoughBeast Actually, there is an amazing coincidence here. The energy required to boost all of Mars' matter to escape velocity is almost exactly equal to the energy required to stop it in its orbit (and let it fall into the sun). By "almost equal" I mean within 1 per cent. Ack! Who let me make that claim, anyway? Why don't you people check on claims like this? I just redid my calculations, and it seems that "mistakes were made". Actually, to stop Mars in its orbit takes nearly 40 times as much energy as blowing it up. Sorry, all. Well, at least we don't have to worry about the numerologists.

22nd February 2012, 03:58 PM	#115
Stereolab Massager of French Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 3,372	Over 100 responses, and no one has mentioned Alexander Abian? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexander_Abian