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Tags Brent Bozell III , CNS News , John Birch Society , Media Research Center , Shaun Richman , socialism charges

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Old 14th April 2012, 10:27 PM   #1
njslim
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American federation Teachers hires Socialist 911 truther

The American Federation of Teachers, nations 2nd largest teachers union
hired an avowed 911 truther and radical Socialist Shaun Richman as an
organizer


http://www.independentsentinel.com/2...her-organizer/

Ever wonder why education is in such trouble .....
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Old 14th April 2012, 10:30 PM   #2
dc1971
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Originally Posted by njslim View Post
The American Federation of Teachers, nations 2nd largest teachers union
hired an avowed 911 truther and radical Socialist Shaun Richman as an
organizer


http://www.independentsentinel.com/2...her-organizer/

Ever wonder why education is in such trouble .....
Not because they're "Socialist", I'm sure!
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Old 14th April 2012, 10:53 PM   #3
Scott Sommers
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I read about this on the John Birch Society forum. They're very concerned about this, as well.
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I've seen it here and in several other places that there is no Illuminati. That doesn't even make sense. There's a Wikipedia entry that talks about it. I'm not saying that everything on Wikipedia is true, but if you read it, it's just really clear how the Illuminati controls the world.
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Old 14th April 2012, 11:29 PM   #4
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It does not appear to me that Richman is a Truther in any sense that we use the term on this forum.

In your original link to the right-wing Independent Sentinel, there is a link in the sentence
Quote:
CNS News reports that the Socialist Party are Truthers.
this leads to the CNS News article
Socialists Doubt Bin Laden Behind Attacks on US

CNS News is described in its Wiki as
Quote:
formerly called the Conservative News Service, is an American news website owned by the Media Research Center
The Media Research Center in turn is described in their Wiki as
Quote:
is a conservative content analysis organization based in Alexandria, Virginia, founded in 1987 by conservative activist L. Brent Bozell III. Its stated mission is to "prove — through sound scientific research — that liberal bias in the media does exist and undermines traditional American values" and to "neutralize [that bias's] impact on the American political scene"
L. Brent Bozell Jr. (that's the father of the current president) was widely believed to hold strong support for the conspiracy group, the John Birch Society...from his Wiki
Quote:
...making him absent from the Palm Beach decision of Buckley, Goldwater, Russell Kirk, and William Baroody Sr. to freeze out the John Birch Society from the conservative movement. Kirk inferred that Bozell would not have had any reason to be opposed to the decision but in fact he, along with Frank Meyer and William Rusher, protested the exclusion of the Society from the conservative movement.

To return to our so-called Truther, Shaun Richman, in the CNS link, it is "proved" that Richman is a "Truther" through this statement,
Quote:
"I refuse to believe that Osama bin Laden...is behind all of these things he's been accused of," said Shaun Richman, the co-vice national chairman of the Socialist Party USA.
The CNS article goes on to say,
Quote:
Richman pointed to a recent Washington Post article that indicated the Sept. 11 hijackers may have been an isolated cell," acting alone. "Most of the people who planned it (Sept. 11 attacks) died in the execution of it," he said.
I couldn't find anything even in the CNS News article that claimed he is a Truther that he is in fact a Truther - although he is clearly as much an apologist for Islamic terrorism as is Ron Paul.

Richman has a blog. http://www.shaunrichman.org/?p=80

I did not read the whole thing, but a blog search found this page for his posts that contain the term "9/11"
http://www.shaunrichman.org/?s=9%2F11
I couldn't find anything where he says anything Truther-like.

So I'm left wondering why njslim would be repeating rumours like this that appear to have no truth value in them at all. Are you part of a conspiracy to discredit socialism in the USA? Are you a member of the John Birch Society? Is this disinfo to make hard-core conservatives look bad by making it look like they don't do their research properly?
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I've seen it here and in several other places that there is no Illuminati. That doesn't even make sense. There's a Wikipedia entry that talks about it. I'm not saying that everything on Wikipedia is true, but if you read it, it's just really clear how the Illuminati controls the world.

Last edited by Scott Sommers; 14th April 2012 at 11:36 PM.
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Old 15th April 2012, 12:03 AM   #5
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As long as it's not a rabid anti-truther who can't tell his backside from his brain. I don't care what you believe in your personal life, just don't bring it into public life, right? Keep the stupid to yourself.

Which reminds me of the restaurant owner who we discovered was a rabid anti-truther. This was quite a surprise. Where do such people come from, besides the handful of frothing nutbars we see posting on the internet? Uncoincidentally, his restaurant is going down the crapper. That he's an idiot is already evidenced by his anti-trutherism, so I guess that explains why he can't keep a restaurant going in a popular nightlife district, with customers being spoon-fed to him. How could anyone fail so completely, both in business and as a person? I think we can guess.
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Old 15th April 2012, 12:17 AM   #6
Scott Sommers
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Quote:
ergo
This message is hidden because ergo is on your ignore list.
Whatever this post says, I urge you, don't let him or any other Truther sidetrack this post from the issue of Shaun Richman and the claim that he is a Truther.
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I've seen it here and in several other places that there is no Illuminati. That doesn't even make sense. There's a Wikipedia entry that talks about it. I'm not saying that everything on Wikipedia is true, but if you read it, it's just really clear how the Illuminati controls the world.
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Old 15th April 2012, 12:31 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by njslim View Post
Ever wonder why education is in such trouble .....
Because the government runs it? With stolen taxpayer money? And because a well-informed populace runs counter to the objectives of the ruling class who owns the government?

You really don't have to look any further than that.
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Old 15th April 2012, 05:45 AM   #8
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Okay, who wants to take bets on how long before JihadJane shows up?
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Old 15th April 2012, 05:53 AM   #9
njslim
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Bozell is nephew of William F Buckley

Solid mainstream conservative

Save the country - clone Ronald Reagan .....!
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Old 15th April 2012, 06:37 AM   #10
Scott Sommers
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Originally Posted by njslim View Post
Bozell is nephew of William F Buckley

Solid mainstream conservative

Save the country - clone Ronald Reagan .....!
Got a question for ya'. Did you actually look at the Independent Sentinel before you linked to it? Did you look through their link to CNS News to see what kind of news source it is? Or did you just link to it because you're one of those JREF friends who gets all sweaty and excited when they see the word socialism - 'cause ya' know it must be true if it's something bad, right? And those damn teacher's unions...God...don't ya' just hate them as well? If it says something bad about those worthless teacher's unions, it must be true. Right?

So after all this, I'm left wondering about your OP,
Quote:
Ever wonder why education is in such trouble .....
Which thing is supposed to be showing how bad education is? Is it that the IS would use words like Truther to label someone who is clearly not one? Is it because of the conspiracy theory pushed by crap news like CNS? Or is it the sloppy research of your OP used just to discredit politics you don't agree with?

On the other hand, if you're just mistaken and can understand how your OP is misleading and confused, then I have to say the veracity of my response is uncalled for.
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I've seen it here and in several other places that there is no Illuminati. That doesn't even make sense. There's a Wikipedia entry that talks about it. I'm not saying that everything on Wikipedia is true, but if you read it, it's just really clear how the Illuminati controls the world.

Last edited by Scott Sommers; 15th April 2012 at 07:28 AM.
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Old 15th April 2012, 12:12 PM   #11
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The source in the OP is whacked. They follow a paragraph where Mr. Richman talks about quitting the Socialist Party with a paragraph from CNS News that says the Socialists don't believe Bin Laden was behind the attacks. Therefore Richman is a truther. What?

I'm with Scott, most of the lefty truthers disappeared when Obama got elected.
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Old 15th April 2012, 03:39 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by ergo View Post
As long as it's not a rabid anti-truther who can't tell his backside from his brain. I don't care what you believe in your personal life, just don't bring it into public life, right? Keep the stupid to yourself.

Which reminds me of the restaurant owner who we discovered was a rabid anti-truther. This was quite a surprise. Where do such people come from, besides the handful of frothing nutbars we see posting on the internet? Uncoincidentally, his restaurant is going down the crapper. That he's an idiot is already evidenced by his anti-trutherism, so I guess that explains why he can't keep a restaurant going in a popular nightlife district, with customers being spoon-fed to him. How could anyone fail so completely, both in business and as a person? I think we can guess.
Is that restaurant owner your boss?
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Old 15th April 2012, 08:24 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by ergo View Post
As long as it's not a rabid anti-truther who can't tell his backside from his brain. I don't care what you believe in your personal life, just don't bring it into public life, right? Keep the stupid to yourself.

Which reminds me of the restaurant owner who we discovered was a rabid anti-truther. This was quite a surprise. Where do such people come from, besides the handful of frothing nutbars we see posting on the internet? Uncoincidentally, his restaurant is going down the crapper. That he's an idiot is already evidenced by his anti-trutherism, so I guess that explains why he can't keep a restaurant going in a popular nightlife district, with customers being spoon-fed to him. How could anyone fail so completely, both in business and as a person? I think we can guess.
Fail?

I know what situation you're talking about. It was big news on Prison Planet. However last time I looked the aforementioned restaurant is still in business.

Must be one of those still-in-business fails, eh?
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Old 15th April 2012, 08:47 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by ergo View Post
As long as it's not a rabid anti-truther who can't tell his backside from his brain. I don't care what you believe in your personal life, just don't bring it into public life, right? Keep the stupid to yourself.
There isn't evenany proof right now that the person in question is a twoofer. You might want to save your ammo.

The sicte cited is aparrently a right-wing nut bar outfit.

Where do such people come from, besides the handful of frothing nutbars we see posting on the internet?
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Old 15th April 2012, 10:08 PM   #15
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The CNS news article does contain this bit:

Quote:
"At best, there were a couple of fly-by-night meetings between representatives of al Qaeda and these terrorists," Richman contends. "There certainly is no smoking gun connected to Osama bin Laden, at least from what's been presented."
That's Trutherism in my view.

Richman does seem to be a first-class ass:

Quote:
On behalf of the Socialist Party, I want to welcome you to our Free Speech forum in defense of human rights attorney Lynne Stewart. This forum is cosponsored by the New York City and New Jersey locals of the Socialist Party, and the party’s Direct Action Tendency. We have a really great panel tonight, with a number of crusading legal activists.
Lynne Stewart is the sleazeball attorney who is currently serving ten years in prison for providing material support to terrorism. She passed messages from the blind Sheikh to his supporters in defiance of special administrative measures that she had agreed to in order to meet with Rahman in prison.

As for Richman, he does seem to have left the Socialist Party itself, but he claims not to have changed much:

Quote:
My political perspective hasn’t changed very much, but my perspective has become more nuanced.
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Old 15th April 2012, 11:54 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by Brainster View Post
The CNS news article does contain this bit:



That's Trutherism in my view.

Richman does seem to be a first-class ass:



Lynne Stewart is the sleazeball attorney who is currently serving ten years in prison for providing material support to terrorism. She passed messages from the blind Sheikh to his supporters in defiance of special administrative measures that she had agreed to in order to meet with Rahman in prison.

As for Richman, he does seem to have left the Socialist Party itself, but he claims not to have changed much:
Or it could be an error based on early and incomplete understanding of what happened on 9/11. There are several surveys around examining misconceptions of what happened on 9/11, such as how the killers made their way in to the USA through Canada - which they did not. Misconceptions remain/ed widespread long after the attacks. I suspect that for a long time, much of the large numbers obtained in national surveys of Truther beliefs were, in fact, misconceptions about what was truth and rumour, rather than Truther beliefs.

But then I do agree, these people seem like idiots. I don't agree with them on much of anything. I'm not a supporter of the American Socialist Party. Richman and his friends may even be no-planers, for all I know. But I doubt if there was real evidence available somewhere, the CNS and its affiliates wouldn't be printing it. I can only conclude that this is the best they have twisted to make it look as bad as they can.

The CNS looks like a branch of the kind of generic conspiracy pushed by the John Birch Society. The official position stated by its CEO Art Thompson is not a pro-Truther position.
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I AGREE

Although the retard doing the interview is Craig Fitzgerald, leader of We Are Change - New York. Beisdes, I know that many JBS members do believe in a 9/11 conspiracy, including John Perna, and even though they have no official position on chemtrails, some younger members have chemtrail pictures in their Facebook photo galleries.

But the public position of many conspiracy leaning conservative groups is that 9/11 conspiracy is one of the positions that separates the whackos from the true conservatives. So it's no surprise that a right-wing news blog links to a nut bar news group to 'prove' that a left-wing activists is a 9/11 Truther while their house is flooded with them. except their 'evidence' is so weak that the best they can do is nothing more than inuendo and rumour.
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I've seen it here and in several other places that there is no Illuminati. That doesn't even make sense. There's a Wikipedia entry that talks about it. I'm not saying that everything on Wikipedia is true, but if you read it, it's just really clear how the Illuminati controls the world.

Last edited by Scott Sommers; 15th April 2012 at 11:59 PM.
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Old 16th April 2012, 12:13 AM   #17
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When I hear it from a source that is not wrapped in tin foil, I might take it all seriously.

When some nutjob tells us that unionizing charter school teachers will destroy them, I have to conclude either that the group shrieking about it are dimwits, or that charter schools are a fraud.

If screwing teachers makes schools work better, I sure would like to know what sort of magic is involved.
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Old 16th April 2012, 04:26 AM   #18
Scott Sommers
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Originally Posted by leftysergeant View Post
When I hear it from a source that is not wrapped in tin foil, I might take it all seriously.

When some nutjob tells us that unionizing charter school teachers will destroy them, I have to conclude either that the group shrieking about it are dimwits, or that charter schools are a fraud.

If screwing teachers makes schools work better, I sure would like to know what sort of magic is involved.
Whether one supports the idea of unions or not shouldn't be at issue in determining if someone is a Truther moron or not. It should be obvious from one's words, and in this case, it is not. Brainster disagrees with me, but Richman hasn't said anything much different from Ron Paul. Or at least he's not quoted as doing so. And while out JREF friend Sword of Truth suspects Ron Paul is a secret Truther, it's pretty clear from Paul's own words that this is something we can only 'suspect'.

You can suspect all you want with Richman, as well. There is nothing he's said in the sources we are using that would make him a Truther. If njslim thinks he is a Truther, it's because of his opinions about socialists and teacher's union officials. I generally share his opinions about the interpretation of socialism found among Americans who call themselves socialist. But all this is irrelevant. njslim is acting like one of the Truther morons we chastise on thsi forum. He's labeling someone's position based on their affiliation to an unrelated organization on unrelated statements published in highly biased sources - whose politics I can only guess he agrees with. This sounds like something our JREF Truther friends would do and the sort of thing most of us here profess in public that we oppose.

Once again, I may be jumping to conclusions about this. njslim may have a clear understanding of the weak nature of his OP and just not had time to get around to addressing it. In such a case, I would certainly owe him or her an apology.
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I've seen it here and in several other places that there is no Illuminati. That doesn't even make sense. There's a Wikipedia entry that talks about it. I'm not saying that everything on Wikipedia is true, but if you read it, it's just really clear how the Illuminati controls the world.

Last edited by Scott Sommers; 16th April 2012 at 04:29 AM.
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Old 16th April 2012, 05:37 AM   #19
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Originally Posted by njslim View Post
The American Federation of Teachers, nations 2nd largest teachers union
hired an avowed 911 truther and radical Socialist Shaun Richman as an
organizer


http://www.independentsentinel.com/2...her-organizer/

Ever wonder why education is in such trouble .....
Given the the right wing definition of socialist is anyone to the left of Attila the Hun or themselves, pardon me if I'm less than terrified of them in a teachers union. Given the lousy pay of teachers, perhaps a little aggressive unionization is overdue (no I'm not a teacher, but I have taught and believe me its tougher than it looks as you can't kill any of the kids no matter how much you want to
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Old 16th April 2012, 05:44 AM   #20
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Originally Posted by Brainster View Post
The CNS news article does contain this bit:

Quote:
"At best, there were a couple of fly-by-night meetings between representatives of al Qaeda and these terrorists," Richman contends. "There certainly is no smoking gun connected to Osama bin Laden, at least from what's been presented."
That's Trutherism in my view.
Richman was first quoted as saying that in a CNS story dated October 11, 2001. It seems that for some reason, the story was reposted verbatim in 2008.

I think Richman was probably right at the time. Even if he wasn't, I would set the bar for "Trutherism" higher than that.
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Old 16th April 2012, 07:56 AM   #21
Scott Sommers
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Originally Posted by MarkLindeman View Post
It seems that for some reason, the story was reposted verbatim in 2008.
For some reason? Let me guess...it was their part of the struggle to make sure that heathen from Kenya didn't trick the American people into putting him the White House. And then it gets reprinted in 2012? What a coincidence. Glad to see our friends on the extreme Right are maintaining their integrity.

Quote:
Richman was first quoted as saying that in a CNS story dated October 11, 2001. ..I think Richman was probably right at the time. Even if he wasn't, I would set the bar for "Trutherism" higher than that.
But to return to your post...thank you Mark for the clarification. I'm not at all surprised by this. I may disagree with Richman that pacifism is the appropriate response to 9/11, but if he were one a' them thermite explodin', dustifyin', nuclear bombin', no-plane-kind-a'-Truther folk, there'd be more of this slathered all over the Net by our trusty friends at CNS.
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I've seen it here and in several other places that there is no Illuminati. That doesn't even make sense. There's a Wikipedia entry that talks about it. I'm not saying that everything on Wikipedia is true, but if you read it, it's just really clear how the Illuminati controls the world.
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Old 16th April 2012, 11:47 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by MarkLindeman View Post
Richman was first quoted as saying that in a CNS story dated October 11, 2001. It seems that for some reason, the story was reposted verbatim in 2008.

I think Richman was probably right at the time. Even if he wasn't, I would set the bar for "Trutherism" higher than that.
Okay, if it's a 2001 statement, it's certainly reasonably justified. If he were saying that in 2010 I'd say he was a Truther.
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Old 16th April 2012, 01:17 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by Brainster View Post
Okay, if it's a 2001 statement, it's certainly reasonably justified. If he were saying that in 2010 I'd say he was a Truther.
Pardon me while I split hairs, maybe.

If he said it in 2010, I would want to know more of the context. Someone intent on exculpating bin Laden of any responsibility for 9/11 may well be a truther or someone with similar habits of mind. But I bet some of the posts in the "caveman mastermind" thread that argue that bin Laden wasn't the mastermind behind 9/11 could be portrayed as truther posts if quoted very selectively. Also, I've encountered people who ask astonishingly naive questions, but not in a JAQing way -- they just don't know. So I hesitate to pigeonhole people based on isolated comments, although if the comment were "Well, obviously the Twin Towers were destroyed by explosives," I wouldn't quibble.
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Old 17th April 2012, 04:14 AM   #24
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I have posted a comment on the link from the OP explaining that Shaun Richman is not a Truther. Apparently I was not fast enough. The heroes of 9/11 Truth have beat me there.

Sara Noble, who operates the Independent Sentinel, has responded by posting by quoting this passage from the original 2001 article that MArk found. Apparently she does not realize the original quotes were from 2001. I hope she does after my response.
Quote:
Sara Noble on April 17, 2012 at 7:14 am
CNS has a 2008 article in which he (Richman) said -

Richman believes that there is a “bigger part” to the U.S. war on terrorism. He is convinced that the State Dept. and “the powers that be” want a war. “It’s a quick war,” he said. “It means a bigger military budget and everybody’s happy. There was never any doubt that there would be any response but a war.”

Richman considers the “war on terrorism” unjust – until some “damn good evidence” is s account produced against bin Laden.

Richman pointed to a recent Washington Post article that indicated the Sept. 11 hijackers may have been an isolated cell,” acting alone.

“Most of the people who planned it (Sept. 11 attacks) died in the execution of it,” he said.

“At best, there were a couple of fly-by-night meetings between representatives of al Qaeda and these terrorists,” Richman contends. “There certainly is no smoking gun connected to Osama bin Laden, at least from what’s been presented.”

Richman insists that the people of Afghanistan “have never been, and will never be, our enemy.” President Bush has also made it clear that the people of Afghanistan are not our enemies. But Richman said he’s not even sure he sees the Taliban and bin Laden as the enemy.

“I would like to see more facts,” he commented.

Even if credible evidence is presented against bin Laden, Richman said, “You really have to question whether this (military strike) is going to do much good and if this isn’t just really creating the terrorists of tomorrow.”

However, Richman concluded, “The people who did this, if there are people who did this that are still out there — they should be put on trial at The Hague.”

Also I personally am an Independent, not a right winger.
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I've seen it here and in several other places that there is no Illuminati. That doesn't even make sense. There's a Wikipedia entry that talks about it. I'm not saying that everything on Wikipedia is true, but if you read it, it's just really clear how the Illuminati controls the world.

Last edited by Scott Sommers; 17th April 2012 at 04:48 AM.
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Old 17th April 2012, 05:36 AM   #25
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Originally Posted by sheeplesnshills View Post
Given the the right wing definition of socialist is anyone to the left of Attila the Hun
Except this guy is, or was, an actual socialist. Not a social welfare advocate, but someone who actually thinks the government should own the means of production.
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Old 17th April 2012, 05:41 AM   #26
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Originally Posted by WildCat View Post
Except this guy is, or was, an actual socialist. Not a social welfare advocate, but someone who actually thinks the government should own the means of production.
I'm not even going to go there. She's just wrong. She uses misleading sources and doesn't appear willing to acknowledge this, even when it's pointed out to her. While I appreciate Sarah's willingness to respond to me, she has since posted more links referring to how "radical" Richman is. I know that. Who cares? She made the claim he's a 9/11 conspiracy theorist. She has no good reason to say this. I have provided her with credible information and a reasonable argument as to why this is the true. If she keeps pretending the point is that he's "radical" then she is being as bad of the 9/11 retards that post here or on their own forums.
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I've seen it here and in several other places that there is no Illuminati. That doesn't even make sense. There's a Wikipedia entry that talks about it. I'm not saying that everything on Wikipedia is true, but if you read it, it's just really clear how the Illuminati controls the world.
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Old 19th April 2012, 01:32 AM   #27
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Originally Posted by ergo View Post
As long as it's not a rabid anti-truther who can't tell his backside from his brain. I don't care what you believe in your personal life, just don't bring it into public life, right? Keep the stupid to yourself.

Which reminds me of the restaurant owner who we discovered was a rabid anti-truther. This was quite a surprise. Where do such people come from, besides the handful of frothing nutbars we see posting on the internet? Uncoincidentally, his restaurant is going down the crapper. That he's an idiot is already evidenced by his anti-trutherism, so I guess that explains why he can't keep a restaurant going in a popular nightlife district, with customers being spoon-fed to him. How could anyone fail so completely, both in business and as a person? I think we can guess.
Ahhhh I get what ergo's doing with his recent string of posts...projection, it's all projection.
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