How homeopathy does work? - 4 Years of DHMS course.

Actually the homeopaths at otherhealth have no answers of Mr. Hans interogation (like police officer). :D

By the way, it is a good forum (my first ever visit), from that forum, I got so many links. tnx ;)
 
in my humble opinion the following post is little different from the already explained explanation of this forum.

tnx for the link

If accidentally some one is exposed to this Arsenic poison. The following possible symptoms will be produced in the healthy person.

Headaches, convulsion, confusion, drowsiness, change in color of fingernails, vomiting, diarrhea, blood in urine, muscle cramps, fatigue, weakness, hair loss, dermatitis, Coma and death are possible. The most effected regions would be Lungs, skin, kidneys and liver.

How these symptoms were produced in healthy individual? (You claimed you know) These observations are not mine. These observations have been recorded by medical scientists.

The homeopathic potency Arsenic Album also acts in the same manner in the patient as it acts in healthy person. In a patient, when arsenic album in controlled material doses (12c, 18c and 30c) was given, an artificial disease / symptoms (above) were produced in the same pattern as it mostly produce in healthy person. At this stage, a complex picture will be developed.

Group of Symptoms (A): are those symptoms, which the patient reported at the time of consultation to homeopath and on the basis of this group “A”, arsenic album in low material doses was prescribed.

Group of Symptoms (: are those fake symptoms (similar to group of symptoms A), which were produced when arsenic album in potency form (low material dose) was given.

The sign of “aggravation” is actually the sign of production of fake symptoms group “B” in the patients along with the old symptoms group “A” which he reported at the time of consultation. When a homeopath observes the first sign of aggravation, he stops the administration of further potency (low dose).

This “aggravation” production of fake symptoms (which are not so harmful) become responsible of generating / sending a reflex to the body’s natural immune system (resistance power / vital force) to start working. This natural resistance power system overcome the group of symptoms “A” and subside them.

Here the question arises? How did arsenic album in potency form cover up the group of symptoms “A” ? It was not the arsenic album that covered up the symptoms rather it was the body’s own immune system that finished up the symptoms. Arsenic was just a stimulating agent.

What is Pharmacodynamics of this practice?

The answer is very simple. How the real arsenic symptoms were produced when it was exposed to healthy person accidentally? The modern medical science is silent. No body knows the exact physiological effects. It is just a true observation based on logical understanding and experimentation according to the available approved medical laws / principles.

Why do medical professionals prescribe Dimercaprol in arsenic album toxicity?

No body knows the exact Pharmacodynamics of this drug in arsenic poising. It is not yet known but again it is very widely used effective drug in removing the toxicity of arsenic in human body because the experimentations show that it is very successful in controlling the acute conditions of arsenic poising.

I hope this answers all your questions.
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M Sarwar said:
in my humble opinion the following post is little different from the already explained explanation of this forum.

tnx for the link
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Hello M Sarwar.
That explanation is pretty worthless and was posted, I believe, in the NCH forum.
 
If the above explanation is useless then put cool water from the "Homeopathic Water Cooler" which was gifted to few homeopaths in the last seminar held in Pakistan. :D

wcool5lu.jpg
 
Welcome back, Dr. Sheikh.

Now that you're back, can you answer my question: Do you accept that matter is composed of atoms? A simple yes or no will suffice.
 
Dr. A Sheikh said:
If the above explanation is useless then put cool water from the "Homeopathic Water Cooler" which was gifted to few homeopaths in the last seminar held in Pakistan. :D
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Welcome back sheikh. Are you going to answer any questions this time around or will you just weasel around and slink away in a few days?
 
Donks said:
Welcome back sheikh. Are you going to answer any questions this time around or will you just weasel around and slink away in a few days?
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Oh oh, I know the answer to this one can I answer please, please? :D
 
Mojo said:
Welcome back, Dr. Sheikh.

Now that you're back, can you answer my question: Do you accept that matter is composed of atoms? A simple yes or no will suffice.
Click to expand...

I am ready to answer all your remaining queries.

Mojo. yes!
 
Dr. A Sheikh said:
If the above explanation is useless then put cool water from the "Homeopathic Water Cooler" which was gifted to few homeopaths in the last seminar held in Pakistan. :D

wcool5lu.jpg
Click to expand...
The explanation basically says that a homeopathic preparation works in the same way as a crude substance, right?

Let's take one thing at a time. So please explain:

The crude substance works in a physiological, dose-dependent way. For arsenic, that means less substance, less effect. The concentration where arsenic ceases to have any effect is around 0.1% for the dose sizes used in homeopathy. So how do you claim that any effect exists in concentrations that are many orders of magnitude less (even if we forget Avogadro's limit for the time being)?

Hans
 
Dr. A Sheikh said:
I am ready to answer all your remaining queries.

Mojo. yes!
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Then please answer this simple question:

How many atoms of water are there in one litre of water, please?
 
Dr. A Sheikh said:
I am ready to answer all your remaining queries.

Mojo. yes!
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OK, matter is composed of atoms.

Do you agree that an atom has a finite mass? Again, a yes or no answer will be fine.
 
MRC_Hans said:
The explanation basically says that a homeopathic preparation works in the same way as a crude substance, right?

Let's take one thing at a time. So please explain:

The crude substance works in a physiological, dose-dependent way. For arsenic, that means less substance, less effect. The concentration where arsenic ceases to have any effect is around 0.1% for the dose sizes used in homeopathy. So how do you claim that any effect exists in concentrations that are many orders of magnitude less (even if we forget Avogadro's limit for the time being)?

Hans
Click to expand...

Before answering this question I would like to ask you a question (rather repeating an old question as mentioned by many members) because the answer of your question is hidden in my question.

Does a 12c / 18c (under avogadro's limitation) potency (arsenic) can bring some physiological change in the body?
 
Originally posted by Dr. A Sheikh: Does a 12c / 18c (under avogadro's limitation) potency (arsenic) can bring some physiological change in the body?
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Dr. A Sheikh, 12C and 18C are above Avogadro's number. Could you have meant 12X? That would be below Avogadro's number. So there would be some molecules or ions of arsenic in a 12X remedy.


Suppose you had a 12X remedy containing arsenic alba (arsenic trioxide) at 1 x 10<sup>-12</sup> grams per ml. If it completely dissolved, you would have about 0.75 x 10<sup>-12</sup> grams arsenic per ml. If you took a 1 ml dose of the arsenic remedy, you would get 0.75 x 10<sup>-12</sup> grams of arsenic.
Now suppose you drank a cup of water (about 250 ml).
In my neighborhood, the water supply contains 0.5 X 10<sup>-6</sup> g arsenic /L. (The maximum allowable limit is 50 X 10<sup>-6</sup> g arsenic /L.) The amount of arsenic in the cup of water (if it had the same arsenic level as my water) would be 125000 X 10<sup>-12</sup> g.

Compare the amount of arsenic from your remedy to the amount of arsenic in the cup of water you drank.
Arsenic in remedy = 0.75 x 10<sup>-12</sup> grams
Arsenic in water = 125000 X 10<sup>-12</sup> grams.
There is more than 100,000 times as much arsenic just in the drinking water than you would get from your remedy. (And the amount in the water is supposedly a safe level.)

Any effect of the arsenic in the remedy would be insignificant in comparison to any effect of the arsenic you would get every day in your drinking water.

edited to add: I do not know about effects of different arsenic compounds.
 
Dr. A Sheikh said:
YES
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Right. So you acknowledge that matter is composed of atoms and that an atom has a finite mass. This means that a given amount of a given substance will contain a finite number of atoms.

Do you accept that if you divide a finite number by a larger finite number you will get an answer that is less than 1?
 
Zep said:
Then please answer this simple question:

How many atoms of water are there in one litre of water, please?
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I don't know but I agree with the equation of number of atoms/molecules presented by Zep, badlyshaved moneky and donks etc.
 
Dr. A Sheikh said:
I don\'t know but I agree with the equation of number of atoms/molecules presented by Zep, badlyshaved moneky and donks etc.
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OK, so do you agree there are a finite number of molecules of water in any given amount of water?

(Mojo, we\'re getting there, but slowly!)
 
flume said:
Dr. A Sheikh, 12C and 18C are above Avogadro's number. Could you have meant 12X? That would be below Avogadro's number. So there would be some molecules or ions of arsenic in a 12X remedy.


Suppose you had a 12X remedy containing arsenic alba (arsenic trioxide) at 1 x 10<sup>-12</sup> grams per ml. If it completely dissolved, you would have about 0.75 x 10<sup>-12</sup> grams arsenic per ml. If you took a 1 ml dose of the arsenic remedy, you would get 0.75 x 10<sup>-12</sup> grams of arsenic.
Now suppose you drank a cup of water (about 250 ml).
In my neighborhood, the water supply contains 0.5 X 10<sup>-6</sup> g arsenic /L. (The maximum allowable limit is 50 X 10<sup>-6</sup> g arsenic /L.) The amount of arsenic in the cup of water (if it had the same arsenic level as my water) would be 125000 X 10<sup>-12</sup> g.

Compare the amount of arsenic from your remedy to the amount of arsenic in the cup of water you drank.
Arsenic in remedy = 0.75 x 10<sup>-12</sup> grams
Arsenic in water = 125000 X 10<sup>-12</sup> grams.
There is more than 100,000 times as much arsenic just in the drinking water than you would get from your remedy. (And the amount in the water is supposedly a safe level.)

Any effect of the arsenic in the remedy would be insignificant in comparison to any effect of the arsenic you would get every day in your drinking water.

edited to add: I do not know about effects of different arsenic compounds.
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You said, That would be below Avogadro's number. So there would be some molecules or ions of arsenic in a 12X remedy.

If you accept the prescence of ions of homeopathic medicine (about 3000 thousand potencies) under avogadros limit then atleast accept the physiological action of these potencies too because I only drink that brand of mineral water which has no arsenic.

c4a_worldmarket_drinking.jpg


Whenever, you will accept that homeopathic potencies have physiological action under the limit of avogadro number limit then I will address your question of above the limit of avogadros number.

Do you accept the homeopathic medicine may have physiological action under avogadros numbers limit? YES or No (A simple answer is required)
 
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