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Tags bigfoot , dna , Ed Smith , Melba Ketchum

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Old 13th February 2013, 09:54 AM   #3441
Tolls
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Originally Posted by OntarioSquatch View Post
... their legal counsel advised them not to publish a manuscript on such a controversial subject as it would destroy the editors’ reputations ...
Do legal types really advise against this sort of thing?
I find that really hard to believe that that sort of decision would fall anywhere other than with the editors, based on reviewer feedback.
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Old 13th February 2013, 09:57 AM   #3442
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that's a publicists job, not a lawyers

BS ALERT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Old 13th February 2013, 10:10 AM   #3443
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Originally Posted by Tolls View Post
Do legal types really advise against this sort of thing?
I find that really hard to believe that that sort of decision would fall anywhere other than with the editors, based on reviewer feedback.
It's either sour grapes or a complete fabrication, neither of which reflect well on Ms. Ketchum.
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Old 13th February 2013, 10:21 AM   #3444
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Has anyone bought the actual paper? I'm rather hoping that Calwaterbear is leafing through it right now.
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Old 13th February 2013, 10:24 AM   #3445
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I'm betting Ketchum's report truly belongs in The Journal of Irreproducible Results. But rather than verify that hypothesis, I've decided to spend my $30 on a long-term supply of milk and Oreos--because, unlike Bigfoot, cows and non-hydrogenated vegetable oil actually exist.
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Old 13th February 2013, 10:36 AM   #3446
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Originally Posted by jerrywayne View Post
Looks to be the equivalent:

Meldrum gets his magnum opus on sasquatch published not by
http://books.scientificamerican.com/sa-ebooks/landing/ , for instance, but by the folks here, http://www.tor.com/
It seems to me that a publisher of science fiction and fantasy is exactly the right place for Meldrum to publish.

It probably falls more in the realm of fantasy than that of science fiction.
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Old 13th February 2013, 10:38 AM   #3447
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Originally Posted by StankApe View Post
This has as much credibility as my releasing a press report claiming I am now a billionaire....

It's a complete farce! There's no science going on here!

Man I can't wait for calwaterbear to check this paper out and give us the lowdown!
I'm sure you are a millionaire, perhaps even a billionaire.




In Zimbabwe dollars.
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Old 13th February 2013, 10:51 AM   #3448
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Originally Posted by CORed View Post
I'm sure you are a millionaire, perhaps even a billionaire.




In Zimbabwe dollars.
at this very moment, in actual cash in my wallet. change bucket and savings account I have $9.58.........


$3,467 Zimbabwean dollars
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Old 13th February 2013, 11:09 AM   #3449
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Originally Posted by LTC8K6 View Post
I think that when we finally get to read this paper, we will all know why it was only published in a recently created online journal...

And why it's $30 to buy a copy...
do you get a t-shirt with that? with a picture of a medicine dropper and some test tubes?

if you get put on the list of authors on a paper like this (think Carnival Triumph) is it good or bad that they spell your name wrong? 2nd author "Dr." Pat "Wojtkiecicz" is Pat Wojtkiewicz, and may not be a doctor; he does use that title at times, but the only documentation I find is when asked under oath, he testified that he had a master's degree in science from Northwestern State [Louisiana]. I suppose he may have gotten a Ph.D. later.
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Old 13th February 2013, 11:17 AM   #3450
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Originally Posted by StankApe View Post
at this very moment, in actual cash in my wallet. change bucket and savings account I have $9.58......... $3,467 Zimbabwean dollars
Sorry to disappoint you, but Zimbabwe has adopted the US dollar, and so the Zim dollar isn't legal tender there any more.
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Old 13th February 2013, 11:18 AM   #3451
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well that's unfortunate ! I was enjoying my "thousandaire" status!
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Old 13th February 2013, 11:20 AM   #3452
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A comment from Ben Radford:
"I've read it, it's really, really funny."
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Old 13th February 2013, 11:31 AM   #3453
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hold on everybody, lets look at this sytematically

geeze, i knew this would happen, melbas spys informed her that I had a very busy day today, so it was time to release the hounds! Guys I have to administer 200 essay exams today, then guess what, I have to read them!

OK so I think we can and should go about this in a very systematic way, and many of you would be willing to pitch in a little of your time.

I suggest we start with the list of authors.
First thing we need to know is are all of the authors actually on board with this?

each should be contacted - IN A VERY POLITE WAY, either by email or phone. They should be asked 3 questions - VERY RESPECTFULLY,

1. are they aware they are listed as a co-author on this paper?

2. If so, can they tell you how they were involved? writing? analyzing the genome? preparing samples for sequencing? Doing the actual sequensing?

3. Do they realize the paper is claiming the existance of bigfoot, as a hibred human entity.

Thats it, no confrontation, no real followup (unless they want to talk, then you ought to listen closely).

I see that as step one of a very reasoned approach to examining this paper and it's extraordinary claims.

Going over and analyzing the data may take time, but first, lets examine the participation of the authors.
If anyone wants to tackle part of that, i guess just let me know, so we can divide up the work. We really do not need 15 people calling each and every one of them!
CWB

Last edited by calwaterbear; 13th February 2013 at 11:35 AM.
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Old 13th February 2013, 11:40 AM   #3454
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what, do you think people would want to get off the Carnival Melba? I mean, look what they're getting for their money.
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Old 13th February 2013, 11:47 AM   #3455
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Allegedly Melba pulled the video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?featur...&v=khHSX3ZYaKI

It no longer works.
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Old 13th February 2013, 11:49 AM   #3456
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another thing to check out

this on line journal, and it is labled as a scientific journal" so it must be.
anyway it has some spectacular photos on the cover

http://www.denovojournal.com/#!journals/c10d6

anyone here have to ability and inclination to track down those images on the web, I suspect they will be stock photos fro sale by professional photographers, and the photographer would certainly be thrilled to hear from you complementing hi or her magnificent work displayed on the cover!
Unless of course the jornal neglected to pay for the images!
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Old 13th February 2013, 12:03 PM   #3457
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When you click on the image info it says that they don't provide information for ownership of the image. But if you click on the HTMl for the image it says Wix , which lets you create your own free do it yourself web site. Probably a stock image from there.

It does say this in the Wix user agreement though:

dditional Prohibited Uses​
In addition to all the above prohibitions, you agree that you will NOT knowingly use the Service, among other things, to:
(a) harm minors in any way;
(b) impersonate any person or entity, or falsely state or otherwise misrepresent your affiliation with a person or an entity;
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Old 13th February 2013, 12:07 PM   #3458
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The Kingfisher photo is from http://www.freedigitalphotos.net/ima...er_p72957.html

The Panda http://www.freedigitalphotos.net/ima...da_p43576.html

Note: They are not free, you have to attribute them. And pay for certain usage.
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Old 13th February 2013, 12:41 PM   #3459
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I like the very bottom of their web pages.

"© 2013 - all rights preserved."

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Old 13th February 2013, 12:54 PM   #3460
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Author check update

just to keep things organized, we have talked with Prychitco, and Wojtkiecicz.

Prychitco did some sequencing, is aware of the paper, but did no analysis or writing of the paper. He has a private lab, but they only do the old school sequensing - the sanger technologies.

Wojtkiecicz is aware of the paper, had not seen any recent versions, and had resized and reformatted some images for melba, who he has known for a long time. he also apparently worked on 4 or 5 samples, but could not get DNA from them, apparently he was using a kit that was specific to human. he has not seen anything since Melba went next gen .

We are currently efforting Bollinger, Watts, and Toler.

Still a few names to be checked on!

Thats where we stand right now!
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Old 13th February 2013, 12:55 PM   #3461
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I saw that, though I wonder who's rights are 'preserved', DeNovo or DeVono scientific publishing?

(not allowed to post pictures yet, sorry)
tinypic.com/r/2817ts8/6
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Old 13th February 2013, 01:07 PM   #3462
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Originally Posted by Gamolon View Post
I like the very bottom of their web pages.

"© 2013 - all rights preserved."

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Old 13th February 2013, 01:35 PM   #3463
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According to the whois records, the denovojournal.com domain was registered on February 4, 2013. Denovoscientificpublishing.com was registered February 11, 2013 and doesn't even have a website, just a Wix placeholder page. Both are private registrations so there's no contact information. Looks like this was a very recent idea. There are leftovers in my fridge that have been around longer than Denovo Journal.
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Old 13th February 2013, 01:39 PM   #3464
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Good morning Robin! Hows the Publishing business!

Ladies and gentlemen we have a celebrity Big time publisher of a true"scientific jornal" among us. Welcome Robin Lynn Pheifer, or whatever name you are using now.

Robin, now using the name :
Robin Haynes, was identified as Editor on the front cover of our brand newly created "Scientific Journal" De Novo. Congratulations on the birth of a new website, I believe the birthday was Feb 4th, of this year - correct?

So within 15 minutes of me mentioning it here at JREF, her name was removed from the front cover, and no names in contact us etc, it all seems to be gone! Thats a real shame Robin, you ought to be getting credit for all your hard work!

Lucky for you, when you google De Novo, one of the links is for contact us, and for whatever reason, your name appears there on the google link, even thought it has been scrubbed from the De Novo website.

for those of you coming late to this game, a very brief recap of who Robin Haynes, AKA pheifer, AKA Lynn etc etc is!
She is the woman in michigan with 10 bigfoots inhabitting her 10 acre michigan property. She routinely feeds then Blueberry Bagels, and went over to russia for burtsevs dog and pony show, which ended in her publically blasting Meldrum apparently because he was not willing to be hoaxed!

anyway, thanks for reading us Robin, you are always welcome here, just wish you wouldn't try to sneak around, thats totally beneath someone with the stature of a big time scientific journal editor, you ought to participate her to educate us!
CWB
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Old 13th February 2013, 01:42 PM   #3465
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calwaterbear is the "House" of Bigfoot skeptics
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Old 13th February 2013, 01:50 PM   #3466
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Originally Posted by parnassus View Post
do you get a t-shirt with that? with a picture of a medicine dropper and some test tubes?

if you get put on the list of authors on a paper like this (think Carnival Triumph) is it good or bad that they spell your name wrong? 2nd author "Dr." Pat "Wojtkiecicz" is Pat Wojtkiewicz, and may not be a doctor; he does use that title at times, but the only documentation I find is when asked under oath, he testified that he had a master's degree in science from Northwestern State [Louisiana]. I suppose he may have gotten a Ph.D. later.
Looking under "Patrick," I did find evidence that he is a Ph.D at this point.
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Old 13th February 2013, 01:59 PM   #3467
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CALWATERBEAR, if you can get a screen shot of that google search turning up Robin, then up load it to imageshack, it would be preserved for all to see. I can't get it to come up
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Old 13th February 2013, 01:59 PM   #3468
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I have so been trolling bigfoot evidence blog! the denial over there is actually BIGGER than the river in egypt!
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Old 13th February 2013, 02:09 PM   #3469
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Originally Posted by StankApe View Post
I have so been trolling bigfoot evidence blog! the denial over there is actually BIGGER than the river in egypt!
How so? I HATE that site.

Robin did provide many pro-Bigfoot writers with the press pass. Funny that.
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Old 13th February 2013, 02:17 PM   #3470
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Originally Posted by idoubtit View Post
How so? I HATE that site.

Robin did provide many pro-Bigfoot writers with the press pass. Funny that.
They are claiming that she was forced to do this because mean old science denied her out of hand without even reading her paper.

It's one big excuse machine over there right now. Nobody wants to admit that this was a big con from the start so the various stages of grief are in play...
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Old 13th February 2013, 02:23 PM   #3471
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Which is why I hate that site. Bunch of boneheads.

Did you notice how much of the paranormal bigfootery is all about having "FANS" and no critics? If you've ever been to a UFO Bigfoot Ghost conventions, it's disgusting fawning over celebrities. Skeptics make poor "fans".
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Old 13th February 2013, 02:29 PM   #3472
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Originally Posted by Drewbot View Post
CALWATERBEAR, if you can get a screen shot of that google search turning up Robin, then up load it to imageshack, it would be preserved for all to see. I can't get it to come up
Yeah, i am getting smarter, before I went public i screen shotted it, as well as just cut and pasted the text. I have no idea how to use image shack, you want me to email you the image?
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Old 13th February 2013, 02:43 PM   #3473
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Originally Posted by Drewbot View Post
CALWATERBEAR, if you can get a screen shot of that google search turning up Robin, then up load it to imageshack, it would be preserved for all to see. I can't get it to come up
Yeah, i am getting smarter, before I went public i screen shotted it, as well as just cut and pasted the text. I have no idea how to use image shack, you want me to email you the image?
NOT SMART ENOUGH HOWEVER TO KEEP FROM DOUBLE POSTING! MAN i AM A GENIUS!

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Old 13th February 2013, 02:57 PM   #3474
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Originally Posted by StankApe View Post
I have so been trolling bigfoot evidence blog! the denial over there is actually BIGGER than the river in egypt!
I take it they want to serve up some crow.
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Old 13th February 2013, 03:02 PM   #3475
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Originally Posted by OntarioSquatch View Post
Some interesting info:

"We encountered the worst scientific bias in the peer review process in recent history. I am calling it the “Galileo Effect”.
Ah yes, the "Galileo Effect". Well known in the physics community. When someone comes up with a load of utter codswallop that violates everything we know about physics, and tries to insist that their pet theory is reality, and electrons really are just torus-shaped photons, or that gravity is really an illusion caused by electromagnetic attraction, they invariably compare themselves to Galileo when no reputable journal will touch their nonsense with a ten-foot pole.

Whatserface (sorry, I can't be bothered to remember the name of every nutjob on the Internet), the vet who wants to pretend she's a genetics expert, is well on the way to hitting every standard mark of crankhood known to science.
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Old 13th February 2013, 03:02 PM   #3476
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Originally Posted by idoubtit View Post
Did you notice how much of the paranormal bigfootery is all about having "FANS" and no critics? If you've ever been to a UFO Bigfoot Ghost conventions, it's disgusting fawning over celebrities. Skeptics make poor "fans".
I witnessed an otherwise logical, level-headed (other than her paranormal beliefs) woman go absolutely gaga over Zak Bagans during a podcast. It was quite unsettling.
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Old 13th February 2013, 03:30 PM   #3477
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I am not surprised or disappointed in the Melba situation. Several years ago I had blogged on her credibility based on a simple public search She had none then, why would she have any now, once a con and all that jazz.

I did get a kick out of the video which I downloaded. He said 6 BPM. About right for a Black Bear which is 5-6 BPM, not that you can truly identify the blob in the bush. Here is a pic of a Cinnamon Black Bear that resembles the fluff in the brush.

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Old 13th February 2013, 03:32 PM   #3478
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DeNovo or Gonzo?

"Galileo Effect" or Velikovsky Complex?
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Old 13th February 2013, 03:40 PM   #3479
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That website is pretty funny. It's been even funnier for me today than most because I've always had a personal translation of my own for the phrase "de novo". I know it means "anew", but a popular connotation of its use, especially as I've read in evolutionary biology, is more like "from nothing". Seems appropriate.

The BFF is running too slowly for me to bother waiting to see responses to the Ketchum thread there. Anyone more patient than I have anything to report?
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Old 13th February 2013, 04:04 PM   #3480
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This is absolutely hysterical. I for one can not wait for real scientists to shred her work. The only way this works out is if this was some long planned publicity stunt for a docu-drama movie like Blair Witch or The Fourth Kind. Otherwise, this is like watching a train wreck in extreme slow motion. The good news is that crows are currently safe from being ingested in large quantities.
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