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Tags alex jones , lawsuits , Sandy Hook , shooting conspiracies

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Old 31st March 2019, 10:40 AM   #401
William Parcher
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This guy is a loon.

But putting that aside, if he really truly is psychotic then he shouldn't be self-evaluating and instead should have a doctor do all the talking concerning his mental health. If he is psychotic then he can't really be expected to say rational and reasonable things about his own condition because... well, because he is psychotic.

Sometimes psychotic people figure out how to make a bunch of fame and money based on their own psychosis.
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Old 31st March 2019, 11:30 AM   #402
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My understanding is that to prove defamation in the US courts one must show that the statements were published, false, injurious, and unprivileged. Public figures that are targets of defamation also have to show actual malice: that "the person who made the statement knew it wasn't true, or didn't care whether it was true or not and was reckless with the truth. IMHO pretty much a slam-dunk on all criteria for the parents.

But I believe that Alex Jones is now trying to convince the court that he believed at the time his statements were true because he was some form of crazy. But his testimony is so self-serving that if anything it convinces me that he is a coldly calculating individual whose self-serving actions extend way back and continue to this day.

Throw the book at him!
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Old 31st March 2019, 12:05 PM   #403
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Originally Posted by William Parcher View Post
Sometimes psychotic people figure out how to make a bunch of fame and money based on their own psychosis.

We had one of those a couple of years ago, Graham Bishop, a British psychic, who became famous and made a lot of money, aided and abetted by a ruthless TV network, until he tried to kill his daughters (CPH Post, Nov. 20, 2013) in a fit of jealous rage.
Alex Jones appears to be much more calculating than that.
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Old 31st March 2019, 12:11 PM   #404
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Originally Posted by William Parcher View Post
This guy is a loon.

But putting that aside, if he really truly is psychotic then he shouldn't be self-evaluating and instead should have a doctor do all the talking concerning his mental health. If he is psychotic then he can't really be expected to say rational and reasonable things about his own condition because... well, because he is psychotic.

Sometimes psychotic people figure out how to make a bunch of fame and money based on their own psychosis.
A perfect example of a "Catch 22" situation?
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Old 31st March 2019, 01:46 PM   #405
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Psychosis does cover delusions, so this could easily be more accurate than not.
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Old 31st March 2019, 01:57 PM   #406
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The show must go on, and Alex is not going to lose this one easy.


Win or lose AJ gets lots of publicity and that is exactly what his type needs to keep making money.
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Old 31st March 2019, 02:01 PM   #407
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Originally Posted by Checkmite View Post
Psychosis does cover delusions, so this could easily be more accurate than not.
Psychosis can involve big cognitive errors. A psychotic can say that they previously were psychotic - when in fact they still are. That "error" would be a symptom of psychosis. The psychosis can cause them to not understand or to make excuses or assertions or explanations of any sort.
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Old 31st March 2019, 02:28 PM   #408
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The nice part is, even when trying to concoct an excuse for his behavior, he just can't help being Alex Jones. He blames making up conspiracy theories on his "psychosis", but then:

Quote:
He said it was the "trauma of the media and the corporations lying so much" that caused him to distrust everything, "kind of like a child whose parents lie to them over and over again."

...he blames his psychosis on a conspiracy theory.

It's elephants all the way down, folks!
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Old 31st March 2019, 05:13 PM   #409
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Originally Posted by dann View Post
Yes, the poor guy is a victim of fake news:
Hm. His lawyers are letting him go to court with the affirmative defense that the Deep State pushed him into a psychosis. But he got better.

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Old 31st March 2019, 06:30 PM   #410
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I've watched some of the first video. I heard Jones' lawyer say that he objected to form quite a bit. Does that affect the deposition's power of evidence? What does objecting to form entail, and how is it different from a typical objection?
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Old 31st March 2019, 07:06 PM   #411
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Originally Posted by heymatto70 View Post
I've watched some of the first video. I heard Jones' lawyer say that he objected to form quite a bit. Does that affect the deposition's power of evidence? What does objecting to form entail, and how is it different from a typical objection?

https://www.litigationandtrial.com/2...g-to-the-form/

I was curious about that, too, so I googled it, and found this.

I listened to the first half this evening while I was doing something else. I thought Jones wasn't doing too badly at first, but he went downhill pretty rapidly. I'd say Jones is going to get his head handed to him if this goes to trial.

Also, in my non-expert opinion, Jones's lawyer is an idiot. I suppose I shouldn't be surprised, as I strongly suspect no reputable lawyer would take the case.
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Old 31st March 2019, 07:24 PM   #412
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Jones is in it for the money. He will say any old **** as long as someone pays him. He needs to be bankrupted now and kept in poverty permanently.

And as for harassment, I hope he gets a long sentence at hard labour. I know a number of sub-Antarctic islands with air force runways on them that need to be swept clean of penguin-**** with a toothbrush.
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Old 31st March 2019, 08:01 PM   #413
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Originally Posted by JayUtah View Post
Hm. His lawyers are letting him go to court with the affirmative defense that the Deep State pushed him into a psychosis. But he got better.


Unruly mob: "She's a witch, she's a witch"
Guard: "What makes you think she is a witch?"
Peasant: "Well, she turned me into a newt!"
Guard: "A newt!?"
Peasant: *** pauses & looks around *** "I got better."
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Old 31st March 2019, 08:18 PM   #414
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Originally Posted by Norman Alexander View Post
J
And as for harassment, I hope he gets a long sentence at hard labour. I know a number of sub-Antarctic islands with air force runways on them that need to be swept clean of penguin-**** with a toothbrush.
The spice mines of Kessel or the dilithium mines of rura penthe would both be too good for him. Straight to hell would be nice.
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Old 31st March 2019, 09:13 PM   #415
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Originally Posted by Norman Alexander View Post
Jones is in it for the money. He will say any old **** as long as someone pays him. He needs to be bankrupted now and kept in poverty permanently.

And as for harassment, I hope he gets a long sentence at hard labour. I know a number of sub-Antarctic islands with air force runways on them that need to be swept clean of penguin-**** with a toothbrush.
If Jones isn't left destitute and, eventually, in a prison cell after all of this, we really don't have a justice system worth the name.
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Old 31st March 2019, 11:24 PM   #416
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Here's a punishment for someone else who is found guilty: Having to share a cell with Jones. Imagine the torture of never having the miserable ****** shutting up but ranting like he does, day and night.
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Old 31st March 2019, 11:28 PM   #417
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Originally Posted by heymatto70 View Post
I've watched some of the first video. I heard Jones' lawyer say that he objected to form quite a bit. Does that affect the deposition's power of evidence? What does objecting to form entail, and how is it different from a typical objection?
An objection as to form means an objection to the form of the question. That would include questions that are vague or misleading or that require speculation or make false assumptions.

For a deposition, objections to form must be raised during the deposition so that the other side has an opportunity to rephrase the question.

An example from the article is when Bankston asks, "If a person were to stake out those addresses, they could wait for Mr. Pozner to come pick up his mail, couldnít they?"

Barnes objects as to form. The basis for the objection would be that the question asks for speculation. Anybody could speculate as to what other people could do such as wait for someone to pick up mail. That is speculation. It is not information that the witness could actually know.
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Old 1st April 2019, 01:20 AM   #418
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Originally Posted by DevilsAdvocate View Post
That would include questions that are vague or misleading or that require speculation or make false assumptions.
Considering that sums up Jones in a nutshell, I can't see the problem myself....
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Old 1st April 2019, 02:23 AM   #419
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He won't be left penniless. You can be sure some of his assets have been transferred to tax haven accounts around the world and aren't recorded anywhere that can be found.
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Old 1st April 2019, 04:10 AM   #420
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Originally Posted by DevilsAdvocate View Post
An objection as to form means an objection to the form of the question. That would include questions that are vague or misleading or that require speculation or make false assumptions.

For a deposition, objections to form must be raised during the deposition so that the other side has an opportunity to rephrase the question.

An example from the article is when Bankston asks, "If a person were to stake out those addresses, they could wait for Mr. Pozner to come pick up his mail, couldnít they?"

Barnes objects as to form. The basis for the objection would be that the question asks for speculation. Anybody could speculate as to what other people could do such as wait for someone to pick up mail. That is speculation. It is not information that the witness could actually know.
AIUI, there another a very important aspect to this.

If, during the deposition, Jones' Lawyer does not object to certain types of questions as to form, then in so doing, he has automatically waived any right to object to those same questions during the trial. For example, if he fails to object to form when a question requires the defendant to speculate, then at trial "Objection; Calls for Speculation" will be overruled. The only questions this does not apply to are those relating to matters of law; things such as hearsay or competency of the witness.
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Old 1st April 2019, 05:43 AM   #421
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Oh I see Alex Jones has one of those "I have a condition where the only symptom is 'I'm not responsible for any actions I perform that make me look bad'" things that are going around.
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Old 1st April 2019, 05:52 AM   #422
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Originally Posted by Norman Alexander View Post
Here's a punishment for someone else who is found guilty: Having to share a cell with Jones. Imagine the torture of never having the miserable ****** shutting up but ranting like he does, day and night.


But on the upside, you'd have the opportunity to beat the **** out of AJ every goddamned day.
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Old 1st April 2019, 05:56 AM   #423
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Originally Posted by Horatius View Post
The nice part is, even when trying to concoct an excuse for his behavior, he just can't help being Alex Jones. He blames making up conspiracy theories on his "psychosis", but then:




...he blames his psychosis on a conspiracy theory.

It's elephants all the way down, folks!
Just because he suffers from paranoia doesn't mean THEY aren't after him all the time!
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Old 1st April 2019, 06:03 AM   #424
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Originally Posted by smartcooky View Post
...or competency of the witness.
We have many lawyers in the forum, and they can correct me. But I believe that when competency involves the qualifications of a witness who is being incorrectly treated as an expert, then an objection claiming a lack of foundation constitutes an object as to form. That is, a question asking the witness to apply expertise he does not have would be a question of improper form and therefore objectionable at deposition.
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Old 1st April 2019, 06:25 AM   #425
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Great editorial from The New York Times yesterday. Money quote:
Itís unsurprising that the opposing legal team chose to release the deposition footage online, where it received tens of thousands of views in just 24 hours. In the sea of viral clips of Alex Jones, he always appears larger than life ó and, crucially, in tenuous control of whatever narrative heís spinning. That control is largely the source of his power over his audience, his employees and his critics.

But this new set of viral clips busts the myth of Alex Jones, presenting him in a situation he can neither engineer nor spin. Heís a man who has lost control of the narrative. And itís this performance ó more than any ruling from any judge ó that poses the greatest threat to the Infowars empire.
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Old 1st April 2019, 06:41 AM   #426
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Originally Posted by DevilsAdvocate View Post
An objection as to form means an objection to the form of the question. That would include questions that are vague or misleading or that require speculation or make false assumptions.

For a deposition, objections to form must be raised during the deposition so that the other side has an opportunity to rephrase the question.

An example from the article is when Bankston asks, "If a person were to stake out those addresses, they could wait for Mr. Pozner to come pick up his mail, couldnít they?"

Barnes objects as to form. The basis for the objection would be that the question asks for speculation. Anybody could speculate as to what other people could do such as wait for someone to pick up mail. That is speculation. It is not information that the witness could actually know.
The form of questions can be changes to ask the virtual exact questions. I know being in several depositions where lawyers play with words and meanings.
Secondly if the questions pertain to an act/leading to an act and that is what the deposition is regarding an objection would be meaningless, as it attempts to discover if there was intent to commit an offense. Just my two cents from being in several depositions.
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Old 1st April 2019, 07:50 AM   #427
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Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
Oh I see Alex Jones has one of those "I have a condition where the only symptom is 'I'm not responsible for any actions I perform that make me look bad'" things that are going around.
poor guy
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Old 1st April 2019, 08:37 AM   #428
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Originally Posted by Trebuchet View Post
Look they need to discredit crisis actors. As mass shootings are a myth all those involved with all of them are crisis actors. Fortunately for the NRA they are killing themselves off.
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Old 1st April 2019, 07:34 PM   #429
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Originally Posted by Captain_Swoop View Post
He won't be left penniless. You can be sure some of his assets have been transferred to tax haven accounts around the world and aren't recorded anywhere that can be found.
Pay shark-like forensic accountants lucrative commissions to find his assets. They will.
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Old 1st April 2019, 07:36 PM   #430
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Originally Posted by SpitfireIX View Post
Great editorial from The New York Times yesterday. Money quote:
Itís unsurprising that the opposing legal team chose to release the deposition footage online, where it received tens of thousands of views in just 24 hours. In the sea of viral clips of Alex Jones, he always appears larger than life ó and, crucially, in tenuous control of whatever narrative heís spinning. That control is largely the source of his power over his audience, his employees and his critics.

But this new set of viral clips busts the myth of Alex Jones, presenting him in a situation he can neither engineer nor spin. Heís a man who has lost control of the narrative. And itís this performance ó more than any ruling from any judge ó that poses the greatest threat to the Infowars empire.
I wish. His fans will never jump ship.
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Old 1st April 2019, 08:20 PM   #431
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Originally Posted by trustbutverify View Post
I wish. His fans will never jump ship.
So they are not even smart enough to be rats. Good to know.
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Old 1st April 2019, 10:02 PM   #432
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Originally Posted by Norman Alexander View Post
Here's a punishment for someone else who is found guilty: Having to share a cell with Jones. Imagine the torture of never having the miserable ****** shutting up but ranting like he does, day and night.
Can he please share a small, cold cell with Trump?
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Old 1st April 2019, 10:29 PM   #433
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Originally Posted by JayUtah View Post
We have many lawyers in the forum, and they can correct me. But I believe that when competency involves the qualifications of a witness who is being incorrectly treated as an expert, then an objection claiming a lack of foundation constitutes an object as to form. That is, a question asking the witness to apply expertise he does not have would be a question of improper form and therefore objectionable at deposition.
Do you write bar exam questions? Thatís a bit of a tricky one. Iíll give it a shot.

First, objections as to form are not the only type of objections allowed at a deposition. Basically, all of the standard objections can be raised. The significant thing about an objection as to form is that it must be raised during the deposition, otherwise it is waived and cannot be raised at trial. The reason for that is because the form of the question can be corrected during the deposition.

Lack of foundation is perhaps not the appropriate phrase here. Lack of foundation is an objection as to form. It basically means the question came out of left field without establishing what is being talked about or how the witness would have personal knowledge to answer the question. You are perhaps thinking of lack of foundational reliability. That means an expert witness is relying on unsupported or unproven or unprovable facts or assumptions.

An objection to a deponentís competence is not waived if it is not made at a deposition. Competency usually means that the witness understands what is going on and can answer questions. Competency for an expert witness is a bit different. But it sounds like you are asking something else.

It sounds like you are asking about a case where a non-expert pertinent witness is asked a question that would normally only be asked of an expert. At trial, a pertinent witness can only be asked about things that person has personal knowledge of. They canít be asked for opinion (with some exceptions) or questions to establish a truth about some general subject. For example, they canít be asked about the effectiveness of some medical procedure. That would be hearsay. Expert witnesses are largely exempt from that because their job is largely to provide information that would otherwise be objectionable as opinion or hearsay.

The purpose of a trial is to establish truth. But the purpose of a deposition is to collect evidence. Therefore, at a deposition questions may be asked that call for opinion or hearsay.

In a trial when there is a sustained objection to a question, a new question is asked. But in a deposition the witness still answers the question. Testimony in a deposition is not admissible at trial (except in certain circumstances) because it is hearsay. But the same questions can be asked of the witness at trial. If the form of the question was not objected to during the deposition, it is assumed to be in proper form. An objection as to form is really just a signal to the other side that the question would be objected to during a trial.

A witness can be asked about some expertise knowledge or opinion during a deposition. There is no need to raise an objection during the deposition because that question would not be allowed during a trial as opinion or hearsay under the rules of evidence.
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Old 1st April 2019, 10:30 PM   #434
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Originally Posted by trustbutverify View Post
I wish. His fans will never jump ship.
Correct.

They will see this as the "Deep State", who are in their minds, the perpetrators of the Sandy Hook false flag operation, persecuting their embattled hero, and trying to silence him.

There is, of course, no accounting for Stupid!
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Old 2nd April 2019, 02:40 AM   #435
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His responses are nearly as funny as Trump's were in his video testimony. It really is a good way of stripping away the fluff, the spin and getting some semblance of the actual facts. Which as ever for these types of people seems to be literally non existent.
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Old 2nd April 2019, 03:45 AM   #436
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It does become quite funny when Jones is asked about things for which they have video evidence from his own shows, and resorts to 'that's a short clip, taken out of context'

The irony is simply too delightful.
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Old 2nd April 2019, 04:08 AM   #437
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Originally Posted by Worm View Post
It does become quite funny when Jones is asked about things for which they have video evidence from his own shows, and resorts to 'that's a short clip, taken out of context'

The irony is simply too delightful.
And the audio has been altered!
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Old 22nd June 2019, 08:59 AM   #438
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Not Alex Jones, but ... Sandy Hook dad wins suit against massacre deniers (CNN, June 19, 2019)
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Old 22nd June 2019, 09:03 AM   #439
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Originally Posted by dann View Post
Not Alex Jones, but ... Sandy Hook dad wins suit against massacre deniers (CNN, June 19, 2019)
Fetzerís whining it up I see. I wonder if he represented himself because no lawyer would take this case? Or if heís just a cheap-o.
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Old 22nd June 2019, 09:39 AM   #440
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Originally Posted by dann View Post
Not Alex Jones, but ... Sandy Hook dad wins suit against massacre deniers (CNN, June 19, 2019)
Perhaps not but it certainly doesn't bode well for him.
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