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Tags transgender incidents , transgender issues , transgender rights

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Old 8th July 2019, 05:58 AM   #481
Robin
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Originally Posted by Darat View Post
Depends what you mean. For example in the 80s in Manchester many of the Ts would go to the New Union (not the most trendy of the few gay pubs around the area) and they certainly didn't face violence and threats in such a pub. Yes there were some issues in that some of the Gs and Ls were not that friendly or supportive but in the end the commonality of persecution brought the activists together.
My recollection too. There were lots of tensions between certain groups and trans women in particular, but we were all there in it together.

Bisexuals got a worse run in many ways, especially as in the '80's it was hard to get people to believe there was such a thing. I wasn't around to see LGBT all grouped together. Even the L and G was a difficult marriage.
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Old 11th July 2019, 05:25 AM   #482
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Via CBS

Quote:
A transgender journalist is expressing concern about how Democrats running for president talk about trans issues. Katelyn Burns, who was the first transgender Capitol Hill reporter in U.S. history, joins CBSN to discuss her latest article in Politico.
https://twitter.com/transscribe/stat...54552932519945

YouTube Video This video is not hosted by the ISF. The ISF can not be held responsible for the suitability or legality of this material. By clicking the link below you agree to view content from an external website.
I AGREE


ETA: Funny thing about this is that we know Julián Castro practiced his answers time and time again, from last weekend's episode of This American Life.
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Old 16th July 2019, 02:03 PM   #483
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Science!

https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/114291...fair-advantage

Quote:
Science demonstrates that high adult levels of testosterone, as well as permanent testosterone effects on male physiology during in utero and early development, provides a performance advantage in sport and that much of this male physiology is not mitigated by the transition to a transwoman.
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Old 17th July 2019, 05:55 PM   #484
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Originally Posted by The Atheist View Post

You mean smashing the women's hurdle world record by 2 full seconds (if I remember correctly) isn't normal? Shocked.

All the women MMA fighters that had to fight a trans then later complained they'd never been hit so hard in their lives actually weren't lying?

This is one of the stupidest subjects ever discussed here, and that is saying a whole lot.

Sorry ladies, we're taking away your bathrooms, your right to your own bodies, and now your sports. Ya let's get things back to where they belong - the dark ages.

WT politically correct F is wrong with people?

And guess what? Scientists will not sway people's opinions on this matter. Science is not politically correct.
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Old 18th July 2019, 10:19 AM   #485
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Originally Posted by The Atheist View Post
Interesting:

"Potential solutions include excluding trans women from competing in the women's division, creating a third division for trans women and intersex women and calculating a handicap for trans women based on their testosterone levels – similar to that used in golf.

Their preferred option is an extension of this with a proposed algorithm that could account for a range of parameters, both physical and social, including physiological,*gender identity and could include socioeconomic status."


... could include socioeconomic status? Say goodbye to the Olympics being simply about 'the fastest man/woman in the world'
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Old 18th July 2019, 11:02 AM   #486
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Originally Posted by Giz View Post
... could include socioeconomic status? Say goodbye to the Olympics being simply about 'the fastest man/woman in the world'
"You ran faster, but I won because I would have been even faster than you if I'd had a better upbringing and could afford better equipment and training. And if I were a man."

ETA: If this goes through, sooner or later we're going to have a fast woman who beats a slow man, but still loses the race because she didn't beat him by enough to offset her wealth advantage under the handicap rules.

And there are other awkwardnesses ahead of us as well. Sports competitions make money off of people who want to see the best of the best, putting each other to the test. This is why men's events generate far more revenue than women's events. Merging the literal best with the potential best into a single handicapped event will almost certainly reduce viewership and revenue. Presumably this outcome is undesirable to the IOC. Hopefully they don't actually imagine that the "transwomen are women" activists represent a demographic large enough to offset these revenue losses.

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Old 18th July 2019, 11:04 AM   #487
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The weirdest thing about all of this is that we now have situations where men make the best women.
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Old 18th July 2019, 12:46 PM   #488
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
"You ran faster, but I won because I would have been even faster than you if I'd had a better upbringing and could afford better equipment and training. And if I were a man."
"Fastest Woman in the World with a Gross Annual Income of less that $25,000".

The possible categories are endless.
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Old 18th July 2019, 01:10 PM   #489
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What will happen first? Equal pay for women's soccer? Or the complete destruction of women's soccer?

Sooner or late, a junior varsity men's college team is going to identify as women, go to the world cup, and score points like it was basketball.

Last edited by theprestige; 18th July 2019 at 01:12 PM.
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Old 18th July 2019, 01:22 PM   #490
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
What will happen first? Equal pay for women's soccer? Or the complete destruction of women's soccer?
I really liked the Babylon Bee take:

Pay Gap Between Men's And Women's Teams Reveals Shocking Truth That People Are Paid To Play Soccer

My favorite bit:
"Soccer is a game played by children and Europeans that involves moving a ball around without using one’s hands -- the feature that distinguishes man from lesser animals."
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Old 18th July 2019, 01:25 PM   #491
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
I really liked the Babylon Bee take:

Pay Gap Between Men's And Women's Teams Reveals Shocking Truth That People Are Paid To Play Soccer

My favorite bit:
"Soccer is a game played by children and Europeans that involves moving a ball around without using one’s hands -- the feature that distinguishes man from lesser animals."


Ah, but human soccer players use their back legs to move the ball around. I'd like to see a dog do that.
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Old 18th July 2019, 01:29 PM   #492
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Originally Posted by GlennB View Post


Ah, but human soccer players use their back legs to move the ball around. I'd like to see a dog do that.
Dogs might have some trouble, but birds could do it easily enough.
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Old 18th July 2019, 02:37 PM   #493
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Originally Posted by Giz View Post
Interesting:

... creating a third division for trans women and intersex women ...
That's the only sensible option, otherwise sport will end up in the same classification debacle that disabled sport has.

Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
The weirdest thing about all of this is that we now have situations where men make the best women.
Thailand & Pacific Islands have recognised that for many years.

Depends on what accessories you're after - bit like choosing between a sports car and a kitted-out 4WD.
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Old 21st July 2019, 07:24 PM   #494
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Originally Posted by Robin View Post
My recollection too. There were lots of tensions between certain groups and trans women in particular, but we were all there in it together.

Bisexuals got a worse run in many ways, especially as in the '80's it was hard to get people to believe there was such a thing. I wasn't around to see LGBT all grouped together. Even the L and G was a difficult marriage.
This mostly sums up my thoughts. Numerous small group identity folks mostly.tolerate kinda similar identity groups to try to gain special rights over the average citizen. Special.protection under law until they can do whatever they want because they feel it is as they say.

Not every office wants a six foot bloke in a bad wig and a dress greeting arrivals as it may present the wrong image. They don't want a toothless guy dressed like he is homeless for the same reasons. Even if both are perfectly capable of doing the job.

But laws exist in some places saying you couldn't refuse either the job based on appearance.

All it does is change internal policies to where they hire the best applicant based on unstated qualifications.
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Old 23rd July 2019, 12:00 PM   #495
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Originally Posted by Rolfe View Post
I don't know who it is. I don't see any reason to doubt the authenticity of the screen captures though. I've read too many similar ones. Including Jonathan Yaniv.

It may very well be that most of these guys will hold back from actually assaulting anyone and simply get their rocks off by being in women's spaces, watching women's discomfort with their presence, and revelling in the whole charade. It's already been ruled (in the USA I believe) that girls have no right to visual privacy and so long as the man in their locker room doesn't actually touch them he can do what he likes and they have no comeback. Somehow it's not "exposing himself" or flashing if he says he's trans.

But you know what? I don't care. It's "not all transwomen" for sure, but it's a non-trivial proportion of them, and I am sick and tired of being lectured by clueless wokebeards that I should be kind and budge over for them, or worse still I have no right to privacy and not wanting that changing next to me is as bad as racism. I know the author of this blog post in real life. I tell you straight, if I ever see him in the ladies room when I'm there, I will run a mile.

How the freaking hell did we even get into this situation?
So Yaniv is back in the news. He's trying to organize a topless swimming event for 12 year old girls (well, not only girls, and not only 12, but including them). Parents would be excluded. I guess suing immigrants for refusing to wax his hairy balls isn't enough fun for him anymore. Oh, Canada.
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Old 23rd July 2019, 01:05 PM   #496
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This individual is taking trolling IRL to a whole other level.
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Old 23rd July 2019, 02:54 PM   #497
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From the article about the topless swim:
Quote:
The swim is for kids who identify as “LGBTQ2S+”.
What does "2S+" mean?

I'm starting to think that eventually there will be so many letters that everyone will have at least one that applies to them.
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Old 23rd July 2019, 03:00 PM   #498
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Originally Posted by TomB View Post
From the article about the topless swim: What does "2S+" mean?
2S+ = Too shy plus don't even know what to do if we get naked.
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Old 23rd July 2019, 03:17 PM   #499
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Originally Posted by TomB View Post
From the article about the topless swim:


What does "2S+" mean?

I'm starting to think that eventually there will be so many letters that everyone will have at least one that applies to them.
2S = Two-Spirited
+ = other identities not listed.
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Old 24th July 2019, 11:33 AM   #500
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Bizarrely, I'm already in a position where I could identify as one of the alphabet soup if I chose. I choose not to.
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Old 24th July 2019, 11:50 AM   #501
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Originally Posted by Rolfe View Post
Bizarrely, I'm already in a position where I could identify as one of the alphabet soup if I chose. I choose not to.
Since I can pass as a straight white male, I'd be a fool to identify as anything less.
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Old 24th July 2019, 12:08 PM   #502
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Since I can pass as a straight white male, I'd be a fool to identify as anything less.
Can't tell if sarcastic, b/c www.

My son has no trouble passing as well, but I wouldn't ever advise him to deny his Native American and Puerto Rican heritage.
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Old 24th July 2019, 03:56 PM   #503
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Since I can pass as a straight white male, I'd be a fool to identify as anything less.
I have a hard time seeing how being a straight white male is an advantage these days. In past times, sure. Now I feel more like a minority group. In fact, I'm quite sure that demographic is a minority
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Old 24th July 2019, 04:04 PM   #504
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Originally Posted by d4m10n View Post
Can't tell if sarcastic, b/c www.

My son has no trouble passing as well, but I wouldn't ever advise him to deny his Native American and Puerto Rican heritage.
Little bit sarcastic. If we accept the "privilege" framing, then anything other than straight white male is a state of lesser privilege.
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Old 26th July 2019, 12:59 AM   #505
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Originally Posted by Marcus View Post
I have a hard time seeing how being a straight white male is an advantage these days. In past times, sure. Now I feel more like a minority group. In fact, I'm quite sure that demographic is a minority
Yeah, it's tough being a white bloke, having all those centuries of privilege that means we're automatically seen as more authoritative, get the pick of the best women and run almost everything.

I'm thinking about starting a support group.
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Old 26th July 2019, 01:06 AM   #506
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Originally Posted by Wayward son View Post
2S = Two-Spirited
Kind of America-centric
Quote:

+ = other identities not listed.
Like het?
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Old 26th July 2019, 06:21 AM   #507
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Originally Posted by Robin View Post
Originally Posted by Wayward son View Post
2S = Two-Spirited
Kind of America-centric


<snip>

I don't see why. It is a concept found in societies all over the world. Even patriarchal ones.

Judeo-Christian and Abrahamic cultures are more the exception to that than the rule.
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Old 26th July 2019, 07:23 AM   #508
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Originally Posted by Marcus View Post
I have a hard time seeing how being a straight white male is an advantage these days. In past times, sure. Now I feel more like a minority group. In fact, I'm quite sure that demographic is a minority
μολων λαβε
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Old 26th July 2019, 07:38 AM   #509
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Originally Posted by quadraginta View Post
I don't see why. It is a concept found in societies all over the world. Even patriarchal ones.
Only in patriarchal ones, apparently.

Originally Posted by article
What’s instead true is that American Indian nations that had more rigid gender roles and assigned women less power historically felt the need to strip male/female identities from non-conformers, while more egalitarian societies with less gender socialization lack two-spirit people because of, rather than in spite of, their lack of emphasis on sex-assigned gender roles.
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Old 26th July 2019, 12:16 PM   #510
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
μολων λαβε
"Come and take them"? Not sure what that means in this context but at least it's not an insult.
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Old 26th July 2019, 12:31 PM   #511
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Originally Posted by Marcus View Post
"Come and take them"? Not sure what that means in this context but at least it's not an insult.
It's not about being the majority demographic. It's about having the majority of the privileges.

Come and take the privileges. It's a bit of a non sequitur, though. Sorry about that.
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Old 26th July 2019, 08:22 PM   #512
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
It's not about being the majority demographic. It's about having the majority of the privileges.

Come and take the privileges. It's a bit of a non sequitur, though. Sorry about that.

In a way that is exactly what is happening to the poor, abused, misunderstood snowflakes.

Their privilege is gradually being taken away. Eroded a little bit at a time. Can't hire whoever they want. Can't rent or sell to whoever they want. Can't keep the brown people out of their schools or neighborhoods or clubs.

They used to be able to throw them out of town at sundown. Now they have to live next door to them. They used to be able to keep them off of juries. Now they can't even keep them off the bench. They used to be able to keep them from voting at all. Now they lose elections to them.

It's a terrible thing, loss of privilege.
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Old 27th July 2019, 07:08 AM   #513
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Originally Posted by quadraginta View Post
Their privilege is gradually being taken away. Eroded a little bit at a time. Can't hire whoever they want. Can't rent or sell to whoever they want. Can't keep the brown people out of their schools or neighborhoods or clubs.
Difficult at this point to avoid analogy to the safe spaces discussed upthread.
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Old 27th July 2019, 12:13 PM   #514
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Old 27th July 2019, 01:12 PM   #515
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Originally Posted by quadraginta View Post
In a way that is exactly what is happening to the poor, abused, misunderstood snowflakes.

Their privilege is gradually being taken away. Eroded a little bit at a time. Can't hire whoever they want. Can't rent or sell to whoever they want. Can't keep the brown people out of their schools or neighborhoods or clubs.

They used to be able to throw them out of town at sundown. Now they have to live next door to them. They used to be able to keep them off of juries. Now they can't even keep them off the bench. They used to be able to keep them from voting at all. Now they lose elections to them.

It's a terrible thing, loss of privilege.
Weird flex, but okay.
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Old 28th July 2019, 12:37 AM   #516
The Atheist
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Then, there's the trans woman who's claiming hate crimes because female beauticians won't wax its pubic hair: https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...triarchy-women

My suggestion is a woman should offer to wax its scrotal area, but heat the wax to a 212 degrees Celsius, then claim to have mixed up the scales.

Piece of garbage, doing real harm to actual transgender women.
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Old 28th July 2019, 08:43 AM   #517
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Originally Posted by The Atheist View Post
Then, there's the trans woman who's claiming hate crimes because female beauticians won't wax its pubic hair: https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...triarchy-women

My suggestion is a woman should offer to wax its scrotal area, but heat the wax to a 212 degrees Celsius, then claim to have mixed up the scales.

Piece of garbage, doing real harm to actual transgender women.
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Old 28th July 2019, 08:45 AM   #518
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What's your point? That women should be forced to touch make genitals of in the name of acceptance?
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Old 28th July 2019, 12:02 PM   #519
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
What's your point? That women should be forced to touch make genitals of in the name of acceptance?
Ahem, those are female balls
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Old 28th July 2019, 12:18 PM   #520
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Originally Posted by Giz View Post
Ahem, those are female balls
Of course they are.
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