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Old 30th July 2019, 06:04 AM   #561
uke2se
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Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
Oh I guess it's because I'm a transphobic bigot because I don't agree with you about everything.
No, but you might be a transphobic bigot because you chose to forget about half of the people we are discussing in order to promote a losing argument.

Are you a transphobe, Joe?
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Old 30th July 2019, 06:08 AM   #562
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Remember a page and a half ago where I was a liar for claiming that people would call me a bigot? Good times.
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Old 30th July 2019, 06:08 AM   #563
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
What are you talking about?
Suppose you once had a female and a male shower. Now you have two showers that either sex can go into. Women and transwomen are suddenly nowhere to be seen in either shower room. You have already called the women misandrist. Are the transwomen misandrist as well, to you?

(I guess you can't call transwomen "transphobes" since they are not refusing to shower with themselves)
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Old 30th July 2019, 06:09 AM   #564
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Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
Remember a page and a half ago where I was a liar for claiming that people would call me a bigot? Good times.
I'm just asking you if you are. I mean, were you one of the people who rushed to the defense of the obviously transphobic Rolfe? If so, you might be bigoted. Maybe you should take a moment and ask yourself why you feel so strongly about this issue.
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Old 30th July 2019, 06:10 AM   #565
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Originally Posted by Arcade22 View Post
And yet I've only been arguing here about Rolfe's sick and demented horror stories about how utterly terrible it is that trans-women can use the same restrooms as other women, because apparently some of them would abuse that right to take used tampons. That's the concrete example they chose to bash trans-women with.

Yet some of you people apparently manage to twist that into me saying that anyone who says they are a woman should be recognized as such. How you manage that i will never know.
I responded to you asking the question "Are any of them transwomen?" in response to GlennB's providing evidence of the incidence of sexual harassment in unisex changing rooms.
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Old 30th July 2019, 06:10 AM   #566
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Originally Posted by Francesca R View Post
Suppose you once had a female and a male shower. Now you have two showers that either sex can go into.
No you don't.

Originally Posted by Francesca R View Post
Women and transwomen are suddenly nowhere to be seen in either shower room.
Yes they would be. They would be in the women's shower room.

Originally Posted by Francesca R View Post
You have already called the women misandrist. Are the transwomen misandrist as well, to you?
No. I called Rolfe misandrist, because she clearly is.

Originally Posted by Francesca R View Post
(I guess you can't call transwomen "transphobes" since they are not refusing to shower with themselves)
I think you are quite confused.
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Old 30th July 2019, 06:12 AM   #567
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Originally Posted by Belz... View Post
It's unfortunate that you have me on ignore
Me too I suspect. Alas, nobody reads Nietzsche anymore, do they...

Originally Posted by Nietzsche
The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently.
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Old 30th July 2019, 06:12 AM   #568
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
No you don't.
Just suppose you did and go from there
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Old 30th July 2019, 06:14 AM   #569
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
Do you think that men would simly claim to be trans to get at the women's shower room?
Do you think men should simply be able to claim to be trans to get into it?

(Which means of course that the claim is not necessary in the first place)
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Old 30th July 2019, 06:14 AM   #570
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Originally Posted by Francesca R View Post
Just suppose you did and go from there
No.

I don't know what ****** up reality you are seeing here. I'm simply talking about allowing transpeople to use the dressing room of the gender they are or have transitioned to.
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Old 30th July 2019, 06:15 AM   #571
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I'm sure at some point someone will very kindly give us a functional difference between "Identity as a woman" and "Claim to be a woman" that can be applied before the fact without being a mind-reader.
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Old 30th July 2019, 06:15 AM   #572
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Originally Posted by Francesca R View Post
Do you think men should simply be able to claim to be trans to get into it?
No. And that's not what's happening, nor what's being requested by trans-activists. It's the massive straw man erected by transphobes.
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Old 30th July 2019, 06:16 AM   #573
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
No.
Evasion noted.
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Old 30th July 2019, 06:17 AM   #574
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Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
I'm sure at some point someone will very kindly give us a functional difference between "Identity as a woman" and "Claim to be a woman" that can be applied before the fact without being a mind-reader.
Recognized legally as a woman. Transitioned to a woman. Transitioning to a woman.

And you're forgetting the transmen again. Why are the transwomen so much more vile in your eyes?
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Old 30th July 2019, 06:17 AM   #575
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
No.
OK thank you. I agree with you.
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Old 30th July 2019, 06:18 AM   #576
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Originally Posted by Francesca R View Post
Evasion noted.
Dishonesty on display.
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Old 30th July 2019, 06:19 AM   #577
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Originally Posted by Francesca R View Post
OK thank you. I agree with you.
Again, dishonesty. Quote the rest. That word does not sum up my views on this issue.

Argue honestly or get the **** out of the thread.
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Old 30th July 2019, 06:19 AM   #578
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
Recognized legally as a woman. Transitioned to a woman. Transitioning to a woman.

And you're forgetting the transmen again. Why are the transwomen so much more vile in your eyes?
*Responds in Bigot Speech*

TRANS PEOPLE BAD! *Pounds desk with my fist*

That's all your gonna hear anyway no matter what I say.

Now in this scene you'll get huffy and defensive. And action!
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Old 30th July 2019, 06:21 AM   #579
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
That word does not sum up my views on this issue.
It doesn't?

Would "yes" do it better? If so it is odd that you typed no.

What a pity, because you had made a sensible answer which I would applaud.
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Old 30th July 2019, 06:21 AM   #580
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Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
*Responds in Bigot Speech*

TRANS PEOPLE BAD! *Pounds desk with my fist*

That's all your gonna hear anyway no matter what I say.

Now in this scene you'll get huffy and defensive. And action!
I asked if you were a transphobe and you never answered. Based on your posts, I'm getting the sense that you are far more bigoted than you believe yourself to be.

That's fine. Recognizing and understanding your own tendencies to bigotry is a process.
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Old 30th July 2019, 06:21 AM   #581
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
nor what's being requested by trans-activists.
Yes it is, that's exactly what's being requested, at least in the UK. That the whole "get a Gender Recognition Certificate" thing is discriminatory and should be done away with.
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Old 30th July 2019, 06:22 AM   #582
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Originally Posted by Francesca R View Post
It doesn't?

Would "yes" do it better? If so it is odd that you typed no.

What a pity, because you had made a sensible answer which I would applaud.
If you can't be honest, stop replying to me. I'm not interested in having a conversation with you if you are going to keep this up.
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Old 30th July 2019, 06:23 AM   #583
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
I asked if you were a transphobe and you never answered. Based on your posts, I'm getting the sense that you are far more bigoted than you believe yourself to be.

That's fine. Recognizing and understanding your own tendencies to bigotry is a process.
And everyone else that you're talking to you?

Are you literally the only non-bigoted person in the world?

Lucky you. You should be out using your powers for good since you and only you are capable of not being a bigot, not arguing with obviously bigoted people on the internet.
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Old 30th July 2019, 06:24 AM   #584
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
Aside from the fact that it's kind of sad that a person is nothing more than his or her gentials to you
When out of facts, go for ad hominems.
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Old 30th July 2019, 06:25 AM   #585
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Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
And everyone else that you're talking to you?

Are you literally the only non-bigoted person in the world?
Hell no. I'm racist and bigoted towards trans and gay people too. I recognize this and am working to supress those emotions, because I know that they aren't productive and based on fear of the other and the unknown.

Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
Lucky you. You should be out using your powers for good since you and only you are capable of not being a bigot, not arguing with obviously bigoted people on the internet.
My "power" is rather to spot bigotry in others. In Rolfe, it's easy and anyone can see it. In you, you sure as hell can't.
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Old 30th July 2019, 06:25 AM   #586
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So anyway last night me, Belz, and Francesca were cooking and eating a transperson for dinner, as is our want in life as TOTAL TRANSPHOBE BIGOTS....
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Old 30th July 2019, 06:26 AM   #587
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
Are you a transphobe, Joe?
Who gives a ****?

Is your entire goal here to prop yourself up on a moral pedestal? How about you address the arguments rather than the persons?

Someone repost this to him.
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Old 30th July 2019, 06:27 AM   #588
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Originally Posted by Belz... View Post
Well, I never said it turned it legal. What gave you that idea?
You said that people "can claim to be trans as a defense for their otherwise illegal actions". A legal defense is, by definition, something that legally justifies a criminal act, thus making an otherwise criminal act legal; or at least mitigating the severity of said criminal act. In the real world, at least outside of Canada, sexual harassment is still illegal even if you are a woman or trans woman.

Or are women allowed to go into changing rooms with dildos and butt plugs clearly visible and start masturbating in-front of people? Are women allowed to intensively watch other women undress, follow them into the showers and touch them? Just what kind of things do you people think women can get away with?

It should be noted here that right now there's nothing at all preventing anyone from claiming that, them (supposedly) being trans, as a defense for any kind of criminal offence. Of course it doesn't work.
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Old 30th July 2019, 06:28 AM   #589
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
If you can't be honest
I defy you to find any lack of honesty. I asked you "Do you think men should simply be able to claim to be trans to get into [the formerly female shower room]?".

This is a yes or no question and you selected no. I agree with no. Now you staggeringly wish to squirm out of having said no.

I have zero interest in anything you added after no because it is not an answer to what I asked you and is irrelevant and misinformed and incorrect anyway. But mostly it is not necessary to your answer and is to be discarded.

If you retract your no then I will conclude that you revert to not answering the question. Which is your prerogative, even if it undermines your contribution rather a lot.
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Old 30th July 2019, 06:29 AM   #590
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Originally Posted by Francesca R View Post
I defy you to find any lack of honesty.
The two posts where I pointed out your dishonesty were dishonest. They were dishonest because you snipped out one word and left out the clarifying text. I don't care what you are interested in. My reply is not just visible to you.

There.
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Old 30th July 2019, 06:29 AM   #591
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Originally Posted by Arcade22 View Post
You said that people "can claim to be trans as a defense for their otherwise illegal actions". A legal defense is, by definition, something that legally justifies a criminal act, thus making an otherwise criminal act legal; or at least mitigating the severity of said criminal act. In the real world, at least outside of Canada, sexual harassment is still illegal even if you are a woman or trans woman.

Or are women allowed to go into changing rooms with dildos and butt plugs clearly visible and start masturbating in-front of people? Are women allowed to intensively watch other women undress, follow them into the showers and touch them? Just what kind of things do you people think women can get away with?

It should be noted here that right now there's nothing at all preventing anyone from claiming that, them (supposedly) being trans, as a defense for any kind of criminal offence. Of course it doesn't work.
Cis-men can't legally do any of those things either but they still aren't allowed in women's dressing rooms to further keep them doing it.

This "But they aren't allowed to..." is a red herring.
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Old 30th July 2019, 06:31 AM   #592
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
They were dishonest because you snipped out one word and left out the clarifying text.
Rejected. You do not need to clarify a yes/no. I get that you want to fudge and squirm but that's not honest on your part so you will hopefully thank me for discarding that part (you are welcome).
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Old 30th July 2019, 06:32 AM   #593
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
No.

I don't know what ****** up reality you are seeing here.
It's called a hypothetical.

I suppose you skipped more than set theory, then.
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Old 30th July 2019, 06:32 AM   #594
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Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
Cis-men can't legally do any of those things either but they still aren't allowed in women's dressing rooms to further keep them doing it.

This "But they aren't allowed to..." is a red herring.
It is a red herring. On your part. As Arcade has eloquently laid out.
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Old 30th July 2019, 06:34 AM   #595
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Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
Cis-men can't legally do any of those things either but they still aren't allowed in women's dressing rooms to further keep them doing it.
Ah yes, the good old rapists who would obey the women's only sign on the door, patiently waiting for their victims to leave so they can rape them in good faith.
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Old 30th July 2019, 06:34 AM   #596
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
Recognized legally as a woman. Transitioned to a woman. Transitioning to a woman.
Ah, then people who identify as women are not women by that act alone.

Quote:
And you're forgetting the transmen again.
No one's forgetting anything. It's the example used because that's the TOPIC OF THE THREAD.

Quote:
Why are the transwomen so much more vile in your eyes?


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Old 30th July 2019, 06:34 AM   #597
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
It is a red herring. On your part. As Arcade has eloquently laid out.
Well that must be true because you said so, so if I disagree I'm a bigot.

Pensis attached to women are less dangerous then pensises attached to men. Got it. Better pretend that makes sense so I'm not a bigot.
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Old 30th July 2019, 06:35 AM   #598
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Originally Posted by Francesca R View Post
Rejected. You do not need to clarify a yes/no.
Yes, I do and did. It's not your choice, but mine. Seems you have trouble respecting other people, and that might explain your behavior towards transpeople as well?

Originally Posted by Francesca R View Post
I get that you want to fudge and squirm but that's not honest on your part so you will hopefully thank me for discarding that part (you are welcome).
No, I did not want to "fudge and squirm". I wanted to point out that what you called "agreement" was anything but, because your question came from an imaginary perspective that is being held up as truth by transphobes. That was the whole summary of my reply, and that was important.
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Old 30th July 2019, 06:35 AM   #599
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
I asked if you were a transphobe and you never answered. Based on your posts, I'm getting the sense that you are far more bigoted than you believe yourself to be.
Given that bigotry is hostility towards other points of view, what does that make you?
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Old 30th July 2019, 06:36 AM   #600
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Originally Posted by Arcade22 View Post
Ah yes, the good old rapists who would obey the women's only sign on the door, patiently waiting for their victims to leave so they can rape them in good faith.
You're aware I'm pretty much the only one in this discussion against gender segregated bathrooms, right?
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