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Tags Mandela effect , memory

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Old 14th March 2018, 06:05 AM   #121
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Originally Posted by Veliki George View Post
I'm very skeptical and I always look for rational explanations. I've been following this phenomenon for a while and it's been very funny and entertaining. Until the movie They live! I clearly remember it with an exclamation mark in the title. It seems like 80 percent of people remember it that way.
I can't find a rational explanation, but I can't just jump to conclusion that multiverses are merging because some pop cultural references change.
Is there any other skeptic who has experienced something like so called Mandela effect?
Also Thanksgiving confusion baffles me.
The rational explanation may simply be that the recalled events tend to be about trivial matters, and statistically some people will have the same misrememberings. I thought Mandela had died, remember a coming attraction poster for the movie Shazam featuring Sinbad, and thought Thanksgiving was on the third Thursday. I have thousands of other memories, accurate and not, that do not overlap with other peoples' recollections. The odds are that a lot of people will remember a few things wrong in the same way.
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Old 14th March 2018, 07:03 AM   #122
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But really, the main example of the Mandela Effect is the girl from Moonraker, who fell in love at first sight with JAWS (Richard Kiel) had braces on when I saw it at the movies.

Now... I can find no evidence of those braces.

It really is baffling, because I remember her smiling, and he smiled back, and the fact that they both had metal appliances on their teeth was why they fell in love.

It's not on any copies of the film available.
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Old 14th March 2018, 07:16 AM   #123
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Originally Posted by Drewbot View Post
But really, the main example of the Mandela Effect is the girl from Moonraker, who fell in love at first sight with JAWS (Richard Kiel) had braces on when I saw it at the movies.

Now... I can find no evidence of those braces.

It really is baffling, because I remember her smiling, and he smiled back, and the fact that they both had metal appliances on their teeth was why they fell in love.

It's not on any copies of the film available.
That's actually a great barometer for demonstrating how bad memory is. Watch a movie you haven't seen in years and see how accurately you remember it.
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Old 14th March 2018, 07:23 AM   #124
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Originally Posted by Drewbot View Post
But really, the main example of the Mandela Effect is the girl from Moonraker, who fell in love at first sight with JAWS (Richard Kiel) had braces on when I saw it at the movies.

Now... I can find no evidence of those braces.

It really is baffling, because I remember her smiling, and he smiled back, and the fact that they both had metal appliances on their teeth was why they fell in love.

It's not on any copies of the film available.
Is it possible that that's a scene from The Spy Who Loved Me?
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Old 14th March 2018, 07:23 AM   #125
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Originally Posted by Drewbot View Post
But really, the main example of the Mandela Effect is the girl from Moonraker, who fell in love at first sight with JAWS (Richard Kiel) had braces on when I saw it at the movies.

Now... I can find no evidence of those braces.

It really is baffling, because I remember her smiling, and he smiled back, and the fact that they both had metal appliances on their teeth was why they fell in love.

It's not on any copies of the film available.
Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
That's actually a great barometer for demonstrating how bad memory is. Watch a movie you haven't seen in years and see how accurately you remember it.
I'm going to have to look for that one, cause I swear I remember braces, too.
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Old 14th March 2018, 07:24 AM   #126
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Originally Posted by William Parcher View Post
Is it possible that that's a scene from The Spy Who Loved Me?
No, he meets Dolly in Moonraker. No love interest for Jaws in the earlier film.
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Old 14th March 2018, 07:33 AM   #127
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My mandela effect,
Vague memories of shazam starring sinbad
Scientist predicting Global cooling in the 70s I specifically remember the series finale of James Burke's The Day the Universe changed ending with such a prediction which appears to be totally false.
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Old 14th March 2018, 07:35 AM   #128
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Originally Posted by Hellbound View Post
No, he meets Dolly in Moonraker. No love interest for Jaws in the earlier film.
Check this out...

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=2BhLAWP7jGA
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Old 14th March 2018, 07:43 AM   #129
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Originally Posted by William Parcher View Post
Never seen that before, so don't think that's the cause of my confusion. In fact, that commercial suggests that this little collective brain lapse has been around for some time.

Interesting.
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Old 14th March 2018, 07:44 AM   #130
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But they would say its a proof for ME.

"without being an actual Mandela Effect itself this advert might be one of the strongest proofs we have of the Mandela Effect. If Dolly never had braces in the movie Moonraker then this advert would make absolutely no sense at all. Anyone saying that we just have a false memory of Dolly wearing braces need only be referred to this commercial."
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Old 14th March 2018, 07:45 AM   #131
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Originally Posted by William Parcher View Post
Yes this commercial is a play on the Mandela Effect, or it is an insider jab by someone who knows the truth. That Dolly REALLY wore braces in Moonraker.

Nice find Parcher
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Old 14th March 2018, 07:49 AM   #132
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Originally Posted by Drewbot View Post
Now... I can find no evidence of those braces.
...
It's not on any copies of the film available.
I watched Moonraker only a few weeks ago and had the exact same confusion.
I always thought she had braces as well...
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Old 14th March 2018, 07:51 AM   #133
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Originally Posted by Veliki George View Post
But they would say its a proof for ME.

"without being an actual Mandela Effect itself this advert might be one of the strongest proofs we have of the Mandela Effect. If Dolly never had braces in the movie Moonraker then this advert would make absolutely no sense at all. Anyone saying that we just have a false memory of Dolly wearing braces need only be referred to this commercial."
I can think of two explanations off the top of my head that are more likely than "parallel worlds are colliding and the main effect is people appearing to misremember pop culturual trivia"

1: They just added the braces as a little visual reference to the Jaws character and did not intend to reference any particular scene or interaction from Moonraker.
Notice that Kiel doesn't even see her braces, and does not fall in love with her. He just smiles a lot, pays and leaves. Then she smiles and we, the audience, see her braces.

2: The people from the add agency also misremembered the scene.
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Old 14th March 2018, 07:53 AM   #134
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Adding some more zooms and gifs to the question here:
http://dolly.barriereader.co.uk/dolly.html
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Old 14th March 2018, 07:53 AM   #135
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Originally Posted by Porpoise of Life View Post
I can think of two explanations off the top of my head that are more likely than "parallel worlds are colliding and the main effect is people appearing to misremember pop culturual trivia"

1: They just added the braces as a little visual reference to the Jaws character and did not intend to reference any particular scene or interaction from Moonraker.
Notice that Kiel doesn't even see her braces, and does not fall in love with her. He just smiles a lot, pays and leaves. Then she smiles and we, the audience, see her braces.

2: The people from the add agency also misremembered the scene.
3: They recognized that a lot of people misremembered the scene, and this was common, so played on that fact in their commercial (which was my first thought).
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Old 14th March 2018, 08:09 AM   #136
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In my opinion, the commercial wasn't produced that way because they were aware of a "Mandela Effect" happening throughout the population.
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Old 14th March 2018, 08:09 AM   #137
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Do you think it was produced because the directors remembered it that way, themselves?
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Old 14th March 2018, 08:15 AM   #138
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Originally Posted by Drewbot View Post
Do you think it was produced because the directors remembered it that way, themselves?
That's my choice 2
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Old 14th March 2018, 08:18 AM   #139
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Originally Posted by Drewbot View Post
Do you think it was produced because the directors remembered it that way, themselves?
No. I think that they wanted to create a reference to Jaws in a funny way.

I believe that that commercial predates the Internet and predates the (now) widespread realization that there is a Jaws Mandela Effect phenomenon. For some people, that commercial could cause the JME when they didn't actually have it prior.
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Old 14th March 2018, 08:23 AM   #140
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Originally Posted by Drewbot View Post
Do you think it was produced because the directors remembered it that way, themselves?
Another possibility is that the commercial producers did not suffer from the ME nor did they think that others suffered from it, but...

They felt that Moonraker would have been so much more cool and funny if Dolly had had braces. IOW, not remembering her with braces, but instead realizing that she would have been better with braces. So they gave them to "her" in their commercial.
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Old 14th March 2018, 09:28 AM   #141
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Originally Posted by Drewbot View Post
Adding some more zooms and gifs to the question here:
http://dolly.barriereader.co.uk/dolly.html
Among many things, claims
Quote:
As a side note, I just noticed how much her teeth change colour through those frames. White to yellowy. Shadow changes tone, not hue.
Shadows most definitely can change how something looks, Very dramatically so, Case in point:


The 'Orange' middle cube in shadow is the same color as the brown middle cube on top.

However, I ask the following; Which is more probable? You and "80%" of 'Moonraker' fans quantum leaped into this braceless universe OR You're simply misremembering a single scene from a film over 30 years old?
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Old 14th March 2018, 09:39 AM   #142
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The most logical explanation is that we all hallucinated that braces on Dolly would have been a better connection, so it became part of our memory, simply because the directors SHOULD have put braces on her.

Although, for people to remember actually consciously thinking about the braces connection while watching the movie, adds a thought-conscious level that most ME do not include.
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Old 14th March 2018, 09:42 AM   #143
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Originally Posted by Drewbot View Post
The most logical explanation is that we all hallucinated that braces on Dolly would have been a better connection, so it became part of our memory, simply because the directors SHOULD have put braces on her.

Although, for people to remember actually consciously thinking about the braces connection while watching the movie, adds a thought-conscious level that most ME do not include.
A lot of people may be unconsciously filling in a sight gag that would have naturally fit the scene
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Old 14th March 2018, 09:45 AM   #144
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There are probably many people who saw Moonraker on television and have no clue if Dolly had braces or not because of the crappy resolution. The quality of television imagery was really bad and still true even if you rented it on VHS.

The images in the link are 1080 (probably from Blu-ray) and might even have better definition than if you had watched it on the big screen in the theater.
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Old 14th March 2018, 09:53 AM   #145
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Originally Posted by Thermal View Post
A lot of people may be unconsciously filling in a sight gag that would have naturally fit the scene
Another issue with trying to get a handle on this ME thing is this: If it's possible to have an incorrect memory, then it's also possible to have an incorrect memory of a memory.

IOW, you can now think that you always thought or "knew" that Dolly has braces - but you really didn't. And once you are informed that it's a common ME then you suddenly and falsely believe that it always did effect you too.
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Old 14th March 2018, 10:19 AM   #146
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Originally Posted by William Parcher View Post
Another issue with trying to get a handle on this ME thing is this: If it's possible to have an incorrect memory, then it's also possible to have an incorrect memory of a memory.

IOW, you can now think that you always thought or "knew" that Dolly has braces - but you really didn't. And once you are informed that it's a common ME then you suddenly and falsely believe that it always did effect you too.
Yep. It's turtles all the way down!
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Old 14th March 2018, 10:22 AM   #147
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The Mandela Effect is not all that different from quantum immortality, which is taken seriously by some very smart people, like Max Tegmark.

Perhaps the people who remember "Berenstein Bears" (and I am one of them), died in some universe and the one that branched off had subtle differences.
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Old 14th March 2018, 10:26 AM   #148
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Sometimes stupid ideas are held by smart people. I don't know what quantum immortality is, but The Mandela Effect is a stupid idea.
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Old 14th March 2018, 10:31 AM   #149
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It is a glitch in the programming of the simulation that we are living in!!
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Old 14th March 2018, 10:32 AM   #150
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Originally Posted by JesseCuster View Post
Sometimes stupid ideas are held by smart people. I don't know what quantum immortality is, but The Mandela Effect is a stupid idea.
It's the idea that, in some alternative universe, you never die. Basically, an evidenceless assertion of the many-worlds interpretation of quantum mechanics. Basically, an extension (QI) of an opinion (many worlds) about an aspect (superpositions and waveform collapse) of an actual scientific theory (quantum mechanics).

As we all know, QM is the Kevin Bacon of scientific theories. If you can draw the connection through enough steps, it must be true.

Still not the same, though. QI specifically precludes the idea that any information can cross over the barriers between worlds.

And, considering we already have abundant evidence of the fallible and mutable nature of memory, as well as how it's shaped by shared discussion with others (think repressed memory recovery writ large), positing ME as an explanation for these little inconsistencies is like positing leprechauns as the cause of the missing socks in your dryer.
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Old 14th March 2018, 10:32 AM   #151
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Originally Posted by Drewbot View Post
It is a glitch in the programming of the simulation that we are living in!!
Evidence?....
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Old 14th March 2018, 10:36 AM   #152
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Originally Posted by Veliki George View Post
I'm very skeptical and I always look for rational explanations. I've been following this phenomenon for a while and it's been very funny and entertaining. Until the movie They live! I clearly remember it with an exclamation mark in the title. It seems like 80 percent of people remember it that way.
Where did the figure of '80 percent' come from? Were people polled about the subject? I don't believe it for a second.

80% of people in general remember it that way? Doubtful as I doubt 80% of people are even aware of the movie.

80% of people who are aware of the film remember it that way?

80% of people who are fans of the film remember it that way?

Do 80% of people when told to write down the name of the movie "They Live" include an exclamation mark?

If shown a mocked up poster with an exclamation mark in it, do 80% of people not notice there's anything wrong?

If asked if "They Live!" is the correct name of the movie, do 80% of people not identify what's wrong?

If asked if there's an exclamation mark in the title, do 80% of people agree that there is? I wouldn't be surprised at this at all, as it's clearly a loaded question prompting people what to think, and the movie title is in fact an exclamation, so an exclamation mark at the end wouldn't be out of place?

Is the 80% figure simply something you've come up with based upon an informal poll of people you know?

Quote:
I can't find a rational explanation, but I can't just jump to conclusion that multiverses are merging because some pop cultural references change.
If you're jumping to the conclusion that 'multiverses are merging' to explain why some people falsely think there's an exclamation mark in the name of a movie, then I would say that's a result of a lack of imagination and/or critical thinking.
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Old 14th March 2018, 10:57 AM   #153
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Originally Posted by JesseCuster View Post
Sometimes stupid ideas are held by smart people. I don't know what quantum immortality is, but The Mandela Effect is a stupid idea.
Of course you don't.
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Old 14th March 2018, 11:02 AM   #154
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I am endlessly fascinated by the Mandela Effect. It should prompt people to go, "Hell, its crazy what tricks memory can play?" Instead, in some folks it prompts, "Hell, I must come from a different universe!" Seriously, whether there's a "!" at the end of a movie title is some inexplicable phenomenon rather than a fault of memory? Why is it so hard to except that memory sucks?
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Old 14th March 2018, 11:03 AM   #155
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Originally Posted by Hellbound View Post
It's the idea that, in some alternative universe, you never die. Basically, an evidenceless assertion of the many-worlds interpretation of quantum mechanics. Basically, an extension (QI) of an opinion (many worlds) about an aspect (superpositions and waveform collapse) of an actual scientific theory (quantum mechanics).

As we all know, QM is the Kevin Bacon of scientific theories. If you can draw the connection through enough steps, it must be true.

Still not the same, though. QI specifically precludes the idea that any information can cross over the barriers between worlds.

And, considering we already have abundant evidence of the fallible and mutable nature of memory, as well as how it's shaped by shared discussion with others (think repressed memory recovery writ large), positing ME as an explanation for these little inconsistencies is like positing leprechauns as the cause of the missing socks in your dryer.
Since the current thinking is that we live in an ensemble of an infinite/nearly infinite number of universes, and some of these universes possibly have an effect on us, it's not exactly "leprechauns".
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Old 14th March 2018, 11:04 AM   #156
Veliki George
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Originally Posted by JesseCuster View Post
Where did the figure of '80 percent' come from? Were people polled about the subject? I don't believe it for a second.

80% of people in general remember it that way? Doubtful as I doubt 80% of people are even aware of the movie.

80% of people who are aware of the film remember it that way?

80% of people who are fans of the film remember it that way?

Do 80% of people when told to write down the name of the movie "They Live" include an exclamation mark?

If shown a mocked up poster with an exclamation mark in it, do 80% of people not notice there's anything wrong?

If asked if "They Live!" is the correct name of the movie, do 80% of people not identify what's wrong?

If asked if there's an exclamation mark in the title, do 80% of people agree that there is? I wouldn't be surprised at this at all, as it's clearly a loaded question prompting people what to think, and the movie title is in fact an exclamation, so an exclamation mark at the end wouldn't be out of place?

Is the 80% figure simply something you've come up with based upon an informal poll of people you know?

If you're jumping to the conclusion that 'multiverses are merging' to explain why some people falsely think there's an exclamation mark in the name of a movie, then I would say that's a result of a lack of imagination and/or critical thinking.
OK, it's just approximation based on comments on reddit, some forums and videos. But funny thing is there is a band called They Live Exclamation Point. I wonder how they got their name.
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Old 14th March 2018, 11:12 AM   #157
Hellbound
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Originally Posted by Fudbucker View Post
Since the current thinking is that we live in an ensemble of an infinite/nearly infinite number of universes, and some of these universes possibly have an effect on us, it's not exactly "leprechauns".
NoTM

That's not a current scientific theory or law.

That's not even current scientific hypothesis.

At least, not in the way you're interpreting it.

The current many-universes idea isn't about quantum events, but about the effects of the inflation period after the big bang. And in that, the universes are separate from each other and, by definition, can have no interaction. It's something that, by it's very nature, can't even be tested.

The many-worlds interpretation of quantum mechanics is not even a theory or hypothesis at all, but an interpretation...akin to a thought experiment, and isn't generally accepted except among those who aren't in the field.

In QM, if the math doesn't show it, it's not part of the theory. None of the math shows a many-worlds interpretation on the macro level like you've suggested. Even on the micro level, it's suppositional, not proven by any means.

In any case, you're going past actual QM, through an interpretation, on to an opinion based on that. At best you're two steps removed from any testable, provable science.

It's leprechauns.
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Old 14th March 2018, 11:21 AM   #158
Drewbot
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Originally Posted by Nay_Sayer View Post
Evidence?....
One of the parameters of the program, is that it does not allow the characters in the simulation to find evidence of the simulation.
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Old 14th March 2018, 11:33 AM   #159
theprestige
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Originally Posted by Veliki George View Post
OK, it's just approximation based on comments on reddit, some forums and videos. But funny thing is there is a band called They Live Exclamation Point. I wonder how they got their name.
What's your theory?

Faulty memory?
Convergent evolution?
Parallel universes?
Something else?
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Old 14th March 2018, 11:37 AM   #160
ahhell
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Originally Posted by Veliki George View Post
OK, it's just approximation based on comments on reddit, some forums and videos. But funny thing is there is a band called They Live Exclamation Point. I wonder how they got their name.
Probably because they live in a world where some people think a faulty memory of a movie title proves the existence of an alternate universe rather than proving faulty human memory.

Just spit balling.

Seriously though, isn't it more likely that people are conflating "Them!" with "They Live"? Or any number of other moves who's title end in "!"
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