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Tags DeSantis , electioneering , florida , immigration

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Old 20th September 2022, 11:02 AM   #281
Upchurch
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Texas sheriff opens investigation into DeSantis’ migrant flight to Martha’s Vineyard

Quote:
A Texas sheriff has launched an investigation into the circumstances surrounding Gov. Ron DeSantis' choice to transport a group of migrants from San Antonio to Martha's Vineyard, according to the sheriff's office.

San Antonio's Bexar County Sheriff, Javier Salazar, gave a news conference on the migrant flight on Monday. It's important to note that DeSantis is a Republican and Salazar is a Democrat.

“The Bexar County Sheriff’s Office has opened an investigation into the migrants that were lured from the Migrant Resource Center, located in Bexar County, TX, and flown to Florida, where they were ultimately left to fend for themselves in Martha’s Vineyard, MA,” the Bexar County Sheriff’s Office tweeted. “Additionally, we are working with private attorneys who are representing the victims, as well as advocacy organizations regarding this incident.”

Is "pwning the libs" an affirmative legal defense?
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Old 20th September 2022, 11:05 AM   #282
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
I don't know that he is a Trump "mini-me". He seems sharper and not as much of a loose cannon. I mean, he hasn't even hosted The Apprentice. And he doesn't have a past loaded with questionable business dealings. Plus, he is a lot younger.
Look! Squirrel!

I notice you don't mention how he differs from Trump in his political ideology .

You're not fooling anyone with your act.

Last edited by Stacyhs; 20th September 2022 at 11:07 AM.
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Old 20th September 2022, 11:10 AM   #283
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Originally Posted by Upchurch View Post
Texas sheriff opens investigation into DeSantis’ migrant flight to Martha’s Vineyard

Quote:
Quote:
A Texas sheriff has launched an investigation into the circumstances surrounding Gov. Ron DeSantis' choice to transport a group of migrants from San Antonio to Martha's Vineyard, according to the sheriff's office.

San Antonio's Bexar County Sheriff, Javier Salazar, gave a news conference on the migrant flight on Monday. It's important to note that DeSantis is a Republican and Salazar is a Democrat.

“The Bexar County Sheriff’s Office has opened an investigation into the migrants that were lured from the Migrant Resource Center, located in Bexar County, TX, and flown to Florida, where they were ultimately left to fend for themselves in Martha’s Vineyard, MA,” the Bexar County Sheriff’s Office tweeted. “Additionally, we are working with private attorneys who are representing the
Is "pwning the libs" an affirmative legal defense?
It's not like a Texas Republican is going to question the legality of the stunt, especially Trump/Abbott lickspittle AG Ken Paxton.
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Old 20th September 2022, 11:12 AM   #284
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
Look! Squirrel!

I notice you don't mention how he differs from Trump in his political ideology .

You're not fooling anyone with your act.

You may enjoy this article which discusses some differences between DeSantis and Trump, and why DeSantis is a more promising GOP candidate:

Liberals Should Welcome Ron DeSantis’ Rise
https://www.politico.com/news/magazi...cracy-00044494

DeSantis would be a fool not to appeal to Trump's base. He is doing a good job, with stunts like this, and it might land him the Oval Office in 2024.
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Old 20th September 2022, 11:20 AM   #285
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Originally Posted by Upchurch View Post
Well it is texas...
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Old 20th September 2022, 11:42 AM   #286
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DeSantis's only playbook is doing the opposite of what Dems do. Like almost every Republican these days, he's and underplants gnome, following the script of:

1. Trigger the Libs
2. ??
3. Profit
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Old 20th September 2022, 11:55 AM   #287
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
DeSantis's only playbook is doing the opposite of what Dems do. Like almost every Republican these days, he's and underplants gnome, following the script of:

1. Trigger the Libs
2. ??
3. Profit
That's the modern Republican party in a nutshell: Whatever the Democratic Party is for, they're against. That and cruelty.
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Old 20th September 2022, 12:07 PM   #288
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Originally Posted by kookbreaker View Post
Red states already use Greyhound therapy.
Theres been local news stories here that certain states, including Texas, are doing just that. Giving homeless a one way ticket to Albuquerque. I guess we can afford to house them though, what with all the pot we're selling to Texans at border towns.
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Old 20th September 2022, 12:07 PM   #289
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
DeSantis's only playbook is doing the opposite of what Dems do. Like almost every Republican these days, he's and underplants gnome, following the script of:

1. Trigger the Libs
2. ??
3. Profit
Getting a profit seems to be pretty easy, look at how much the Stop the Steal got as profit.
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Old 20th September 2022, 12:20 PM   #290
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Originally Posted by lobosrul5 View Post
Theres been local news stories here that certain states, including Texas, are doing just that. Giving homeless a one way ticket to Albuquerque. I guess we can afford to house them though, what with all the pot we're selling to Texans at border towns.
That's been going on for years. And major cities don't just receive those riders. They also will send them off too. The problem is, there's very little consideration for where the person is actually from or if they have any prospects there.
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Old 20th September 2022, 12:25 PM   #291
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Originally Posted by ponderingturtle View Post
Clearly florida hates refugees, I look forward to seeing the new stance sending cubans back home.

Cuba receives undocumented migrants returned by U.S. authorities (Granma.cu, June 18, 2021)
The results and challenges of migratory relations between Cuba and the U.S. (Granma.cu, Jan 24, 2018)
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Old 20th September 2022, 12:54 PM   #292
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
You may enjoy this article which discusses some differences between DeSantis and Trump, and why DeSantis is a more promising GOP candidate:

Liberals Should Welcome Ron DeSantis’ Rise
https://www.politico.com/news/magazi...cracy-00044494

DeSantis would be a fool not to appeal to Trump's base. He is doing a good job, with stunts like this, and it might land him the Oval Office in 2024.
LOL! REALLY?

That is an opinion piece written by conservative writer Rich Lowry, editor-in-chief of the National Review, who is a DeSantis supporter if his articles are any indication. And they are.

Your linked article doesn't discuss political or ideological differences between Trump and DeSantis, but focuses on how DeSantis isn't crazy as Trump, is smarter, and doesn't come with Trump's baggage.

Quote:
There is no doubt that DeSantis reflects a new more Trumpian Republican Party, in his combativeness with the press, in his emphasis on cultural issues, in his willingness to use government power in the culture war, and in his ability to appeal to Trump voters.
Quote:
DeSantis may be Trumpy in notable respects, but, importantly, he doesn’t exhibit any of Trump’s character flaws.
Quote:
By any reasonable standard, DeSantis’ supposed sins are peccadilloes compared to those of Trump.
Lowry then goes on to compare some of Trump's actions compared to DeSantis', which as a conservative, Lowry obviously approves of or he wouldn't have brought them up as positives examples. However, those examples are 1) the very things that Dems are critical of, and 2) are also supported by Trump.
For example:

Quote:
Trump tried to bully his vice president into changing or blocking the counting of the electoral votes and then sat contentedly as a braying mob targeted him; DeSantis ended Florida’s Covid strictures earlier than most other states.
But DeSantis endorses election deniers like Doug Mastriano, Kari Lake, Blake Masters, and JD Vance just like Trump. Trump also supported DeSantis' ending of Covid strictures.

Quote:
Trump may or may not have lunged at the steering wheel of his SUV as it took him back to the White House on Jan. 6 instead of to the U.S. Capitol; DeSantis signed a bill to prevent kids from being taught about sexual orientation and gender identity in public schools in grades K-3.
Trump also approves of the new "Don't Say Gay" law:

"Former President Trump (R) on Thursday said Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis’ (R) decision to sign the Parental Rights in Education law – know to its critics as the “Don’t Say Gay” law – was a “good move.”

“I do think it was a good move,” Trump said in an interview with The Washington Post, though he reportedly declined to elaborate."


Quote:
Trump has continued to promote conspiracy theories about the 2020 election and endorse candidates who believe or pretend to believe in them; DeSantis criticized Anthony Fauci.
As posted above, DeSantis also endorses candidates who believe or pretend to believe in the same election conspiracy theories. And Trump also criticized Fauci.
DeSantis refuses to say whether the election was rigged but he also refuses to say it wasn't. His post-election crackdown on 'voter fraud' gives a clue as to what he does think.

DeSantis may not be a sociopathic narcissist like Trump, but he's still a Trumper in his beliefs and actions.
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Old 20th September 2022, 02:16 PM   #293
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
You may enjoy this article which discusses some differences between DeSantis and Trump, and why DeSantis is a more promising GOP candidate:

Liberals Should Welcome Ron DeSantis’ Rise
https://www.politico.com/news/magazi...cracy-00044494

DeSantis would be a fool not to appeal to Trump's base. He is doing a good job, with stunts like this, and it might land him the Oval Office in 2024.
So now kidnapping and racketeering are just politics?

Is there anything that isn't just politics to you?
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Old 20th September 2022, 02:50 PM   #294
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Originally Posted by arayder View Post
So now kidnapping and racketeering are just politics?

Is there anything that isn't just politics to you?

I don't think we can exactly call this "kidnapping". I mean, apparently DHS was involved. One might even say that without their help, this might not have come to fruition.
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Old 20th September 2022, 03:04 PM   #295
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
I don't think we can exactly call this "kidnapping".
Taken somewhere under false pretenses? Oh, I think we can.

Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
I mean, apparently DHS was involved.
I missed that. Source?

eta: Yeah, I'm calling BS on that. Everything I'm reading says DHS specifically wasn't notified or involved.
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Old 20th September 2022, 03:36 PM   #296
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
I don't think we can exactly call this "kidnapping". I mean, apparently DHS was involved. One might even say that without their help, this might not have come to fruition.
Is there any political crime you won't try to explain away?
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Old 20th September 2022, 03:43 PM   #297
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
I don't think we can exactly call this "kidnapping". I mean, apparently DHS was involved. One might even say that without their help, this might not have come to fruition.
Originally Posted by Upchurch View Post
Taken somewhere under false pretenses? Oh, I think we can.


I missed that. Source?

eta: Yeah, I'm calling BS on that. Everything I'm reading says DHS specifically wasn't notified or involved.
Yeah so tack on another crime!

"But your honor I can break any law I want as long as I tweak the libs."
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Old 20th September 2022, 04:40 PM   #298
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Migrants file class action suit has been filed against DeSantis over his stunt.

Quote:
The group of Venezuelan migrants flown from Texas to Martha’s Vineyard, Mass., last week by Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis (R) filed a class-action suit against the governor and the state’s transportation secretary on Tuesday.

The suit provides a detailed account of how the migrants came to board the two planes allegedly under false pretenses, arguing the relocations violated their Fourth and 14th Amendment rights and the Civil Rights Act of 1964.

“These immigrants, who are pursuing the proper channels for lawful immigration status in the United States, experienced cruelty akin to what they fled in their home country,” the suit alleges.

“Defendants manipulated them, stripped them of their dignity, deprived them of their liberty, bodily autonomy, due process and equal protection under law, and impermissibly interfered with the Federal Government’s exclusive control over immigration in furtherance of an unlawful goal and a personal political agenda,” it continues.

The suit, filed in a federal trial court in Massachusetts, asks a judge to declare DeSantis’s relocations illegal under the Constitution as well as federal and state laws. It also asks the judge to prevent Florida from inducing immigrants to travel across state laws by fraud and misrepresentation.

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Old 20th September 2022, 04:46 PM   #299
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The money DeSantis used to fly the migrants to MA specifically states the migrants must be in FL but the migrants were taken from TX, flown to FL, and then on to MA. Stopping in FL is probably an attempt by DeSantis to circumvent that requirement. He broke FL law with this stunt.
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Old 20th September 2022, 04:51 PM   #300
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Originally Posted by Upchurch View Post
I missed that. Source?

eta: Yeah, I'm calling BS on that. Everything I'm reading says DHS specifically wasn't notified or involved.

Watch the vid linked at the start of the thread. "Angry Jane Curtin" (as I like to call her) is ranting about all of the mistreatment of the migrants. She claims that on top of everything else, DHS was assigning them falsified paperwork listing their addresses as random shelters.

This has been gone over in the thread, already. I'm surprised you missed it.
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Old 20th September 2022, 04:56 PM   #301
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
Watch the vid linked at the start of the thread. "Angry Jane Curtin" (as I like to call her) is ranting about all of the mistreatment of the migrants. She claims that on top of everything else, DHS was assigning them.falsified paperwork listing their addresses as random shelters.

This has been gone over in the thread, repeatedly.
Why do you have such a problem with calling her by her name? Rachel Shell.

Is 'triggering the libs' really that vital for you?
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Old 20th September 2022, 05:02 PM   #302
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
Watch the vid linked at the start of the thread. "Angry Jane Curtin" (as I like to call her) is ranting about all of the mistreatment of the migrants. She claims that on top of everything else, DHS was assigning them falsified paperwork listing their addresses as random shelters.
That was not related to DeSantis’s kidnapping scheme.

ETA: after re-reading, I take this back. That is an unauthoritative source and not evidence of anything
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Old 20th September 2022, 05:11 PM   #303
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Originally Posted by Upchurch View Post
That was not related to DeSantis’s kidnapping scheme.

Yeah, no...they were just passing through, and decide to stop to lend a hand after hours.

First you deny their involvement, and now you...deny their involvement.
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Old 20th September 2022, 05:13 PM   #304
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Originally Posted by Upchurch View Post
ETA: after re-reading, I take this back. That is an unauthoritative source and not evidence of anything

You know that is where most of the claims being referenced in this thread originated, right? That was also discussed extensively, earlier. Maybe read the thread and get some more context.
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Old 20th September 2022, 05:52 PM   #305
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Originally Posted by Upchurch View Post
That was not related to DeSantis’s kidnapping scheme.

ETA: after re-reading, I take this back. That is an unauthoritative source and not evidence of anything
It appears to be true that the false address data was entered by DHS, but also that this was a matter of standard practice. In other words, this isn't about collusion between the DHS and the DeSantis folks at all.


Quote:
“Before they boarded the planes, the migrants were processed by agents of the Department of Homeland Security who listed falsified addresses on the migrants’ paperwork,” said Rachel Self, one of the immigration attorneys who spoke to reporters in Edgartown.

[...]

While they did not directly respond to the claims, officials with DHS now say the allegation is not only unrelated to what they called DeSantis’ “stunt” of sending planes to sanctuary jurisdictions, but also appears to be a misunderstanding of how they process migrants at the border. When migrants cross the border and enter a processing center — such as those who crossed at Eagle Pass before making their way to San Antonio — they fill out a digital “notice to appear” form with the assistance of an agent, and print it out with their approval of the address. Migrants are asked if they have somewhere specific to go, and if they do not, are assigned a random location for their court appearance, DHS officials explained.


They leave with a packet detailing how they can change their address. But the packet of instructions is in English, and the entire process often overwhelms migrants already exhausted from the journey and eager to move out of U.S. custody, officials said.

Read more at: https://www.miamiherald.com/news/pol...#storylink=cpy
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Old 20th September 2022, 06:06 PM   #306
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Originally Posted by phiwum View Post
It appears to be true that the false address data was entered by DHS, but also that this was a matter of standard practice. In other words, this isn't about collusion between the DHS and the DeSantis folks at all.
Quote:
“Before they boarded the planes, the migrants were processed by agents of the Department of Homeland Security who listed falsified addresses on the migrants’ paperwork,” said Rachel Self, one of the immigration attorneys who spoke to reporters in Edgartown.

Now we are getting somewhere. People were up in arms over this stuff, and partially because this screeching harpy was portraying it as an egregious foul. As I said earlier, most of what people have taken as "fact" originated from her.

How can she call herself a respectable immigration attorney if she doesn't even understand the process? Of course everyone here jumped on every little thing she said as undisputed truth. Typical.

It might not be collusion, but I would consider it concerning that they took part at all. Especially since everyone is howling about the supposed illegality of the whole action. They performed a key function in the process.
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Old 20th September 2022, 06:12 PM   #307
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Originally Posted by phiwum View Post
It appears to be true that the false address data was entered by DHS, but also that this was a matter of standard practice. In other words, this isn't about collusion between the DHS and the DeSantis folks at all.
Quote:
Migrants are asked if they have somewhere specific to go, and if they do not, are assigned a random location for their court appearance, DHS officials explained.
Ah, so DHS have been either collaborating with Texas and Florida to make immigration as difficult as possible, or they are being utter ******* dicks as well.
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Old 20th September 2022, 06:21 PM   #308
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
Now we are getting somewhere. People were up in arms over this stuff, and partially because this screeching harpy was portraying it as an egregious foul. As I said earlier, most of what people have taken as "fact" originated from her.

How can she call herself a respectable immigration attorney if she doesn't even understand the process? Of course everyone here jumped on every little thing she said as undisputed truth. Typical.

It might not be collusion, but I would consider it concerning that they took part at all. Especially since everyone is howling about the supposed illegality of the whole action. They performed a key function in the process.
Well, the race to the bottom is progressing well, isn't it?

Illegal and immoral acts are passed over as acceptable if one can find enough participants in the act in various parts of society.

It's worth noting that this sort of loathsome acceptance of official wrong doing has long further racism and anti-semitism.
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Old 20th September 2022, 06:56 PM   #309
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It's worth noting that our subject's rejection of Christianity clears the way for the mistreatment and abuse of strangers who we are called upon by every religion to love.

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Old 20th September 2022, 07:11 PM   #310
phiwum
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Originally Posted by Norman Alexander View Post
Ah, so DHS have been either collaborating with Texas and Florida to make immigration as difficult as possible, or they are being utter ******* dicks as well.
I didn't get that.

First, the addresses are entered during processing. Nothing to do with the political schemes of DeSantis.

Second, they apparently need to enter an address. This seems to be a simple solution, but perhaps carelessly implemented. Certainly worthy of criticism, but not what is call utter ******* dicks.

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Old 20th September 2022, 07:16 PM   #311
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
How can she call herself a respectable immigration attorney if she doesn't even understand the process? Of course everyone here jumped on every little thing she said as undisputed truth. Typical.
Aren't we talking about a Massachusetts immigration attorney? They don't focus on too many asylum seekers crossing the border with no fixed address in the US, I'd wager.

If your client showed you paperwork with a home address that he's never been to and that was filled in for him, you might well think something's wrong here. And in fact, this practice is far from ideal. The court will be sending documents to an address that has nothing to do with the person unless he changes address[1], but the instructions for doing so are in English.

The attorney was not wrong to complain about this practice, but she was wrong to infer that these addresses had to do with the other shabby treatment the immigrants endured.

[1] Not positive about this being part of the effect. Might just be used for assigning a court and communication is handled in other ways.

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Old 20th September 2022, 10:41 PM   #312
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Originally Posted by arayder View Post
It's worth noting that our subject's rejection of Christianity clears the way for the mistreatment and abuse of strangers who we are called upon by every religion to love.

Huh? Not sure what that means, or who it applies to? DeSantis is a Christian, last I checked.
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Old 20th September 2022, 10:41 PM   #313
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The migrants flown to Martha's Vineyard have filed a class action lawsuit....

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Old 20th September 2022, 10:51 PM   #314
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DeSantis’ office hits back after class action suit from migrants, reveals 'consent form' they allegedly signed
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/des...legedly-signed

Quote:
The form reads: "I agree to hold the benefactor or its designed representatives harmless of all liability arising out of or in any way relating to any injuries and damages that may occur during the agreed transport to locations outside of Texas until the final destination in Massachusetts."

The above seems legit. No specific destination in MA is specified, either.

Quote:
The class action lawsuit alleges that the migrants were told they were going to Boston or Washington, "which was completely false," and were induced with perks such as $10 McDonalds gift certificates.

The above claim seems weak, considering the signed form (which was in English and Spanish). Also, how many gift certificates? I feel like critics are downplaying the perk, here.
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Old 20th September 2022, 10:52 PM   #315
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A lot of these people are uneducated, confused, desperate, scared, and feel powerless. It wouldn't surprise me if they really had no true understanding of what they were signing. How many of us sign things we don't really read thoroughly?

Every single one us has.
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Old 20th September 2022, 10:58 PM   #316
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
DeSantis’ office hits back after class action suit from migrants, reveals 'consent form' they allegedly signed
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/des...legedly-signed

Quote:
The form reads: "I agree to hold the benefactor or its designed representatives harmless of all liability arising out of or in any way relating to any injuries and damages that may occur during the agreed transport to locations outside of Texas until the final destination in Massachusetts."
The above seems legit. No specific destination in MA is specified, either.

That reads to me like they're talking about during the actual trip from TX to MA had has nothing to do with the pamphlet's 'aid' that they didn't even qualify for and it's only for refugees, not asylum seekers.
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Old 21st September 2022, 07:51 AM   #317
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The "I believe in limited government" to "the government should engage in human trafficking" pipeline.
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Old 21st September 2022, 08:46 AM   #318
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Originally Posted by phiwum View Post
Aren't we talking about a Massachusetts immigration attorney? They don't focus on too many asylum seekers crossing the border with no fixed address in the US, I'd wager.

If your client showed you paperwork with a home address that he's never been to and that was filled in for him, you might well think something's wrong here. And in fact, this practice is far from ideal. The court will be sending documents to an address that has nothing to do with the person unless he changes address[1], but the instructions for doing so are in English.

The attorney was not wrong to complain about this practice, but she was wrong to infer that these addresses had to do with the other shabby treatment the immigrants endured.

[1] Not positive about this being part of the effect. Might just be used for assigning a court and communication is handled in other ways.
The explanation in The Miami Herald makes it look like a federal agency is dealing with a federal issue and trying to spread the cases throughout the country. You have to figure Self would know this as this is, after all, literally her job.

I'm going to go out on a limb here and hazard a guess that the documents have been translated into Spanish by at least one of the myriad of aid agencies and churches in the border states and go out even further and suggest they're freely available. If I'm wrong, then somebody needs to get with the program, pronto.

What needs to happen now is Massachusetts needs to amend their refugee aid program to include asylees as well as refugees and push the sanctuary state to a whole new level.
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Old 21st September 2022, 09:04 AM   #319
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"Seems legit," Warp12 sez. ****. It don' gotta be legit. Ronnie Da Samwitch* dunnit! 'At's all. Dat ole ****** up in Dee Cee ain't gonna do ****. Fuggeddaboutit.

* Wuh kinda samwich? Baloney!
Or mebbe knuckle? Huh? Huh?
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Old 21st September 2022, 09:34 AM   #320
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Originally Posted by Warp12 View Post
DeSantis’ office hits back after class action suit from migrants, reveals 'consent form' they allegedly signed
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/des...legedly-signed




The above seems legit. No specific destination in MA is specified, either.




The above claim seems weak, considering the signed form (which was in English and Spanish). Also, how many gift certificates? I feel like critics are downplaying the perk, here.
The quote you excerpted refers to "the final destination in Massachusetts." If they were told that destination was Boston and they were told of benefits they would receive there (though they were ineligible), then they were hornswaggled and that form doesn't change that fact.
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