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Tags Congressional hearings , donald trump , impeachment , Trump administration , Trump controversies

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Old 30th November 2019, 07:14 PM   #201
phiwum
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
We need a poll. Maybe when it gets closer so people know what the evidence is.

Or we could have one poll now and one later to see who changed their minds.
PhantomWolf was just pointing out your terminology error. The House impeaches, the Senate tries.
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Old 30th November 2019, 07:16 PM   #202
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Originally Posted by PhantomWolf View Post
That doesn't explain how he would win though, all you are saying is that those that will vote for him regardless already, will still vote for him after impeachment. The problem he has though is that his base currently isn't large enough to get him reelected.

So how exactly would impeachment change those numbers?
Just think it will further entrench his current voters, add a few more who fall for his **** and a lot of people are too embarrassed to say they support Trump in polls, so say, undecided or hang up, then rock up and vote for him.

A kind of uber version of Winston Peters.
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Old 30th November 2019, 07:20 PM   #203
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Originally Posted by PhantomWolf View Post
I can say with 100% certainty that no Senator on either side of the aisle will vote to Impeach him.
Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
We need a poll. Maybe when it gets closer so people know what the evidence is.

Or we could have one poll now and one later to see who changed their minds.
He's playing you here Ginger. The Senate DOESN'T impeach. Impeach is what the House does. The Senate convicts removes and disqualifies.
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Old 30th November 2019, 07:25 PM   #204
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Originally Posted by phiwum View Post
PhantomWolf was just pointing out your terminology error. The House impeaches, the Senate tries.
And I was ignoring it because my other option was to express disgust at the pedantry. We all know that. Gawd, how many times does it need to be explained?

Sorry, PW. I was holding my tongue but phiwum broke it loose.
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Old 30th November 2019, 07:27 PM   #205
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
He's playing you here Ginger. The Senate DOESN'T impeach. Impeach is what the House does. The Senate convicts removes and disqualifies.
Yeah because none of us have heard that crap repeated a thousand times in this thread alone.
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Old 30th November 2019, 07:35 PM   #206
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
Just think it will further entrench his current voters, add a few more who fall for his **** and a lot of people are too embarrassed to say they support Trump in polls, so say, undecided or hang up, then rock up and vote for him.

A kind of uber version of Winston Peters.
The problem is that the polls are already showing that 52% of voters are saying that they will not vote for him, and with ~50% supporting impeachment and removal, if they see that the Senate won't do their job, they are just as likely, if not more likely, to be energized into voting to remove him themselves.

Likewise there are probably those that would have voted for him that on seeing the evidence will change their minds and simply not vote at all.

I also know that there are people that regardless of Impeachment, voted for him last time, or didn't vote "because Clinton" who are determined to vote against him this time.

So you are again left with the problem of where are these people who will be boosting his vote enough to win going to come from?
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Old 30th November 2019, 07:37 PM   #207
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
And I was ignoring it because my other option was to express disgust at the pedantry. We all know that. Gawd, how many times does it need to be explained?

Sorry, PW. I was holding my tongue but phiwum broke it loose.
If you know it, why are you still getting it wrong?
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Old 30th November 2019, 07:44 PM   #208
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
Just think it will further entrench his current voters, add a few more who fall for his **** and a lot of people are too embarrassed to say they support Trump in polls, so say, undecided or hang up, then rock up and vote for him.

A kind of uber version of Winston Peters.
If someone is too embarrassed to say they support Trump in polls, they should be asking themselves why. I've never been embarrassed by for whom I've voted and have had no problem saying so when asked.

Last edited by Stacyhs; 30th November 2019 at 07:48 PM.
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Old 30th November 2019, 08:12 PM   #209
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Originally Posted by PhantomWolf View Post
If you know it, why are you still getting it wrong?
Because it's tedious to constantly worry about it.

Does it bother you? Think people are all stupid and you have to constantly police them?

This is PART 2 of the House Impeachment thread. Do you honestly think you need to make sure everyone understands because I can't imagine there is a single person in this thread that doesn't get it yet.
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Old 30th November 2019, 08:14 PM   #210
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
And I was ignoring it because my other option was to express disgust at the pedantry. We all know that. Gawd, how many times does it need to be explained?

Sorry, PW. I was holding my tongue but phiwum broke it loose.
Uh huh.
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Old 30th November 2019, 08:38 PM   #211
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Originally Posted by Cabbage View Post
"We can give a pass on Republican hypocrisy because Democrats might employ the exact same hypocrisy 30 years from now"


LOL!



That's some nuclear grade whataboutism there, bro.

Tu quoque imaginarium

Last edited by WilliamSeger; 30th November 2019 at 08:46 PM.
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Old 30th November 2019, 08:52 PM   #212
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
If someone is too embarrassed to say they support Trump in polls, they should be asking themselves why. I've never been embarrassed by for whom I've voted and have had no problem saying so when asked.
Totally agree

In an ideal world that is how people like you and me work.

We have a piddly party here called NZ First, run by one bloke called Winston Peters that decided the govt last time (we have a system where this can happen)

They poll in the 3%s or 4s for years and then the election happens and they get about 6 or 7s

They come across as a bunch of xenophobes to play to weird old people.
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Old 1st December 2019, 12:40 AM   #213
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
All an impeachment decision will do is result in Trump winning again.

The dems and left media are just too dim to realise.
And in this hypothetical logic *not* doing anything would still have Trump win. Not least because he's doing the very thing he should be impeached for; tilting his chances by engaging in scumbaggery. And so if the Dems are gonna lose anyway, why not engrave into the historical record what the scumbag has done? And at least tarnish the POS for all time with the qualifier, "impeached."
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Old 1st December 2019, 12:43 AM   #214
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Originally Posted by Lurch View Post
And in this hypothetical logic *not* doing anything would still have Trump win. Not least because he's doing the very thing he should be impeached for; tilting his chances by engaging in scumbaggery. And so if the Dems are gonna lose anyway, why not engrave into the historical record what the scumbag has done? And at least tarnish the POS for all time with the qualifier, "impeached."

If you just left him to be embarrassing your entire country by himself the left press and potiticians wouldn't look so obviously handwringingly whingey.
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I generally oppose gun control, but I support the ban on assault weapons and I support a slightly longer waiting period to purchase a gun. With today’s Internet technology we should be able to tell within 72-hours if a potential gun owner has a record.

Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
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Old 1st December 2019, 12:55 AM   #215
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
If you just left him to be embarrassing your entire country by himself the left press and potiticians wouldn't look so obviously handwringingly whingey.
So what are these whingey politicians to do? You seem to think that a proper and fair process laid out in the Constitution is for wimps. Do they round up the offender and put him before a firing squad? Something in between?

By the way, I've pointed out a few times at least that I'm a Canuck. I watch these shenanigans going on to my south a lot more closely than for previous US administrations because of their gravity.
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Old 1st December 2019, 01:00 AM   #216
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
If you just left him to be embarrassing your entire country by himself the left press and potiticians wouldn't look so obviously handwringingly whingey.

Oh sure, giving a corrupt president free rein to do as he pleases is a perfectly sound strategy.
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Old 1st December 2019, 01:08 AM   #217
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A bit of reality

The agenda against the idiot was going on long before the impeachment prospects
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Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
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Old 1st December 2019, 01:10 AM   #218
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
A bit of reality

The agenda against the idiot was going on long before the impeachment prospects

That's nice, but it doesn't imply he shouldn't be impeached.
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Old 1st December 2019, 01:16 AM   #219
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
A bit of reality

The agenda against the idiot was going on long before the impeachment prospects
The idiot's criminal wrongdoing was going on long before he became president, and that criminal wrongdoing is ongoing!
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Old 1st December 2019, 01:17 AM   #220
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Originally Posted by Cabbage View Post
That's nice, but it doesn't imply he shouldn't be impeached.
All good

I apologise and acquiesce.

It is an utter waste of time that will backfire, when they could be actually showing a difference, but I genuinely do apologise.
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Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
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Old 1st December 2019, 01:23 AM   #221
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
All good

I apologise and acquiesce.

It is an utter waste of time that will backfire, when they could be actually showing a difference, but I genuinely do apologise.
Oh, I now see what the problem is: You're confusing your opinion with reality.

As you can see, many of us disagree with you.
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Old 1st December 2019, 01:32 AM   #222
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Originally Posted by Lurch View Post
And in this hypothetical logic *not* doing anything would still have Trump win. Not least because he's doing the very thing he should be impeached for; tilting his chances by engaging in scumbaggery. And so if the Dems are gonna lose anyway, why not engrave into the historical record what the scumbag has done? And at least tarnish the POS for all time with the qualifier, "impeached."
THIS.

Narcisists cannot bear the idea that not everyone loves them. Trump hates the idea of being impeached, because that will create a permanent stain on his presidency, an asterisk next to his name - that's all people will remember years down the line.

Cullennz, I'm guessing you are a sports fan, so perhaps I can relate this to you this way. If you follow cricket, you will know that Muttiah Muralitharan is the highest wicket-taker in the history of Test cricket. You will also know that there will always be an asterisk next to his name, and I'm guessing you will probably know why.
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Old 1st December 2019, 01:33 AM   #223
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Originally Posted by Cabbage View Post
Oh, I now see what the problem is: You're confusing your opinion with reality.

As you can see, many of us disagree with you.

Disagreeing is fine.

Don't blame you

I actually hope your right as Trump is an idiot.

Time will tell and all that

Just was pointing out how sometimes things backfire when approached stupidly
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Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
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Old 1st December 2019, 01:36 AM   #224
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Originally Posted by smartcooky View Post
THIS.

Narcisists cannot bear the idea that not everyone loves them. Trump hates the idea of being impeached, because that will create a permanent stain on his presidency, an asterisk next to his name - that's all people will remember years down the line.

Cullennz, I'm guessing you are a sports fan, so perhaps I can relate this to you this way. If you follow cricket, you will know that Muttiah Muralitharan is the highest wicket-taker in the history of Test cricket. You will also know that there will always be an asterisk next to his name, and I'm guessing you will probably know why.
Of course

I also remember Clinton still had his trademark smirk on his face after being impeached probably while remembering the dress, and no one really gave a crap in the end.
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I generally oppose gun control, but I support the ban on assault weapons and I support a slightly longer waiting period to purchase a gun. With today’s Internet technology we should be able to tell within 72-hours if a potential gun owner has a record.

Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
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Old 1st December 2019, 01:45 AM   #225
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
Disagreeing is fine.

Don't blame you

I actually hope your right as Trump is an idiot.

Time will tell and all that

Just was pointing out how sometimes things backfire when approached stupidly
Since we can't run a counterfactual, time won't tell.
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Old 1st December 2019, 01:45 AM   #226
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post

Just was pointing out how sometimes things backfire when approached stupidly

You think I'm unaware of that?? Look, that's exactly what I witnessed when the GOP impeached Clinton.

Go ahead and cling to the idea that you've had some original thought that never ever even occurred to me, if that makes you feel any better.
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Old 1st December 2019, 01:48 AM   #227
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Originally Posted by Cabbage View Post
You think I'm unaware of that?? Look, that's exactly what I witnessed when the GOP impeached Clinton.

Go ahead and cling to the idea that you've had some original thought that never ever even occurred to me, if that makes you feel any better.
Nice try, but I am not even American. You know more about the politics than me.

Trying to play the victim while extremely lefty like is silly
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I generally oppose gun control, but I support the ban on assault weapons and I support a slightly longer waiting period to purchase a gun. With today’s Internet technology we should be able to tell within 72-hours if a potential gun owner has a record.

Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
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Old 1st December 2019, 02:26 AM   #228
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
Nice try, but I am not even American.
I know.

Quote:
You know more about the politics than me.
Again, I know.

Quote:
Trying to play the victim while extremely lefty like is silly
No idea where this came from. Never tried playing the victim here, bro.
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Old 1st December 2019, 03:07 AM   #229
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
This is a test for our democracy. Is the GOP too corrupt to uphold the Constitution? Or should we just bury the nation and its principles?

If this isn't impeachable, what is?
I have started digging the Hole we can either bury 🦊 News and the Republicans or the nation, I have no hope for either at this point.
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Old 1st December 2019, 04:08 AM   #230
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According to this, Rudy is about to be indicted.

Legal storm clouds gather over Rudy Giuliani, America's tarnished mayor

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...y_to_clipboard
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Old 1st December 2019, 06:03 AM   #231
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Originally Posted by Trebuchet View Post
That would require taking an airplane. I used to work where they build them.
Boat? You could even travel west and go over mainland Eurasia, if you were so inclined.
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Old 1st December 2019, 06:51 AM   #232
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
A bit of reality

The agenda against the idiot was going on long before the impeachment prospects
Perhaps. And yet, that is irrelevant to the question: should Trump be removed for what he did?
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Old 1st December 2019, 07:05 AM   #233
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Originally Posted by a_unique_person View Post
According to this, Rudy is about to be indicted.

Legal storm clouds gather over Rudy Giuliani, America's tarnished mayor

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...y_to_clipboard
It's inevitable that Trump's fixer will be indicted. Just ask Michael Cohen. The question becomes, will Trump's lawyer's lawyer land in hot water? Trump's corruption cooties are mega powerful, able to withstand Kevin Bacon.
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Old 1st December 2019, 07:38 AM   #234
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
All good

I apologise and acquiesce.

It is an utter waste of time that will backfire, when they could be actually showing a difference, but I genuinely do apologise.
What do you mean by "showing a difference"? Given the situation that exists in the US, what do you believe Democrats should be doing, if not holding impeachment hearings?
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Old 1st December 2019, 07:42 AM   #235
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Quote:
The net tightened again last week when it emerged a grand jury had issued a broad subpoena for documents relating to Giuliani’s international consulting business as part of an investigation of alleged crimes including money laundering, wire fraud, campaign finance violations, making false statements, obstruction of justice, and violations of the Foreign Agents Registration Act.
Oof.
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Old 1st December 2019, 07:43 AM   #236
varwoche
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There's one thing I know for sure: Anyone who thinks they know with confidence how this will play out in the election is full of it.
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Old 1st December 2019, 08:11 AM   #237
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Have you people taken a look at the FOIA release by the State Department concerning Giuliani's activities? I mean, like yourself, not through some pre$$titute filter? They are here. Happy study.
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Old 1st December 2019, 09:07 AM   #238
CapelDodger
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Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
All an impeachment decision will do is result in Trump winning again.

The dems and left media are just too dim to realise.
That's gonna come back and bite you next November, mark my words.
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Old 1st December 2019, 09:20 AM   #239
CapelDodger
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Originally Posted by varwoche View Post
There's one thing I know for sure: Anyone who thinks they know with confidence how this will play out in the election is full of it.
Quite. The electoral fallout from this is literally incalculable. Which does make a nonsense of theprestige's argument that the impeachment enquiry is the result of a political calculation. One thing I'm certain of is that impeachment followed by a failure to convict by the Senate will not spark a wave of sympathy for an honest and hard-working President being unfairly bullied by the Democratic Party.
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Old 1st December 2019, 09:31 AM   #240
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Originally Posted by varwoche View Post
There's one thing I know for sure: Anyone who thinks they know with confidence how this will play out in the election is full of it.
One would have to be a regular Edgar Casey to do that; predicting the coming rise of Atlantis off the East Coast in 1989. Or an Ellen G. White predicting the reestablishment of slavery in the 20th Century. Or Jesus (or someone in his name) predicting he'd return in AD 69 or 70.

I predict that a lot of people will be unhappy.
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