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Old 17th May 2019, 09:04 AM   #1
theprestige
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Trump Hates Buttigieg Because He's Gay

No, not really:
Fox News’ Steve Hilton asked Trump whether he thinks “it’s just great” to have it “not even seen as a big deal” for a male presidential candidate to be onstage with his husband.

“I think it’s absolutely fine,” Trump responded in a clip that was posted on Thursday. “I think that’s something that perhaps some people will have a problem with. I have no problem with it whatsoever. I think it’s good."

https://www.politico.com/story/2019/...usband-1329624
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Old 17th May 2019, 09:09 AM   #2
BobTheCoward
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Should be interesting. The Breitbart comment section hates him because he is gay.

They also think the media is too focused on him being gay.... without realizing the website selects stories based on n their interest in the subject.
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Old 17th May 2019, 09:36 AM   #3
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Ambiguity in the thread title. It can be read to mean that Trump hates Buttergleg because Trump is gay.
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Old 17th May 2019, 09:43 AM   #4
theprestige
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Originally Posted by TragicMonkey View Post
Ambiguity in the thread title. It can be read to mean that Trump hates Buttergleg because Trump is gay.
You're welcome.
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Old 17th May 2019, 09:47 AM   #5
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The cynic in me says Trump has no problem with it because he knows there's a certain segment of voter that will have a big problem with it, and drive more votes into the Trump column.

Oh, wait, that's not the cynic in me, it's the realist in me.
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Old 17th May 2019, 09:56 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
No, not really:
Fox News’ Steve Hilton asked Trump whether he thinks “it’s just great” to have it “not even seen as a big deal” for a male presidential candidate to be onstage with his husband.

“I think it’s absolutely fine,” Trump responded in a clip that was posted on Thursday. “I think that’s something that perhaps some people will have a problem with. I have no problem with it whatsoever. I think it’s good."

https://www.politico.com/story/2019/...usband-1329624
How else can you possibly interpret this? "Some people" is how Trump refers to himself. "Some people will have a problem with it" means "I personally have a problem with it and will bring it up at literally every opportunity."
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Old 17th May 2019, 09:59 AM   #7
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Actually, haven't we been repeatedly told that what Trump says doesn't matter, that we can't take his word for anything?

You know,for example, if he says something bat-**** insane it doesn't really mean he's insane?

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Old 17th May 2019, 10:48 AM   #8
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I gather that Trump holds--or at least held--many liberal views, having spent much of his life hanging around in the celeb/arts/sports sphere. For instance, only until his jumping into the Prez race he was avowedly pro-choice.

His currently expressed views are at least a cynical adoption of what is necessary to secure his approval from his base, predominantly the white evangelicals.

Even more frightful to contemplate, he might be something of an empty, malleable vessel, eager to reflect any position of those from whom he needs approval. Or from whom he is beholden. We already see his flip-flopping arising from the influence exerted by the last person spoken to.
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Old 17th May 2019, 10:54 AM   #9
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Well if Trump is for it I now hate gays
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Old 17th May 2019, 11:13 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Trump Hates Buttigieg Because He's Gay
No, not really:
Fox News’ Steve Hilton asked Trump whether he thinks “it’s just great” to have it “not even seen as a big deal” for a male presidential candidate to be onstage with his husband.

“I think it’s absolutely fine,” Trump responded
Keep in mind that Trump has a history of proclaiming 'support' for the rights of the LGBT community, yet acts in a way that harms those same individuals.

When he accepted the republican nomination at the 2016 republican convention, he held up a rainbow flag. Since he became president, he has sought to:
- Ban transexuals from the military
- Allow businesses to discriminate against homosexual customers

Trump's claim that he's OK with Buttigieg is just empty rhetoric. Unless he is planning on reversing some of the policies his administration has engaged in, we can accurately label him as 'anti-Gay'
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Old 17th May 2019, 11:47 AM   #11
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Trump has got to be the absolute worst homophobe ever.
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Old 17th May 2019, 12:14 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by TragicMonkey View Post
Ambiguity in the thread title. It can be read to mean that Trump hates Buttergleg because Trump is gay.
No. Grammatically the antecedent to 'he' in that sentence is Buttigieg.
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Old 17th May 2019, 01:07 PM   #13
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I think it's a non-issue in the sense that we can't really know much about Trump from what he says, except that he presumably at least does not believe open gay bashing is appropriate or politic. Since he's a notorious liar and often inconsistent, all we can know for sure is his current position. That position is, at least for the moment, a decent enough one. My guess is that if he saw Buttigieg as a real threat, that position might change.
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Old 17th May 2019, 01:22 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by Lurch View Post
Even more frightful to contemplate, he might be something of an empty, malleable vessel, eager to reflect any position of those from whom he needs approval. Or from whom he is beholden. We already see his flip-flopping arising from the influence exerted by the last person spoken to.

It's been pretty well established that his opinion on just about any issue is identical to the opinion of the last person who talked to him about that issue for any length of time.
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Old 17th May 2019, 01:29 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by bruto View Post
I think it's a non-issue in the sense that we can't really know much about Trump from what he says, except that he presumably at least does not believe open gay bashing is appropriate or politic. Since he's a notorious liar and often inconsistent, all we can know for sure is his current position. That position is, at least for the moment, a decent enough one.
You really think Trump's position on homosexuals is a 'decent enough' one?

Mr. Donald "My V.P. supports gay conversion therapy" Trump has a decent position?

Mr. Donald "No Trans people in the military" has a decent position?

Mr. Donald "Lets nominate as many social conservative judges as we can" has a decent position?

Mr. Donald "This administration is going to try to interfere with court cases that allow discrimination against homosexuals" has a decent position?

Is the fact that he's not openly gay-bashing (and instead undermining them quietly) enough to be considered decent these days?
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Old 17th May 2019, 01:33 PM   #16
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Trump hates him because he has no idea how to say his name. It looks furrin' or something.
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Old 17th May 2019, 02:08 PM   #17
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I really have no idea what Trump thinks of gay people deep within his heart of hearts.

I know that he voiced his support for trans people and could point to Caitlyn Jenner as a prominent supporter. Until he set policy to discriminate against them.

I know he pointed to a few of his African American supporters, like Omarosa as evidence that he has no racism against black people. We could ask her what she thinks about that now.

He weirdly points to current black unemployment numbers as proof of how not racist his administration is. That falls into the "not even wrong" category. It would take at least several paragraphs just to untangle the weirdness of that claim.

And as far as gay people go, he seems very happy to support the people who want to discriminate against them and support the legislation they're asking for to do it.

I imagine that if Mayor Pete were to get the nomination, Trump's ardent supporters would be using Buttigieg's sexuality as part of their memes and efforts to mock and discredit him. I'd bet on some fake conspiracy theories involving Buttigieg's sex life. And I'll bet that Trump will be delighted to accept the boost such a smear gives his campaign.

It's not the people or groups that Trump personally loves or hates that concern me. I don't know if he truly believes in anything except himself. It's that he's happy to accommodate and weaponize and feed the racism that's prevalent in his base to empower himself.
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Old 17th May 2019, 03:01 PM   #18
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Trump has stated many things in contradiction to previous statements on the same subject.

No statement by Trump can be interpenetrated to mean he really believes anything at all or that his view may change from one moment to another.

In the attachment we can see Trump and his campaign in 2016 assert 5 different positions on abortion in less than 24 hours.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...=.fa4af4928c54
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Old 17th May 2019, 03:47 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by Lurch View Post
Even more frightful to contemplate, he might be something of an empty, malleable vessel, eager to reflect any position of those from whom he needs approval. Or from whom he is beholden. We already see his flip-flopping arising from the influence exerted by the last person spoken to.
What if he was re-elected with a Democratic Congress? Then, IMO, we'd have a transition to UHC and comprehensive immigration reform and legalized weed. So that isn't necessarily frightful to me. He'd probably go down in history as an effective president. He doesn't give a **** about the future of the GOP. There is the matter of his "base," but maybe he's malleable enough to tell them all to go piss up a rope.

I don't know why he has a bug up his ass about trans people in the Armed Forces. That kind of came out of nowhere. I don't think that's a big issue even with the so-called "base." Trump must have seen an advantage in it, but I'm not sure why.
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Old 17th May 2019, 03:51 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by Cavemonster View Post
I really have no idea what Trump thinks of gay people deep within his heart of hearts.

I know that he voiced his support for trans people and could point to Caitlyn Jenner as a prominent supporter. Until he set policy to discriminate against them.

I know he pointed to a few of his African American supporters, like Omarosa as evidence that he has no racism against black people. We could ask her what she thinks about that now.

He weirdly points to current black unemployment numbers as proof of how not racist his administration is. That falls into the "not even wrong" category. It would take at least several paragraphs just to untangle the weirdness of that claim.

And as far as gay people go, he seems very happy to support the people who want to discriminate against them and support the legislation they're asking for to do it.

I imagine that if Mayor Pete were to get the nomination, Trump's ardent supporters would be using Buttigieg's sexuality as part of their memes and efforts to mock and discredit him. I'd bet on some fake conspiracy theories involving Buttigieg's sex life. And I'll bet that Trump will be delighted to accept the boost such a smear gives his campaign.

It's not the people or groups that Trump personally loves or hates that concern me. I don't know if he truly believes in anything except himself. It's that he's happy to accommodate and weaponize and feed the racism that's prevalent in his base to empower himself.
That.
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Old 17th May 2019, 04:27 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by TragicMonkey View Post
Ambiguity in the thread title. It can be read to mean that Trump hates Buttergleg because Trump is gay.
Could be - he works very hard to make people think he isn't!!!! And the way he does it makes many people find him bad!!!
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Old 17th May 2019, 04:31 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by Cavemonster View Post
I really have no idea what Trump thinks of gay people deep within his heart of hearts.

I know that he voiced his support for trans people and could point to Caitlyn Jenner as a prominent supporter. Until he set policy to discriminate against them.

I know he pointed to a few of his African American supporters, like Omarosa as evidence that he has no racism against black people. We could ask her what she thinks about that now.

He weirdly points to current black unemployment numbers as proof of how not racist his administration is. That falls into the "not even wrong" category. It would take at least several paragraphs just to untangle the weirdness of that claim.

And as far as gay people go, he seems very happy to support the people who want to discriminate against them and support the legislation they're asking for to do it.

I imagine that if Mayor Pete were to get the nomination, Trump's ardent supporters would be using Buttigieg's sexuality as part of their memes and efforts to mock and discredit him. I'd bet on some fake conspiracy theories involving Buttigieg's sex life. And I'll bet that Trump will be delighted to accept the boost such a smear gives his campaign.

It's not the people or groups that Trump personally loves or hates that concern me. I don't know if he truly believes in anything except himself. It's that he's happy to accommodate and weaponize and feed the racism that's prevalent in his base to empower himself.
Yes to all of these. I haven't seen evidence that Trump is personally a homophobe. I'm sure he'd be happy if homophobes vote for him. He knows he's got their votes anyway, without saying anything overtly homophobic. His statement is clever. He says that "perhaps some people will have a problem" with Buttigieg's gayness without endorsing that view, because he knows he doesn't have to. He doesn't outright condemn the view either, only disassociates himself from it.
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Old 17th May 2019, 04:59 PM   #23
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Apparently some people do have a problem...
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Old 17th May 2019, 05:27 PM   #24
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I'm willing to believe that Trump doesn't hate gays, certainly not the way he does Blacks, Hispanics, and Muslims. His problem is going to be that most of his core supporters do. He'll probably have to change course to avoid losing votes. That's certainly never bothered him before.
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Old 17th May 2019, 05:32 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by Trebuchet View Post
I'm willing to believe that Trump doesn't hate gays, certainly not the way he does Blacks, Hispanics, and Muslims. His problem is going to be that most of his core supporters do. He'll probably have to change course to avoid losing votes. That's certainly never bothered him before.
I don't think so. As others have pointed out, his previous actions such as banning transgendered people from serving in the military makes homophobes/bigots very happy. His supporters obviously don't care what he says, it's what he does that matters to them.
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Old 17th May 2019, 05:56 PM   #26
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This is weaker sauce then when someone said Trump couldn’t be racist because he pardoned some long, long dead victim of a racist law.
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Old 17th May 2019, 05:57 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by applecorped View Post
Apparently some people do have a problem...
It’s funny how actions speak louder than words.
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Old 17th May 2019, 06:27 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
You really think Trump's position on homosexuals is a 'decent enough' one?

Mr. Donald "My V.P. supports gay conversion therapy" Trump has a decent position?

Mr. Donald "No Trans people in the military" has a decent position?

Mr. Donald "Lets nominate as many social conservative judges as we can" has a decent position?

Mr. Donald "This administration is going to try to interfere with court cases that allow discrimination against homosexuals" has a decent position?

Is the fact that he's not openly gay-bashing (and instead undermining them quietly) enough to be considered decent these days?
I did not mean to suggest that I think Trump's actual position on gays or much else is decent. My mistake for using the word "position," I guess. I merely meant that the statement under question is unobjectionable, though meaningless.
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Old 17th May 2019, 06:39 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by Trebuchet View Post
I'm willing to believe that Trump doesn't hate gays, certainly not the way he does Blacks, Hispanics, and Muslims. His problem is going to be that most of his core supporters do. He'll probably have to change course to avoid losing votes. That's certainly never bothered him before.
Just like his view on abortion, I doubt he was ever against it until it became a votes issue.
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Old 17th May 2019, 10:29 PM   #30
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I mean there are a few things genuine about Trump.

He probably doesn't drink.

He probably doesn't have a problem with gays.
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Old 17th May 2019, 10:43 PM   #31
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Originally Posted by Venom View Post
I mean there are a few things genuine about Trump.

He probably doesn't drink.

He probably doesn't have a problem with gays.
But he does things consistent with his statements about drinking (he doesn't do it).

He sure does a lot of stuff you would see from someone with a problem with gays.
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Old 17th May 2019, 10:57 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by Hellbound View Post
Actually, haven't we been repeatedly told that what Trump says doesn't matter, that we can't take his word for anything?

You know,for example, if he says something bat-**** insane it doesn't really mean he's insane?

I think the best way to proceed is to assume Trump’s word means literally nothing.
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Old 17th May 2019, 11:09 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by Venom View Post
I mean there are a few things genuine about Trump.

He probably doesn't drink.
He's incoherent enough without alcohol.
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Old 17th May 2019, 11:12 PM   #34
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Originally Posted by Beelzebuddy View Post
How else can you possibly interpret this? "Some people" is how Trump refers to himself. "Some people will have a problem with it" means "I personally have a problem with it and will bring it up at literally every opportunity."
You mean the way John Kerry and John Edwards brought up Dick Cheney's daughter's sexuality in the 2004 debates?

Originally Posted by John Edwards
I think the vice president and his wife love their daughter. I think they love her very much. And you can't have anything but respect for the fact that they're willing to talk about the fact that they have a gay daughter, the fact that they embrace her. It's a wonderful thing.
Originally Posted by John Kerry
If you were to talk to Dick Cheney's daughter, who is a lesbian, she would tell you that she's being who she was, she's being who she was born as.
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Old 17th May 2019, 11:21 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by Brainster View Post
You mean the way John Kerry and John Edwards brought up Dick Cheney's daughter's sexuality in the 2004 debates?
I don't see the issue.
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Old 17th May 2019, 11:22 PM   #36
Norman Alexander
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Trump doesn't give a personal damn if someone is gay, or transgender, or whatever. Simply because he doesn't give a personal damn about anyone but himself. It only makes any impact on his thinking if he is trying to seduce them, or his Veep or advisors tell him what he has to say bad about them.
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Old 18th May 2019, 01:09 AM   #37
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Originally Posted by Trebuchet View Post
I'm willing to believe that Trump doesn't hate gays, certainly not the way he does Blacks, Hispanics, and Muslims. His problem is going to be that most of his core supporters do. He'll probably have to change course to avoid losing votes. That's certainly never bothered him before.
No, he has those votes locked in.
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Old 18th May 2019, 01:11 AM   #38
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Originally Posted by Brainster View Post
You mean the way John Kerry and John Edwards brought up Dick Cheney's daughter's sexuality in the 2004 debates?
And wasn't that sweet of them. Unless you think it's a problem. Are you saying it's a problem???
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Old 18th May 2019, 02:02 AM   #39
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Originally Posted by Trebuchet View Post
I'm willing to believe that Trump doesn't hate gays, certainly not the way he does Blacks, Hispanics, and Muslims. His problem is going to be that most of his core supporters do. He'll probably have to change course to avoid losing votes. That's certainly never bothered him before.
I don’t think Trump hates any of those people: he’s probably completely indifferent to them. I think Trump only has an opinion on anything that can help or hinder his ambition. For example, prior to becoming a Republican candidate for the presidency, his opinion on immigrants, illegal or not was probably “hey, a source of cheap labour for my hotels”.

I think all the rhetoric you see and all the positions he takes on minorities are there because that is exactly what the people who vote for him want. He doesn’t really care at all.
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Old 18th May 2019, 02:26 AM   #40
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
No, not really:
Fox News’ Steve Hilton asked Trump whether he thinks “it’s just great” to have it “not even seen as a big deal” for a male presidential candidate to be onstage with his husband.

“I think it’s absolutely fine,” Trump responded in a clip that was posted on Thursday. “I think that’s something that perhaps some people will have a problem with. I have no problem with it whatsoever. I think it’s good."

https://www.politico.com/story/2019/...usband-1329624
So that means he has a problem with it.
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