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Old 19th November 2016, 10:56 AM   #1
fedupwithCT
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In Defense of Facebook Censorship

I'll be the first to admit that I trust the media but no matter what I say or do it seems like most people do not. Talking about the facebook censorship issue where Facebook is planning to fact-check trending news. I think this is a great idea as it will help readers avoid stories that may not be true.

A lot of people I know IRL have a huge problem with this and they go on rants about how Facebook will block certain news stories. Does anybody else agree with me?
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Old 19th November 2016, 11:16 AM   #2
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It's not a news story if some teens in Macedonia made it up.

Maybe a rating system of fact check-ability, though I doubt the people that eat that fake news up will pay any attention to being told it is fake news.

Here are the problems: Both FaceBook and the mainstream news make money on fake stories, or at a minimum distorted stories such as manufactured controversy, promoting controversy that they know isn't factual, and false equivalency. There is little to no motivation for promoting evidence based news.

Then there are the consumers of lies. They are not motivated to find out the stories they want or like to be true, aren't. And for the people benefitting off the promoted lies, all they need do is cry conspiracy and establishment suppression of facts.

So very easy to lead the sheeple who are not interested in critical thinking or else believe falsely that they are critical thinkers..
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Old 19th November 2016, 11:18 AM   #3
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I agree, I'm not on Facebook myself but from what I've seen via my friends and family the percentage of fake news stories currently exceeds the number of real news stories.

I know Facebook have been trying to avoid being a considered a news provider but at this point they have become one of the major news sources for many of their members and need to act accordingly.
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Old 19th November 2016, 11:23 AM   #4
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Short version, ******** (aka deplorables ) want to read/watch things that support their beliefs/likes and do not care if they are not true. Functional non - deplorables want real/true information that helps them make real, rational choices.
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Old 19th November 2016, 11:40 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by paulhutch View Post
I agree, I'm not on Facebook myself but from what I've seen via my friends and family the percentage of fake news stories currently exceeds the number of real news stories.

I know Facebook have been trying to avoid being a considered a news provider but at this point they have become one of the major news sources for many of their members and need to act accordingly.
It's funny you say this because most people who are on facebook will claim that they never use it for news, yet in the same breath they say they saw something extraordinary on the site

Facebook is pretty much a news empire at this point and they are walking a grey line here where if they do too much regulation they will turn people off but if they do it right, they can become the most powerful source in news. So far, most of what Facebook has touched has turned to gold, so they have a golden opportunity here too.
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Old 19th November 2016, 11:49 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by fedupwithCT View Post
I'll be the first to admit that I trust the media but no matter what I say or do it seems like most people do not. Talking about the facebook censorship issue where Facebook is planning to fact-check trending news. I think this is a great idea as it will help readers avoid stories that may not be true.

A lot of people I know IRL have a huge problem with this and they go on rants about how Facebook will block certain news stories. Does anybody else agree with me?
Facebook is a privately run internet site, and just like ISF, they can apply their own standards as to what can be posted on their property.

I've been had by fake stories a few times, and have learned to check with Snopes, or track down a second independent source.

At the end of the day it is the individual's responsibility to learn what is a credible source for news and what is not. The bad news is that the window for what is a credible news source is getting smaller all the time.
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Old 19th November 2016, 12:22 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by Axxman300 View Post



At the end of the day it is the individual's responsibility to learn what is a credible source for news and what is not. The bad news is that the window for what is a credible news source is getting smaller all the time.

It's hard to believe America is even considering the "fake news" censorship program. Aren't citizens empowered to make up their own minds in a free society?



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Old 19th November 2016, 12:38 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post

So very easy to lead the sheeple who are not interested in critical thinking or else believe falsely that they are critical thinkers..
wow
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Old 19th November 2016, 12:59 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by fedupwithCT View Post
I'll be the first to admit that I trust the media but no matter what I say or do it seems like most people do not. Talking about the facebook censorship issue where Facebook is planning to fact-check trending news. I think this is a great idea as it will help readers avoid stories that may not be true.

A lot of people I know IRL have a huge problem with this and they go on rants about how Facebook will block certain news stories. Does anybody else agree with me?
Depends. Do you trust Facebook, the corporation?
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Old 19th November 2016, 01:44 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by The Big Dog View Post
wow

Get with the program. The monumental failure of the majority of ISF "skeptics" to grasp what was going on while filling page after page each day with nonsense commentary about the latest "polls" is now Alex Jones' fault. We've always been at war with Eurasia.
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Old 19th November 2016, 01:56 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by marplots View Post
Depends. Do you trust Facebook, the corporation?
It's funny you ask that because I do trust facebook. I've often found the most hardened Conspiracy Theorist and privacy activist to be most active on Facebook, when I ask why they are using such a supposedly evil social network and then do all this other stuff to question other corporations or other media sources, it's funny to watch them squirm.
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Old 19th November 2016, 01:57 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by Axxman300 View Post
Facebook is a privately run internet site, and just like ISF, they can apply their own standards as to what can be posted on their property.

I've been had by fake stories a few times, and have learned to check with Snopes, or track down a second independent source.

At the end of the day it is the individual's responsibility to learn what is a credible source for news and what is not. The bad news is that the window for what is a credible news source is getting smaller all the time.
But sometimes having that choice is too much for people and they start believing everything that agrees with them, and only agrees with them.
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Old 19th November 2016, 03:29 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by Axxman300 View Post
At the end of the day it is the individual's responsibility to learn what is a credible source for news and what is not. The bad news is that the window for what is a credible news source is getting smaller all the time.
We've learned from recent events that individuals don't take responsibility for this. It led us to Trump, and it might be high time to start looking at remedies.
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Old 19th November 2016, 04:25 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
We've learned from recent events that individuals don't take responsibility for this. It led us to Trump, and it might be high time to start looking at remedies.
I'm all for Facebook taking responsibility as a de facto news outlet to do responsible fact cheking in advance, they have the perfect right to do so. I wait to see how they propose to accomplish the goal and still maintain a successful business model.

That noted, let's not kid ourselves that how humans vote everywhere at any time has not been essentially based on biased information seeking and unvetted information.

Nearly all news sources are untrustworthy to some extent.
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Old 19th November 2016, 05:22 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by fedupwithCT View Post
But sometimes having that choice is too much for people and they start believing everything that agrees with them, and only agrees with them.


scary road you're going down
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Old 19th November 2016, 09:33 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
We've learned from recent events that individuals don't take responsibility for this. It led us to Trump, and it might be high time to start looking at remedies.
First off, there is a long list of reasons that Trump is president-elect, Facebook and fake news isn't even in the top 50.

Second, messing with the First Amendment is playing into Trump's hands (you know, fascism).
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Old 19th November 2016, 09:40 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by fedupwithCT View Post
But sometimes having that choice is too much for people and they start believing everything that agrees with them, and only agrees with them.
You mean like Fox and MSNBC news?

We are in the Google-Wikipedia age where nobody knows how to process straight information, let alone filter out bad web sources. I went back to college, and I had four classes where we went to the library for a class session on what to look for when citing a credible source (edu, gov, etc), and we were all shown a Martin Luther King Jr website that is run by Stormfront (Nazis), and you have to look for their name in the fine print.

On Facebook I see posts from questionable - yet predictable - sources all the time. People who are anti-GMOs, Anti-GOP, and other issues are all prone to be suckered. I have been suckered a few times my own self (the last one was about a guy arrested with cow eyeballs in his rectum). These things pop up among the sea of cat videos on my feed.

I applaud Facebook for taking initiative on this subject.
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Old 19th November 2016, 10:56 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by applecorped View Post
scary road you're going down
Unfortunately the deplorables went down it.
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Old 20th November 2016, 04:02 AM   #19
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I for one welcome my corporate overlords.

I have no problem with them protecting me from information that may be incorrect.

I am glad that they will step in and stop me from making the mistake of sharing links to information that may be incorrect.

It is a good thing that these rich and powerful corporations are using there superior knowledge and position of trust to help us common folk think right.
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Old 20th November 2016, 04:46 AM   #20
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Originally Posted by Axxman300 View Post
First off, there is a long list of reasons that Trump is president-elect, Facebook and fake news isn't even in the top 50.

Second, messing with the First Amendment is playing into Trump's hands (you know, fascism).
I think you're wrong about the importance of fake news in Trump's rise, and nobody is playing with the first amendment when they want Facebook to factcheck news.
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Old 20th November 2016, 06:16 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by fuelair View Post
Unfortunately the deplorables went down it.
unfortunate for you perhaps, others are not so incontinent
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Old 20th November 2016, 08:15 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by applecorped View Post
unfortunate for you perhaps, others are not so incontinent
Many people were thrilled with the rise of fascism and narcissistic authoritarian demagogues the first time around, too.
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Old 20th November 2016, 04:56 PM   #23
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Just in case it isn't clear to everyone, what Facebook is going to do is stop promoting fake news stories in it's company selected trending topics.

They have no plans to delete people's posts or limit what people can post (at least not anymore than they have for years). They just want to make sure that news stories that they spotlight for everyone are real news stories not fake ones.
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Old 20th November 2016, 05:36 PM   #24
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(Grunch) who decides they're not true? Trump? Putin? Obama?
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Old 20th November 2016, 07:52 PM   #25
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To little to late, unfortunately.
both the Trump and Brexit campaigns waged a social media whirlwind of lies that needed somebody to clamp down, then.
Le Pen might get her referendum in France however, but would the English-speaking world care?
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Old 20th November 2016, 08:08 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by fuelair View Post
Short version, ******** (aka deplorables ) want to read/watch things that support their beliefs/likes and do not care if they are not true. Functional non - deplorables want real/true information that helps them make real, rational choices.
You're a bore.

That is all.
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Old 20th November 2016, 08:10 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by Open View Post
(Grunch) who decides they're not true? Trump? Putin? Obama?
Some of the examples were things like "Pope endorses Trump", which were untrue. If Facebook is big enough, and they are, that they can go vette these claims, good for them.

People will pay attention to their efforts and see how it turns out. If they start hiding or delaying stuff that turns out to be true, or slanting to one side or another, it will come out.
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Old 20th November 2016, 08:46 PM   #28
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I'd think it would put more liability on Facebook, not that a million or two would make any difference to them. If they promoted a fake story and somebody sued for libel, Facebook could have said, we just print 'em. Not our fault your girlfiend said you had sex with the dog. Now they have to say, we checked it out and believed you had sex with the dog and deliberately decided to tell everyone. They'll never miss the million.

Ottherwise, I can't see much difference. Somebody is behind the news stories, whether it's Facebook and other fake news sellers, or Facebook and other "serious" news outlets. Everyone still has to sort through it all and decide what to believe.

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Old 4th December 2016, 05:37 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by uke2se View Post
I think you're wrong about the importance of fake news in Trump's rise, and nobody is playing with the first amendment when they want Facebook to factcheck news.
Actually they are not. As a private company, FB and Google , etc. have an absolute right to search out, remove, ban the posters of the material, etc. As so few seem to understand, the Constitution only refers to the government censoring stuff, not private companies/news organizations!!!!
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Old 4th December 2016, 05:41 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by Open View Post
(Grunch) who decides they're not true? Trump? Putin? Obama?
It's legal, and should be done.
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Old 4th December 2016, 05:52 PM   #31
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Facebook is only giving another "safe space" for our cowardly liberal friends.
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Old 4th December 2016, 06:14 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by Axxman300 View Post
First off, there is a long list of reasons that Trump is president-elect, Facebook and fake news isn't even in the top 50.
You don't know that. We know that people interviewed who voted for Trump often cited falsehoods as their reason.

Originally Posted by Axxman300 View Post
Second, messing with the First Amendment is playing into Trump's hands (you know, fascism).
No one is saying to mess with the 1st Amendment. We'll be needing a united front to combat Trump's promised effort to make it easier for people to sue the news media for defamation if he follows through on his threats. As is is now, Obama made some poor choices, IMO, to prosecute whistleblowers.

But pressuring FB to clean up their act doesn't go against the 1st Amendment. For example, they could address the bots which spread fake stories. They could address foreign operatives that spread fake stories which might have an impact on an election.

You are looking at a narrow slice, an individual's right to make up a fake story and other individuals' rights to repost said stories. But how about a corporations responsibility to police their platform when the fake stories are having such a negative impact? And the news media has an obligation to report on bots and trolls spreading propaganda. One need not ban speech to identify the fact the source is a Russian agent or a teenager in Macedonia trying to direct traffic to their websites.
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Old 4th December 2016, 06:19 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by Open View Post
(Grunch) who decides they're not true? Trump? Putin? Obama?
This assumes fact checking is necessarily partisan. It doesn't have to be. If you track a story down about a pizza house conspiracy and find out it originated with a Russian in Crimea, surely it is not partisan to report that. If you find bots spreading stories, it's not partisan to report that.
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Old 4th December 2016, 06:30 PM   #34
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Thank you for including me!
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Old 5th December 2016, 12:54 AM   #35
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dickz
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Old 5th December 2016, 03:36 AM   #36
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The major problem I have is that I don't really want Facebook to be considered a legitimate news source.

At least as it stands you get to make the strong argument that any news taken from there has a high probability of being sponsored content, clickbait, a spoof, or just pulled out of someone's behind until verified by an external source.

The last thing I want is huge sections of society getting their information filtered by some opaque method instituted by a major corporation and saying "It's okay, they have to have policies in place to make sure content is legit". When you look at the terrible media sources that actually do front primarily as news (Fox News, the Daily Mail in the UK, and so on), I have no reason to think that Facebook will be capable of being more trustworthy.

Tinfoil hat in hand, are you really going to be happier for knowing that now you only see the news Facebook wants you to see?
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Old 5th December 2016, 06:51 AM   #37
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Unfortunately, were already over that threshold. There are people who get most of their news from their Facebook feed.
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Old 5th December 2016, 09:32 AM   #38
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Originally Posted by logger View Post
Facebook is only giving another "safe space" for our cowardly liberal friends.
You think posting lies as if they were true is a good thing? Remember it goes both ways.
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