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12th October 2017, 03:16 AM | #361 |
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Except you said earlier:
So, if there is evidence of a "massive debris wall" that can show us snapped off mastodon femurs, then why is it not showing us actual bits of the civilisation in question other than these buildings? Or are the other buildings, roads etc somehow more fragile than a mastodon leg? Or more prone to some sort of sorting? Considering we have ruins, we would expect the other stuff to be located near them. That's how pretty much all other sites work. |
12th October 2017, 04:26 AM | #362 |
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12th October 2017, 04:28 AM | #363 |
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12th October 2017, 05:13 AM | #364 |
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Small tsunami results:
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12th October 2017, 05:31 AM | #365 |
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12th October 2017, 05:32 AM | #366 |
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12th October 2017, 05:34 AM | #367 |
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12th October 2017, 05:36 AM | #368 |
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12th October 2017, 05:37 AM | #369 |
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12th October 2017, 06:07 AM | #370 |
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No one doubts that the ruins exist.
They doubt your un evidenced assertions. |
12th October 2017, 06:30 AM | #371 |
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12th October 2017, 04:33 PM | #372 |
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That's not true. The imagery and artwork found at Gobekli Tepe is found at other stone age archaeological sites in the same area. It's like other abandoned Mesopotamian sites, the people developed other later locations like Karahan Tepe.
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12th October 2017, 07:35 PM | #373 |
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12th October 2017, 07:36 PM | #374 |
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So, this scablands flood...where did the water go?
How much did it raise the ocean levels? |
12th October 2017, 08:58 PM | #375 |
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Originally Posted by Matthew Ellard
Your "lost agricultural civilisation" claim is thus debunked twice. Firstly by grain DNA evidence and secondly that the population was still there. |
13th October 2017, 06:13 AM | #376 |
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You're conflating and pettifogging.
Atlantis was destroyed by a global flood, about 12,500 years ago. The flood was released with this scablands event. GT dates TO this time period, and the site required a MASSIVE labor force as well as agriculture. AFTER this period...humanity took a nose-dive, and stopped building 'as intricate' temples and monuments. There WERE still monument builders, but the designs had lost much in craftsmanship, until they stopped altogether. We know humanity had advanced agriculture and massive settlements/cities, because GT was perfectly preserved by those who followed thereafter. |
13th October 2017, 06:22 AM | #377 |
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Cool drum temple: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FhoOA3pASy4
*We just don't build stuff like that anymore... |
13th October 2017, 06:27 AM | #378 |
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13th October 2017, 06:35 AM | #379 |
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13th October 2017, 06:37 AM | #380 |
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Atlantis is not historical fact.
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13th October 2017, 06:45 AM | #381 |
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13th October 2017, 06:48 AM | #382 |
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13th October 2017, 06:58 AM | #383 |
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13th October 2017, 07:01 AM | #384 |
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Plato did (and does) not have historical data on his side, and was well known for making up stories to make a point.
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13th October 2017, 07:09 AM | #385 |
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13th October 2017, 07:12 AM | #386 |
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Plato was a well written student, teacher, and historian. To completely make-up a tale of a non-existent city, to make a point, would have been a VERY weak point indeed.
Fiction CAN'T teach you how the real world works. History hopes to do so. Fiction is for entertainment. Plato wrote to teach. |
13th October 2017, 07:29 AM | #387 |
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Ok...the woo is coming out. I think I'll take scholarly word above your's KotA.
"The continuing industry of discovering Atlantis illustrates the dangers of reading Plato. For he is clearly using what has become a standard device of fictionstressing the historicity of an event (and the discovery of hitherto unknown authorities) as an indication that what follows is fiction. The idea is that we should use the story to examine our ideas of government and power. We have missed the point if instead of thinking about these issues we go off exploring the sea bed. The continuing misunderstanding of Plato as historian here enables us to see why his distrust of imaginative writing is sometimes justified." J. Annas, Plato: A Very Short Introduction (OUP 2003), p.42 This is quoted in the Atlantis Wikipedia article. However, the pdf version of her entire work concerning Plato is available for free in pdf form. Please inform yourself. |
13th October 2017, 07:42 AM | #388 |
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13th October 2017, 07:46 AM | #389 |
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He wasn't an historian.
Quote:
Quote:
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13th October 2017, 08:18 AM | #390 |
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There's no demand at the moment. I can't shift any temples at all. Pyramids and Catacombs are on a downer at the moment as well no customers for a few millenia. Same with cast iron train sheds and box girder bridges, not had any men in side whiskers or tall stovepipe hats asking after them for over a hundred years
Can I interest you in some glass, concrete and steel? |
13th October 2017, 08:19 AM | #391 |
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I assume KotA still has me on ignore, but for anyone who hasn't ever bothered to look into the original source for all this Atlantis stuff:
It's a work of fiction. Obviously. Plato at no point claims otherwise - one of the fictional characters claims it's true, but for obvious reasons that doesn't count. Plato isn't a character in the story, so nothing in the story should be attributed to Plato as if he said it - rather he was the author, and everything else was the dialogue of a fictional character. Furthermore, if you apply the standard KotA is to everything Plato wrote you have to take a lot of other things as "true" that he doesn't. |
13th October 2017, 07:16 PM | #392 |
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No. I'm reading the actual recent Anthropological prehistory papers on Göbekli Tepe comparing it's culture to other cultures nearby. Have you read any of these?
Although carvings on the three human skulls from Göbekli Tepe are so far unique, all other modification types have known parallels from Neolithic sites in Anatolia and the Levant (table S3). Cut marks connected with secondary burial customs are documented at numerous sites [for example, Tell Qaramel (5), Jericho (10), Körtik Tepe (27)], and ochre and other coloring substances have been found adhering to bones or as scattered layers covering skeletons [for example, Körtik Tepe (27), ’Ain Ghazal (9), and Jericho (10)]. Do you think Jericho, which shares cultural burial activities and population with Göbekli Tepe was also destroyed by a magical flood? If there were systematic agriculture around Göbekli Tepe then the salt tables would have risen exactly as they did in Mesopotamia. Why isn't this so? What is your "working hypothesis" to explain this absence? |
13th October 2017, 07:42 PM | #393 |
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The crude beer made at Göbekli Tepe for ritual feasts, as archaeologists found on the site, only used local wild grain species.
Can you explain why this is so if , as you claim, there was large scale systematic agriculture going on by a unknown civilisation? The role of cult and feasting in the emergence of Neolithic communities. New evidence from Gobekli Tepe, ¨ https://www.cambridge.org/core/servi...03598X00047840 |
14th October 2017, 05:27 AM | #394 |
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14th October 2017, 06:54 AM | #395 |
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14th October 2017, 06:57 AM | #396 |
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14th October 2017, 07:00 AM | #397 |
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14th October 2017, 07:02 AM | #398 |
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14th October 2017, 07:10 AM | #399 |
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14th October 2017, 07:17 AM | #400 |
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