Dear Users… (A thread for Sysadmin, Technical Support, and Help Desk people) Part 10 - Page 6

TragicMonkey · 20th August 2021, 09:13 AM

No kidding: I'm now having to explain to a consultant, via email, how time itself works. They're not getting that two separate sets of data don't match. The first set is all items within X years from this date. The second set is all items from January 2021-now, then FROM EACH ITEM look back X years to make a status determination. Consultant thinks that because both X are the same the two separate data sets should be exactly equal. I'm having to explain how things inside a date range are not the same as a date range relative to the things. He asked me "can you make them match?" Um, no. Neither time, nor math, works like that. Only if all items occurred on precisely the same date would that work.

BowlOfRed · 20th August 2021, 09:17 AM

Originally Posted by TragicMonkey

"can you make them match?" Um, no. Neither time, nor math, works like that.

I'm going to have a talk with your manager about how uncooperative you're being.

catsmate · 20th August 2021, 09:36 AM

I may have mentioned my abhorrence of Apple and all their empty promises previously but today my detestation was reinforced.
I was persuaded (by means of SO induced guilt tripping) to purchase a replacement case for the iPad of a neighbour (lovely septuagenarian lady, shame about the Apple aberration, but it was a gift). The current case having done its duty (too well IMO) and saved the accursed thing from shattering when dropped.

So I drop into my usual small IT place and chat with Gerry when he was free from anxious computer people. I'd picked him up a four-shot coffee and a pastry because he's a nice guy whom I've known for years (and in whose direction I sent quite a bit of business). I asked him for a suitable case: one that holds the accursed thing in place, can take a mild impact and isn't pink or garish. For a 6GEN iPad. I hadn't brought the damned thing because it's owner would be using it at lunchtime.

In the box of dozens of iPad and generic cases could we find one? No. Apple changes the design so often that none were definitely compatible with 6GEN iPad, as opposed to the plethora of other generations and variants (Air, Mini, Pro).

On the plus side when I dropped in to explain this, and pick up the case for the return trip tomorrow, I fixed her SkyQ remote's refusal to go left.

alfaniner · 20th August 2021, 12:03 PM

Originally Posted by catsmate

I may have mentioned my abhorrence of Apple and all their empty promises previously but today my detestation was reinforced.
I was persuaded (by means of SO induced guilt tripping) to purchase a replacement case for the iPad of a neighbour (lovely septuagenarian lady, shame about the Apple aberration, but it was a gift). The current case having done its duty (too well IMO) and saved the accursed thing from shattering when dropped.

So I drop into my usual small IT place and chat with Gerry when he was free from anxious computer people. I'd picked him up a four-shot coffee and a pastry because he's a nice guy whom I've known for years (and in whose direction I sent quite a bit of business). I asked him for a suitable case: one that holds the accursed thing in place, can take a mild impact and isn't pink or garish. For a 6GEN iPad. I hadn't brought the damned thing because it's owner would be using it at lunchtime.

In the box of dozens of iPad and generic cases could we find one? No. Apple changes the design so often that none were definitely compatible with 6GEN iPad, as opposed to the plethora of other generations and variants (Air, Mini, Pro).

On the plus side when I dropped in to explain this, and pick up the case for the return trip tomorrow, I fixed her SkyQ remote's refusal to go left.

I had a hell of a time as a solo Apple Developer because by the time I got an app ready, there was a new version of the iPhone out that had different screen dimensions. It wasn't as simple as programming a "fit to screen" module if you wanted an app to look right. So glad I got out of that.

arthwollipot · 25th August 2021, 11:41 PM

I'm on New Starter Requests again this week. And in my care, we're a full week ahead of the queue. In other words, all new starters who are starting up to a week from now have already been done.

I like being this far ahead of the queue.

Norman Alexander · 26th August 2021, 04:08 AM

Originally Posted by catsmate

I may have mentioned my abhorrence of Apple and all their empty promises previously but today my detestation was reinforced.
I was persuaded (by means of SO induced guilt tripping) to purchase a replacement case for the iPad of a neighbour (lovely septuagenarian lady, shame about the Apple aberration, but it was a gift). The current case having done its duty (too well IMO) and saved the accursed thing from shattering when dropped.

So I drop into my usual small IT place and chat with Gerry when he was free from anxious computer people. I'd picked him up a four-shot coffee and a pastry because he's a nice guy whom I've known for years (and in whose direction I sent quite a bit of business). I asked him for a suitable case: one that holds the accursed thing in place, can take a mild impact and isn't pink or garish. For a 6GEN iPad. I hadn't brought the damned thing because it's owner would be using it at lunchtime.

In the box of dozens of iPad and generic cases could we find one? No. Apple changes the design so often that none were definitely compatible with 6GEN iPad, as opposed to the plethora of other generations and variants (Air, Mini, Pro).

On the plus side when I dropped in to explain this, and pick up the case for the return trip tomorrow, I fixed her SkyQ remote's refusal to go left.

Helpful?

https://www.casebuddy.com.au/collect...a-454196828062

Filippo Lippi · 26th August 2021, 05:03 AM

I thought I was getting somewhere with standards and "quality" at work, but it seems not. Now feeling quite foolish. A bit like being British and believing that those who govern us should have a sense of probity.

catsmate · 26th August 2021, 11:27 AM

Originally Posted by Norman Alexander

Helpful?

https://www.casebuddy.com.au/collect...a-454196828062

Mmmmm, no, not really as I've obtained a rather nice case here (for €10.80) and wouldn't purchase from Australia anyway, given the delivery time and cost. Oh and they don't ship here.
They also appear to be grossly over-priced, a case similar to the one I got is AUS$50.

Thanks anyway.

Norman Alexander · 26th August 2021, 03:08 PM

Originally Posted by catsmate

Mmmmm, no, not really as I've obtained a rather nice case here (for €10.80) and wouldn't purchase from Australia anyway, given the delivery time and cost. Oh and they don't ship here.
They also appear to be grossly over-priced, a case similar to the one I got is AUS$50.

Thanks anyway.

I thought they were vastly overpriced too. We use a LOT of iPads at work. Most of them have covers. So we get lots of dropped units replaced, not to mention doctors wanting the latest model upgrades all the time. So I'm sure I could have scrabbled through our cracked and upgraded old units to find a potential fit.

catsmate · 26th August 2021, 11:45 PM

Originally Posted by Norman Alexander

I thought they were vastly overpriced too. We use a LOT of iPads at work. Most of them have covers. So we get lots of dropped units replaced, not to mention doctors wanting the latest model upgrades all the time. So I'm sure I could have scrabbled through our cracked and upgraded old units to find a potential fit.

Thank you. After forty minutes of searching through boxes we (the two staff and I) found a rather nice blue, fake-leather, case with built-in stand and pen holder which proved ideal.
But the variations, and the seemingly pointless changes to design......aaargh.

TragicMonkey · 1st September 2021, 03:40 PM

Grrr. Last year: "We'll have TM report on this data, but it cannot be used for Purpose X. Under NO circumstances should anybody try to use these numbers for Purpose X."

Today: "WHY IS YOUR DATA WRONG?!!?!? I'm using it for Purpose X and it's not working!! WHAT DID YOU DO, THIS IS YOUR FAULT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

arthwollipot · 1st September 2021, 09:31 PM

I've just come from a major training session for our new ServiceNow environment and... (I don't want to jinx this) it looks good. Functional, efficient, lots of useful features. Right now my biggest concern is getting the users to understand how much it can help them - how much functionality it puts into their hands rather than ours. We'll never be able to turn everybody into a power user, obviously, but the more people understand this new system, the easier my job is going to be.

I reckon we're going to change over to this new system and we'll all realise exactly how limited the old one is. We're not migrating any of the legacy data into ServiceNow so we'll need to run both for quite a while, and the contrasts will be stark.

Norman Alexander · 1st September 2021, 10:32 PM

Originally Posted by arthwollipot

I've just come from a major training session for our new ServiceNow environment and... (I don't want to jinx this) it looks good. Functional, efficient, lots of useful features. Right now my biggest concern is getting the users to understand how much it can help them - how much functionality it puts into their hands rather than ours. We'll never be able to turn everybody into a power user, obviously, but the more people understand this new system, the easier my job is going to be.

I reckon we're going to change over to this new system and we'll all realise exactly how limited the old one is. We're not migrating any of the legacy data into ServiceNow so we'll need to run both for quite a while, and the contrasts will be stark.

As an SN user, it certainly has good features. But the web interface design could REALLY do with a thorough review for better screen ergonomics and consistency. Clunky barely covers it. I've seen a LOT better interfaces on web-based products years ago.

arthwollipot · 1st September 2021, 11:32 PM

Originally Posted by Norman Alexander

As an SN user, it certainly has good features. But the web interface design could REALLY do with a thorough review for better screen ergonomics and consistency. Clunky barely covers it. I've seen a LOT better interfaces on web-based products years ago.

Learning the UI is certainly going to be the biggest part of the learning curve but I have no doubt that once I start using it on a regular basis I'll get used to it. It's definitely better than SCSM's UI, that's for sure.

Filippo Lippi · 2nd September 2021, 05:20 AM

"Our transfer process is failing, it worked yesterday before you did X?"
"Is this a particularly big file?"
"No, but you did X yesterday, is it because of that?"
"Can you try it again?"
"OK. It failed. Is it because of X?"
"I just don't understand"

FFS. First rule of support is "what has changed?"

I guess the second rule of support is "don't admit liability"

TragicMonkey · 2nd September 2021, 09:13 AM

Ha! All roads lead to TragicMonkey's data! Somebody requested something from my coworker, who asked me about it because it involves the increasingly niche set of data I mess with. Turns out somebody was trying to do a run around my chain of command to get at my precious data they're not entitled to have. What they didn't know is that it would of course circle back to me because I am the ultimate source of this particular kind of data. (It's not that I'm particularly skilled or special, I just happened to be the one who got the assignment a year ago that snowballed into this weird madness.) Ever'body wants to get their sticky hands on the hot sweet fruit of my glistening, musky SQL!

JoeMorgue · 2nd September 2021, 09:15 AM

At this point TM just write a small Python random number generator to create databases of pure numerical gibberish. It seems it would hardly making any difference seeing as how much they want the numbers cooked at this point.

Your users it seems don't want data, but some sort of "Give me the numbers I want before I even know what they are" device.

TragicMonkey · 2nd September 2021, 09:40 AM

Originally Posted by JoeMorgue

At this point TM just write a small Python random number generator to create databases of pure numerical gibberish. It seems it would hardly making any difference seeing as how much they want the numbers cooked at this point.

Your users it seems don't want data, but some sort of "Give me the numbers I want before I even know what they are" device.

Actually in this case they do want real data, but they're not supposed to have it. They're supposed to make certain financial decisions without knowing the things this data would reveal; otherwise it opens up potential for shady misconduct. I really don't think they're trying to do anything evil, though--I think what's driving this is that one team used to provide two pieces of information and last year I was made to take over one of them. I think that team is trying to fix it so I do the other thing for them, send them the results, then they can get paid to do nothing. I don't think they realized the sensitivity of the data would trigger attention to their requests.

Norman Alexander · 2nd September 2021, 05:39 PM

Originally Posted by TragicMonkey

Actually in this case they do want real data, but they're not supposed to have it. They're supposed to make certain financial decisions without knowing the things this data would reveal; otherwise it opens up potential for shady misconduct. I really don't think they're trying to do anything evil, though--I think what's driving this is that one team used to provide two pieces of information and last year I was made to take over one of them. I think that team is trying to fix it so I do the other thing for them, send them the results, then they can get paid to do nothing. I don't think they realized the sensitivity of the data would trigger attention to their requests.

Time for a pay rise!

How much would it cost to be a member of both those other teams? Can you aggregate the pay for both of those other positions into your current pay?

There's got to be an angle to this...

JoeMorgue · 7th September 2021, 09:01 AM

Trouble ticket that just hit my queue:

"I have a website that sends a code to my cell phone before I can login, but my supervisor has a policy where I we cannot have our phones out at our desks."

TragicMonkey · 9th September 2021, 08:04 AM

Oh dear. Not a user but another report person. If the intention is to use the data for marketing outreach it should be automatically assumed you exclude those people we know to be deceased. It's pointless at best, upsetting at worst to send advertising offers to the deceased. Particularly when you're in healthcare and there's a good chance the death happened on your own premises!

Hellbound · 9th September 2021, 08:15 AM

Originally Posted by TragicMonkey

Oh dear. Not a user but another report person. If the intention is to use the data for marketing outreach it should be automatically assumed you exclude those people we know to be deceased. It's pointless at best, upsetting at worst to send advertising offers to the deceased. Particularly when you're in healthcare and there's a good chance the death happened on your own premises!

But our offers are so good, even the dead want in on them!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Darat · 9th September 2021, 08:17 AM

Originally Posted by TragicMonkey

Oh dear. Not a user but another report person. If the intention is to use the data for marketing outreach it should be automatically assumed you exclude those people we know to be deceased. It's pointless at best, upsetting at worst to send advertising offers to the deceased. Particularly when you're in healthcare and there's a good chance the death happened on your own premises!

Typical livest!

Wudang · 9th September 2021, 12:39 PM

Originally Posted by Hellbound

But our offers are so good, even the dead want in on them!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Ahem! I believe the preferred term is "metabolically challenged".

Stross, pterry? Can't recall

Norman Alexander · 9th September 2021, 02:07 PM

Originally Posted by JoeMorgue

Trouble ticket that just hit my queue:

"I have a website that sends a code to my cell phone before I can login, but my supervisor has a policy where I we cannot have our phones out at our desks."

Sheesh. Toilet break.

arthwollipot · 9th September 2021, 06:31 PM

I had a weird call yesterday.

"I've got the commencement confirmation for the new starter, but the start date listed is the actual date that they will be commencing. Does that matter?"

a_unique_person · 9th September 2021, 07:25 PM

I hope you said "yes".

Norman Alexander · 9th September 2021, 07:30 PM

Originally Posted by arthwollipot

I had a weird call yesterday.

"I've got the commencement confirmation for the new starter, but the start date listed is the actual date that they will be commencing. Does that matter?"

Is it dated 31-June? Or 31-September?

TragicMonkey · 9th September 2021, 08:20 PM

Originally Posted by arthwollipot

I had a weird call yesterday.

"I've got the commencement confirmation for the new starter, but the start date listed is the actual date that they will be commencing. Does that matter?"

I bet they just left a "not" out before "the actual date".

arthwollipot · 9th September 2021, 09:29 PM

Originally Posted by TragicMonkey

I bet they just left a "not" out before "the actual date".

No, they were very clear. It was a phone call, not an email.

BowlOfRed · 10th September 2021, 12:34 AM

I read the stories of how the retail staff can defuse situations by just agreeing with the dumbness.

I'm too curious. I would immediately reply with "Why is that a concern? What date do you think should be listed as the start date?"

lauwersw · 10th September 2021, 03:05 AM

That's very easy to explain: they assume IT is incompetent and they should set the start date much earlier or IT won't be ready in time when the new user starts.

catsmate · 10th September 2021, 03:26 AM

Originally Posted by TragicMonkey

Oh dear. Not a user but another report person. If the intention is to use the data for marketing outreach it should be automatically assumed you exclude those people we know to be deceased. It's pointless at best, upsetting at worst to send advertising offers to the deceased. Particularly when you're in healthcare and there's a good chance the death happened on your own premises!

We're going to have to send Reg Shoe around for your next batch of diversity training, aren't we?

TragicMonkey · 10th September 2021, 05:56 AM

Originally Posted by arthwollipot

No, they were very clear. It was a phone call, not an email.

Oh. In that case the answer to "does that matter?" is "ultimately, nothing matters" and hang up. If people are going to ask philosophical questions they deserve philosophical answers. Consider the yawning gulfs of eternity and the immensity of the universe! Contemplate mortality! Clearly this person's starting date cannot matter in the least tiny bit, not when compared to the full scale of existence. Even an omnicognizant loving god would have to consider such a matter trivial to the point of contempt. Really, it's practically an affront to a possible deity to even mention it. You should file an intolerant workplace complaint with HR because this person committed tacit blasphemy by asking you that question. I wouldn't settle for anything less than five thousand bucks and an extra week of vacation time.

Norman Alexander · 10th September 2021, 06:53 AM

...omnicog??

Wudang · 10th September 2021, 06:59 AM

Originally Posted by arthwollipot

I had a weird call yesterday.

"I've got the commencement confirmation for the new starter, but the start date listed is the actual date that they will be commencing. Does that matter?"

I vaguely wondered if they were thinking of "commencement" as a ceremony (which begs the question of what kind of job would have that on start day) but then saw they say "commencing" so yeah I got nothing.

I've only been in IT since 1984 and don't do drugs these days so users are still beyond me.

alfaniner · 10th September 2021, 07:06 AM

Originally Posted by arthwollipot

I had a weird call yesterday.

"I've got the commencement confirmation for the new starter, but the start date listed is the actual date that they will be commencing. Does that matter?"

Just trying to parse it -- perhaps the user wondered if the "commencement confirmation" meant it started as of the notification time, as opposed to the listed start date.

Dr. Keith · 10th September 2021, 08:00 AM

Originally Posted by arthwollipot

No, they were very clear. It was a phone call, not an email.

I often have to ask people why they are calling me and it is sometimes hard to do so without being rude. I tend to play dumb because I just don’t care if they think I’m dumb and it makes my life easier.

Caller: <long story>

Dr: Ok.

C: what do you think?

Dr: I need more coffee?

JoeMorgue · 10th September 2021, 01:38 PM

Our SLA gives us 3 business days to make new user accounts.

HR has sent us 12 new hire requests since 3:30 for people who start first thing Monday morning.

alfaniner · 10th September 2021, 01:54 PM

Originally Posted by JoeMorgue

Our SLA gives us 3 business days to make new user accounts.

HR has sent us 12 new hire requests since 3:30 for people who start first thing Monday morning.

"Welp...! Gotta get my work done before the weekend!"

20th August 2021, 09:13 AM	#201
TragicMonkey Poisoned Waffles Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Monkey Posts: 66,035	No kidding: I'm now having to explain to a consultant, via email, how time itself works. They're not getting that two separate sets of data don't match. The first set is all items within X years from this date. The second set is all items from January 2021-now, then FROM EACH ITEM look back X years to make a status determination. Consultant thinks that because both X are the same the two separate data sets should be exactly equal. I'm having to explain how things inside a date range are not the same as a date range relative to the things. He asked me "can you make them match?" Um, no. Neither time, nor math, works like that. Only if all items occurred on precisely the same date would that work.
	__________________ You added nothing to that conversation, Barbara.

20th August 2021, 09:36 AM	#203
catsmate No longer the 1 Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 28,613	I hate iPads. I may have mentioned my abhorrence of Apple and all their empty promises previously but today my detestation was reinforced. I was persuaded (by means of SO induced guilt tripping) to purchase a replacement case for the iPad of a neighbour (lovely septuagenarian lady, shame about the Apple aberration, but it was a gift). The current case having done its duty (too well IMO) and saved the accursed thing from shattering when dropped. So I drop into my usual small IT place and chat with Gerry when he was free from anxious computer people. I'd picked him up a four-shot coffee and a pastry because he's a nice guy whom I've known for years (and in whose direction I sent quite a bit of business). I asked him for a suitable case: one that holds the accursed thing in place, can take a mild impact and isn't pink or garish. For a 6GEN iPad. I hadn't brought the damned thing because it's owner would be using it at lunchtime. In the box of dozens of iPad and generic cases could we find one? No. Apple changes the design so often that none were definitely compatible with 6GEN iPad, as opposed to the plethora of other generations and variants (Air, Mini, Pro). On the plus side when I dropped in to explain this, and pick up the case for the return trip tomorrow, I fixed her SkyQ remote's refusal to go left.
	__________________ As human right is always something given, it always in reality reduces to the right which men give, "concede," to each other. If the right to existence is conceded to new-born children, then they have the right; if it is not conceded to them, as was the case among the Spartans and ancient Romans, then they do not have it. For only society can give or concede it to them; they themselves cannot take it, or give it to themselves.

20th August 2021, 12:03 PM	#204
alfaniner Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Sorth Dakonsin Posts: 27,901	Originally Posted by catsmate I may have mentioned my abhorrence of Apple and all their empty promises previously but today my detestation was reinforced. I was persuaded (by means of SO induced guilt tripping) to purchase a replacement case for the iPad of a neighbour (lovely septuagenarian lady, shame about the Apple aberration, but it was a gift). The current case having done its duty (too well IMO) and saved the accursed thing from shattering when dropped. So I drop into my usual small IT place and chat with Gerry when he was free from anxious computer people. I'd picked him up a four-shot coffee and a pastry because he's a nice guy whom I've known for years (and in whose direction I sent quite a bit of business). I asked him for a suitable case: one that holds the accursed thing in place, can take a mild impact and isn't pink or garish. For a 6GEN iPad. I hadn't brought the damned thing because it's owner would be using it at lunchtime. In the box of dozens of iPad and generic cases could we find one? No. Apple changes the design so often that none were definitely compatible with 6GEN iPad, as opposed to the plethora of other generations and variants (Air, Mini, Pro). On the plus side when I dropped in to explain this, and pick up the case for the return trip tomorrow, I fixed her SkyQ remote's refusal to go left. I had a hell of a time as a solo Apple Developer because by the time I got an app ready, there was a new version of the iPhone out that had different screen dimensions. It wasn't as simple as programming a "fit to screen" module if you wanted an app to look right. So glad I got out of that.
	__________________ Science is self-correcting. Woo is self-contradicting.

25th August 2021, 11:41 PM	#205
arthwollipot Observer of Phenomena Pronouns: he/him Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Ngunnawal Country Posts: 82,098	I'm on New Starter Requests again this week. And in my care, we're a full week ahead of the queue. In other words, all new starters who are starting up to a week from now have already been done. I like being this far ahead of the queue.
	__________________ Слава Україні! Героям Слава! 20220224 - 20230224

26th August 2021, 04:08 AM	#206
Norman Alexander Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: Dharug & Gundungurra Posts: 14,983	Originally Posted by catsmate I may have mentioned my abhorrence of Apple and all their empty promises previously but today my detestation was reinforced. I was persuaded (by means of SO induced guilt tripping) to purchase a replacement case for the iPad of a neighbour (lovely septuagenarian lady, shame about the Apple aberration, but it was a gift). The current case having done its duty (too well IMO) and saved the accursed thing from shattering when dropped. So I drop into my usual small IT place and chat with Gerry when he was free from anxious computer people. I'd picked him up a four-shot coffee and a pastry because he's a nice guy whom I've known for years (and in whose direction I sent quite a bit of business). I asked him for a suitable case: one that holds the accursed thing in place, can take a mild impact and isn't pink or garish. For a 6GEN iPad. I hadn't brought the damned thing because it's owner would be using it at lunchtime. In the box of dozens of iPad and generic cases could we find one? No. Apple changes the design so often that none were definitely compatible with 6GEN iPad, as opposed to the plethora of other generations and variants (Air, Mini, Pro). On the plus side when I dropped in to explain this, and pick up the case for the return trip tomorrow, I fixed her SkyQ remote's refusal to go left. Helpful? https://www.casebuddy.com.au/collect...a-454196828062
	__________________ _{...our governments are just trying to protect us from terror. In the same way that someone banging a hornets’ nest with a stick is trying to protect us from hornets. Frankie Boyle, Guardian, July 2015}

20th August 2021, 09:17 AM	#202
BowlOfRed Master Poster Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Silicon Valley Posts: 2,341	Originally Posted by TragicMonkey "can you make them match?" Um, no. Neither time, nor math, works like that. I'm going to have a talk with your manager about how uncooperative you're being.

26th August 2021, 05:03 AM	#207
Filippo Lippi Illuminator Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 4,377	I thought I was getting somewhere with standards and "quality" at work, but it seems not. Now feeling quite foolish. A bit like being British and believing that those who govern us should have a sense of probity.
	__________________ You can't defeat fascism through debate because it's not simply an idea, proposal or theory. It's a fundamentally flawed way of looking at the world. It's a distorting prism, emotionally charged and completely logic-proof. You may as well challenge rabies to a game of Boggle. @ViolettaCrisis

26th August 2021, 11:27 AM	#208
catsmate No longer the 1 Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 28,613	Originally Posted by Norman Alexander Helpful? https://www.casebuddy.com.au/collect...a-454196828062 Mmmmm, no, not really as I've obtained a rather nice case here (for €10.80) and wouldn't purchase from Australia anyway, given the delivery time and cost. Oh and they don't ship here. They also appear to be grossly over-priced, a case similar to the one I got is AUS$50. Thanks anyway.
	__________________ As human right is always something given, it always in reality reduces to the right which men give, "concede," to each other. If the right to existence is conceded to new-born children, then they have the right; if it is not conceded to them, as was the case among the Spartans and ancient Romans, then they do not have it. For only society can give or concede it to them; they themselves cannot take it, or give it to themselves.

26th August 2021, 03:08 PM	#209
Norman Alexander Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: Dharug & Gundungurra Posts: 14,983	Originally Posted by catsmate Mmmmm, no, not really as I've obtained a rather nice case here (for €10.80) and wouldn't purchase from Australia anyway, given the delivery time and cost. Oh and they don't ship here. They also appear to be grossly over-priced, a case similar to the one I got is AUS$50. Thanks anyway. I thought they were vastly overpriced too. We use a LOT of iPads at work. Most of them have covers. So we get lots of dropped units replaced, not to mention doctors wanting the latest model upgrades all the time. So I'm sure I could have scrabbled through our cracked and upgraded old units to find a potential fit.
	__________________ _{...our governments are just trying to protect us from terror. In the same way that someone banging a hornets’ nest with a stick is trying to protect us from hornets. Frankie Boyle, Guardian, July 2015}

26th August 2021, 11:45 PM	#210
catsmate No longer the 1 Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 28,613	Originally Posted by Norman Alexander I thought they were vastly overpriced too. We use a LOT of iPads at work. Most of them have covers. So we get lots of dropped units replaced, not to mention doctors wanting the latest model upgrades all the time. So I'm sure I could have scrabbled through our cracked and upgraded old units to find a potential fit. Thank you. After forty minutes of searching through boxes we (the two staff and I) found a rather nice blue, fake-leather, case with built-in stand and pen holder which proved ideal. But the variations, and the seemingly pointless changes to design......aaargh.
	__________________ As human right is always something given, it always in reality reduces to the right which men give, "concede," to each other. If the right to existence is conceded to new-born children, then they have the right; if it is not conceded to them, as was the case among the Spartans and ancient Romans, then they do not have it. For only society can give or concede it to them; they themselves cannot take it, or give it to themselves.

1st September 2021, 03:40 PM	#211
TragicMonkey Poisoned Waffles Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Monkey Posts: 66,035	Grrr. Last year: "We'll have TM report on this data, but it cannot be used for Purpose X. Under NO circumstances should anybody try to use these numbers for Purpose X." Today: "WHY IS YOUR DATA WRONG?!!?!? I'm using it for Purpose X and it's not working!! WHAT DID YOU DO, THIS IS YOUR FAULT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"
	__________________ You added nothing to that conversation, Barbara.

1st September 2021, 09:31 PM	#212
arthwollipot Observer of Phenomena Pronouns: he/him Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Ngunnawal Country Posts: 82,098	I've just come from a major training session for our new ServiceNow environment and... (I don't want to jinx this) it looks good. Functional, efficient, lots of useful features. Right now my biggest concern is getting the users to understand how much it can help them - how much functionality it puts into their hands rather than ours. We'll never be able to turn everybody into a power user, obviously, but the more people understand this new system, the easier my job is going to be. I reckon we're going to change over to this new system and we'll all realise exactly how limited the old one is. We're not migrating any of the legacy data into ServiceNow so we'll need to run both for quite a while, and the contrasts will be stark.
	__________________ Слава Україні! Героям Слава! 20220224 - 20230224

1st September 2021, 10:32 PM	#213
Norman Alexander Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: Dharug & Gundungurra Posts: 14,983	Originally Posted by arthwollipot I've just come from a major training session for our new ServiceNow environment and... (I don't want to jinx this) it looks good. Functional, efficient, lots of useful features. Right now my biggest concern is getting the users to understand how much it can help them - how much functionality it puts into their hands rather than ours. We'll never be able to turn everybody into a power user, obviously, but the more people understand this new system, the easier my job is going to be. I reckon we're going to change over to this new system and we'll all realise exactly how limited the old one is. We're not migrating any of the legacy data into ServiceNow so we'll need to run both for quite a while, and the contrasts will be stark. As an SN user, it certainly has good features. But the web interface design could REALLY do with a thorough review for better screen ergonomics and consistency. Clunky barely covers it. I've seen a LOT better interfaces on web-based products years ago.
	__________________ _{...our governments are just trying to protect us from terror. In the same way that someone banging a hornets’ nest with a stick is trying to protect us from hornets. Frankie Boyle, Guardian, July 2015}

1st September 2021, 11:32 PM	#214
arthwollipot Observer of Phenomena Pronouns: he/him Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Ngunnawal Country Posts: 82,098	Originally Posted by Norman Alexander As an SN user, it certainly has good features. But the web interface design could REALLY do with a thorough review for better screen ergonomics and consistency. Clunky barely covers it. I've seen a LOT better interfaces on web-based products years ago. Learning the UI is certainly going to be the biggest part of the learning curve but I have no doubt that once I start using it on a regular basis I'll get used to it. It's definitely better than SCSM's UI, that's for sure.
	__________________ Слава Україні! Героям Слава! 20220224 - 20230224

2nd September 2021, 05:20 AM	#215
Filippo Lippi Illuminator Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 4,377	"Our transfer process is failing, it worked yesterday before you did X?" "Is this a particularly big file?" "No, but you did X yesterday, is it because of that?" "Can you try it again?" "OK. It failed. Is it because of X?" "I just don't understand" FFS. First rule of support is "what has changed?" I guess the second rule of support is "don't admit liability"
	__________________ You can't defeat fascism through debate because it's not simply an idea, proposal or theory. It's a fundamentally flawed way of looking at the world. It's a distorting prism, emotionally charged and completely logic-proof. You may as well challenge rabies to a game of Boggle. @ViolettaCrisis

2nd September 2021, 09:13 AM	#216
TragicMonkey Poisoned Waffles Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Monkey Posts: 66,035	Ha! All roads lead to TragicMonkey's data! Somebody requested something from my coworker, who asked me about it because it involves the increasingly niche set of data I mess with. Turns out somebody was trying to do a run around my chain of command to get at my precious data they're not entitled to have. What they didn't know is that it would of course circle back to me because I am the ultimate source of this particular kind of data. (It's not that I'm particularly skilled or special, I just happened to be the one who got the assignment a year ago that snowballed into this weird madness.) Ever'body wants to get their sticky hands on the hot sweet fruit of my glistening, musky SQL!
	__________________ You added nothing to that conversation, Barbara.

2nd September 2021, 09:15 AM	#217
JoeMorgue Self Employed Remittance Man Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Florida Posts: 44,114	At this point TM just write a small Python random number generator to create databases of pure numerical gibberish. It seems it would hardly making any difference seeing as how much they want the numbers cooked at this point. Your users it seems don't want data, but some sort of "Give me the numbers I want before I even know what they are" device.
	__________________ "If everyone in the room says water is wet and I say it's dry that makes me smart because at least I'm thinking for myself!" - The Proudly Wrong. Last edited by JoeMorgue; 2nd September 2021 at 09:16 AM.

2nd September 2021, 09:40 AM	#218
TragicMonkey Poisoned Waffles Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Monkey Posts: 66,035	Originally Posted by JoeMorgue At this point TM just write a small Python random number generator to create databases of pure numerical gibberish. It seems it would hardly making any difference seeing as how much they want the numbers cooked at this point. Your users it seems don't want data, but some sort of "Give me the numbers I want before I even know what they are" device. Actually in this case they do want real data, but they're not supposed to have it. They're supposed to make certain financial decisions without knowing the things this data would reveal; otherwise it opens up potential for shady misconduct. I really don't think they're trying to do anything evil, though--I think what's driving this is that one team used to provide two pieces of information and last year I was made to take over one of them. I think that team is trying to fix it so I do the other thing for them, send them the results, then they can get paid to do nothing. I don't think they realized the sensitivity of the data would trigger attention to their requests.
	__________________ You added nothing to that conversation, Barbara.

2nd September 2021, 05:39 PM	#219
Norman Alexander Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: Dharug & Gundungurra Posts: 14,983	Originally Posted by TragicMonkey Actually in this case they do want real data, but they're not supposed to have it. They're supposed to make certain financial decisions without knowing the things this data would reveal; otherwise it opens up potential for shady misconduct. I really don't think they're trying to do anything evil, though--I think what's driving this is that one team used to provide two pieces of information and last year I was made to take over one of them. I think that team is trying to fix it so I do the other thing for them, send them the results, then they can get paid to do nothing. I don't think they realized the sensitivity of the data would trigger attention to their requests. Time for a pay rise! How much would it cost to be a member of both those other teams? Can you aggregate the pay for both of those other positions into your current pay? There's got to be an angle to this...
	__________________ _{...our governments are just trying to protect us from terror. In the same way that someone banging a hornets’ nest with a stick is trying to protect us from hornets. Frankie Boyle, Guardian, July 2015}

7th September 2021, 09:01 AM	#220
JoeMorgue Self Employed Remittance Man Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Florida Posts: 44,114	Trouble ticket that just hit my queue: "I have a website that sends a code to my cell phone before I can login, but my supervisor has a policy where I we cannot have our phones out at our desks."
	__________________ "If everyone in the room says water is wet and I say it's dry that makes me smart because at least I'm thinking for myself!" - The Proudly Wrong.

9th September 2021, 08:04 AM	#221
TragicMonkey Poisoned Waffles Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Monkey Posts: 66,035	Oh dear. Not a user but another report person. If the intention is to use the data for marketing outreach it should be automatically assumed you exclude those people we know to be deceased. It's pointless at best, upsetting at worst to send advertising offers to the deceased. Particularly when you're in healthcare and there's a good chance the death happened on your own premises!
	__________________ You added nothing to that conversation, Barbara.

9th September 2021, 08:15 AM	#222
Hellbound Merchant of Doom Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Not in Hell, but I can see it from here on a clear day... Posts: 15,112	Originally Posted by TragicMonkey Oh dear. Not a user but another report person. If the intention is to use the data for marketing outreach it should be automatically assumed you exclude those people we know to be deceased. It's pointless at best, upsetting at worst to send advertising offers to the deceased. Particularly when you're in healthcare and there's a good chance the death happened on your own premises! But our offers are so good, even the dead want in on them! Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
	__________________ History does not always repeat itself. Sometimes it just yells "Can't you remember anything I told you?" and lets fly with a club. - John w. Campbell

9th September 2021, 08:17 AM	#223
Darat Lackey Administrator Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: South East, UK Posts: 109,607	Originally Posted by TragicMonkey Oh dear. Not a user but another report person. If the intention is to use the data for marketing outreach it should be automatically assumed you exclude those people we know to be deceased. It's pointless at best, upsetting at worst to send advertising offers to the deceased. Particularly when you're in healthcare and there's a good chance the death happened on your own premises! Typical livest!
	__________________ I wish I knew how to quit you

9th September 2021, 12:39 PM	#224
Wudang BOFH Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: People's Republic of South Yorkshire Posts: 15,452	Originally Posted by Hellbound But our offers are so good, even the dead want in on them! Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Ahem! I believe the preferred term is "metabolically challenged". Stross, pterry? Can't recall
	__________________ "Your deepest pools, like your deepest politicians and philosophers, often turn out more shallow than expected." Walter Scott.

9th September 2021, 02:07 PM	#225
Norman Alexander Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: Dharug & Gundungurra Posts: 14,983	Originally Posted by JoeMorgue Trouble ticket that just hit my queue: "I have a website that sends a code to my cell phone before I can login, but my supervisor has a policy where I we cannot have our phones out at our desks." Sheesh. Toilet break.
	__________________ _{...our governments are just trying to protect us from terror. In the same way that someone banging a hornets’ nest with a stick is trying to protect us from hornets. Frankie Boyle, Guardian, July 2015}

9th September 2021, 06:31 PM	#226
arthwollipot Observer of Phenomena Pronouns: he/him Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Ngunnawal Country Posts: 82,098	I had a weird call yesterday. "I've got the commencement confirmation for the new starter, but the start date listed is the actual date that they will be commencing. Does that matter?"
	__________________ Слава Україні! Героям Слава! 20220224 - 20230224

9th September 2021, 07:25 PM	#227
a_unique_person Director of Hatcheries and Conditioning Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Waiting for the pod bay door to open. Posts: 45,256	I hope you said "yes".
	__________________ *Continually pushing the boundaries of mediocrity.* Everything is possible, but not everything is probable. “Perception is real, but the truth is not.” - Imelda Marcos

9th September 2021, 07:30 PM	#228
Norman Alexander Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: Dharug & Gundungurra Posts: 14,983	Originally Posted by arthwollipot I had a weird call yesterday. "I've got the commencement confirmation for the new starter, but the start date listed is the actual date that they will be commencing. Does that matter?" Is it dated 31-June? Or 31-September?
	__________________ _{...our governments are just trying to protect us from terror. In the same way that someone banging a hornets’ nest with a stick is trying to protect us from hornets. Frankie Boyle, Guardian, July 2015}

9th September 2021, 08:20 PM	#229
TragicMonkey Poisoned Waffles Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Monkey Posts: 66,035	Originally Posted by arthwollipot I had a weird call yesterday. "I've got the commencement confirmation for the new starter, but the start date listed is the actual date that they will be commencing. Does that matter?" I bet they just left a "not" out before "the actual date".
	__________________ You added nothing to that conversation, Barbara.

9th September 2021, 09:29 PM	#230
arthwollipot Observer of Phenomena Pronouns: he/him Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Ngunnawal Country Posts: 82,098	Originally Posted by TragicMonkey I bet they just left a "not" out before "the actual date". No, they were very clear. It was a phone call, not an email.
	__________________ Слава Україні! Героям Слава! 20220224 - 20230224

10th September 2021, 12:34 AM	#231
BowlOfRed Master Poster Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Silicon Valley Posts: 2,341	I read the stories of how the retail staff can defuse situations by just agreeing with the dumbness. I'm too curious. I would immediately reply with "Why is that a concern? What date do you think should be listed as the start date?"

10th September 2021, 03:05 AM	#232
lauwersw Thinker Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 169	That's very easy to explain: they assume IT is incompetent and they should set the start date much earlier or IT won't be ready in time when the new user starts.
lauwersw Thinker Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 169

10th September 2021, 03:26 AM	#233
catsmate No longer the 1 Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 28,613	Originally Posted by TragicMonkey Oh dear. Not a user but another report person. If the intention is to use the data for marketing outreach it should be automatically assumed you exclude those people we know to be deceased. It's pointless at best, upsetting at worst to send advertising offers to the deceased. Particularly when you're in healthcare and there's a good chance the death happened on your own premises! We're going to have to send Reg Shoe around for your next batch of diversity training, aren't we?
	__________________ As human right is always something given, it always in reality reduces to the right which men give, "concede," to each other. If the right to existence is conceded to new-born children, then they have the right; if it is not conceded to them, as was the case among the Spartans and ancient Romans, then they do not have it. For only society can give or concede it to them; they themselves cannot take it, or give it to themselves.

10th September 2021, 05:56 AM	#234
TragicMonkey Poisoned Waffles Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Monkey Posts: 66,035	Originally Posted by arthwollipot No, they were very clear. It was a phone call, not an email. Oh. In that case the answer to "does that matter?" is "ultimately, nothing matters" and hang up. If people are going to ask philosophical questions they deserve philosophical answers. Consider the yawning gulfs of eternity and the immensity of the universe! Contemplate mortality! Clearly this person's starting date cannot matter in the least tiny bit, not when compared to the full scale of existence. Even an omnicognizant loving god would have to consider such a matter trivial to the point of contempt. Really, it's practically an affront to a possible deity to even mention it. You should file an intolerant workplace complaint with HR because this person committed tacit blasphemy by asking you that question. I wouldn't settle for anything less than five thousand bucks and an extra week of vacation time.
	__________________ You added nothing to that conversation, Barbara.

10th September 2021, 06:53 AM	#235
Norman Alexander Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: Dharug & Gundungurra Posts: 14,983	...omnicog??
	__________________ _{...our governments are just trying to protect us from terror. In the same way that someone banging a hornets’ nest with a stick is trying to protect us from hornets. Frankie Boyle, Guardian, July 2015}