Criminal Charges Against Trump / Trump Indicted Part II - Page 6

gnome · 9th May 2023, 09:52 PM

That is exactly what I am seeing already.

I noted that "Technically not rape" is not as redeeming a statement as they might hope, but they just repeated themselves with more exclamation marks.

The Don · 9th May 2023, 10:21 PM

And if President Trump becomes the GOP candidate you can bet that the Republicans will be calling for a ban on vexatious law suits of this kind (against prominent Republicans - by them is 100% fine

).

The Great Zaganza · 9th May 2023, 10:27 PM

nvm

Stacyhs · 9th May 2023, 11:07 PM

The comments I'm seeing by Trumpers is that this is all a scheme by Dems and that it's just another witch hunt for the most persecuted president of all time. They think Carroll is a liar and paid to bring the lawsuit. They're overdosing on the Trump flavored Kool Aid.

Gulliver Foyle · 9th May 2023, 11:23 PM

Originally Posted by Norman Alexander

So Trump has been found guilty of "sexual assault" in a civil case, and he just pays a pittance and walks away?

I'm remaining puzzled how sexual assault, what would by all accounts be a criminal situation, is being decided in a civil court.

Because for some strage reason most US states, including New York have a statute of limitations for rape (and in most cases, a very short one).

Gulliver Foyle · 9th May 2023, 11:28 PM

Originally Posted by Norman Alexander

Trump doesn't have a bank account. He has lines of credit with unnamed finance sources through multiple levels of obfuscation. Most seem to lead back towards Moscow, Riyadh and Beijing.

Anything coming from the three above capitals is properly called a bribe. And his lines of credit that aren't from criminal sources dried up years ago.

The Don · 9th May 2023, 11:39 PM

Originally Posted by Stacyhs

The comments I'm seeing by Trumpers is that this is all a scheme by Dems and that it's just another witch hunt for the most persecuted president of all time. They think Carroll is a liar and paid to bring the lawsuit. They're overdosing on the Trump flavored Kool Aid.

In the event that President Trump becomes the candidate for the 2024 Presidential election this will also become the official Republican line as well.

The GOP has learned that truth is malleable.

Skeptic Ginger · 9th May 2023, 11:46 PM

Originally Posted by Norman Alexander

US civil cases don't end in jail time? And sexual assault and rape are civil law crimes?

Sometimes, yes. It has to do with the statute of limitations and the burden of proof.

Skeptic Ginger · 9th May 2023, 11:48 PM

Originally Posted by Stacyhs

When OJ Simpson was acquitted on the criminal murder charges of Nicole Simpson and Ronald Goldman, he was sued by Goldman's father in civil court. The court found him liable for their deaths and awarded Fred Goldman over $33 million.

Good example.

Sad but true.

Skeptic Ginger · 9th May 2023, 11:52 PM

Originally Posted by acbytesla

I bet he does. Trump is obsessed with it.

No, the others have it right. He only imagines what is in it, he doesn't look.

The payment will come out of donor accounts that Trump won't bother looking at either except for grift.

Norman Alexander · 10th May 2023, 12:03 AM

Originally Posted by Gulliver Foyle

Because for some strange reason most US states, including New York have a statute of limitations for rape (and in most cases, a very short one).

I understand the legal situation. But I hope my POV is clear too. The Orange Anus could actually sexually assault a woman and quite possibly rape her, and by dint of the passage of time, get away with just a rap on the knuckles.

Words fail me.

Mojo · 10th May 2023, 12:19 AM

Originally Posted by The Don

In the event that President Trump becomes the candidate for the 2024 Presidential election this will also become the official Republican line as well.

If it does, will she be able to sue them as well?

Steve · 10th May 2023, 04:38 AM

Originally Posted by Norman Alexander

I understand the legal situation. But I hope my POV is clear too. The Orange Anus could actually sexually assault a woman and quite possibly rape her, and by dint of the passage of time, get away with just a rap on the knuckles.

Words fail me.

American law, like so many things American, can be rather third world and male POV dominated.

Tero · 10th May 2023, 04:39 AM

All that Trump semen out there, all over the place. It could become a collector's item.

The Great Zaganza · 10th May 2023, 04:46 AM

Originally Posted by Tero

All that Trump semen out there, all over the place. It could become a collector's item.

It's worthless because he got the Vaxx. He's no longer a Pureblood.

dirtywick · 10th May 2023, 04:47 AM

Originally Posted by Segnosaur

My concern isn't so much the appeals... its the optics of it in a political sense.

The MAGAchud will look at the decision and say "see? He's innocent! He didn't rape her!". And they will ignore everything else that was in the decision.. the defamation, the other aspects of the assault, etc.

probably, but so what. this wasn't going to convince people that will never be convinced anymore than anything else has.

to me this is pretty significant. i believe that sitting down and saying someone is guilty of rape, even in a civil trial where the burden of evidence is lower, is a pretty difficult thing to do, so i'm not suprised they didn't take it that far.

i think this proved that without the right wing media filter and a jury pool where the most absolute of lunatics are filtered out he can have a fair trial.

Fast Eddie B · 10th May 2023, 05:21 AM

Originally Posted by dudalb

Actually, Guilty is a concept restricted to criminal law, so technically Trump was not found guilty, but it indeed a distinction without any clear difference.

I think there is a clear difference.

In a criminal proceeding, a jury of your peers - or a judge - must find that there is no reasonable doubt that you committed the crime - a very high standard.

In a civil trial, all that is required to find a defendant liable is a preponderance of the evidence. A pretty low standard, merely finding the defendant “probably” did it.

I am still not sure exactly what happened in that dressing room so long ago. Based on testimony, and his damning deposition, I’m comfortable saying it’s probable that events transpired pretty much as Carroll recounted. Especially with the defendant not testifying - or even showing up - to present a defense. Knowing what I know, I doubt I could find Trump guilty of rape. Even the sexual battery is not 100% convincing. But certainly the defamation counts soundly found him liable - and I’m very glad of that.

Tero · 10th May 2023, 05:33 AM

he says it's been going on for a million years. For stars.

Mike! · 10th May 2023, 05:36 AM

Originally Posted by Tero

he says it's been going on for a million years. For stars.
https://gumlet.assettype.com/bdnews-...mat=webp&w=940

A million years? Well that's sure to piss off the Young Earthers....

alfaniner · 10th May 2023, 06:02 AM

One downside from my POV is that this news blew the discussions of the wave of shootings in the couple weeks that preceded it right off the air. I thought I saw some minor progress. But it is ratings month. Trump draws more eyes.

JoeMorgue · 10th May 2023, 06:54 AM

Originally Posted by Stacyhs

The comments I'm seeing by Trumpers is that this is all a scheme by Dems and that it's just another witch hunt for the most persecuted president of all time. They think Carroll is a liar and paid to bring the lawsuit. They're overdosing on the Trump flavored Kool Aid.

Again that's what happens when facts go away, which is why the Republicans made so much effort into pushing into a post-fact world.

In a post-fact world "Stopping Evil" and "A political bias hit" look exactly the same.

This is why Republican deny any distinction between something being "untrue" and it being "unpopular."

Without facts the truth DOES belong to whoever is the most stubborn and pig-headed and we are NEVER going to win a stubborn and pig-headed fight with the Right.

slyjoe · 10th May 2023, 07:10 AM

Originally Posted by JoeMorgue

Again that's what happens when facts go away, which is why the Republicans made so much effort into pushing into a post-fact world.

In a post-fact world "Stopping Evil" and "A political bias hit" look exactly the same.

This is why Republican deny any distinction between something being "untrue" and it being "unpopular."

Without facts the truth DOES belong to whoever is the most stubborn and pig-headed and we are NEVER going to win a stubborn and pig-headed fight with the Right.

I don't know the answer, but if you want to stop a certain behavior you have to either reward for changing the behavior or punish for continuing the bahvior. I don't see much in between.

Paul2 · 10th May 2023, 12:26 PM

Originally Posted by Mike!

I know it stinks that he got off on the rape allegation, but the analysis I've seen says she raised the doubt when she said , and I'm paraphrasing, she didn't know if it was his fingers or his penis that entered her. And remember, Trump has those little tiny hands, and as such, pretty tiny fingers too.
So you can infer what you like here, but I'm still thinking he did it, and it was just so small, she couldn't be sure what it was. Right or wrong, that's what I'm thinking, and I'm sticking to it.

Here is a Slate article that I don't think makes 100% sense, but at least it's an attempt to explain how the jury found on sexual abuse but not rape.

TLDR: other confirmatory witnesses didn't claim rape; finding for rape crosses some line

dudalb · 10th May 2023, 02:05 PM

Line is you have to prove pentration in rape.

Stacyhs · 10th May 2023, 05:19 PM

Originally Posted by dudalb

Line is you have to prove pentration in rape.

Personally, I think rape should be defined as any non-consensual vaginal or anal penetration by any object, not just a penis.

alfaniner · 10th May 2023, 05:22 PM

"I had my picture taken with her".

"I don't know her. I never met her."

acbytesla · 10th May 2023, 08:15 PM

Originally Posted by Stacyhs

Personally, I think rape should be defined as any non-consensual vaginal or anal penetration by any object, not just a penis.

I'm pretty sure that in some States it is.

PitPat · 10th May 2023, 08:23 PM

Originally Posted by alfaniner

"I had my picture taken with her".

"I don't know her. I never met her."

That very much stood out to me. Will it matter....

The Great Zaganza · 10th May 2023, 09:39 PM

Clearly, the Verdict was one or two orders of magnitude too low: Trump is going right back to Defamation.

Orphia Nay · 10th May 2023, 10:08 PM

Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza

Clearly, the Verdict was one or two orders of magnitude too low: Trump is going right back to Defamation.

Trump doesn't stop committing crimes just because he's been found liable, he thinks his litigiousness will keep him safe for the term of his natural life.

arthwollipot · 10th May 2023, 10:46 PM

Toe-curlingly bad television: Trump’s torturous town hall backfires on CNN

Quote:

Truth didn’t stand a chance as the former president talked too fast to be factchecked and too shamelessly to be interrupted

The nausea came gradually, then suddenly, and with disconcerting familiarity. We had been flung back in time to the political hellscape of 2016. Only the second time around, it was somehow worse.

Donald Trump, the former US president appearing on CNN for the first time since that fateful election year, lied and lied and lied. He was a leviathan of lying, a juggernaut of junk, an ocean liner of mendacity that left little boats of truth spinning and overturning in its wake.

The Don · 10th May 2023, 10:56 PM

Originally Posted by arthwollipot

Toe-curlingly bad television: Trump’s torturous town hall backfires on CNN

For all of those people who say that President Trump has no chance in 2024, I present this as evidence.

He has plenty of support and a sizeable proportion of the US electorate consider him a hero.

alfaniner · 11th May 2023, 06:32 AM

I did see some people not applauding, and actually looking angry at some of the more egregious points. But I had to look hard.

quadraginta · 14th May 2023, 01:59 PM

Originally Posted by arthwollipot

Toe-curlingly bad television: Trump’s torturous town hall backfires on CNN

I started to watch it, but after five minutes I couldn't stomach any more. I figured if anything really earthshaking happened I'd end up seeing it on interminable reruns anyhow.

newyorkguy · 14th May 2023, 02:33 PM

Originally Posted by arthwollipot

Toe-curlingly bad television: Trump’s torturous town hall backfires on CNN

Quite a performance. This was the eff-you moment.

Quote:

Even seasoned Trump watchers were disgusted by what came next. Trump said of Carroll: “I have no idea who she is. I had a picture taken years ago with her and her husband, nice guy John Johnson. He was a newscaster, very nice man. She called him an ape, happens to be African American. Called him an ape – the judge wouldn’t allow us to put that in. Her dog or her cat was named Vagina, the judge wouldn’t allow to put that in.”

Stacyhs · 14th May 2023, 03:12 PM

If Carroll were a racist as Trump is trying to claim, she would not have married a Black man in the first place. We'd have to know the context in which she called him that. Calling a man a "big ape" or the like isn't necessarily racist.

Carroll's cat was named Vagina T. Fireball.

Neither of those things Trump is ranting about has diddley squat to do with anything.

Trebuchet · 14th May 2023, 03:22 PM

Originally Posted by Stacyhs

The comments I'm seeing by Trumpers is that this is all a scheme by Dems and that it's just another witch hunt for the most persecuted president of all time. They think Carroll is a liar and paid to bring the lawsuit. They're overdosing on the Trump flavored Kool Aid.

He's undeniably the most prosecuted!

newyorkguy · 14th May 2023, 03:23 PM

“John Johnson. He was a newscaster, very nice man. She called him an ape, happens to be African American. Called him an ape – the judge wouldn’t allow us to put that in. Her dog or her cat was named Vagina, the judge wouldn’t allow us to put that in.”

Stacyhs · 14th May 2023, 04:10 PM

Originally Posted by newyorkguy

“John Johnson. He was a newscaster, very nice man. She called him an ape, happens to be African American. Called him an ape – the judge wouldn’t allow us to put that in. Her dog or her cat was named Vagina, the judge wouldn’t allow us to put that in.”

That pic is obviously and AI creation...and even with that there are no people of color in it.

newyorkguy · 14th May 2023, 05:21 PM

The photo is from a Washington Post news story, not from the CNN Town Hall. (Were any photos taken? I haven't seen any.) I chose it at random and it was supposed to be sarcastic. That is, I'm sure trump supporters -- and only trump supporters -- would cheer on those kinds of comments.

I have to admit wondering, though, if Jean Carroll having been in an interracial marriage may have angered trump -- her husband, John Johnson, was a well-known New York TV news broadcaster (though I believe they'd divorced by the time trump attacked her) -- and was the motivation for trump deciding to sexually attack her when they had a chance encounter.

9th May 2023, 09:52 PM	#201
gnome Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 13,741	That is exactly what I am seeing already. I noted that "Technically not rape" is not as redeeming a statement as they might hope, but they just repeated themselves with more exclamation marks.
	__________________

9th May 2023, 10:27 PM	#203
The Great Zaganza Maledictorian Join Date: Aug 2016 Posts: 19,888	nvm
	__________________ “Don’t blame me. I voted for Kodos.”

9th May 2023, 11:23 PM	#205
Gulliver Foyle Graduate Poster Join Date: Dec 2014 Location: Cork baaaiii Posts: 1,691	Originally Posted by Norman Alexander So Trump has been found guilty of "sexual assault" in a civil case, and he just pays a pittance and walks away? I'm remaining puzzled how sexual assault, what would by all accounts be a criminal situation, is being decided in a civil court. Because for some strage reason most US states, including New York have a statute of limitations for rape (and in most cases, a very short one).
	__________________ Ceterum autem censeo Factio Republicanus esse delendam

9th May 2023, 11:28 PM	#206
Gulliver Foyle Graduate Poster Join Date: Dec 2014 Location: Cork baaaiii Posts: 1,691	Originally Posted by Norman Alexander Trump doesn't have a bank account. He has lines of credit with unnamed finance sources through multiple levels of obfuscation. Most seem to lead back towards Moscow, Riyadh and Beijing. Anything coming from the three above capitals is properly called a bribe. And his lines of credit that aren't from criminal sources dried up years ago.
	__________________ Ceterum autem censeo Factio Republicanus esse delendam

10th May 2023, 12:03 AM	#211
Norman Alexander Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: Dharug & Gundungurra Posts: 14,961	Originally Posted by Gulliver Foyle Because for some strange reason most US states, including New York have a statute of limitations for rape (and in most cases, a very short one). I understand the legal situation. But I hope my POV is clear too. The Orange Anus could actually sexually assault a woman and quite possibly rape her, and by dint of the passage of time, get away with just a rap on the knuckles. Words fail me.
	__________________ _{...our governments are just trying to protect us from terror. In the same way that someone banging a hornets’ nest with a stick is trying to protect us from hornets. Frankie Boyle, Guardian, July 2015}

9th May 2023, 10:21 PM	#202
The Don Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Sir Fynwy Posts: 36,611	And if President Trump becomes the GOP candidate you can bet that the Republicans will be calling for a ban on vexatious law suits of this kind (against prominent Republicans - by them is 100% fine ).

9th May 2023, 11:07 PM	#204
Stacyhs Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: United States Posts: 30,295	The comments I'm seeing by Trumpers is that this is all a scheme by Dems and that it's just another witch hunt for the most persecuted president of all time. They think Carroll is a liar and paid to bring the lawsuit. They're overdosing on the Trump flavored Kool Aid.

9th May 2023, 11:39 PM	#207
The Don Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Sir Fynwy Posts: 36,611	Originally Posted by Stacyhs The comments I'm seeing by Trumpers is that this is all a scheme by Dems and that it's just another witch hunt for the most persecuted president of all time. They think Carroll is a liar and paid to bring the lawsuit. They're overdosing on the Trump flavored Kool Aid. In the event that President Trump becomes the candidate for the 2024 Presidential election this will also become the official Republican line as well. The GOP has learned that truth is malleable.

9th May 2023, 11:46 PM	#208
Skeptic Ginger Nasty Woman Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 93,917	Originally Posted by Norman Alexander US civil cases don't end in jail time? And sexual assault and rape are civil law crimes? Sometimes, yes. It has to do with the statute of limitations and the burden of proof.

9th May 2023, 11:48 PM	#209
Skeptic Ginger Nasty Woman Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 93,917	Originally Posted by Stacyhs When OJ Simpson was acquitted on the criminal murder charges of Nicole Simpson and Ronald Goldman, he was sued by Goldman's father in civil court. The court found him liable for their deaths and awarded Fred Goldman over $33 million. Good example. Sad but true.

9th May 2023, 11:52 PM	#210
Skeptic Ginger Nasty Woman Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 93,917	Originally Posted by acbytesla I bet he does. Trump is obsessed with it. No, the others have it right. He only imagines what is in it, he doesn't look. The payment will come out of donor accounts that Trump won't bother looking at either except for grift.

10th May 2023, 12:19 AM	#212
Mojo Mostly harmless Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Nor Flanden Posts: 37,079	Originally Posted by The Don In the event that President Trump becomes the candidate for the 2024 Presidential election this will also become the official Republican line as well. If it does, will she be able to sue them as well?
	__________________ "You got to use your brain." - McKinley Morganfield "The poor mystic homeopaths feel like petted house-cats thrown at high flood on the breaking ice." - Leon Trotsky

10th May 2023, 04:38 AM	#213
Steve Penultimate Amazing Join Date: May 2005 Location: Sydney Nova Scotia Posts: 12,576	Originally Posted by Norman Alexander I understand the legal situation. But I hope my POV is clear too. The Orange Anus could actually sexually assault a woman and quite possibly rape her, and by dint of the passage of time, get away with just a rap on the knuckles. Words fail me. American law, like so many things American, can be rather third world and male POV dominated.
	__________________ Caption from and old New Yorker cartoon - Why am I shouting? Because I'm wrong!"

10th May 2023, 04:39 AM	#214
Tero Illuminator Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: North American prairie Posts: 3,074	All that Trump semen out there, all over the place. It could become a collector's item.
	__________________ Dominus vo-bisque'em Et cum spear a tu-tu, oh! Politics blog: https://esapolitics.blogspot.com/ Parody: http://karireport.blogspot.com/ Poll: https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com...proval-rating/

10th May 2023, 04:46 AM	#215
The Great Zaganza Maledictorian Join Date: Aug 2016 Posts: 19,888	Originally Posted by Tero All that Trump semen out there, all over the place. It could become a collector's item. It's worthless because he got the Vaxx. He's no longer a Pureblood.
	__________________ “Don’t blame me. I voted for Kodos.”

10th May 2023, 04:47 AM	#216
dirtywick Illuminator Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 4,373	Originally Posted by Segnosaur My concern isn't so much the appeals... its the optics of it in a political sense. The MAGAchud will look at the decision and say "see? He's innocent! He didn't rape her!". And they will ignore everything else that was in the decision.. the defamation, the other aspects of the assault, etc. probably, but so what. this wasn't going to convince people that will never be convinced anymore than anything else has. to me this is pretty significant. i believe that sitting down and saying someone is guilty of rape, even in a civil trial where the burden of evidence is lower, is a pretty difficult thing to do, so i'm not suprised they didn't take it that far. i think this proved that without the right wing media filter and a jury pool where the most absolute of lunatics are filtered out he can have a fair trial.
dirtywick Illuminator Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 4,373

10th May 2023, 05:21 AM	#217
Fast Eddie B Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Lenoir City, TN/Mineral Bluff, GA Posts: 7,558	Originally Posted by dudalb Actually, Guilty is a concept restricted to criminal law, so technically Trump was not found guilty, but it indeed a distinction without any clear difference. I think there is a clear difference. In a criminal proceeding, a jury of your peers - or a judge - must find that there is no reasonable doubt that you committed the crime - a very high standard. In a civil trial, all that is required to find a defendant liable is a preponderance of the evidence. A pretty low standard, merely finding the defendant “probably” did it. I am still not sure exactly what happened in that dressing room so long ago. Based on testimony, and his damning deposition, I’m comfortable saying it’s probable that events transpired pretty much as Carroll recounted. Especially with the defendant not testifying - or even showing up - to present a defense. Knowing what I know, I doubt I could find Trump guilty of rape. Even the sexual battery is not 100% convincing. But certainly the defamation counts soundly found him liable - and I’m very glad of that.

10th May 2023, 05:33 AM	#218
Tero Illuminator Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: North American prairie Posts: 3,074	he says it's been going on for a million years. For stars.
	__________________ Dominus vo-bisque'em Et cum spear a tu-tu, oh! Politics blog: https://esapolitics.blogspot.com/ Parody: http://karireport.blogspot.com/ Poll: https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com...proval-rating/ Last edited by Darat; 10th May 2023 at 12:01 PM. Reason: Resized image

10th May 2023, 05:36 AM	#219
Mike! Official Ponylandistanian National Treasure. Respect it! Join Date: May 2010 Location: Ponylandistan! Where the bacon grows on trees! Can it get any better than that? I submit it can not! Posts: 50,196	Originally Posted by Tero he says it's been going on for a million years. For stars. https://gumlet.assettype.com/bdnews-...mat=webp&w=940 A million years? Well that's sure to piss off the Young Earthers....
	__________________ "Never judge a man until you’ve walked a mile in his shoes... Because then it won't really matter, you’ll be a mile away and have his shoes."

10th May 2023, 06:02 AM	#220
alfaniner Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Sorth Dakonsin Posts: 27,892	One downside from my POV is that this news blew the discussions of the wave of shootings in the couple weeks that preceded it right off the air. I thought I saw some minor progress. But it is ratings month. Trump draws more eyes.
	__________________ Science is self-correcting. Woo is self-contradicting.

10th May 2023, 06:54 AM	#221
JoeMorgue Self Employed Remittance Man Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Florida Posts: 44,080	Originally Posted by Stacyhs The comments I'm seeing by Trumpers is that this is all a scheme by Dems and that it's just another witch hunt for the most persecuted president of all time. They think Carroll is a liar and paid to bring the lawsuit. They're overdosing on the Trump flavored Kool Aid. Again that's what happens when facts go away, which is why the Republicans made so much effort into pushing into a post-fact world. In a post-fact world "Stopping Evil" and "A political bias hit" look exactly the same. This is why Republican deny any distinction between something being "untrue" and it being "unpopular." Without facts the truth DOES belong to whoever is the most stubborn and pig-headed and we are NEVER going to win a stubborn and pig-headed fight with the Right.
	__________________ "If everyone in the room says water is wet and I say it's dry that makes me smart because at least I'm thinking for myself!" - The Proudly Wrong.

10th May 2023, 07:10 AM	#222
slyjoe Illuminator Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Near Harmonica Virgins, AZ Posts: 3,499	Originally Posted by JoeMorgue Again that's what happens when facts go away, which is why the Republicans made so much effort into pushing into a post-fact world. In a post-fact world "Stopping Evil" and "A political bias hit" look exactly the same. This is why Republican deny any distinction between something being "untrue" and it being "unpopular." Without facts the truth DOES belong to whoever is the most stubborn and pig-headed and we are NEVER going to win a stubborn and pig-headed fight with the Right. I don't know the answer, but if you want to stop a certain behavior you have to either reward for changing the behavior or punish for continuing the bahvior. I don't see much in between.
	__________________ "You have done nothing to demonstrate an understanding of scientific methodology or modern skepticism, both of which are, by necessity, driven by the facts and evidence, not by preconceptions, and both of which are strengthened by, and rely upon, change." - Arkan Wolfshade

10th May 2023, 12:26 PM	#223
Paul2 Philosopher Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 7,792	Originally Posted by Mike! I know it stinks that he got off on the rape allegation, but the analysis I've seen says she raised the doubt when she said , and I'm paraphrasing, she didn't know if it was his fingers or his penis that entered her. And remember, Trump has those little tiny hands, and as such, pretty tiny fingers too. So you can infer what you like here, but I'm still thinking he did it, and it was just so small, she couldn't be sure what it was. Right or wrong, that's what I'm thinking, and I'm sticking to it. Here is a Slate article that I don't think makes 100% sense, but at least it's an attempt to explain how the jury found on sexual abuse but not rape. TLDR: other confirmatory witnesses didn't claim rape; finding for rape crosses some line
Paul2 Philosopher Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 7,792	__________________ It's nice to be nice to the nice. Aristotle, so far as I know, was the first man to proclaim explicitly that man is a rational animal. His reason for this view was one which does not now seem very impressive: it was, that some people can do sums. - Bertrand Russell

10th May 2023, 02:05 PM	#224
dudalb Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Sacramento Posts: 58,605	Line is you have to prove pentration in rape.
	__________________ Pacifism is a shifty doctrine under which a man accepts the benefits of the social group without being willing to pay - and claims a halo for his dishonesty. Robert Heinlein.

10th May 2023, 05:19 PM	#225
Stacyhs Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: United States Posts: 30,295	Originally Posted by dudalb Line is you have to prove pentration in rape. Personally, I think rape should be defined as any non-consensual vaginal or anal penetration by any object, not just a penis.

10th May 2023, 05:22 PM	#226
alfaniner Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Sorth Dakonsin Posts: 27,892	"I had my picture taken with her". "I don't know her. I never met her."
	__________________ Science is self-correcting. Woo is self-contradicting.

10th May 2023, 08:15 PM	#227
acbytesla Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Dec 2012 Posts: 31,708	Originally Posted by Stacyhs Personally, I think rape should be defined as any non-consensual vaginal or anal penetration by any object, not just a penis. I'm pretty sure that in some States it is.
	__________________ Just because I'm paranoid doesn't mean they're not out to get to me. .

10th May 2023, 08:23 PM	#228
PitPat Philosopher Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Seattle Posts: 5,216	Originally Posted by alfaniner "I had my picture taken with her". "I don't know her. I never met her." That very much stood out to me. Will it matter....

10th May 2023, 09:39 PM	#229
The Great Zaganza Maledictorian Join Date: Aug 2016 Posts: 19,888	Clearly, the Verdict was one or two orders of magnitude too low: Trump is going right back to Defamation.
	__________________ “Don’t blame me. I voted for Kodos.”

10th May 2023, 10:08 PM	#230
Orphia Nay Penguilicious Spodmaster. Tagger Photo Contest Winner Join Date: May 2005 Location: Ponylandistan Presidential Palace (above the Spods' stables). Posts: 41,936	Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza Clearly, the Verdict was one or two orders of magnitude too low: Trump is going right back to Defamation. Trump doesn't stop committing crimes just because he's been found liable, he thinks his litigiousness will keep him safe for the term of his natural life.
	__________________ "We stigmatize and send to the margins people who trigger in us the feelings we want to avoid" - Melinda Gates, "The Moment of Lift".

10th May 2023, 10:46 PM	#231
arthwollipot Observer of Phenomena Pronouns: he/him Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Ngunnawal Country Posts: 82,020	Toe-curlingly bad television: Trump’s torturous town hall backfires on CNN Quote: Truth didn’t stand a chance as the former president talked too fast to be factchecked and too shamelessly to be interrupted The nausea came gradually, then suddenly, and with disconcerting familiarity. We had been flung back in time to the political hellscape of 2016. Only the second time around, it was somehow worse. Donald Trump, the former US president appearing on CNN for the first time since that fateful election year, lied and lied and lied. He was a leviathan of lying, a juggernaut of junk, an ocean liner of mendacity that left little boats of truth spinning and overturning in its wake.
	__________________ Слава Україні! Героям Слава! 20220224 - 20230224

10th May 2023, 10:56 PM	#232
The Don Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Sir Fynwy Posts: 36,611	Originally Posted by arthwollipot Toe-curlingly bad television: Trump’s torturous town hall backfires on CNN For all of those people who say that President Trump has no chance in 2024, I present this as evidence. He has plenty of support and a sizeable proportion of the US electorate consider him a hero.

11th May 2023, 06:32 AM	#233
alfaniner Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Sorth Dakonsin Posts: 27,892	I did see some people not applauding, and actually looking angry at some of the more egregious points. But I had to look hard.
	__________________ Science is self-correcting. Woo is self-contradicting.

14th May 2023, 01:59 PM	#234
quadraginta Becoming Beth Join Date: May 2009 Location: Central Vale of Humility (USA, sort of) Posts: 26,840	Originally Posted by arthwollipot Toe-curlingly bad television: Trump’s torturous town hall backfires on CNN I started to watch it, but after five minutes I couldn't stomach any more. I figured if anything really earthshaking happened I'd end up seeing it on interminable reruns anyhow.
	__________________ "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep." "Ninety percent of the politicians give the other ten percent a bad reputation."

14th May 2023, 03:12 PM	#236
Stacyhs Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: United States Posts: 30,295	If Carroll were a racist as Trump is trying to claim, she would not have married a Black man in the first place. We'd have to know the context in which she called him that. Calling a man a "big ape" or the like isn't necessarily racist. Carroll's cat was named Vagina T. Fireball. Neither of those things Trump is ranting about has diddley squat to do with anything.