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Old 27th July 2020, 01:25 PM   #281
carlitos
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Originally Posted by ;13168481
Originally Posted by CaptainHowdy View Post
If you don’t believe that masks restrict airflow, try running uphill while wearing one.
I have.
That was funny. I now run with a microfiber neck gaiter, which is easy to pull up around mouth and nose when you're around people.

Other than the knucklehead fitness bros wanting to open their gyms, most of the MAGA anti-mask idiots I have seen couldn't run for 2 blocks. I hope that they consult a physician before attempting to "prove" that masks restrict air flow while exercising.
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Old 27th July 2020, 02:06 PM   #282
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Originally Posted by Disbelief View Post
That you attempt to downplay the severity of the virus, yet you compare it to H1N1 where the death rate was .02%. Your out of your ass guess of .5% is way off the current 3.5% based on current data. You can't use one story as a trend, just so it can fit your narrative, especially when you consider many health experts feel that many more deaths have actually been missed.
And mortality is the tip of the iceberg. From shootings to polio, from fires to car accidents to measles, if something isn't instantly lethal, it tends to maim far more than it kills.

About 10% of COVID-19 survivors seem to suffer at least medium-term health issues.
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link is 2015 data (2013 Data below):
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US 16.4% of GDP of which 48.2% is public expenditure - 7.9% of GDP is public spending
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Old 27th July 2020, 02:32 PM   #283
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Originally Posted by jimbob View Post
And mortality is the tip of the iceberg. From shootings to polio, from fires to car accidents to measles, if something isn't instantly lethal, it tends to maim far more than it kills.

About 10% of COVID-19 survivors seem to suffer at least medium-term health issues.
We've got a saying around here, working around hazardous materials, hazardous equipment and often at hazardous heights. 'What doesn't kill you just screws you up really, really bad for a very, very long time.'
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Old 28th July 2020, 07:16 AM   #284
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Originally Posted by The Man View Post
We've got a saying around here, working around hazardous materials, hazardous equipment and often at hazardous heights. 'What doesn't kill you just screws you up really, really bad for a very, very long time.'
Exactly
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http://www.oecd.org/els/health-systems/health-data.htm
link is 2015 data (2013 Data below):
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US 16.4% of GDP of which 48.2% is public expenditure - 7.9% of GDP is public spending
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Old 28th July 2020, 11:34 AM   #285
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Originally Posted by Ryokan View Post
One death is a tragedy.

149 852 deaths, as of today, and rising, is obviously just statistics.
Over 150k now, according to Worldometer.
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Old 28th July 2020, 02:12 PM   #286
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Originally Posted by Trebuchet View Post
Over 150k now, according to Worldometer.
It will disappear soon, once Kushner has worked out how to delete numbers in Excel.
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Old 28th July 2020, 02:30 PM   #287
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Originally Posted by carlitos View Post
That was funny. I now run with a microfiber neck gaiter, which is easy to pull up around mouth and nose when you're around people.

Other than the knucklehead fitness bros wanting to open their gyms, most of the MAGA anti-mask idiots I have seen couldn't run for 2 blocks. I hope that they consult a physician before attempting to "prove" that masks restrict air flow while exercising.

There have already been tests that show that oxygenation of people's blood is the same with or without masks. People claiming otherwise are either lying or delusional.
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Old 28th July 2020, 09:22 PM   #288
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Originally Posted by dann View Post
There have already been tests that show that oxygenation of people's blood is the same with or without masks. People claiming otherwise are either lying or delusional.
I'm going with self-deluded, with confirmation bias being the underlying etiology.


As for the total number of cases in the US suddenly shrinking: they are just stupid enough to try to redefine a case and a COVID death.

They do that at their own peril. Only the deluded base is going to buy that, and their numbers are being chipped away as grandma and grandpa die (among multiple other situations) and make it personal.

You can't hide overwhelmed hospitals and refrigerated truck morgues. Trump can say whatever he wants. The local news is going to show those local stories.

And if Trump thinks he can claim the country is aflame with rioting Antifa activists, it's not going to fly. There are a couple blocks in Seattle, gawd knows, maybe a half dozen blocks in Portland involved. You live in Seattle or Portland you can see the whole city is not in flames.

I say let the idiot bury himself. Sadly we can't begin to correct the situation until Nov.
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Old 28th July 2020, 11:30 PM   #289
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This pandemic could. but sadly will not - be a chance for religious believers around the world to see that, whatever beliefs people hold, the gods they believe in can do absolutely nothing. I googled: what does the Pope have to say, and a link came up to the text of an interview with the Pope, in which he said he had prayed to the Lord to take away 'with His hand' the virus … at which point I immediately gave up. The only good point there is on this is that none of the main news bulletins, the ones I listen to anyway, do not even refer to any faith belief aspect of dealing with it.
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Old 1st August 2020, 07:23 AM   #290
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Originally Posted by SusanB-M1 View Post
This pandemic could. but sadly will not - be a chance for religious believers around the world to see that, whatever beliefs people hold, the gods they believe in can do absolutely nothing. I googled: what does the Pope have to say, and a link came up to the text of an interview with the Pope, in which he said he had prayed to the Lord to take away 'with His hand' the virus … at which point I immediately gave up. The only good point there is on this is that none of the main news bulletins, the ones I listen to anyway, do not even refer to any faith belief aspect of dealing with it.
The church we use to go to as kids and that I pass on my way home from work has had on its sign "God is still in control". Which of course would mean that this is the hand of god, perchance smiting some and just catching some others with some splash damage.
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Old 1st August 2020, 09:18 AM   #291
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Originally Posted by The Man View Post
The church we use to go to as kids and that I pass on my way home from work has had on its sign "God is still in control". Which of course would mean that this is the hand of god, perchance smiting some and just catching some others with some splash damage.
I realise I'm not the intended recipient of their message but I would be less than reassured to think this is how things go when someone is in control.
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Old 1st August 2020, 10:15 AM   #292
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Originally Posted by Arcade22 View Post
Thankfully no one wears any face masks in the Nordic countries.

Fortunately, they are starting now. In spite of Tegnell and his poor performance as an epidemiologist.
And even Swedish state television is preparing its viewers and readers for the use of munskydd.
Maybe there is still hope for Sweden after all.
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"Stupidity renders itself invisible by assuming very large proportions. Completely unreasonable claims are irrefutable. Ni-en-leh pointed out that a philosopher might get into trouble by claiming that two times two makes five, but he does not risk much by claiming that two times two makes shoe polish." B. Brecht
"The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx
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Old 1st August 2020, 10:19 AM   #293
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Originally Posted by The Man View Post
The church we use to go to as kids and that I pass on my way home from work has had on its sign "God is still in control". Which of course would mean that this is the hand of god, perchance smiting some and just catching some others with some splash damage.

Collateral is always the best kind of damage ...
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"Stupidity renders itself invisible by assuming very large proportions. Completely unreasonable claims are irrefutable. Ni-en-leh pointed out that a philosopher might get into trouble by claiming that two times two makes five, but he does not risk much by claiming that two times two makes shoe polish." B. Brecht
"The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx
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Old 1st August 2020, 10:44 AM   #294
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Gainesville, Florida, U.S.A. here; maybe 30% of people in public are wearing masks. It’s actually a city ordinance to wear masks in public, but not one of these in recent, red-neck, trump-trash idiots will.

Turns out that fascism is a public health hazard as well as an odious political philosophy
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Old 1st August 2020, 12:06 PM   #295
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I think you're being unfair to Fascists!

Hitler was very concerned about public health. He wanted his people to be strong and healthy, so if you didn't happy to be a Jew, a gypsy, a homosexual, a communist, or a cripple (an awful lot of ifs!), he wanted people to get healthy and to stay healthy - by exercising, by eating more fruit and vegetables, and by giving up smoking and drinking. He didn't want people to ruin each other's health. That's what you had wars for!
Lifestyle, health, and health promotion in Nazi Germany (BMJ, Dec. 18, 2004)

Mussolini's fascism was much the same:
Quote:
By 1925, the Fascist government had "embarked upon an elaborate program" that included food supplementary assistance, infant care, maternity assistance, general healthcare, wage supplements, paid vacations, unemployment benefits, illness insurance, occupational disease insurance, general family assistance, public housing and old age and disability insurance.
Economy of Italy under fascism: Structural deficit, public works and social welfare (Wiki)

It is pure conjecture, of course, but I'm pretty sure that both Hitler and Mussolini would have wanted people to wear face masks in a pulmonary virus pandemic.

In some respects, libertarians are even more irrational than Nazis and Fascists.
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"Stupidity renders itself invisible by assuming very large proportions. Completely unreasonable claims are irrefutable. Ni-en-leh pointed out that a philosopher might get into trouble by claiming that two times two makes five, but he does not risk much by claiming that two times two makes shoe polish." B. Brecht
"The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx
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Old 1st August 2020, 12:39 PM   #296
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Originally Posted by Jack by the hedge View Post
I realise I'm not the intended recipient of their message but I would be less than reassured to think this is how things go when someone is in control.
Exactly my query each time I pass the sign, 'How does that reassure anyone?'

Oh, great, god's still in control and all praise be unto him and his glorious mercy that thou beist not amongst the smited.
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Old 1st August 2020, 02:32 PM   #297
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Originally Posted by dann View Post
I think you're being unfair to Fascists!

Hitler was very concerned about public health. He wanted his people to be strong and healthy, so if you didn't happy to be a Jew, a gypsy, a homosexual, a communist, or a cripple (an awful lot of ifs!), he wanted people to get healthy and to stay healthy - by exercising, by eating more fruit and vegetables, and by giving up smoking and drinking and then taking shedloads of meth. He didn't want people to ruin each other's health. That's what you had wars for!
Lifestyle, health, and health promotion in Nazi Germany (BMJ, Dec. 18, 2004)

Mussolini's fascism was much the same:



It is pure conjecture, of course, but I'm pretty sure that both Hitler and Mussolini would have wanted people to wear face masks in a pulmonary virus pandemic.

In some respects, libertarians are even more irrational than Nazis and Fascists.
Minor addition highlighted,
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Expenditure on healthcare
http://www.oecd.org/els/health-systems/health-data.htm
link is 2015 data (2013 Data below):
UK 8.5% of GDP of which 83.3% is public expenditure - 7.1% of GDP is public spending
US 16.4% of GDP of which 48.2% is public expenditure - 7.9% of GDP is public spending
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Old 1st August 2020, 02:33 PM   #298
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Originally Posted by The Man View Post
Exactly my query each time I pass the sign, 'How does that reassure anyone?'

Oh, great, god's still in control and all praise be unto him and his glorious mercy that thou beist not amongst the smited.
"Pray to Cthulu to be among the first to be eaten"?
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OECD healthcare spending
Expenditure on healthcare
http://www.oecd.org/els/health-systems/health-data.htm
link is 2015 data (2013 Data below):
UK 8.5% of GDP of which 83.3% is public expenditure - 7.1% of GDP is public spending
US 16.4% of GDP of which 48.2% is public expenditure - 7.9% of GDP is public spending
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Old 2nd August 2020, 12:56 PM   #299
dann
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Originally Posted by jimbob View Post
Minor addition highlighted,

Yes, like I said: "That's what you had wars for!"
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"Stupidity renders itself invisible by assuming very large proportions. Completely unreasonable claims are irrefutable. Ni-en-leh pointed out that a philosopher might get into trouble by claiming that two times two makes five, but he does not risk much by claiming that two times two makes shoe polish." B. Brecht
"The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness. The demand to give up the illusion about its condition is the demand to give up a condition which needs illusions." K. Marx
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Old 6th August 2020, 02:18 PM   #300
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Originally Posted by SusanB-M1 View Post
This pandemic could. but sadly will not - be a chance for religious believers around the world to see that, whatever beliefs people hold, the gods they believe in can do absolutely nothing.
I do not see how. The vast majority of religious people don't imagine their gods dramatically ending or changing major world events in response to prayers.

Yes I know there's a handful of religious TV personalities who proclaim otherwise, and there are plenty of people who cheer them on. But I've come to realize that is largely performative. Pat Robertson may or may not actually believe God personally sent a hurricane to South Carolina because he's mad at gay people for instance, but most of his followers certainly don't and only assent because it makes them feel good in the moment to pretend it's true.
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