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Old 1st June 2022, 06:48 PM   #441
dudalb
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Originally Posted by shuttlt View Post
Is that really the fandom? I see more studios attempting to use social media influencers and access journalists to try and polish and excuse their ****** product. You have fandom after fandom being accused of being racist or sexist for not liking some uninspired reboot created by people who dislike the source material and use diversity as a substitute for quality.
Yes, it is.
You see crap like that on many geek sites, and lot of it is not planted by studios. It's too badly wirtten and inept for that.
But again tell me why diversity is a bad thing.........
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Old 1st June 2022, 06:59 PM   #442
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
......
Also, "only Heard is entitled to say how she feels" is the lamest rebuttal. It's technically true, but so what? We could certainly say that based on the evidence, we think she's probably lying about how she feels. And we could certainly say that based on the evidence, we think that her feelings, while apparently sincere, do not seem to be based in reality.
Depp is a celebrity. To find Heard liable, the jury had to find that she was knowingly and deliberately lying, not mistaken or confused or overly emotional, and that she was lying specifically and maliciously to injure Depp. I just don't see that in her column, which was the sole basis for the suit. As I said, I think her defense might have gone over the top with her testimony, rather than focusing on the content of the column.

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Old 1st June 2022, 07:01 PM   #443
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The Johnny Depp/Amber Heard thing

I think there’s a huge mistake being made by ascribing the activity of “the fandom,” to the actual person they are a fan of. Like, whatever “the fandom” does shouldn’t color one’s view of the merits of accusations against the object of the fandom.
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Old 1st June 2022, 07:07 PM   #444
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Originally Posted by xjx388 View Post
I think there’s a huge mistake being made by ascribing the activity of “the fandom,” to the actual person they are a fan of. Like, whatever “the fandom” does shouldn’t color one’s view of the merits of accusations against the object of the fandom.
Yes,yes, I know that but still.......

I can't help but think a little less of Depp because of the fanaticism of his fans.
I thinkit would be smart for him to ask them to lay off and leave Heard alone for the time being, but I am betting he is too bitter for that.
I have the same problem in sports. I admit one reason I dislike the New York Yankees is the arrogance of their fans, who seem to think that a basic law of the universe has been shattered if the Yankees don't win the pennant every year.
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Old 1st June 2022, 07:08 PM   #445
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
......
And if televised trials were the norm, this one wouldn't stick out so much, and there would probably be less interest in it.
But most trials would never be televised, even if they could be. Camera crews are expensive and air time is valuable. If Depp and Heard were mid-level civil servants giving identical testimony, it wouldn't be on TV. The problem with a televised trial is the question of whether cameras influence the behavior of the judge, jury and witnesses. A lot of people continue to believe that the OJ trial might have unfolded differently if everybody involved, particularly Judge Ito, wasn't performing for television.
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Old 1st June 2022, 07:43 PM   #446
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Originally Posted by shuttlt View Post
I'm not arguing that he has some enormous fanbase. That said, the director of Minamata was complaining that MGM killed the domestic release because of Amber Heard's accusations.
I’m sure he did. Easy to claim, difficult to disprove.

But unfortunately for Depp and his sycophants, the expiration date on that excuse was today at approximately 3 PM EST.
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Old 1st June 2022, 08:10 PM   #447
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
You didn’t watch the trial, did you?
No, and I hope most people had better things to do with their time. But I saw and read enough media reports to know it was a circus. I contend that the original column shouldn't have been the basis for a trial in the first place.
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Old 1st June 2022, 08:19 PM   #448
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Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
No, and I hope most people had better things to do with their time. But I saw and read enough media reports to know it was a circus. I contend that the original column shouldn't have been the basis for a trial in the first place.
As expected. Media reports of the trial bear only the most superficial resemblance to what actually happened. You are opining about things you know effectively nothing about.
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Old 1st June 2022, 08:23 PM   #449
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Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
But most trials would never be televised, even if they could be. Camera crews are expensive and air time is valuable.
No crew is needed for static cameras, and streaming on the internet is dirt cheap.

Quote:
The problem with a televised trial is the question of whether cameras influence the behavior of the judge, jury and witnesses.
Why is that axiomatically bad? Public scrutiny may keep all parties more honest. That's a change for the better.
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Old 1st June 2022, 08:33 PM   #450
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
As expected. Media reports of the trial bear only the most superficial resemblance to what actually happened. You are opining about things you know effectively nothing about.
Did you see every media report? I actually trust experienced reporters for the Washington Post, NY Times etc. to separate what's important from the distractions.
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Old 1st June 2022, 08:41 PM   #451
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Originally Posted by Puppycow View Post
.....
Even though she doesn't name Depp, it seems very reasonable that people would reach that conclusion given that she mentioned "domestic abuse" and "two years ago" when she was married to Depp. "Two years ago" is when she got a temporary restraining order against him. It seems to reference that, and the media coverage of it at the time.
.....

Sure, but she didn't say anything in her column that hadn't already been well-publicized. And at the time she and Depp reached a settlement, they released a statement that included:
Quote:
"Our relationship was intensely passionate and at times volatile, but always bound by love. Neither party has made false accusations for financial gain. There was never any intent of physical or emotional harm."
https://www.cnn.com/2022/04/30/enter...ine/index.html

Her column included this:
Quote:
Then two years ago, I became a public figure representing domestic abuse, and I felt the full force of our culture’s wrath for women who speak out.
It is a matter of plain fact that she did become a public figure in connection with domestic abuse claims. She doesn't repeat the claims themselves, or identify an abuser. Thin gruel for a $50 million suit.
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Old 1st June 2022, 08:48 PM   #452
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
No crew is needed for static cameras, and streaming on the internet is dirt cheap.

Why is that axiomatically bad? Public scrutiny may keep all parties more honest. That's a change for the better.
Anyone running any site still expects a return from eyeballs and ad clicks. How many trials are conducted every day in the U.S., even in one big city? The only trials that would be televised would involve high-profile celebs or especially gruesome murders, and those are the ones that would encourage posturing by all participants.
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Old 1st June 2022, 11:25 PM   #453
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
Yes,yes, I know that but still.......

I can't help but think a little less of Depp because of the fanaticism of his fans.
I thinkit would be smart for him to ask them to lay off and leave Heard alone for the time being, but I am betting he is too bitter for that.
I have the same problem in sports. I admit one reason I dislike the New York Yankees is the arrogance of their fans, who seem to think that a basic law of the universe has been shattered if the Yankees don't win the pennant every year.

It's not a New York Yankees thing. It's an American thing. Is there any reason at all to assume that Heard's fans wouldn't have behaved in a similar manner?
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Old 2nd June 2022, 01:50 AM   #454
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OK, so I have stayed right out of this debate until now, but I have to say, the more I watched parts of the trial on YT, the more convinced I have become that Amber Heard is a malignant narcissist. She exhibits many, if not most of the traits of my narcissistic ex

- Overblown sense of entitlement
- Grandiose view of her own importance
- No sense of personal accountability
- Total absence of emotional empathy
- Fury and anger when challenged

But the biggie for me is the way she turned herself into the victim. She uses almost the exact same method my ex used on me, something that I later discovered was a well-known technique of the manipulative abuser - a technique called DARVO

DARVO is an acronym for Deny, Attack, Reverse, Victim and Offender. It is a defense mechanism used by manipulators to evade accountability for the abuse they inflict on others. It is a blame-shifting tactic used for gaslighting in the context of emotional abuse.

I had read somewhere that she has been been diagnosed with Histrionic Personality Disorder and Borderline Personality Disorder. I am unsure if this is true, but it would not surprise in the least if it was. Almost all people diagnosed with HPD are narcissists and many, perhaps more than half of those those diagnosed with BPD are also narcissists.
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Old 2nd June 2022, 02:23 AM   #455
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
Yes, it is.
You see crap like that on many geek sites, and lot of it is not planted by studios. It's too badly wirtten and inept for that.
But again tell me why diversity is a bad thing.........
It is used by studios as an alternative to creativity. It gives them marketing strategies and positive press that do not depend on producing good product. The more incentives there are that don't involve producing something good, the more generic garbage is produced. It's like the scene in Dead Poets society where they are plotting what makes good poetry on a graph. Good movies don't come out of a generic corporate focus on ESG scores.
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Old 2nd June 2022, 02:47 AM   #456
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Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
Sure, but she didn't say anything in her column that hadn't already been well-publicized. And at the time she and Depp reached a settlement, they released a statement that included:
The statement was made prior to both the WaPo op-ed and the Sun article that provoked lawsuits. Also worthy of note is that statements of that nature are... not unheard of in divorce settlement negotiations; and rarely worth the paper or pixels they are printed upon.

Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
It is a matter of plain fact that she did become a public figure in connection with domestic abuse claims. She doesn't repeat the claims themselves, or identify an abuser. Thin gruel for a $50 million suit.
Amongst many other things, Heard got caught admitting that the op-ed WAS about Depp in front of the jury during the trial, so....

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Old 2nd June 2022, 02:54 AM   #457
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Originally Posted by shuttlt View Post
It is used by studios as an alternative to creativity. It gives them marketing strategies and positive press that do not depend on producing good product. The more incentives there are that don't involve producing something good, the more generic garbage is produced. It's like the scene in Dead Poets society where they are plotting what makes good poetry on a graph. Good movies don't come out of a generic corporate focus on ESG scores.
Only in right-wing dreamland. Nobody spends money on a movie or streaming service because a given production is "diverse". Speaking as a socialist, feminist, pro-LGBTQ+, activist libtard SJW who would ostensibly be the target of such information.

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Old 2nd June 2022, 03:08 AM   #458
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
ANd, for the record, making Heard some kind of poster for abused women was not a good idea. I am not saying she was not abused, but I think making such a flawed person your mascot was a mistake.
Some of these things you are railing against seem to spring from your own imagination.

Even the people defending Heard (that I've seen) hasten to add that she isn't a blameless victim.

Oh, except for Heard herself, maybe. I guess she wanted to play as a "kind of poster for abused women" for sympathy. She failed.
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Old 2nd June 2022, 03:58 AM   #459
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Originally Posted by Shadowdweller View Post
Only in right-wing dreamland. Nobody spends money on a movie or streaming service because a given production is "diverse". Speaking as a socialist, feminist, pro-LGBTQ+, activist libtard SJW who would ostensibly be the target of such information.
I didn't say that people signed up to streaming services based on diversity. That is kind of the trope that Marvel hires a bunch of blue haired communists, who don't like and don't read comics, and despise the people who do, to write comics. They turn the comic into a vehicle for their politics and all the comic stores close down because you can't pay people to read it. In as much as there is truth to go woke-go broke, that is it.

The thing with all this ESG score, stakeholder capitalism stuff is it introduces performance metrics that have nothing to do with producing things that people want to buy. The more focus there is on diversity, the bechdel test, and being stunning and brave... the less focus you need to have on commercial success. Plus, if all the streaming platforms sign up for the same targets, it really doesn't matter in terms of market share. Hitting political targets rather than creative targets is just so much easier. If your bonus depended on your targets, you'd choose political targets every time.

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Old 2nd June 2022, 04:32 AM   #460
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Originally Posted by Puppycow View Post
Some of these things you are railing against seem to spring from your own imagination.
Perhaps you forget that turning Heard into a poster child for abuse victims was the entire point for the ACLU when they co-wrote her WP column.
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Old 2nd June 2022, 04:34 AM   #461
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Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
Anyone running any site still expects a return from eyeballs and ad clicks. How many trials are conducted every day in the U.S., even in one big city? The only trials that would be televised would involve high-profile celebs or especially gruesome murders, and those are the ones that would encourage posturing by all participants.
Then let me be a bit more specific.

With few exceptions (and this shouldn’t be one), every trial should allow the proceedings to be publicly filmed.
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Old 2nd June 2022, 04:40 AM   #462
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Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
Did you see every media report? I actually trust experienced reporters for the Washington Post, NY Times etc. to separate what's important from the distractions.
Why on earth would you do that? That’s stupid. Especially the Washington Post, given their obvious conflict of interest, since they published the defamatory article.

Never trust the media to report accurately about anything.. Most reporters have little to no experience doing anything except churning out copy fast.
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Old 2nd June 2022, 04:42 AM   #463
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Originally Posted by smartcooky View Post
I had read somewhere that she has been been diagnosed with Histrionic Personality Disorder and Borderline Personality Disorder. I am unsure if this is true,
Oh, it’s very true, and it’s one of the things that was testified to at trial by the diagnosing psychologist.
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Old 2nd June 2022, 04:58 AM   #464
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Originally Posted by shuttlt View Post
I didn't say that people signed up to streaming services based on diversity. That is kind of the trope that Marvel hires a bunch of blue haired communists, who don't like and don't read comics, and despise the people who do, to write comics. They turn the comic into a vehicle for their politics and all the comic stores close down because you can't pay people to read it. In as much as there is truth to go woke-go broke, that is it.

The thing with all this ESG score, stakeholder capitalism stuff is it introduces performance metrics that have nothing to do with producing things that people want to buy. The more focus there is on diversity, the bechdel test, and being stunning and brave... the less focus you need to have on commercial success. Plus, if all the streaming platforms sign up for the same targets, it really doesn't matter in terms of market share. Hitting political targets rather than creative targets is just so much easier. If your bonus depended on your targets, you'd choose political targets every time.
This is an exceedingly bizarre and inaccurate view of how capitalism really works (and is probably a rather sharp derail to boot).
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Old 2nd June 2022, 05:07 AM   #465
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
Then let me be a bit more specific.

With few exceptions (and this shouldn’t be one), every trial should allow the proceedings to be publicly filmed.
I would agree on the principal that the actions of our courts are inherently worthy of public scrutiny, with the caveat that more probably ought to be done to isolate juries. Trusting that jury will follow instructions and not notice the giant media circus occurring around the case they are participating in is a dubious assumption.

I would be very surprised if most, if not all, of the jurors were not aware and influenced by the bizarre media circus that sprung up around this case.
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Old 2nd June 2022, 05:28 AM   #466
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Originally Posted by johnny karate View Post
There’s plenty of evidence, and it’s not that difficult to find. This article (and there are others) came out a year before Amber Heard’s op-ed:

Johnny Depp reportedly drank heavily and was constantly late on the new 'Pirates' movie set
There's a fine tradition of redemption stories for Hollywood idols sobering up and being welcomed back into the industry, so I really doubt there's much stopping Depp from getting back on the horse if he has dried out and becomes reliable again. Then again, there's also plenty of precedent for the benders to never stop until the bloated corpse is discovered years later, so it's really up to Depp.

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Old 2nd June 2022, 06:23 AM   #467
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Originally Posted by SuburbanTurkey View Post
I would agree on the principal that the actions of our courts are inherently worthy of public scrutiny, with the caveat that more probably ought to be done to isolate juries.
I'm not opposed to that.

Quote:
I would be very surprised if most, if not all, of the jurors were not aware and influenced by the bizarre media circus that sprung up around this case.
Counter-argument: in the Rittenhouse trial, my sense was that the general expectation before the trial was that he should be convicted, and that most of the pressure on the jury would be to convict. But because the trial was broadcast, and because people could see what a complete **** show the prosecution was, I think that probably alleviated outside pressure on the jury to provide a conviction. If the jury knows that the public can see what they based their decision on, I think that simplifies their calculations.
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Old 2nd June 2022, 06:44 AM   #468
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The detail that has most of my attention when it comes to this "thing" is how utterly inescapable it was. I used every single tool and option that social media platforms provide to allow you to choose to avoid certain topics. These tools effectively kept Trump and mentions of Trump off my timelines while he was president, but they completely failed here. No matter how many times I clicked the "Don't show me this topic" prompts and "not interested in (keyword)" from the option lists, "LOL TURD LAWYER MOVES LEFT THUMB IN COURT (laughing emoji laughing emoji)" garbage was nevertheless pumped into my feeds at all times of day, every day. I've never seen such a massive and unstoppable junket.
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Old 2nd June 2022, 06:48 AM   #469
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Originally Posted by Checkmite View Post
The detail that has most of my attention when it comes to this "thing" is how utterly inescapable it was. I used every single tool and option that social media platforms provide to allow you to choose to avoid certain topics. These tools effectively kept Trump and mentions of Trump off my timelines while he was president, but they completely failed here. No matter how many times I clicked the "Don't show me this topic" prompts and "not interested in (keyword)" from the option lists, "LOL TURD LAWYER MOVES LEFT THUMB IN COURT (laughing emoji laughing emoji)" garbage was nevertheless pumped into my feeds at all times of day, every day. I've never seen such a massive and unstoppable junket.
It does seem to have been one of those issues where seemingly everyone had to have some strong opinion about. Lots of projection into the tawdry interpersonal affair of two people whose lives are so unusual they may as well be aliens compared to the general public.

I worry that the big victory lap, extending beyond just Depp's weird fanclub, of the win is sending a pretty nasty message to any woman who might be in an abusive situation. The glee and circus atmosphere around this case strikes me as wildly inappropriate for what is otherwise a serious and sober matter.
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Old 2nd June 2022, 06:53 AM   #470
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Originally Posted by SuburbanTurkey View Post
There's a fine tradition of redemption stories for Hollywood idols sobering up and being welcomed back into the industry, so I really doubt there's much stopping Depp from getting back on the horse if he has dried out and becomes reliable again. Then again, there's also plenty of precedent for the benders to never stop until the bloated corpse is discovered years later, so it's really up to Depp.
Unfortunately, Depp doesn’t seem too interested in the kind of introspection that would lead him to redemption. He’s committed himself to a vengeful slash-and-burn blaming of everyone around him.

Now that the dust has settled on all his lawsuits (he still has one pending against him for allegedly assaulting a crew member on one of his most recent films) it will be interesting to see where he goes now that he has no one left to blame for the state of his life and career.
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Old 2nd June 2022, 07:08 AM   #471
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Originally Posted by Checkmite View Post
The detail that has most of my attention when it comes to this "thing" is how utterly inescapable it was. I used every single tool and option that social media platforms provide to allow you to choose to avoid certain topics. These tools effectively kept Trump and mentions of Trump off my timelines while he was president, but they completely failed here. No matter how many times I clicked the "Don't show me this topic" prompts and "not interested in (keyword)" from the option lists, "LOL TURD LAWYER MOVES LEFT THUMB IN COURT (laughing emoji laughing emoji)" garbage was nevertheless pumped into my feeds at all times of day, every day. I've never seen such a massive and unstoppable junket.
This is a problem with social media, not with this "thing". I'm only mildly surprised that trying to use social media tools to curate your social media stream hasn't gotten any easier or more effective since the last time I tried, several years ago.

Now I curate my social media stream by not having one. Funnily enough, I still couldn't avoid this.
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Old 2nd June 2022, 07:12 AM   #472
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
Then let me be a bit more specific.

With few exceptions (and this shouldn’t be one), every trial should allow the proceedings to be publicly filmed.
Filmed for the record is not the same as telecast live. Only the highest profile and most controversial cases would ever be telecast live, still raising all the questions about influence on all the participants, including the jury.

Last edited by Bob001; 2nd June 2022 at 07:26 AM.
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Old 2nd June 2022, 07:16 AM   #473
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Originally Posted by SuburbanTurkey View Post
the win is sending a pretty nasty message to any woman who might be in an abusive situation
Message 1:

"If you think you might be in an abusive situation, then probably make an effort to figure it out one way or the other before going public with accusations towards someone who might or might not be abusing you."

Message 2:

"If you are in an abusive situation, but can't really prove it, then probably make an effort to get out of that situation, and get professional legal and medical help to deal with your abuser. And probably don't go public with accusations that you can't really prove even if you know them to be true."

Message 3:

"If you are abusing someone, and they can prove it, and you can't really prove that they were also abusing you, then probably don't go public with accusations that you can't really prove even if you know them to be true."

None of those messages seem particularly nasty.

And really, "don't make accusations you can't prove" is pretty basic ethics, and pretty basic justice.

What message do you think should be sent to women who might be in an abusive situation? "Make accusations you can't prove"? How is that supposed to work, for them or for society in general?
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Old 2nd June 2022, 07:24 AM   #474
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
Why on earth would you do that? That’s stupid. Especially the Washington Post, given their obvious conflict of interest, since they published the defamatory article.

Never trust the media to report accurately about anything.. Most reporters have little to no experience doing anything except churning out copy fast.
"The media are incompetent and corrupt." Now there's a crazy right-wing trope if I ever heard one. Nothing outside your own direct experience could possibly be true, eh? Unless you agree with it, right? As a point of reference, who do you think won the 2020 election? Responsible media are certainly open to criticism. They are sometimes their own most vigorous critics. But covering a trial is one of the things they do best because it does not require deep technical knowledge. All reporters need to know is who said what. They're good at that.

And the Post was never a party to the suit. It had no stake in the outcome. Instead of suing, maybe Depp should have demanded equal space to respond.

Last edited by Bob001; 2nd June 2022 at 07:28 AM.
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Old 2nd June 2022, 07:25 AM   #475
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
What message do you think should be sent to women who might be in an abusive situation? "Make accusations you can't prove"? How is that supposed to work, for them or for society in general?
I don't think ST has thought very much about this question. I think his response is much more instinctual: the wrong people are satisfied, so the decision must be wrong. And then he's grabbing for a justification for that position, and this is what's being put forward by Heard's attorneys.

Which is how we wind up with nonsense like this:
Amber Heard Verdict Sends A Message To Black Women Everywhere
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Old 2nd June 2022, 07:26 AM   #476
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Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
she gets to decide that she felt abused. It doesn't matter whether someone thinks she should feel that way, or whether somebody else in the same boat would feel the same way.
That's expanding the definition of 'abuse' way beyond what I'm comfortable with.

That expands the definition to the point that I can complain about the abuses of my emplyer by making me work 40 hours a week. I feel that's abusive, therefore it is.

I don't think that's right at all.
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Old 2nd June 2022, 07:32 AM   #477
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Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
"The media are incompetent and corrupt."
I said nothing about corrupt. But if you don't know they're incompetent, then you don't understand anything about the media.

Quote:
Nothing outside your own direct experience could possibly be true, eh?
You're not familiar with the Gell-Mann effect, are you?

Quote:
As a point of reference, who do you think won the 2020 election?
Biden. Nice try, but your attempt to turn this partisan is pathetic.

Quote:
Responsible media are certainly open to criticism. They are sometimes their own most vigorous critics.
Bwahahahahahaha!

No. No they are not.

Quote:
But covering a trial is one of the things they do best because it does not require deep technical knowledge. All reporters need to know is who said what. They're good at that.
And yet, they still managed to do a garbage job at it.

Quote:
And the Post was never a party to the suit. It had no stake in the outcome.
Your second sentence doesn't actually follow from the first. Their stake is reputational, not legal. It looks bad for them to have published a defamatory article, even if they don't have any legal liability for it.
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Old 2nd June 2022, 07:33 AM   #478
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
I don't think ST has thought very much about this question. I think his response is much more instinctual: the wrong people are satisfied, so the decision must be wrong. And then he's grabbing for a justification for that position, and this is what's being put forward by Heard's attorneys.

Which is how we wind up with nonsense like this:
Amber Heard Verdict Sends A Message To Black Women Everywhere
No, my point is that the intense public interest in this case probably has more significance than a dispute between two individuals.

I don't mean to imply this is entirely one sided either. Heard obviously was trying to project her own personal experience onto a wider issue in her original op-ed. The article you link is another example.

My point is that it's pretty obvious that many people taking interest in this case see it as larger than a simple dispute between two people, but as a proxy battle or larger commentary on the general "me too" phenomena.

When you have the House Judiciary GOP social media account posting touch-down dance style gifs of Depp, you're not making a logical leap to suggest that maybe this has taken on a life beyond the explicit parameters of the case. You need not wonder long why Republicans might take find themselves having an affinity for a man accused of abusing women.

https://twitter.com/JudiciaryGOP/sta...81904601669632

For better or worse (definitely worse), this case has become a proxy for something bigger, much like other big cases have before (OJ, Chauvin, Rodney King, etc).

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Old 2nd June 2022, 07:37 AM   #479
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Originally Posted by SuburbanTurkey View Post
It does seem to have been one of those issues where seemingly everyone had to have some strong opinion about. Lots of projection into the tawdry interpersonal affair of two people whose lives are so unusual they may as well be aliens compared to the general public.

I worry that the big victory lap, extending beyond just Depp's weird fanclub, of the win is sending a pretty nasty message to any woman who might be in an abusive situation. The glee and circus atmosphere around this case strikes me as wildly inappropriate for what is otherwise a serious and sober matter.
We're going to do it all over again with Marilyn Manson's pending lawsuit against Evan Rachel Wood. Granted, Manson isn't nearly the beloved figure that Depp is, so he's not going to have much mainstream support. But the salacious details will keep it in the headlines and the alt-right and incel bottom feeders will be running the same game they ran during the Depp-Heard trial.

No matter how you feel about the outcome of this trial, there's now doubt that it created a blue print for wealthy and powerful abusers to further victimize their accusers.
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Old 2nd June 2022, 07:43 AM   #480
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Originally Posted by johnny karate View Post
No matter how you feel about the outcome of this trial, there's now doubt that it created a blue print for wealthy and powerful abusers to further victimize their accusers.
Yeah, no. Most abusers cannot depend on their victims not having any real evidence, and faking evidence, and perjuring themselves on the stand and being caught out doing so.
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