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Tags 2020 elections , biden , Biden administration , Biden controversies , joe biden , Kamala Harris , sucks

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Old 28th June 2022, 10:17 PM   #601
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I don't believe people are emotionally attached to fossil fuels. I do believe people are emotionally attached to the principle of rejecting anything those lefty leftists propose to make our God-given quality of life worse.
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Old 28th June 2022, 10:48 PM   #602
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Originally Posted by ZiprHead View Post
Permits and leases are two differant things.
Thank you for correcting me. I was so excited I must have mixed the two for some reason. I do realize Biden halted the leasing and I'm glad you do too.
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Old 28th June 2022, 11:09 PM   #603
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
The person doing the spinning is you. You've been blaming increased gas prices on Biden. The evidence clearly demonstrates that Biden's actions haven't affected fuel supplies in the slightest.
I haven't put a spin on anything. The examples I pointed out are direct evidence of this administration's Energy Policy failures. I quoted from Executive Order 14008 and linked to the Department of the Interior to investigate. I did add a citation from WAPO but only in reference to the largest lease under Biden in the Gulf of Mexico being shot down by a DC Judge.

If your takeaway is that Biden has had nothing to do with the price of gasoline rising, that's on you. I tend to believe that a President's Energy policies can have either a positive or negative effect on the price of energy.
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Old 30th June 2022, 07:00 AM   #604
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Now he's nominated a right-wing anti-abortion Federal judge hand-picked by McConnell.

That's our great defender of the judicial system's sanity there, folks.
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Old 30th June 2022, 07:59 AM   #605
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
In this forum more than once there has been whining that renewable power wasn't anywhere close to replacing fossil fuels.

It's not only likely alternative energy sources will be able to replace fossil fuels soon, they are proving to be cost effective. Some utility companies want solar power used by homeowners banned. Said companies don't like losing money.
The utility companies don't really care about whether your power is solar, wind, or oil, they care about being the ones to sell the power to you. As costs come down, more and more homeowners are getting of the electric grid completely, forcing them to squeeze their remaining customers harder to keep profits going, making going off-grid more appealing. A decentralized electricity model is the death of their industry.

There are a lot of industrial scale wind and solar arrays out there owned by big business, it is the off-grid stuff that they are trying to quash...
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Old 30th June 2022, 08:41 AM   #606
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Originally Posted by ChrisBFRPKY View Post
I haven't put a spin on anything. The examples I pointed out are direct evidence of this administration's Energy Policy failures. I quoted from Executive Order 14008 and linked to the Department of the Interior to investigate. I did add a citation from WAPO but only in reference to the largest lease under Biden in the Gulf of Mexico being shot down by a DC Judge.

If your takeaway is that Biden has had nothing to do with the price of gasoline rising, that's on you. I tend to believe that a President's Energy policies can have either a positive or negative effect on the price of energy.
Yes, you are. Your logic is impaired. I do think POTUS''s policies can affect energy prices. But it takes years between the time leases are granted, drilling rigs to be built, wells to be dug, pipelines to be constructed and the oil to be delivered to refineries.

We are far more likely facing the problems left by the previous administration than anything Biden has created.
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Last edited by acbytesla; 30th June 2022 at 09:36 AM.
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Old 30th June 2022, 10:17 AM   #607
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Originally Posted by Delvo View Post
Now he's nominated a right-wing anti-abortion Federal judge hand-picked by McConnell.
....

Apparently that's the result of a sleazy deal.
Quote:
As first reported by The Courier-Journal, Rep. John Yarmuth (D-Ky.) and other sources say the done-deal nomination of Chad Meredith is intended to placate McConnell, who will supposedly pledge to not stall further federal nominations by the Biden White House.
https://www.rollingstone.com/politic...edith-1376416/

It's shameful and disgusting, but it's necessary due to the intransigence of the "filibuster forever" Manchin/Sinema crowd. If the Senate had 50 real Democrats voting together, McConnell wouldn't matter.
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Old 30th June 2022, 11:42 AM   #608
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Originally Posted by Random View Post
The utility companies don't really care about whether your power is solar, wind, or oil, they care about being the ones to sell the power to you. As costs come down, more and more homeowners are getting of the electric grid completely, forcing them to squeeze their remaining customers harder to keep profits going, making going off-grid more appealing. A decentralized electricity model is the death of their industry.

There are a lot of industrial scale wind and solar arrays out there owned by big business, it is the off-grid stuff that they are trying to quash...
Is this an excuse for the power companies?

Of course it's not about renewable energy.
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Old 30th June 2022, 12:23 PM   #609
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
Is this an excuse for the power companies?

Of course it's not about renewable energy.
Sorry. A lot of people think it is alternative energy itself that the big utilities object to. It was not readily apparent to me that you were not one of those people. I apologize.
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Old 30th June 2022, 01:18 PM   #610
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Originally Posted by Random View Post
Sorry. A lot of people think it is alternative energy itself that the big utilities object to. It was not readily apparent to me that you were not one of those people. I apologize.
Their objections are not without merit. Maintaining the grid is not inexpensive. Rooftop solar threatens not only their profit, but their ability to maintain the grid.

But I don't think the solution to the problem is eliminating rooftop solar.
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Old 30th June 2022, 01:28 PM   #611
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
Their objections are not without merit. Maintaining the grid is not inexpensive. Rooftop solar threatens not only their profit, but their ability to maintain the grid.

But I don't think the solution to the problem is eliminating rooftop solar.
The solution to the problem is probably going to have to be some combination of charging more to those who will not or cannot get off the grid, and raising taxes for the purpose of maintaining the grid in support of major economic and industrial activity that still needs what the grid provides. Presumably the revenue from these activities will be more than sufficient to pay for the infrastructure, but what if it isn't? We might end up having to claw back some of the savings realized by those with rooftop solar, in the form of taxes to maintain a grid they've opted out of.
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Old 30th June 2022, 03:00 PM   #612
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Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
The solution to the problem is probably going to have to be some combination of charging more to those who will not or cannot get off the grid, and raising taxes for the purpose of maintaining the grid in support of major economic and industrial activity that still needs what the grid provides. Presumably the revenue from these activities will be more than sufficient to pay for the infrastructure, but what if it isn't? We might end up having to claw back some of the savings realized by those with rooftop solar, in the form of taxes to maintain a grid they've opted out of.
I don’t disagree. But there is a huge value to distributed power. Not just to the grid, but society as a whole.

The question is who is going to pay those higher taxes?

The rich keep getting richer and the middle class and poor keep getting poorer.
You can't increase raising prices on them.
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Last edited by acbytesla; 30th June 2022 at 03:40 PM.
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Old 30th June 2022, 03:22 PM   #613
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Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
Apparently that's the result of a sleazy deal.

https://www.rollingstone.com/politic...edith-1376416/

It's shameful and disgusting, but it's necessary due to the intransigence of the "filibuster forever" Manchin/Sinema crowd. If the Senate had 50 real Democrats voting together, McConnell wouldn't matter.
The nominated person was also apparently involved with paying for pardon scheming. It's disappointing that Biden would have real cause to play along here, but also plenty telling that this guy is who McConnell's pushing. Can't say that I trust McConnell to uphold his end of that deal, though.
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Old 30th June 2022, 05:18 PM   #614
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Originally Posted by Aridas View Post
The nominated person was also apparently involved with paying for pardon scheming. It's disappointing that Biden would have real cause to play along here, but also plenty telling that this guy is who McConnell's pushing. Can't say that I trust McConnell to uphold his end of that deal, though.
Biden may nominate him but that doesn't mean he will be approved.
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Old 30th June 2022, 06:41 PM   #615
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
Their objections are not without merit. Maintaining the grid is not inexpensive. Rooftop solar threatens not only their profit, but their ability to maintain the grid.

But I don't think the solution to the problem is eliminating rooftop solar.
I'm not sure how ability to maintain the grid matters here. If you want to stay connected to the grid but still use solar there are regulations that mandate how you do that. They can't have their technicians being exposed to the risk of an improperly installed system.
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Old 30th June 2022, 06:50 PM   #616
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Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
It's shameful and disgusting, but it's necessary due to the intransigence of the "filibuster forever" Manchin/Sinema crowd.
The Manchin Sinematic Universe has been approving non-maniacal appointments so far; their obstructionism has just been about legislation. But even if that weren't the case, it wouldn't make literally letting the Republicans pick the Democrats' appointments for them "necessary" because, whether sane appointments were getting through or not, there would still be no chance at all of McConnell, the inventor of the strategy of just not doing his job on judicial appointments when a Democrat is President, honoring this deal when the time comes. It can not possibly serve any purpose but to demonstrate once again what an utterly clueless and gullible fool Biden is about politics.
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Old 30th June 2022, 07:35 PM   #617
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
I'm not sure how ability to maintain the grid matters here. If you want to stay connected to the grid but still use solar there are regulations that mandate how you do that. They can't have their technicians being exposed to the risk of an improperly installed system.
That's another issue. But for the most part that is dealt with using inverters that won't send power to the grid unless the grid is up.

The point I was making is that it costs the power companies to maintain the grid. Issues with downed power lines, worn out splices, worn out transformers, bad fuses. High voltage power lines are dangerous to work around. This is not cheap.
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Old 30th June 2022, 09:45 PM   #618
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
....
The point I was making is that it costs the power companies to maintain the grid. Issues with downed power lines, worn out splices, worn out transformers, bad fuses. High voltage power lines are dangerous to work around. This is not cheap.
So your claim is it's not about profits, they are barely staying above water?
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Old 30th June 2022, 10:25 PM   #619
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
So your claim is it's not about profits, they are barely staying above water?
It's about both. Companies need to make profits. Nobody works for free.

The answer is public utilities. Regulated and limited profits. In my state, most of the electricity is provided by publicly regulated utilities. And most of that electricity is generated by government power resources.
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Old 30th June 2022, 11:33 PM   #620
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all basic needs need to be met on a non-profit or co-op basis, which should be obvious to anyone who thinks about it.
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Old 7th July 2022, 11:54 AM   #621
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Biden is awarding the Medal of Freedom, the highest civilian honor awarded by the US Government, to 17 people all of which right wing trolls will have a problem with for reasons.
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Old 7th July 2022, 01:15 PM   #622
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Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
Biden is awarding the Medal of Freedom, the highest civilian honor awarded by the US Government, to 17 people all of which right wing trolls will have a problem with for reasons.
You know, if I were president, I would stop awarding the Medal of Freedom and come up with some other award to be the country's "highest civilian honor". (Medal of Integrity? Medal of Citizenship?)

After Stubby McBonespurs gave the award to Rush Lymphnode (a drug addict that politfact pointed out was > 80% wrong) during a state-of-the-union address as a publicity stunt, it seems like award is now tainted.
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Old 7th July 2022, 05:55 PM   #623
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Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
You know, if I were president, I would stop awarding the Medal of Freedom and come up with some other award to be the country's "highest civilian honor". (Medal of Integrity? Medal of Citizenship?)

After Stubby McBonespurs gave the award to Rush Lymphnode (a drug addict that politfact pointed out was > 80% wrong) during a state-of-the-union address as a publicity stunt, it seems like award is now tainted.
I was thinking the same thing.
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Old 7th July 2022, 06:08 PM   #624
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Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
You know, if I were president, I would stop awarding the Medal of Freedom and come up with some other award to be the country's "highest civilian honor". (Medal of Integrity? Medal of Citizenship?)

After Stubby McBonespurs gave the award to Rush Lymphnode (a drug addict that politfact pointed out was > 80% wrong) during a state-of-the-union address as a publicity stunt, it seems like award is now tainted.
GW had already dishonored the medal. He gave one to 'Heck of a Job Brownie' who totally mucked up New Orleans during/after Katrina. But definitely Drumpf topped that. I'm glad to see Biden giving them to people that were at least honorable and not cringeworthy.

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Old 7th July 2022, 08:23 PM   #625
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
GW had already dishonored the medal. He gave one to 'Heck of a Job Brownie' who totally mucked up New Orleans during/after Katrina.
.....
I don't think that's true.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...George_W._Bush

Of course, Bush did give them to Bill Cosby, Paul Bremer and Ben Carson, so your point still holds.

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Old 7th July 2022, 09:49 PM   #626
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Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
I don't think that's true.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...George_W._Bush

Of course, Bush did give them to Bill Cosby, Paul Bremer and Ben Carson, so your point still holds.
In the case of Cosby/Carson, it could be argued that they received the award before it was known just how reprehensible they were.

Compare that to Rush Lymphnode, who's doucheness has been known for some time.

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Old 7th July 2022, 10:15 PM   #627
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Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
I don't think that's true.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...George_W._Bush

Of course, Bush did give them to Bill Cosby, Paul Bremer and Ben Carson, so your point still holds.
Yes, it appears I have a false memory on that one.
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Old 8th July 2022, 08:47 PM   #628
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
Yes, you are. Your logic is impaired. I do think POTUS''s policies can affect energy prices. But it takes years between the time leases are granted, drilling rigs to be built, wells to be dug, pipelines to be constructed and the oil to be delivered to refineries.

We are far more likely facing the problems left by the previous administration than anything Biden has created.
You've obviously never owned or operated a drilling rig. I have. My logic is completely sound and undeniable, it is likely your understanding that is lacking.

Drilling permits for a lease are only a small part of completing a new well. The EPA has much to do with allowing or denying the ability to drill a well. They can delay you indefinitely with things like Environmental studies, wildlife studies, and a whole list of other permits required before you can drill such as: holding pool permits, and waste water disposal permits to name a couple. The waste water disposal can be an issue on its own requiring a separate disposal well to be permitted and drilled before you can ever produce the original well drilled. (That is if you were lucky enough and jumped thru enough red tape to get to drill it in the first place.)

A President's policies regarding the EPA have VERY MUCH to do with new oil and or gas wells and hence the excess or limits in supply of oil and or gas. Policies that empower and create a stronger EPA with more ability to impede production have a direct impact on the amount of oil and gas produced in the US.

If anything, Trump's policies on the EPA were designed to create a more production friendly atmosphere for fossil fuels. Can you say the same of Biden's? I bet you can't.
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Old 8th July 2022, 10:04 PM   #629
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Originally Posted by ChrisBFRPKY View Post
You've obviously never owned or operated a drilling rig. I have. My logic is completely sound and undeniable, it is likely your understanding that is lacking.

Drilling permits for a lease are only a small part of completing a new well. The EPA has much to do with allowing or denying the ability to drill a well. They can delay you indefinitely with things like Environmental studies, wildlife studies, and a whole list of other permits required before you can drill such as: holding pool permits, and waste water disposal permits to name a couple. The waste water disposal can be an issue on its own requiring a separate disposal well to be permitted and drilled before you can ever produce the original well drilled. (That is if you were lucky enough and jumped thru enough red tape to get to drill it in the first place.)
.....
Okay, what specific policy changes did the Biden EPA make, and did they in fact discourage U.S. production?

And do you think protecting wildlife and clean water are unreasonable goals?
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Old 8th July 2022, 10:17 PM   #630
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Originally Posted by ChrisBFRPKY View Post
You've obviously never owned or operated a drilling rig. I have. My logic is completely sound and undeniable, it is likely your understanding that is lacking.

Drilling permits for a lease are only a small part of completing a new well. The EPA has much to do with allowing or denying the ability to drill a well. They can delay you indefinitely with things like Environmental studies, wildlife studies, and a whole list of other permits required before you can drill such as: holding pool permits, and waste water disposal permits to name a couple. The waste water disposal can be an issue on its own requiring a separate disposal well to be permitted and drilled before you can ever produce the original well drilled. (That is if you were lucky enough and jumped thru enough red tape to get to drill it in the first place.)

A President's policies regarding the EPA have VERY MUCH to do with new oil and or gas wells and hence the excess or limits in supply of oil and or gas. Policies that empower and create a stronger EPA with more ability to impede production have a direct impact on the amount of oil and gas produced in the US.

If anything, Trump's policies on the EPA were designed to create a more production friendly atmosphere for fossil fuels. Can you say the same of Biden's? I bet you can't.
so having been part of one tiny fraction of the industry makes you an expert?

The problem is not with the EPA, but with big money firms that own shares in all oil and oil related companies and want all of them to keep prices high to maximize return on their investment.
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Old 9th July 2022, 02:38 AM   #631
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Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
Okay, what specific policy changes did the Biden EPA make, and did they in fact discourage U.S. production?

And do you think protecting wildlife and clean water are unreasonable goals?
Thanks Bob! I was hoping someone would ask that exact question.

Beginning Jan 20, 2021 President Biden enacted a series of Executive Orders. One of those orders is EO 13990 "Protecting Public Health and the Environment and Restoring Science To Tackle the Climate Crisis"

Within that order he revoked several of Trump's Executive Orders. The easiest one that explains why production of US oil and gas has dropped off since then was the revocation of Executive Order 13771 signed Jan 30, 2017 Titled : "Reducing Regulation and Controlling Regulatory Costs" The most important detail within that order was that it required the EPA (and other Government agencies too but the target was the EPA) anyway, they were required to eliminate 2 existing regulations for each new regulation proposed. No new regulations without lifting some old regulations. This made it much more difficult for the EPA to take oil producers to task on well drilling and production. They were no longer able to simply add a new regulation to stop the process anytime they saw fit to do so.

The elimination of that one Executive Order let the EPA off their leash and Biden added a new weapon to use in his war on oil.

Thanks again!
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Old 9th July 2022, 03:11 AM   #632
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
so having been part of one tiny fraction of the industry makes you an expert?

The problem is not with the EPA, but with big money firms that own shares in all oil and oil related companies and want all of them to keep prices high to maximize return on their investment.
I didn't claim to be an expert but I have found new oil fields and drilled those for production as well as reopen, service and produce wells on the old LeGrande Oil Pool in Kentucky. I do have a background of working with the EPA to achieve permits for new wells, opening old wells and permitting and bonding deep injection wells. I am well versed in fulfilling requirements for production of oil in several areas of Kentucky. I don't know if that makes me an expert and I don't consider myself one when among peers in the drilling community but I certainly know a thing or two about the EPA and oil wells.

President Biden's policies and Executive Orders, some as outlined above are directly responsible for the current lack of US production and new exploration of oil and gas. Since the EPA is no longer required to eliminate 2 old regulations for every new regulation proposed, they can and have simply regulated the oil drillers out of a job, as intended. This shouldn't come as a surprise, Biden promised to transition from fossil fuels and he's making good on those promises. Though with his popularity declining has been releasing a million barrels per day from the strategic oil reserves to try and reduce the pump price a few cents. It won't work, he'd have to release at least 2 million barrels a day for about a year just to get near the price we were before.

In case you're wondering what the EPA is doing in 2022 or you were about to ask, have a look here:

https://www.epa.gov/system/files/doc...fact-sheet.pdf

Just a few little things like monitoring 300,000 well sites across the US to make sure they're not out of compliance with the new methane gas requirements to reduce green house gasses. Shutting down any wells not in compliance and requiring surveys of wells for leaks etc. Typical EPA stuff, shutting down production wells to make sure there aren't any methane leaks. Next they'll be bottling cow farts or regulating them. Perhaps cattle farmers will have to pay a greenhouse gas fine or tax per cow.
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Old 9th July 2022, 08:03 PM   #633
Bob001
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Originally Posted by ChrisBFRPKY View Post
Thanks Bob! I was hoping someone would ask that exact question.

Beginning Jan 20, 2021 President Biden enacted a series of Executive Orders. One of those orders is EO 13990 "Protecting Public Health and the Environment and Restoring Science To Tackle the Climate Crisis"

Within that order he revoked several of Trump's Executive Orders. The easiest one that explains why production of US oil and gas has dropped off since then was the revocation of Executive Order 13771 signed Jan 30, 2017 Titled : "Reducing Regulation and Controlling Regulatory Costs" The most important detail within that order was that it required the EPA (and other Government agencies too but the target was the EPA) anyway, they were required to eliminate 2 existing regulations for each new regulation proposed. No new regulations without lifting some old regulations. This made it much more difficult for the EPA to take oil producers to task on well drilling and production. They were no longer able to simply add a new regulation to stop the process anytime they saw fit to do so.

The elimination of that one Executive Order let the EPA off their leash and Biden added a new weapon to use in his war on oil.

Thanks again!
Glad to help. But hat doesn't quite answer the question. You say in effect the EPA restored previous regulations (not the same as creating new ones). What were those regulations, and how did they actually affect oil producers? I don't think it's wildly unreasonable to say you can't poison the air and water while you're drilling for oil. And saying two rules must be dropped to impose a new one doesn't make much sense if it doesn't require assessing what's actually being regulated.

Let's look further. What was the total U.S. oil production in 2020, Trump's last year, and 2021, Biden's first full year, and -- to assess the pandemic's effects -- how do those numbers compare to world oil production in the same periods, and to U.S. imports of foreign oil in the same periods?

Oil is a global market. I think there's a limit to how much Biden can be blamed for gas prices.
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Old 9th July 2022, 08:39 PM   #634
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One look at the Profit Margins will tell you who is to blame for gas prices.
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Old 12th July 2022, 01:02 AM   #635
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Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
Glad to help. But hat doesn't quite answer the question. You say in effect the EPA restored previous regulations (not the same as creating new ones). What were those regulations, and how did they actually affect oil producers? I don't think it's wildly unreasonable to say you can't poison the air and water while you're drilling for oil. And saying two rules must be dropped to impose a new one doesn't make much sense if it doesn't require assessing what's actually being regulated.

Let's look further. What was the total U.S. oil production in 2020, Trump's last year, and 2021, Biden's first full year, and -- to assess the pandemic's effects -- how do those numbers compare to world oil production in the same periods, and to U.S. imports of foreign oil in the same periods?

Oil is a global market. I think there's a limit to how much Biden can be blamed for gas prices.
Sure Bob! Just have a look here:

"Standards of Performance for New, Reconstructed, and Modified Sources and Emissions Guidelines for Existing Sources: Oil and Natural Gas Sector Climate Review"

https://www.federalregister.gov/docu...guidelines-for

Feel free to review the 2021 guidelines and standards set for oil and gas production in the US. There are many. While you do keep in mind these were 2021 and more are proposed and have been enacted for 2022. Each time you read one of the new guidelines concerning methane gas that puts a number on the amount allowed, it will be less than before due to the new emphasis on the climate and protecting us from evil greenhouse gases. Would you like to guess who tasked the EPA to be more environmentally friendly at the cost of production? No peeking.

I'm a fair person. I'll freely admit that President Biden is not 100% to blame for the high price of oil at this moment. There are "recent" contributing factors and to be fair I must allow him those and I do. However, the price of gasoline was rising long before Putin started misbehaving. President Biden's energy policies with emphasis on reduction of greenhouse gases, his halt on new leasing the first day in office, the revocation of Trump's Executive Orders that assisted energy production specifically Executive Order 13771 that limited agencies from enacting new regulations until removal of two existing regulations is and are crucial factors of the current cost of energy.

There are those that claim President Biden has nothing to do with energy production or the lack of it in the US. They say the current price of gasoline has nothing to do with his policies. That's dishonest to the point of being laughable. You can't even call it spin anymore, though my they do try.

The funny thing is, everyone already knew this was going to happen. It's not a surprise. You can't transition away from fossil fuels without gouging oil companies with regulations, reducing production, and raising the price of gasoline. Yet when the price climbed as everyone expected, nobody wants to claim responsibility? How ridiculous is that.
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Old 12th July 2022, 02:58 AM   #636
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Originally Posted by ChrisBFRPKY View Post
I'm a fair person. I'll freely admit that President Biden is not 100% to blame for the high price of oil at this moment. There are "recent" contributing factors and to be fair I must allow him those and I do. However, the price of gasoline was rising long before Putin started misbehaving. President Biden's energy policies with emphasis on reduction of greenhouse gases, his halt on new leasing the first day in office, the revocation of Trump's Executive Orders that assisted energy production specifically Executive Order 13771 that limited agencies from enacting new regulations until removal of two existing regulations is and are crucial factors of the current cost of energy.There are those that claim President Biden has nothing to do with energy production or the lack of it in the US. They say the current price of gasoline has nothing to do with his policies. That's dishonest to the point of being laughable. You can't even call it spin anymore, though my they do try.

The funny thing is, everyone already knew this was going to happen. It's not a surprise. You can't transition away from fossil fuels without gouging oil companies with regulations, reducing production, and raising the price of gasoline. Yet when the price climbed as everyone expected, nobody wants to claim responsibility? How ridiculous is that.
Some of this perception may well have much to do with the more specific arguments being forwarded. Biden policy being reasonably likely to raise the cost of gas by some indeterminate amount eventually? That's not a stretch at all. Your usage of "Yet when the price climbed as everyone expected?" Biden's share of the blame simply being "not 100%," but you focusing almost exclusively on a single aspect of his actions? Prices had been rising since long before Putin misbehaving? The prices had been rising since long before Biden was elected! The many-faceted massive disruptions in both supply and demand that occurred in direct relation to COVID, how the economy pretty well recovered under Biden anyways(a), and so on pretty much guaranteed major increases in gas prices from the suppressed prices that Biden started with no matter how friendly Biden might be with the oil and gas industries! The prices climbed quite a lot, as everyone should have expected under the circumstances because of the larger factors in play? Yeah, duh. Did Biden policy increase that by some amount? It's certainly plausible, especially when one pointedly focuses on only one aspect of the whole, but when the large bulk of the increase pretty obviously has much, much more to do with things outside of his control and many of the arguments being used to accuse him are crap, it's not surprising when there's reflexive backlash against arguments that are not really any better than the ones that you've singled out as laughable and dishonest.

(a) - Should Biden have pointedly worked to sabotage the economy? That would have helped keep gas prices down, after all. Instead, of course, he's pretty clearly worked to restore it, which also happens to drive up gas prices. How much effect he's had is, of course, subject to some similar caveats as his effect on gas prices.
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Old 12th July 2022, 06:26 AM   #637
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Originally Posted by Aridas View Post
(a) - Should Biden have pointedly worked to sabotage the economy? That would have helped keep gas prices down, after all.
Bingo.

That's the response to the "the price of gas was $1.60 when Trump was president" nonsense.

Yeah, great. All Biden needs to do is to crash the economy again, get our unemployment back up over 10%, and gas prices will be fixed!
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Old 12th July 2022, 06:34 AM   #638
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Gas prices are falling, and FOX news is complaining.

https://www.alternet.org/2022/07/fox...ng-gas-prices/
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Old 12th July 2022, 06:51 AM   #639
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So, with fuel prices going back down, did Biden call off the "war" on fossil fuel? Did he surrender? Did the fuels cleverly outmaneuver him?

Surely that "war" couldn't have been just another Republican lie! There were regulations, and we all know regulations are war!
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Old 12th July 2022, 11:40 AM   #640
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Originally Posted by Aridas View Post
Some of this perception may well have much to do with the more specific arguments being forwarded. Biden policy being reasonably likely to raise the cost of gas by some indeterminate amount eventually? That's not a stretch at all. Your usage of "Yet when the price climbed as everyone expected?" Biden's share of the blame simply being "not 100%," but you focusing almost exclusively on a single aspect of his actions? Prices had been rising since long before Putin misbehaving? The prices had been rising since long before Biden was elected! The many-faceted massive disruptions in both supply and demand that occurred in direct relation to COVID, how the economy pretty well recovered under Biden anyways(a), and so on pretty much guaranteed major increases in gas prices from the suppressed prices that Biden started with no matter how friendly Biden might be with the oil and gas industries! The prices climbed quite a lot, as everyone should have expected under the circumstances because of the larger factors in play? Yeah, duh. Did Biden policy increase that by some amount? It's certainly plausible, especially when one pointedly focuses on only one aspect of the whole, but when the large bulk of the increase pretty obviously has much, much more to do with things outside of his control and many of the arguments being used to accuse him are crap, it's not surprising when there's reflexive backlash against arguments that are not really any better than the ones that you've singled out as laughable and dishonest.

(a) - Should Biden have pointedly worked to sabotage the economy? That would have helped keep gas prices down, after all. Instead, of course, he's pretty clearly worked to restore it, which also happens to drive up gas prices. How much effect he's had is, of course, subject to some similar caveats as his effect on gas prices.
The US economy is a disaster. There has been no recovery and much talk of recession. (With current inflation it's somewhat magical how we're not already there, perhaps we are not being told things by the Media that would tend to look bad for the Biden Admin?) Just a guess of course but it would seem the Media is forgiving beyond belief to the Biden Admin. But to even suggest the economy has recovered under Biden is enough spin to dizzy Tucker Carlson and Rachel Maddow both to the point of upchuck. What we have and what is undeniable is a distressed US economy, record breaking inflation and record breaking high prices of energy. Not limited to just the price of gasoline.

Please don't misunderstand my fairness statement above about other contributing factors to the price of oil rising. I focus on real issues and policies that have affected energy production under Biden. I allow only that Russia was a contributing factor that further increased the price of oil. However the price of oil was increasing at a steady rate under Biden anyway (as expected) due to his actions I outlined above. That's the main difference between reality and the Spinner's take.

There is also a noticeable difference between my definition of the price of oil rising and your definition it would seem, mainly the timing. I use the average price of oil during Trump's Presidency prior to the pandemic shutdown when oil crashed to nothing. You seem to be using the point at which the price of oil crashed to nothing and measuring the continued rise from that point attributing an increase to the previous Administration because it rose from effectively "0.00" at the worst point of the pandemic crash. That's a bit too spinny for my taste. I prefer cold hard facts, documented evidence and reality without the spin. You know, like the post with the Executive Orders, names, dates, Government agency policies that were changed, how they changed, how that affects energy and production in the US etc.
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