ISF Logo   IS Forum
Forum Index Register Members List Events Mark Forums Read Help

Go Back   International Skeptics Forum » General Topics » Social Issues & Current Events
 


Welcome to the International Skeptics Forum, where we discuss skepticism, critical thinking, the paranormal and science in a friendly but lively way. You are currently viewing the forum as a guest, which means you are missing out on discussing matters that are of interest to you. Please consider registering so you can gain full use of the forum features and interact with other Members. Registration is simple, fast and free! Click here to register today.
Reply
Old 17th August 2018, 07:07 AM   #1001
SuburbanTurkey
Muse
 
SuburbanTurkey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: Boston, USA
Posts: 726
Originally Posted by Babbylonian View Post
It's cool that we can be so certain of the thoughts and knowledge of a dead man. The science of mediums has apparently come a long way.
These are both likely conclusions. Did McGlockton use his x-ray vision to see Drejka's pistol under his shirt? Did they have some prior knowledge of one another that no witness or news report felt relevant to report? Just use Occam's Razor and don't bust my balls.
__________________
Gobble gobble
SuburbanTurkey is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 17th August 2018, 07:10 AM   #1002
Disbelief
Master Poster
 
Disbelief's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 2,600
Originally Posted by SuburbanTurkey View Post
These are both likely conclusions. Did McGlockton use his x-ray vision to see Drejka's pistol under his shirt? Did they have some prior knowledge of one another that no witness or news report felt relevant to report? Just use Occam's Razor and don't bust my balls.
Or did the frequent the place enough and Drejka already had a reputation for being confrontational?
__________________
Zensmack (LastChild, Laughing Assassin, RazetheFlag, Wastrel, TruthbyDecree) - Working his way up the sock puppet chain, trying to overtake P'Doh. Or, are they the same?

Quote me where I said conspiracists use evidence. - mchapman
Disbelief is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 17th August 2018, 07:29 AM   #1003
Babbylonian
Penultimate Amazing
 
Babbylonian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 11,387
Originally Posted by SuburbanTurkey View Post
These are both likely conclusions. Did McGlockton use his x-ray vision to see Drejka's pistol under his shirt? Did they have some prior knowledge of one another that no witness or news report felt relevant to report? Just use Occam's Razor and don't bust my balls.
You know what's a likely conclusion? That McGlockton feared for his girlfriend's safety. After all, the only participant that we know for certain has a history of starting altercations is Drejka.
Babbylonian is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 17th August 2018, 07:44 AM   #1004
SuburbanTurkey
Muse
 
SuburbanTurkey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: Boston, USA
Posts: 726
Originally Posted by Babbylonian View Post
You know what's a likely conclusion? That McGlockton feared for his girlfriend's safety. After all, the only participant that we know for certain has a history of starting altercations is Drejka.
What does that have to do with anything I said? The only point i was trying to make is that Drejka being armed is a fact unknown to McGlockton when the shove occurred and can't be retroactively used to justify the shove. If I'm walking down the street with a dirty bomb hidden in a suitcase and a mugger shoots me dead, it's still murder even if later on it's shown that the mugger stopped a terrorist attack.

Nuance is dead in this thread. I'll swing back around when the case goes to trial. Hoping for nice long stay at the grey bar hotel for Drejka!
__________________
Gobble gobble

Last edited by SuburbanTurkey; 17th August 2018 at 07:50 AM.
SuburbanTurkey is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 17th August 2018, 07:58 AM   #1005
Babbylonian
Penultimate Amazing
 
Babbylonian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 11,387
Originally Posted by SuburbanTurkey View Post
What does that have to do with anything I said? The only point i was trying to make is that Drejka being armed is a fact unknown to McGlockton when the shove occurred and can't be retroactively used to justify the shove. If I'm walking down the street with a dirty bomb hidden in a suitcase and a mugger shoots me dead, it's still murder even if later on it's shown that the mugger stopped a terrorist attack.
You're still making the assumption that he couldn't see the concealed weapon. I've seen supposedly concealed weapons before, and if I saw someone with such a weapon getting in someone's face, I would absolutely be concerned for the latter's safety. While the weapon might give me pause, I could see where concern for a loved one might override concern for my own safety.

In short, citing Occam's razor is a poor justification for a claim to know what a person was thinking when they're no longer able to provide their side of the story due to being murdered.
Babbylonian is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 17th August 2018, 08:03 AM   #1006
Horatius
NWO Kitty Wrangler
 
Horatius's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 26,693
Originally Posted by SuburbanTurkey View Post
I don't see how any of this info could have affected McGlockton's actions as he:

1) Was totally unaware of the gun until it was drawn from concealment

2) Had no prior conflicts with or knowledge of Drejka.


Assuming facts not in evidence. We know Drejka was shouting at the woman in the car, and we know that Drejka has made overt threats to shoot people in the past. It's not unreasonable to think he made a similar threat in this case.
__________________
Obviously, that means cats are indeed evil and that ownership or display of a feline is an overt declaration of one's affiliation with dark forces. - Cl1mh4224rd
Horatius is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 17th August 2018, 08:07 AM   #1007
eeyore1954
Philosopher
 
eeyore1954's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 6,320
Originally Posted by Horatius View Post
Assuming facts not in evidence. We know Drejka was shouting at the woman in the car, and we know that Drejka has made overt threats to shoot people in the past. It's not unreasonable to think he made a similar threat in this case.
But isn't this also assuming facts not in evidence.
"And with his history of threatening to shoot people in exactly these sorts of situations (that Drejka created), it was entirely reasonable for McGlockton to fear that he, or some member of his family, was at risk for being gunned down."

Of course a good portion of this thread deals with assuming facts not in evidence based upon our personal biases and beliefs.
eeyore1954 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 17th August 2018, 08:09 AM   #1008
AJM8125
Potsing Whiled Runk
Tagger
 
AJM8125's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 20,220
Originally Posted by This is The End View Post
The video shows differently.
I’m afraid it doesn’t. You can’t see it because you’ve set your PC filter to 11. Here’s a thought - We can all agree that Drejka has a history of being a confrontational asswipe and likes to brandish firearms. If he knew McGlockton was approaching, don’t you think he would’ve reacted in some way? Like getting the **** out of his way? Bracing for the hit? Pulling his gun? Anything?

He doesn’t. Because he was taken by surprise. Sucker punched. Blind sided or any other synonym for a surprise attack one may use. Or if he was aware of McGlockton and didn’t react, might that be because he was approaching in a slow, non threatening manner?


Quote:
First of all, it was a justifiable defense of his family not an assault. Secondly, I'm just going to assume you believe that he would have continued because of racism. Since the reality of the situation would lead one to believe that it would have ended with the push with or without the gun. And there is only other place you could have pulled that from. Just sayin.
First of all, I don’t believe your opinion would carry any weight in a court of law. Secondly, I know you’d like to put McGlockton’s corpse and yourself high upon a pedestal so you can beat your racism drum but you can take that nonsense and shove it squarely back into wherever you pulled it from.

McGlockton was a punk who pulled a punk move on another punk who happened to be armed. Pointing out his poor judgment is not racism, no matter how hard it’s bleated.
__________________

Last edited by AJM8125; 17th August 2018 at 08:11 AM.
AJM8125 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 17th August 2018, 03:24 PM   #1009
Silly Green Monkey
Cowardly Lurking in the Shadows of Greatness
 
Silly Green Monkey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Arizona
Posts: 4,386
Too busy with his victim perhaps?
__________________
Normal is just a stereotype.
Silly Green Monkey is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 17th August 2018, 04:03 PM   #1010
sir drinks-a-lot
Illuminator
 
sir drinks-a-lot's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Cole Valley, CA
Posts: 3,459
Originally Posted by AJM8125 View Post
McGlockton was a punk who pulled a punk move on another punk who happened to be armed.
We could have saved ourselves 26 pages if only this concise and accurate summary were provided on the first page.
__________________
I drink to the general joy o' th' whole table. --William Shakespeare
sir drinks-a-lot is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 19th August 2018, 12:08 AM   #1011
This is The End
 
This is The End's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 10,477
Originally Posted by AJM8125 View Post
Iím afraid it doesnít. You canít see it because youíve set your PC filter to 11. Hereís a thought...

The only "thought" to be had right now is that you clearly have no idea what "blind side" actually means.
__________________
________________________
This is The End is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 19th August 2018, 12:57 AM   #1012
Hungry81
Graduate Poster
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 1,899
Originally Posted by This is The End View Post
The only "thought" to be had right now is that you clearly have no idea what "blind side" actually means.
In my experience I can understand how Drejka may have developed tunnel vision as he revved himself up ranting and arguing with his captive audience in the car. I would think it was likely he did not notice Mcglockington approach due to this hubris fulled tunnel vision. I also think that had he not been killed Mcglockington could have been charged with assault. However, Drejka had no cause to shoot Mcglockington and desrves to be charged and hopefully jailed for at least manslaughter or murder and have his gun privileges removed.
Hungry81 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 19th August 2018, 01:01 AM   #1013
AJM8125
Potsing Whiled Runk
Tagger
 
AJM8125's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 20,220
Originally Posted by This is The End View Post
The only "thought" to be had right now is that you clearly have no idea what "blind side" actually means.
I don't?

Wow. Totally blindsided me.

__________________
AJM8125 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 20th August 2018, 11:02 PM   #1014
This is The End
 
This is The End's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 10,477
Did you seriously just link to a thesaurus to define a word??

So not only do you not know what the word blindside means, but you don't know what the word synonym means either.

Some synonyms means exactly the same thing but the vast majority of synonyms are merely "nearly the same".
__________________
________________________
This is The End is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 21st August 2018, 04:40 AM   #1015
AJM8125
Potsing Whiled Runk
Tagger
 
AJM8125's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 20,220
Iíll take that as your white flag.
__________________
AJM8125 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 21st August 2018, 06:20 AM   #1016
eeyore1954
Philosopher
 
eeyore1954's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 6,320
Originally Posted by This is The End View Post
Did you seriously just link to a thesaurus to define a word??

So not only do you not know what the word blindside means, but you don't know what the word synonym means either.

Some synonyms means exactly the same thing but the vast majority of synonyms are merely "nearly the same".
Maybe different people take blind sided to mean different things.

Not sure what you think it means but it doesn't necessarily you didn't see the person. I go with caught unaware. It doesn't even have to deal with vision or another person. IE blind sided by the news.
The thesaurus link actually had some good examples.
eeyore1954 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 22nd August 2018, 08:07 PM   #1017
This is The End
 
This is The End's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 10,477
Originally Posted by eeyore1954 View Post
Maybe different people take blind sided to mean different things.

Yeah, for some people it depends on whether the players are black or white.

If the person defending their family was a 50 year old white guy and the person accosting the family was a 25 year old black guy the word "blindside" would not only mean something different, it wouldn't even enter their mind.
__________________
________________________
This is The End is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 29th August 2018, 11:21 AM   #1018
This is The End
 
This is The End's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 10,477
Missed this a few days ago:


http://www.foxnews.com/us/2018/08/23...g-suspect.html


Quote:
Pinellas County Judge Joseph Bulone ruled Thursday that the $100,000 bail amount for Michael Drejka should stand. He called it "a fair and a reasonable bond under all the facts and circumstances of the case," since Drejka faces anywhere from 11 to 30 years in prison if convicted.
Quote:
Surveillance video shows Drejka initiating the confrontation.
Quote:
Drejka <> pulled a handgun and fired as McGlockton backed away.
Quote:
Drejka has been in jail since he was charged Aug 13.
Quote:
Prosecutors argued that the bail fits the crime, and that Drejka, who has been unemployed for much of the last decade, is a flight risk. They also says he poses a threat to the community and to himself, citing four previous incidents in which Drejka either brandished a gun at someone or became angry with them over perceived traffic sleights.

During one incident where he was ticketed, prosecutors said he became upset with a woman and "brake-stopped," repeatedly braking hard to force the person behind to take evasive action. The 32-year-old woman had two children in her vehicle when she rear-ended Drejka's car.

That's an extremely frowned upon manuever in many cities. He would be up **** creek if he had done that in L.A.


Quote:
Drejka also showed two teens his gun when he became upset that they stopped at a yellow light, and he became upset with another motorist he felt was driving too slow in a school zone.

In another instance, Assistant State Attorney Fred Schaub said, Drejka confronted another man at the same convenience store about parking his septic truck in the same disabled-accessible space, which isn't even in a legal spot according to state specifications.

Quote:
Drejka had a response: "I know I can't help myself, I keep getting myself in trouble."

Rot in prison Drejka you piece of ****.
__________________
________________________
This is The End is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 29th August 2018, 02:14 PM   #1019
jimbob
Uncritical "thinker"
 
jimbob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: UK
Posts: 19,317
Originally Posted by SuburbanTurkey View Post
These are both likely conclusions. Did McGlockton use his x-ray vision to see Drejka's pistol under his shirt? Did they have some prior knowledge of one another that no witness or news report felt relevant to report? Just use Occam's Razor and don't bust my balls.
It's quite reasonable to suppose that McGlockton saw Drejka as "Mr Angry" intimidating his partner and stepped in to defend her.

Given Drejka's history that would seem reasonable in retrospect too.
__________________
OECD healthcare spending
Expenditure on healthcare
http://www.oecd.org/els/health-systems/health-data.htm
link is 2015 data (2013 Data below):
UK 8.5% of GDP of which 83.3% is public expenditure - 7.1% of GDP is public spending
US 16.4% of GDP of which 48.2% is public expenditure - 7.9% of GDP is public spending
jimbob is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 9th September 2018, 04:51 PM   #1020
This is The End
 
This is The End's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 10,477
New(ish) interview with the racist piece of ****.

No remorse OFC.

https://abcnews.go.com/US/florida-st...ry?id=57562288

Quote:
Asked if he could go back and change anything he did that fateful day, Drejka said, "No, [not] off the top of my head."
Quote:
"I followed the law the way I felt the law was supposed to be followed," Drejka told WTSP-TV in Tampa Bay. "I cleared every hurdle that that law had put in front of me."
Quote:
Drejka said he feared for his life when McGlockton "tackled" him to the ground.

"There was only one way to look at that. You have to be scared ... because if youíre not and you're wrong you know Ö thatís that," he said. "

If that is the case why even wait to be tackled. Shoot all young black males on sight.

The first pre-trial hearing will be Oct. 19.
__________________
________________________
This is The End is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Reply

International Skeptics Forum » General Topics » Social Issues & Current Events

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 09:11 AM.
Powered by vBulletin. Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

This forum began as part of the James Randi Education Foundation (JREF). However, the forum now exists as
an independent entity with no affiliation with or endorsement by the JREF, including the section in reference to "JREF" topics.

Disclaimer: Messages posted in the Forum are solely the opinion of their authors.