ISF Logo   IS Forum
Forum Index Register Members List Events Mark Forums Read Help

Go Back   International Skeptics Forum » General Topics » Social Issues & Current Events
 


Welcome to the International Skeptics Forum, where we discuss skepticism, critical thinking, the paranormal and science in a friendly but lively way. You are currently viewing the forum as a guest, which means you are missing out on discussing matters that are of interest to you. Please consider registering so you can gain full use of the forum features and interact with other Members. Registration is simple, fast and free! Click here to register today.
Tags !MOD BOX WARNING!

Reply
Old 5th December 2019, 03:35 PM   #161
arthwollipot
Observer of Phenomena
Pronouns: he/him
 
arthwollipot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Location, Location
Posts: 65,171
Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
"Sort of send a message"? We're on the verge of a global catastrophe. Don't you think this merits more than a "sort of" from people like Greta, who claim to be incensed by the urgent need and lack of action?
You're continuing to complain about a vocal tic? "Sort of" carries no more meaning in this sentence than "Um" would. The technical term is a speech disfluency.
__________________
Self-described nerd.

My mom told me she tries never to make fun of people for not knowing something.
- Randall Munroe
arthwollipot is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th December 2019, 03:36 PM   #162
theprestige
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 41,133
Originally Posted by lionking View Post
And after that she can cure cancer.....: rolleyes :
Let's not get ahead of ourselves.

She can start by explaining why she needed sailboat crew to fly over and help her sail to COP25.
theprestige is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th December 2019, 03:38 PM   #163
theprestige
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 41,133
Originally Posted by arthwollipot View Post
You're continuing to complain about a vocal tic? "Sort of" carries no more meaning in this sentence than "Um" would.
Okay, that makes much more sense. I stand corrected, and withdraw the complaint.

What do you think of the message? Is sustainable global travel for the masses the most important problem the governments of the world should be focusing on right now?
theprestige is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th December 2019, 03:43 PM   #164
arthwollipot
Observer of Phenomena
Pronouns: he/him
 
arthwollipot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Location, Location
Posts: 65,171
Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Let's not get ahead of ourselves.

She can start by explaining why she needed sailboat crew to fly over and help her sail to COP25.
She's under no obligation to explain a damn thing.
__________________
Self-described nerd.

My mom told me she tries never to make fun of people for not knowing something.
- Randall Munroe
arthwollipot is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th December 2019, 03:44 PM   #165
arthwollipot
Observer of Phenomena
Pronouns: he/him
 
arthwollipot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Location, Location
Posts: 65,171
Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Okay, that makes much more sense. I stand corrected, and withdraw the complaint.

What do you think of the message? Is sustainable global travel for the masses the most important problem the governments of the world should be focusing on right now?
It's on the list, but in my opinion not at the top.
__________________
Self-described nerd.

My mom told me she tries never to make fun of people for not knowing something.
- Randall Munroe
arthwollipot is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th December 2019, 04:07 PM   #166
lionking
In the Peanut Gallery
 
lionking's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 44,888
Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Let's not get ahead of ourselves.

She can start by explaining why she needed sailboat crew to fly over and help her sail to COP25.
Explanations are lost on you
__________________
A fanatic is one who can't change his mind and won't change the subject.

Sir Winston Churchill
lionking is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th December 2019, 04:14 PM   #167
theprestige
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 41,133
Originally Posted by arthwollipot View Post
She's under no obligation to explain a damn thing.
True. Her decision not to explain things forms part of the basis for me not taking her seriously.

I'm under no obligation to take her seriously, and I'm starting to resent all the personal attacks and lies that keep sprouting up because I have reasons not to take her seriously.
theprestige is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th December 2019, 04:15 PM   #168
theprestige
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 41,133
Originally Posted by lionking View Post
Explanations are lost on you
You lie:

Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Okay, that makes much more sense. I stand corrected, and withdraw the complaint.
theprestige is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th December 2019, 04:19 PM   #169
arthwollipot
Observer of Phenomena
Pronouns: he/him
 
arthwollipot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Location, Location
Posts: 65,171
Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
True. Her decision not to explain things forms part of the basis for me not taking her seriously.
Do you not take seriously everybody who fails to explain things to you?
__________________
Self-described nerd.

My mom told me she tries never to make fun of people for not knowing something.
- Randall Munroe
arthwollipot is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th December 2019, 04:22 PM   #170
theprestige
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 41,133
Originally Posted by arthwollipot View Post
Do you not take seriously everybody who fails to explain things to you?
Only if I'm supposed to take them seriously for reasons they refuse to explain.
theprestige is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th December 2019, 04:26 PM   #171
Childlike Empress
Ewige Blumenkraft
 
Childlike Empress's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Ivory Tower
Posts: 17,821
Greta has used her time on the boat well and written and translated into seven foreign languages a new manifesto. Oh wait, no, Swedish is not among the eight languages it is published in.

Originally Posted by St Greta
[...] On the next two Fridays, we will again take to the streets: worldwide on November 29, and in Madrid, Santiago, and many other places on December 6 during the UN climate conference. Schoolchildren, young people, and adults all over the world will stand together, demanding that our leaders take action – not because we want them to, but because the science demands it.

That action must be powerful and wide-ranging. After all, the climate crisis is not just about the environment. It is a crisis of human rights, of justice, and of political will. Colonial, racist, and patriarchal systems of oppression have created and fueled it. We need to dismantle them all. Our political leaders can no longer shirk their responsibilities. [...]

Bolding mine. Project Syndicate on which this is published has ...

Originally Posted by wikipedia
... more than 60 authors that submit opinion commentaries on a regular or monthly basis. Periodic editorials are also published by prominent authors such as Shinzo Abe, Francis Fukuyama, Bill and Melinda Gates, Christine Lagarde, Juan Manuel Santos, George Soros, and many others.
__________________
Audiatur et altera pars

Last edited by Childlike Empress; 5th December 2019 at 04:28 PM.
Childlike Empress is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th December 2019, 04:30 PM   #172
Skeptical Greg
Agave Wine Connoisseur
 
Skeptical Greg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Just past ' Resume Speed ' .
Posts: 15,803
Why do I suspect she didn't write that all by herself?
__________________
" The main problem I have with the idea of heaven, is the thought of
spending eternity with most of the people who claim to be going there. "
Skeptical Greg is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th December 2019, 04:37 PM   #173
Childlike Empress
Ewige Blumenkraft
 
Childlike Empress's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Ivory Tower
Posts: 17,821
Originally Posted by Skeptical Greg View Post
Why do I suspect she didn't write that all by herself?

Because you hate independently minded young ladies.
__________________
Audiatur et altera pars
Childlike Empress is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th December 2019, 04:45 PM   #174
arthwollipot
Observer of Phenomena
Pronouns: he/him
 
arthwollipot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Location, Location
Posts: 65,171
Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Only if I'm supposed to take them seriously for reasons they refuse to explain.
Have you asked her to explain it and been declined, then?
__________________
Self-described nerd.

My mom told me she tries never to make fun of people for not knowing something.
- Randall Munroe
arthwollipot is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th December 2019, 04:53 PM   #175
theprestige
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 41,133
Jesus Christ.

Colonial, racist, and patriarchal systems of oppression have created and fueled it. We need to dismantle them all. Our political leaders can no longer shirk their responsibilities.

That's her message to the policy makers at COP25? "Yes, yes," says the Russian representative. "I'll go back to Moscow and get right to work on dismantling the 'colonial, racist, and patriarchal systems of oppression' upon which my nation's economy and government are founded."

I don't see anyone taking her seriously, at this point.

I mean, yes, please, let's dismantle all the colonial, racist, and patriarchal systems of oppression. But we only have about 8 years to put a hard cap on emissions and avoid a general catastrophe. Maybe we should prioritize reducing emissions, and worry about dismantling the world order later?

Though, if we did dismantle the world order, emissions would drop right off. I guess COP25 will be Greta's big test. If she can convince the world leaders to go along with this agenda, to save the planet at the expense of humanity, then I will truly recognize her as a brave campaigner.

But I predict that she won't do much at COP25, and a few weeks from now her fan club will be insulting me for daring to ask, "what exactly did Greta achieve?"
theprestige is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th December 2019, 04:53 PM   #176
cullennz
Embarrasingly illiterate
 
cullennz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 18,003
Originally Posted by Childlike Empress View Post
Because you hate independently minded young ladies.
Would imagine it is less that and more the language used.

Because I agree.

Interesting incite on her thinking if she did actually write it though.

She believes racism and dudes caused climate change.

Think some one might have missed telling the kid about Queen Victoria and the Industrial Revolution.
__________________
I generally oppose gun control, but I support the ban on assault weapons and I support a slightly longer waiting period to purchase a gun. With today’s Internet technology we should be able to tell within 72-hours if a potential gun owner has a record.

Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
cullennz is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th December 2019, 04:56 PM   #177
arthwollipot
Observer of Phenomena
Pronouns: he/him
 
arthwollipot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Location, Location
Posts: 65,171
Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Though, if we did dismantle the world order, emissions would drop right off. I guess COP25 will be Greta's big test. If she can convince the world leaders to go along with this agenda, to save the planet at the expense of humanity, then I will truly recognize her as a brave campaigner.
That's an impossibly high standard you have there.
__________________
Self-described nerd.

My mom told me she tries never to make fun of people for not knowing something.
- Randall Munroe
arthwollipot is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th December 2019, 04:56 PM   #178
Childlike Empress
Ewige Blumenkraft
 
Childlike Empress's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Ivory Tower
Posts: 17,821
Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
Would imagine it is less that and more the language used.

I assumed the joke would be obvious.
__________________
Audiatur et altera pars
Childlike Empress is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th December 2019, 04:59 PM   #179
cullennz
Embarrasingly illiterate
 
cullennz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 18,003
Originally Posted by Childlike Empress View Post
I assumed the joke would be obvious.
Sorry!

That is an embarrassing wooshed ..........(Slinks away quietly)
__________________
I generally oppose gun control, but I support the ban on assault weapons and I support a slightly longer waiting period to purchase a gun. With today’s Internet technology we should be able to tell within 72-hours if a potential gun owner has a record.

Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
cullennz is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th December 2019, 05:00 PM   #180
theprestige
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 41,133
Originally Posted by arthwollipot View Post
Have you asked her to explain it and been declined, then?
I think the need to explain it should be obvious to her. The fact that it's not is sufficient.

The fact that her fan club takes her seriously, in the absence of such an explanation, is one reason why I find her fan club ridiculous.

Don't you think that flying across the Atlantic just to meet Greta in person is kind of a stupid reason thing to do? Doesn't it bother you that Greta plays along with this and hasn't explained it?

Doesn't it bother you that you have to fall back on "she's not obligated to explain anything"? She's supposed to be a communicator, an explainer. What would you have her tell the schoolchildren who see this news and wonder when air travel is okay and when it isn't? "I'm not obligated to explain anything"?
theprestige is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th December 2019, 05:02 PM   #181
theprestige
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 41,133
Originally Posted by arthwollipot View Post
That's an impossibly high standard you have there.
Bravery isn't cheap. My standard, however, is pegged directly to her latest manifesto. It is, in fact, her standard. If she's setting impossible goals for herself, that's on her, not me. Maybe she should focus on something more achievable? Like a simple hard cap on emissions at 300-something gigatons, over the next 8 years or so?

Last edited by theprestige; 5th December 2019 at 05:04 PM.
theprestige is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th December 2019, 05:06 PM   #182
arthwollipot
Observer of Phenomena
Pronouns: he/him
 
arthwollipot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Location, Location
Posts: 65,171
Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Bravery isn't cheap. My standard, however, is pegged directly to her latest manifesto. It is, in fact, her standard.
I submit to you that it is impossible for Greta to do anything that will cause you to change your opinion. Your opinion is already set and you will resist any attempt to change it that does not meet an impossible standard. You've already made up your mind.

You're just going through the motions of "setting standards" and so forth in order to justify your already-made-up mind.
__________________
Self-described nerd.

My mom told me she tries never to make fun of people for not knowing something.
- Randall Munroe
arthwollipot is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th December 2019, 05:15 PM   #183
cullennz
Embarrasingly illiterate
 
cullennz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 18,003
Originally Posted by arthwollipot View Post
I submit to you that it is impossible for Greta to do anything that will cause you to change your opinion. Your opinion is already set and you will resist any attempt to change it that does not meet an impossible standard. You've already made up your mind.

You're just going through the motions of "setting standards" and so forth in order to justify your already-made-up mind.
I noticed you didn't comment on their point
__________________
I generally oppose gun control, but I support the ban on assault weapons and I support a slightly longer waiting period to purchase a gun. With today’s Internet technology we should be able to tell within 72-hours if a potential gun owner has a record.

Source: The America We Deserve, by Donald Trump, p.102 , Jul 2, 2000
cullennz is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th December 2019, 05:15 PM   #184
Steve
Philosopher
 
Steve's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 6,437
Originally Posted by cullennz View Post
Would imagine it is less that and more the language used.

Because I agree.

Interesting incite on her thinking if she did actually write it though.

She believes racism and dudes caused climate change.

Think some one might have missed telling the kid about Queen Victoria and the Industrial Revolution.
Insight
__________________
Caption from and old New Yorker cartoon - Why am I shouting? Because I'm wrong!"
Steve is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th December 2019, 05:17 PM   #185
theprestige
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 41,133
Originally Posted by arthwollipot View Post
I submit to you that it is impossible for Greta to do anything that will cause you to change your opinion. Your opinion is already set and you will resist any attempt to change it that does not meet an impossible standard. You've already made up your mind.

You're just going through the motions of "setting standards" and so forth in order to justify your already-made-up mind.
Mostly I'm just reacting to stuff Greta says. For example: "Colonial, racist, and patriarchal systems of oppression have created and fueled it. We need to dismantle them all. Our political leaders can no longer shirk their responsibilities." That's her standard, not mine.

It's certainly possible for Greta to do stuff to change my opinion. My point is that she's not doing that stuff. She's doing the other thing. I keep asking for reasons to change my opinion, and none are forthcoming. Instead I get the excuse that she doesn't owe me any reasons.

And, to be fair, she's done enough weird stuff already that even if she changes her message and approach drastically from here, it probably won't change my opinion on what she's done so far, or how her fan club has behaved so far.

This really comes across as you looking for excuses to not have to explain the inexplicable.

Last edited by theprestige; 5th December 2019 at 05:24 PM.
theprestige is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th December 2019, 05:20 PM   #186
Stout
Illuminator
 
Stout's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Canada
Posts: 4,018
Originally Posted by lomiller View Post
Conflating carbon emission with emissions cause by burning fossil carbon is a longstanding climate denier technique. The problem is the introduction of fossil carbon into the carbon cycle that is, not the circulation of carbon that is already part of the carbon cycle.
Yes, and if we were to go with the sequester that fossil fuel generated carbon in biomass route then we'd need more trees and critters in the top meter of soil than we had before the industrial revolution.
Stout is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th December 2019, 05:29 PM   #187
8enotto
Graduate Poster
 
Join Date: Dec 2018
Location: Mexico
Posts: 1,408
For the role Miss Greta has taken on she has to weigh every word and plan every public move she makes.

She is the leader of her cause and all eyes are on her . Every great brave act and every bumbling move. Using twatter in an unthinking manner and silly boasting of scaring adults isn't exactly helping her.

Nobody is scared of her or her cause. Everyone over 20 knows inaction and apathy will stop youthful ambitions when they aren't backed by a powerful government.
Those people choose to get behind any cause or not based on its merits. And the capability of the spokesperson to inspire them.
What she is saying isn't wrong, how she delivers that message is lacking.

Leaders don't falter publicly. They don't fall back on a defence of being a inexperienced 15 year old when they bumble.
Always display a series of actions and well thought out public statements and credibility follows.
8enotto is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th December 2019, 05:29 PM   #188
theprestige
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 41,133
Originally Posted by arthwollipot View Post
You're just going through the motions of "setting standards" and so forth in order to justify your already-made-up mind.
There's another way to go about this. You could simply state, in plain language, the standard you think Greta should be held to, and the specific accomplishments she's accomplished to meet that standard.

I've been focusing on the 300-something megatons in 8-11 years goal for the past couple pages, since it seems to be the most concrete bit of climate policy to have come up so far. But maybe that's not fair to Greta. Maybe we need to expect something different from her.

So. What do you think the right standard for Greta's message is? How shall we agree whether she's measuring up?

Is it simply tautological? Whatever she accomplishes is what she's accomplished, and that's all you ask of her? Or is there something more? Some meaningful policy change, some significant reduction in global emissions, something like that, which is her goal?
theprestige is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th December 2019, 05:46 PM   #189
arthwollipot
Observer of Phenomena
Pronouns: he/him
 
arthwollipot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Location, Location
Posts: 65,171
Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Mostly I'm just reacting to stuff Greta says. For example: "Colonial, racist, and patriarchal systems of oppression have created and fueled it. We need to dismantle them all. Our political leaders can no longer shirk their responsibilities." That's her standard, not mine.
You're requiring her to actually have achieved all of these goals before you will accord her any respect at all. That's your standard, and it is impossible for her to meet.

Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
It's certainly possible for Greta to do stuff to change my opinion. My point is that she's not doing that stuff. She's doing the other thing. I keep asking for reasons to change my opinion, and none are forthcoming. Instead I get the excuse that she doesn't owe me any reasons.
Well, she doesn't. She doesn't even know who you are and has no reason to give two rat's tails what you think of her, or what you want from her.

Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
And, to be fair, she's done enough weird stuff already that even if she changes her message and approach drastically from here, it probably won't change my opinion on what she's done so far, or how her fan club has behaved so far.
You keep referring to her "fan club". There is no fan club. She has supporters across the world. Your use of the phrase comes across as derogatory, or at the very least, condescending.

Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
This really comes across as you looking for excuses to not have to explain the inexplicable.
It's not for me to explain. You're demanding explanations from Greta, not from me. And she won't be able to explain it to you unless you ask her to. Are you going to do that?

No. You're not. Because you don't take her seriously because she hasn't answered the questions that you haven't asked her.
__________________
Self-described nerd.

My mom told me she tries never to make fun of people for not knowing something.
- Randall Munroe
arthwollipot is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th December 2019, 05:48 PM   #190
arthwollipot
Observer of Phenomena
Pronouns: he/him
 
arthwollipot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Location, Location
Posts: 65,171
Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
There's another way to go about this. You could simply state, in plain language, the standard you think Greta should be held to, and the specific accomplishments she's accomplished to meet that standard.
Why should I set a standard at all? I'm not the one holding her to standards, you are. She's doing more than I am, and that's good enough for me.
__________________
Self-described nerd.

My mom told me she tries never to make fun of people for not knowing something.
- Randall Munroe
arthwollipot is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th December 2019, 06:05 PM   #191
lionking
In the Peanut Gallery
 
lionking's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 44,888
Originally Posted by Steve View Post
Insight
From a person who is a critic of how Greta expresses herself....
__________________
A fanatic is one who can't change his mind and won't change the subject.

Sir Winston Churchill
lionking is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th December 2019, 06:06 PM   #192
lionking
In the Peanut Gallery
 
lionking's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 44,888
Originally Posted by arthwollipot View Post
Why should I set a standard at all? I'm not the one holding her to standards, you are. She's doing more than I am, and that's good enough for me.
Seconded
__________________
A fanatic is one who can't change his mind and won't change the subject.

Sir Winston Churchill
lionking is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th December 2019, 06:26 PM   #193
Steve
Philosopher
 
Steve's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 6,437
Originally Posted by lionking View Post
From a person who is a critic of how Greta expresses herself....
Well, incite is his actual purpose here so no surprise that he wrote it that way.
__________________
Caption from and old New Yorker cartoon - Why am I shouting? Because I'm wrong!"
Steve is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th December 2019, 08:43 PM   #194
Doghouse Reilly
Adrift on an uncharted sea
 
Doghouse Reilly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 3,052
Originally Posted by arthwollipot View Post
You keep referring to her "fan club". There is no fan club.
https://www.facebook.com/GretaThunbergFanClub2/
Doghouse Reilly is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th December 2019, 08:52 PM   #195
arthwollipot
Observer of Phenomena
Pronouns: he/him
 
arthwollipot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Location, Location
Posts: 65,171
Originally Posted by Doghouse Reilly View Post


Okay there's a fan club. Not the point.
__________________
Self-described nerd.

My mom told me she tries never to make fun of people for not knowing something.
- Randall Munroe
arthwollipot is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th December 2019, 09:15 PM   #196
Doghouse Reilly
Adrift on an uncharted sea
 
Doghouse Reilly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 3,052
Originally Posted by arthwollipot View Post
https://media0.giphy.com/media/gh1PcN7Agxlcc/giphy.gif

Okay there's a fan club. Not the point.
Lol...I couldn't resist.
Doghouse Reilly is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th December 2019, 09:29 PM   #197
arthwollipot
Observer of Phenomena
Pronouns: he/him
 
arthwollipot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Location, Location
Posts: 65,171
Originally Posted by Doghouse Reilly View Post
Lol...I couldn't resist.
Of course you couldn't.
__________________
Self-described nerd.

My mom told me she tries never to make fun of people for not knowing something.
- Randall Munroe
arthwollipot is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th December 2019, 12:41 AM   #198
Matthew Best
Philosopher
 
Matthew Best's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Leicester Square, London
Posts: 7,210
Originally Posted by Skeptical Greg View Post
Why do I suspect she didn't write that all by herself?
Because it has three listed authors?
Matthew Best is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th December 2019, 01:33 AM   #199
Orphia Nay
Penguilicious Spodmaster.
Tagger
 
Orphia Nay's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Ponylandistan Presidential Palace (above the Spods' stables).
Posts: 37,231
Originally Posted by Stout View Post
I for one, am glad she's going to make it to COP 25. Maybe then she can explain this "drastic, sufficient action" she was recently on about.

You know that "drastic, sufficient action" that not even her most ardent supporters wanted to touch with a 10 foot pole.
Originally Posted by Stout View Post
It's because dealing with the mechanics of of what it would take "To have a 67% chance of staying below a 1.5 degrees global temperature rise – the best odds given by the [Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change] – the world had 420 gigatons of CO2 left to emit back on Jan. 1st, 2018. Today that figure is already down to less than 350 gigatons.

"How dare you pretend that this can be solved with just 'business as usual' and some technical solutions? With today's emissions levels, that remaining CO2 budget will be entirely gone within less than 8 1/2 years."

Is pretty freakin' scary.

Other than somebody has to do something, Thunberg doesn't have much of a message.
Do you read/see all her posts on Twitter, for example?


Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Let's not get ahead of ourselves.

She can start by explaining why she needed sailboat crew to fly over and help her sail to COP25.
My guess?

To prove it can be done.

(I know some stuffs about that line of thought. )



Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
Jesus Christ.

Colonial, racist, and patriarchal systems of oppression have created and fueled it. We need to dismantle them all. Our political leaders can no longer shirk their responsibilities.

That's her message to the policy makers at COP25? "Yes, yes," says the Russian representative. "I'll go back to Moscow and get right to work on dismantling the 'colonial, racist, and patriarchal systems of oppression' upon which my nation's economy and government are founded."

I don't see anyone taking her seriously, at this point.

I mean, yes, please, let's dismantle all the colonial, racist, and patriarchal systems of oppression. But we only have about 8 years to put a hard cap on emissions and avoid a general catastrophe. Maybe we should prioritize reducing emissions, and worry about dismantling the world order later?

Though, if we did dismantle the world order, emissions would drop right off. I guess COP25 will be Greta's big test. If she can convince the world leaders to go along with this agenda, to save the planet at the expense of humanity, then I will truly recognize her as a brave campaigner.

But I predict that she won't do much at COP25, and a few weeks from now her fan club will be insulting me for daring to ask, "what exactly did Greta achieve?"
Pretty sure Thunberg's Twitter is where I saw the news that 6,000 climate studies now show we ALL need to reduce emissions by 7.6% every year till 2030.

How many followers do you think saw that?


I'm going to get up on my eco-friendly soap box while I'm here because I want to share info with you lot who are following the COP25 news etc.

Do you know what The World Economic Forum says is the #1 way to cut your emissions?

https://www.facebook.com/WEFvideo/vi...AwOTc1NjU5OTE/

Livestock takes up 4/5 of global farmland.
Cows are responsible for 65% of agricultural emissions.

# 2 is to increase your use of public transport.


How silly is "Greta"?
__________________
"We stigmatize and send to the margins
people who trigger in us the feelings we want to avoid"
- Melinda Gates, "The Moment of Lift".
Orphia Nay is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th December 2019, 01:48 AM   #200
Orphia Nay
Penguilicious Spodmaster.
Tagger
 
Orphia Nay's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Ponylandistan Presidential Palace (above the Spods' stables).
Posts: 37,231
Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
I guess COP25 will be Greta's big test. If she can convince the world leaders to go along with this agenda, to save the planet at the expense of humanity, then I will truly recognize her as a brave campaigner.
Actually, if you check out my thread on Circular Economy in Business etc, it's starting to accrue more stuff about countries that already HAVE implemented global temperature/inequality reduction policies, when I get time to add it.

Or, alternatively, go to the UN website.

Sooo much info I wish I had time to read.

You aren't going to get all answers you need if you keep asking the dwindling number of people who want to argue over what, I don't know, in this thread.

Back to your "test" on Thunberg...

This thread has shown you a lot of what's being done in the world. Is that thanks to Thunberg?

Not sure what some of you are being serious or satirical about today, but there are people taking it somewhat seriously, as far as I can tell, and I find stating facts (if I can) to be working for me a lot of the time.
__________________
"We stigmatize and send to the margins
people who trigger in us the feelings we want to avoid"
- Melinda Gates, "The Moment of Lift".
Orphia Nay is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Reply

International Skeptics Forum » General Topics » Social Issues & Current Events

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 05:32 AM.
Powered by vBulletin. Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

This forum began as part of the James Randi Education Foundation (JREF). However, the forum now exists as
an independent entity with no affiliation with or endorsement by the JREF, including the section in reference to "JREF" topics.

Disclaimer: Messages posted in the Forum are solely the opinion of their authors.