ISF Logo   IS Forum
Forum Index Register Members List Events Mark Forums Read Help

Go Back   International Skeptics Forum » General Topics » Social Issues & Current Events
 


Welcome to the International Skeptics Forum, where we discuss skepticism, critical thinking, the paranormal and science in a friendly but lively way. You are currently viewing the forum as a guest, which means you are missing out on discussing matters that are of interest to you. Please consider registering so you can gain full use of the forum features and interact with other Members. Registration is simple, fast and free! Click here to register today.
Tags Iran incidents , Qasem Soleimani , Trump controversies , US-Iran relations

Reply
Old 3rd January 2020, 06:41 AM   #41
carlosy
Thinker
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 195
They say that there was an imminent thread by Iran/Suleimani.

So, what kind of thread is now eliminated due to the death of Suleimani? Was Suleimani going to shoot someone?
Are the people who were supposed to carry out the attack are now stopping?
carlosy is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 3rd January 2020, 06:49 AM   #42
JoeMorgue
Self Employed
Remittance Man
 
JoeMorgue's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Florida
Posts: 21,979
Originally Posted by a_unique_person View Post
I don't think that's the correct use of the expression "The tail wagging the dog".
It's not in reference to the idiom, it's a reference the satirical 1997 film "Wag the Dog" where an unpopular US President fakes a war with Albanian to distract from scandals in his administration, although the film does take its title from that expression.

The film was released just prior to the American bombing of a chemical factory in Sudan by the Clinton administration at the height of the Lewinsky Scandal, which lead to the term being popularized by people who believed the attack was an intentional distraction and since then "Wag the Dog" has entered into the American lexicon to mean "Create a military crisis to distract from a political scandal."
__________________
- "Ernest Hemingway once wrote that the world is a fine place and worth fighting for. I agree with the second part." - Detective Sommerset
- "Stupidity does not cancel out stupidity to yield genius. It breeds like a bucket-full of coked out hamsters." - The Oatmeal
- "To the best of my knowledge the only thing philosophy has ever proven is that Descartes could think." - SMBC

Last edited by JoeMorgue; 3rd January 2020 at 06:54 AM.
JoeMorgue is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 3rd January 2020, 06:55 AM   #43
3point14
Pi
 
3point14's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 18,957
Originally Posted by carlosy View Post
They say that there was an imminent thread by Iran/Suleimani.

So, what kind of thread is now eliminated due to the death of Suleimani? Was Suleimani going to shoot someone?
Are the people who were supposed to carry out the attack are now stopping?
Well, now he's dead, they've called off the planned invasion of mainland USA. For now.
__________________
Up the River!

Anyone that wraps themselves in the Union Flag and also lives in tax exile is a [redacted]
3point14 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 3rd January 2020, 07:20 AM   #44
JoeMorgue
Self Employed
Remittance Man
 
JoeMorgue's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Florida
Posts: 21,979
It's too early for another Red Dawn remake.
__________________
- "Ernest Hemingway once wrote that the world is a fine place and worth fighting for. I agree with the second part." - Detective Sommerset
- "Stupidity does not cancel out stupidity to yield genius. It breeds like a bucket-full of coked out hamsters." - The Oatmeal
- "To the best of my knowledge the only thing philosophy has ever proven is that Descartes could think." - SMBC
JoeMorgue is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 3rd January 2020, 07:36 AM   #45
theprestige
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 41,052
Originally Posted by 3point14 View Post
Do we think there will be a retaliation?

I wonder what the reaction to 'Iran kills US general' would be.
Like if a US general were traveling in Iraq, and meeting with US-backed Iraqi forces arrayed against the Iranian insurgency in Iraq? And Iran hit him with something, probably not a drone, but maybe a suicide bomber or a mortar attack? Something like that?

I expect the reaction would be much as we see here: Track down Iranian military targets in Iraq - especially high value targets like senior military leaders - and hit them.

Actually I think this probably *is* the retaliation. Or *a* retaliation.

More accurately, I think that once hostilities are underway, it doesn't make sense to talk in terms of "retaliation" between the two belligerents. Nobody asked about German retaliation when the Allies invaded France in the summer of 1944. Nobody wondered what the reaction would be if Germany were to do something similar.

We know Iran has been engaged in proxy warfare and asymmetric warfare against the US and its Middle East allies for decades. We know Iran has been increasingly active in Iraq, building insurgencies, launching terrorist attacks, and promoting instability there for its own ends. My view is that this is not an isolated tit-for-tat incident, happening in a vacuum. I think this is one engagement in an ongoing conflict already in progress.

The biggest shock for me is that apparently Iran is doing so well in Iraq that they felt comfortable sending a senior military leader to meet with Iranian insurgents there, in the open. That's a lot of confidence that they're operating from a position of strength in Iraq. Misplaced confidence, as it turns out. And that's a good thing. A senior commander in an armed conflict who exposes himself on the front lines should get shot by the first enemy soldier to recognize the opportunity. I'm glad that US forces were attentive enough to make it happen, and that the President was willing to authorize it.

---

I'm not sure why the Speaker of the House would need to be informed, except perhaps as a courtesy. We all know what Pelosi would have said, anyway: "Mister President, you can't order that strike. Or any strikes. Now that I've impeached you, you're not allowed to do any presidenting. You have to just stand around looking embarassed while you wait for me to drop the other shoe. Which I might never do. So you can never do anything. I've gutted your presidency."
theprestige is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 3rd January 2020, 07:37 AM   #46
Crossbow
Seeking Honesty and Sanity
 
Crossbow's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Charleston, WV
Posts: 12,764
Just a day or two ago, Trump was saying something like 'No. I do not want a war with Iran, I want peace.'

So I expected that some Fox News boob started bitching about how Trump was sounding like Obama and that Trump heard this criticism during one of his many executive time periods. And thus, Trump had to do something that was completely unlike Obama in order to show everyone that he is not like Obama.

In this case, the something was an assassination done in an allied country without the knowledge or approval of that country.

So now, the rest of us have to deal with another day of Trump being Trump.
__________________
On 22 JUL 2016, Candidate Donald Trump in his acceptance speech: "There can be no prosperity without law and order."
On 05 FEB 2019, President Donald Trump said in his Sate of the Union Address: "If there is going to be peace and legislation, there cannot be war and investigation."
On 15 FEB 2019 'BobTheCoward' said: "I constantly assert I am a fool."
A man's best friend is his dogma.
Crossbow is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 3rd January 2020, 07:43 AM   #47
SuburbanTurkey
Master Poster
 
SuburbanTurkey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: Boston, USA
Posts: 2,515
Congress that has explicitly surrendered their authority to declare war is shocked by use of executive discretion.

If the Dems had any spines at all, they'd be mobilizing to revoke the AUMF and take control of warmaking powers. Not holding my breath on this one.
__________________
Gobble gobble
SuburbanTurkey is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 3rd January 2020, 08:01 AM   #48
Loss Leader
I would save the receptionist.
Moderator
 
Loss Leader's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Florida
Posts: 27,141
There's been a lot of nonsense already in this thread, so let's just get some basic facts out of the way:

Iran is currently funding, arming and coordinating anti-government militias in Iraq, Syria, Lebanon and Israel. These groups have as their purpose the creation of a Shiite state throughout the Middle East. They have been engaging US forces since at least 2002 to be conservative and really since the before the 1980's.

We already are at war with Iran. We have been for decades. Does this attack bring the Iran/US conflict to the forefront instead of allowing shadow politics and proxy wars? Yes. Does it change much of anything? No. Why was there an Iranian General in Iraq? Why was the US embassy in the green zone in Iraq under siege from Iranian-funded protesters?

I absolutely abhor targeted assassinations. They are never appropriate. And if the US took action without appropriate notice to Democrats cleared for such information, that is an attack by the White House on the institutions of our democracy (it remains unclear to me what the facts are regarding that). However, nothing much has changed. Frankly, I see two positive outcomes:

1. The role of Iran in causing violence across the Middle East will be highlighted in such a way that it cannot be conveniently ignored.

2. A drop in oil production in the ME (if such a thing happens) will help push America towards energy independence.

My major concern is that Iran, which cannot take on the US militarily, will strike civilians in Israel out of sheer impotent rage.
__________________
I have the honor to be
Your Obdt. St

L. Leader
Loss Leader is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 3rd January 2020, 08:02 AM   #49
Captain_Swoop
Penultimate Amazing
 
Captain_Swoop's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 23,178
Trump Tweets

General Qassem Soleimani has killed or badly wounded thousands of Americans over an extended period of time, and was plotting to kill many more...but got caught! He was directly and indirectly responsible for the death of millions of people, including the recent large number....

....of PROTESTERS killed in Iran itself. While Iran will never be able to properly admit it, Soleimani was both hated and feared within the country. They are not nearly as saddened as the leaders will let the outside world believe. He should have been taken out many years ago!
Captain_Swoop is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 3rd January 2020, 08:03 AM   #50
Cainkane1
Philosopher
 
Cainkane1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: The great American southeast
Posts: 8,798
They assassinate us we assassinate them. Sounds fair to me.
__________________
If at first you don't succeed try try again. Then if you fail to succeed to Hell with that. Try something else.
Cainkane1 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 3rd January 2020, 08:04 AM   #51
Captain_Swoop
Penultimate Amazing
 
Captain_Swoop's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 23,178
Wasn’t Jared supposed to figure out peace in the Middle East by now?
Captain_Swoop is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 3rd January 2020, 08:05 AM   #52
SuburbanTurkey
Master Poster
 
SuburbanTurkey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: Boston, USA
Posts: 2,515
Originally Posted by Cainkane1 View Post
They assassinate us we assassinate them. Sounds fair to me.
Good thing there won't be any consequences! Iran, properly chastised, will go forth and sin no more.
__________________
Gobble gobble
SuburbanTurkey is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 3rd January 2020, 08:06 AM   #53
theprestige
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 41,052
Originally Posted by Crossbow View Post
Just a day or two ago, Trump was saying something like 'No. I do not want a war with Iran, I want peace.'
A noble sentiment. Hopefully some day it will come to pass.

The sad truth, though, is that Iran has been at war with the US and its allies in the region for decades, and shows no signs of letting up.

It would be nice to have a president who could negotiate a real and lasting peace with Iran. Donald Trump is clearly not that president. Barack Obama wasn't even that president. Without a corresponding wish for peace from the Iranian side, I doubt such a president could exist, no matter how good their intentions upon taking office. So I'll settle for a president that's willing to drone Iranian generals any time they put themselves in range. I'm glad Trump ordered this attack. I'd like to think Obama would have done the same.
theprestige is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 3rd January 2020, 08:23 AM   #54
carlitos
"más divertido"
 
carlitos's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 20,969
Originally Posted by carlosy
Originally Posted by ChristianProgressive View Post
And it conveniently gets the news about the unredacted emails directly implicating Trump in the Ukraine scandal off the radar...
Can you point to those news?
Here you go. Exclusive: Unredacted Ukraine Documents Reveal Extent of Pentagon's Legal Concerns

"Usurper Doanld Trump wags the Iranian Dog" - very nice.
carlitos is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 3rd January 2020, 08:35 AM   #55
Childlike Empress
Ewige Blumenkraft
 
Childlike Empress's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Ivory Tower
Posts: 17,815
Originally Posted by Loss Leader View Post
Iran is currently funding, arming and coordinating anti-government militias in Iraq, Syria, Lebanon and Israel. These groups have as their purpose the creation of a Shiite state throughout the Middle East.



In Lebanon Hezbollah is part of the government, in Iraq the PMU are part of the military, in Syria the Shi'ite militias are with the government against Al-Qaeda/ISIS sunni extremists and in Israel the militias are against occupation, not any legitimate government. And your Shia conspiracy theory should stay inside the orientalist zionist rags you seem to consume.
__________________
Audiatur et altera pars
Childlike Empress is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 3rd January 2020, 09:00 AM   #56
rockysmith76
Muse
 
Join Date: Jul 2019
Posts: 640
Originally Posted by Childlike Empress View Post
Now the region has a new Martyr of unprecedented level. All hell will break loose against US forces. Congratulations.

Relevant thread: https://twitter.com/ejmalrai/status/1212966187157663748
Enemy of America gone, boo hoo.
rockysmith76 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 3rd January 2020, 09:01 AM   #57
rockysmith76
Muse
 
Join Date: Jul 2019
Posts: 640
Originally Posted by ChristianProgressive View Post
Treasonous Donald Trump doesn't give a rat about legality let alone impeachment.
Your post has nothing to do with the original post, your vitriol is a waste of time.
rockysmith76 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 3rd January 2020, 09:03 AM   #58
Childlike Empress
Ewige Blumenkraft
 
Childlike Empress's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Ivory Tower
Posts: 17,815
Originally Posted by rockysmith76 View Post
Enemy of America gone, boo hoo.

Yes, one. A single one. Creating millions more. Congratulations.
__________________
Audiatur et altera pars
Childlike Empress is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 3rd January 2020, 09:03 AM   #59
rockysmith76
Muse
 
Join Date: Jul 2019
Posts: 640
Originally Posted by Garrison View Post
I would imagine an uptick in terrorist activity aimed at the USA somewhere in the near future is far more likely than 'World War III'.
Democrats had Al Qaeda in the Clinton years, ISIS spanned both, and yeah, we popped a terrorist leader, get over it and move on. The protest is nothing more than Partisan whining. The ME has a new martyr every couple of days due to (pick a conflict)
rockysmith76 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 3rd January 2020, 09:08 AM   #60
theprestige
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 41,052
Originally Posted by Childlike Empress View Post
Yes, one. A single one. Creating millions more. Congratulations.
Millions? I doubt it.

People who were on board with Iran's shenanigans will still be on board. No change there. People who weren't on board are probably happier with him dead than not. I suppose there might be a few who switch sides, but I'm pretty sure the "millions" have already chosen their sides in this conflict.

And killing senior leadership, even by ones and twos (is there any other way?) is almost always a good investment in warfare. What's interesting is that modern warfare makes it a lot easier to do.

Last edited by theprestige; 3rd January 2020 at 09:10 AM.
theprestige is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 3rd January 2020, 09:13 AM   #61
varwoche
Penultimate Amazing
 
varwoche's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Puget Sound
Posts: 13,819
Originally Posted by carlosy View Post
They say that there was an imminent thread by Iran/Suleimani.

So, what kind of thread is now eliminated due to the death of Suleimani? Was Suleimani going to shoot someone?
Are the people who were supposed to carry out the attack are now stopping?
With this as a predicate, there's no way for us plebes to assess things.

Hail to the Liar-in-Chief, strike up the band.
__________________
To survive election season on a skeptics forum, one must understand Hymie-the-Robot.
varwoche is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 3rd January 2020, 09:14 AM   #62
theprestige
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 41,052
Originally Posted by Garrison View Post
I would imagine an uptick in terrorist activity aimed at the USA somewhere in the near future is far more likely than 'World War III'.
I expect that Iran is already doing all the terrorism they can manage, as part of their ongoing proxy/insurgency war aims in the Middle East.

Also, in the aftermath of 9/11 it occurred to me that terrorist attacks on the US itself aren't really a good use of resources. What Bin Laden, and ISIS, and Iran, and the other ME terror groups want is regional hegemony. This means that investing in local destabilization efforts has a much better return. And that's what we see from the bulk of terrorist activity.
theprestige is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 3rd January 2020, 09:15 AM   #63
rockysmith76
Muse
 
Join Date: Jul 2019
Posts: 640
Originally Posted by Childlike Empress View Post
Yes, one. A single one. Creating millions more. Congratulations.
That were already there and already hated American/The West/Khaffir.... make to be ignorant of a whole lot of History. Lefties....
rockysmith76 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 3rd January 2020, 09:15 AM   #64
Trebuchet
Penultimate Amazing
 
Trebuchet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: The Great Northwet
Posts: 24,438
Originally Posted by Captain_Swoop View Post
John Bolton Tweeted

@AmbJohnBolton
Congratulations to all involved in eliminating Qassem Soleimani. Long in the making, this was a decisive blow against Iran's malign Quds Force activities worldwide. Hope this is the first step to regime change in Tehran.
Because the neocon regime change in Iraq and Afghanistan has gone SO well!

Originally Posted by 3point14 View Post
Well, now he's dead, they've called off the planned invasion of mainland USA. For now.
But what about all the troops they've got lined up on the Mexican border, disguised as little children?
__________________
Cum catapultae proscribeantur tum soli proscripti catapultas habeant.
Trebuchet is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 3rd January 2020, 09:16 AM   #65
theprestige
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 41,052
Originally Posted by varwoche View Post
With this as a predicate, there's no way for us plebes to assess things.
Predicate aside, even a pleb should be able to assess that Iran crossed over from "imminent threat" to "active and ongoing threat" decades ago, and has been there ever since.
theprestige is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 3rd January 2020, 09:23 AM   #66
crescent
Illuminator
 
crescent's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 3,308
We keep talking about how Iran will react to this.

I am thinking the reaction of the Iraqi government might be more critical. They have two sponsors, they allow this guy free movement within Iraq, pro-Iranian politicians have great influence.

Forget what Iran does. We've probably just lost Iraq.
crescent is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 3rd January 2020, 09:28 AM   #67
alfaniner
Penultimate Amazing
 
alfaniner's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 21,273
Quote:
"Cry 'Havoc!,' and let slip the dogs of war."

"World War III" (along with its variations) is trending on Twitter.

Linday Graham:
Quote:
I really appreciate President Trump letting the world know you cannot kill an American without impunity.
That means exactly the opposite of what it was (most likely) intended to say.
__________________
Science is self-correcting.
Woo is self-contradicting.

Last edited by alfaniner; 3rd January 2020 at 09:30 AM.
alfaniner is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 3rd January 2020, 09:33 AM   #68
webfusion
Philosopher
 
webfusion's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,370
Originally Posted by Captain_Swoop View Post
Wasn’t Jared supposed to figure out peace in the Middle East by now?
He is still working on that.
Avi Berkowitz is in Israel, doing something, not sure what.
https://www.jpost.com/American-Polit...-office-612946

Israel is very much under threat from Tehran, and I doubt this event will change things much. Iran's Brigadier General Esmail Ghaani has taken over as head of the country's Quds Forces.
https://www.jpost.com/Middle-East/Pa...S-crime-612983
IRGC spokesman Ramezan Sharif -- "The joy of the Zionists and Americans will in no time turn into mourning."
webfusion is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 3rd January 2020, 09:38 AM   #69
theprestige
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 41,052
Bah. We already had World War III. This is at least World War IV:

1. World War I
2. World War II
3. The Cold War
4. The Global War On Terror*

---
*This is a terrible name for it, so I hope somebody comes up with a better one soon. Meanwhile, Iran has long been a major belligerent in WW IV, sponsoring insurgencies and engaging in proxy wars throughout the region, and sponsoring terrorism further afield. Droning this Iranian general is no more going to kick off WWIV than invading Normandy was going to kick off WWII. The war in question is already well underway.
theprestige is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 3rd January 2020, 09:40 AM   #70
theprestige
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 41,052
Originally Posted by webfusion View Post
IRGC spokesman Ramezan Sharif -- "The joy of the Zionists and Americans will in no time turn into mourning."
"We were gonna launch a bunch of terrorist attacks anyway, but now we're gonna do it because you droned this guy. So now it's gonna be your fault!"
theprestige is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 3rd January 2020, 09:46 AM   #71
Dr.Sid
Master Poster
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Olomouc, Czech Republic
Posts: 2,222
Originally Posted by rockysmith76 View Post
Your post has nothing to do with the original post, your vitriol is a waste of time.
I like your model of reality. It's surprisingly simple !
Dr.Sid is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 3rd January 2020, 09:52 AM   #72
theprestige
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 41,052
Originally Posted by carlosy View Post
They say that there was an imminent thread by Iran/Suleimani.

So, what kind of thread is now eliminated due to the death of Suleimani? Was Suleimani going to shoot someone?
Are the people who were supposed to carry out the attack are now stopping?
General McChrystal on the threat posed by Suleimani:
His brilliance, effectiveness, and commitment to his country have been revered by his allies and denounced by his critics in equal measure. What all seem to agree on, however, is that the humble leader’s steady hand has helped guide Iranian foreign policy for decades—and there is no denying his successes on the battlefield. Suleimani is arguably the most powerful and unconstrained actor in the Middle East today... Suleimani is singularly dangerous. He is also singularly positioned to shape the future of the Middle East."

https://foreignpolicy.com/gt-essay/i...sem-suleimani/
This guy had contacts and influence throughout the Middle East. He was probably Iran's most effective agent for destablizing the region and furthering Iranian hegemony. There's a lot of pies that are now greatly improved by having his fingers taken out of them.
theprestige is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 3rd January 2020, 09:59 AM   #73
Captain_Swoop
Penultimate Amazing
 
Captain_Swoop's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 23,178
Boris Johnson not told about US airstrike

Quote:
Boris Johnson was not warned about the US airstrike in Iraq that killed a top Iranian general, the BBC understands.
The UK has 400 troops based in the Middle East and works alongside US forces in the region.
But President Donald Trump did not tell the UK PM about the attack he ordered that killed Qasem Soleimani on Friday.
Tory MP Tom Tugendhat said there was a "pattern" from the current White House not to share details with its allies, which was a "matter of concern".
The former chairman of the Commons Foreign Affairs Committee added: "I have long believed the purpose of having allies is so we can surprise our enemies, not each other."
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-50981719
Captain_Swoop is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 3rd January 2020, 09:59 AM   #74
rockysmith76
Muse
 
Join Date: Jul 2019
Posts: 640
Originally Posted by Dr.Sid View Post
I like your model of reality. It's surprisingly simple !
The part that doesn't kowtow to leftie or trump nonsense? Oh well....
rockysmith76 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 3rd January 2020, 10:00 AM   #75
rockysmith76
Muse
 
Join Date: Jul 2019
Posts: 640
Originally Posted by Captain_Swoop View Post
Boris Johnson not told about US airstrike



https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-50981719
so?
rockysmith76 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 3rd January 2020, 10:05 AM   #76
JoeMorgue
Self Employed
Remittance Man
 
JoeMorgue's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Florida
Posts: 21,979
Originally Posted by rockysmith76 View Post
so?
*Very slowly* Because when you're bombing an area with friendlies in it, it's generally a good idea to tell the friendlies.

The UK is our alley. They potentially had troops in the area that was bombed.
__________________
- "Ernest Hemingway once wrote that the world is a fine place and worth fighting for. I agree with the second part." - Detective Sommerset
- "Stupidity does not cancel out stupidity to yield genius. It breeds like a bucket-full of coked out hamsters." - The Oatmeal
- "To the best of my knowledge the only thing philosophy has ever proven is that Descartes could think." - SMBC
JoeMorgue is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 3rd January 2020, 10:07 AM   #77
Captain_Swoop
Penultimate Amazing
 
Captain_Swoop's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 23,178
Plus, they are likely to be on the receiving end of any backlash alongside the US forces in the region.
Captain_Swoop is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 3rd January 2020, 10:26 AM   #78
Dr.Sid
Master Poster
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Olomouc, Czech Republic
Posts: 2,222
Local expert on Iran warns the guy was just a public figure, not important in decission making. And that the act will unite Iran, where government actually has pretty low public support at the moment. As weakening Iran, I guess it won't work.
As of a gesture in style 'we will get you' it might work. But as a distraction from local problems, it works the best.
Dr.Sid is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 3rd January 2020, 10:29 AM   #79
trustbutverify
Philosopher
 
trustbutverify's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 7,716
Originally Posted by SuburbanTurkey View Post
Democrats will be aghast at his pointless escalation of conflict in the Middle East, conveniently forgetting that they have approved every military budget Trump has asked for.

At this point, I almost feel like we need a "rip the bandaid off" approach to US military excesses. Some president needs to just withdraw every US troop from foreign soil and let the chips fall where they may. This would be a disaster, but this country has proven to be totally incapable of acting with good judgement in these matters.

Are we seriously ginning up a war because Iran killed some military contractor? Who gives a **** if he was an American, he was a literal mercenary.
Brilliant analysis.
__________________
"The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated." -- Mahatma Gandhi

Wollen owns the stage
trustbutverify is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 3rd January 2020, 10:33 AM   #80
rockysmith76
Muse
 
Join Date: Jul 2019
Posts: 640
Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
*Very slowly* Because when you're bombing an area with friendlies in it, it's generally a good idea to tell the friendlies.

The UK is our alley. They potentially had troops in the area that was bombed.
And we'd hate to go down that dark "alley", wouldn't we.

A terrorist was removed, terror=bad. Done. Sorry to the lefties that's it's inconvenient that pesky other side did it. Likely they should have let it be known and maybe it was a distraction maybe not for those who don't give a rats ...... about partisan vitriol. It's done, the terror guy is dead. And yes another will pop up tomorrow.
rockysmith76 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Reply

International Skeptics Forum » General Topics » Social Issues & Current Events

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 07:51 PM.
Powered by vBulletin. Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

This forum began as part of the James Randi Education Foundation (JREF). However, the forum now exists as
an independent entity with no affiliation with or endorsement by the JREF, including the section in reference to "JREF" topics.

Disclaimer: Messages posted in the Forum are solely the opinion of their authors.