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Tags 2020 elections , joe biden , presidential candidates

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Old 9th November 2020, 08:09 AM   #201
Darat
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Originally Posted by Mader Levap View Post
Healthcare in USA is designed to kill off poor people.
Not really, a better summary would be it is designed to make the most money.

That the poor don't have much money is why it seems skewed against the poor.
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Old 9th November 2020, 08:15 AM   #202
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Originally Posted by Meadmaker View Post
It is, in some ways, even stupider. Changing jobs, or becoming unemployed, while having health issues can wreak havoc on a families finances, even today. Our medical situation is tied to our employment situation, which is just crazy. However, the kind of scenarios you are describing are mostly a thing of the past. Obamacare helped a lot. Medical bankruptcies plummeted after it was put into effect. It may not be the best possible law, but it achieved some of its goals.
Your account is at variance with the facts

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/02/11/this...ankruptcy.html

And

https://www.thebalance.com/medical-b...istics-4154729
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Old 9th November 2020, 08:23 AM   #203
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Originally Posted by Darat View Post
Your links are not at variance with anything I said.
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Old 9th November 2020, 08:58 AM   #204
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Originally Posted by Darat View Post
Not really, a better summary would be it is designed to make the most money.

That the poor don't have much money is why it seems skewed against the poor.
I don't see any practical difference.
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Old 9th November 2020, 09:09 AM   #205
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Originally Posted by Mader Levap View Post
I don't see any practical difference.
Keeping the poor just about alive for long enough to keep taking their money is the difference.

Dave
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Old 9th November 2020, 09:12 AM   #206
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Originally Posted by Meadmaker View Post
Your links are not at variance with anything I said.
Yes they, are medical bankruptcies have not seen the changes you claimed because of the ACA (and that is just one example.)
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Old 9th November 2020, 11:27 AM   #207
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Originally Posted by Meadmaker View Post
It's per year, at least for every plan I've ever dealt with.

And, you're right. As a 57 year old man on an Obamacare plan, I was paying something like 600 dollars per month for a plan that had a 5,000 dollar deductible. That's right. I would pay 7,000 dollars if I didn't get sick, plus an additional 5,000 dollars if I did, before the insurance companies paid a cent. And why was I on Obamacare? Because I was unemployed.

And yet it was still better than what there was before Obamacare. Trump was, and still is, trying to get rid of Obamacare, but we were told we shouldn't worry, because he has a secret plan to replace it. Assuming his efforts fail in the Supreme Court, as they are expected to, at least we won't have to worry about that for the next four years, but the health care system is still horribly messed up in America, and we certainly are not going to see huge changes for at least two years.

ETA: And the figures I throw around are greatly simplified. In reality, most plans come with tables that take one or two pages to explain exactly how much you will pay for several different categories of health care expenses.
Thanks.
I never knew it worked like that in the US (not with these costs anyway).

Here I pay just shy of 400 euro's per month for the two of us. this is not too dissimilar to what you pay. The amount of 'out of pocket' per year though, is about the same as my monthly fee, namely 385 euro's. Several basic kinds of medical services, like a visit to the general practitioner, are not paid from that 'out of pocket' money.

Note that I have a very comprehensive insurance and that the average monthly fee, is, I believe, about half of ours (a bit more than a half).
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Old 9th November 2020, 11:47 AM   #208
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Originally Posted by crackers View Post
They came there on cruise ships, on vacation, and liked it so much they decided to stay. How else could blacks have possibly gotten to Jamaica?”
User name checks out.
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Old 9th November 2020, 11:50 AM   #209
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Originally Posted by Darat View Post
Not really, a better summary would be it is designed to make the most money.

That the poor don't have much money is why it seems skewed against the poor.
You say tomato.

It's also how it is designed to kill poor people.
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Old 9th November 2020, 02:28 PM   #210
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Originally Posted by erwinl View Post
Here I pay just shy of 400 euro's per month for the two of us. this is not too dissimilar to what you pay.
The price I quoted was for me alone. My wife, on a different plan, was more expensive. My 21 year old son, on a different plan, was much cheaper.
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Old 9th November 2020, 02:30 PM   #211
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Originally Posted by Mader Levap View Post
Healthcare in USA is designed to kill off poor people.
Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
You say tomato.

It's also how it is designed to kill poor people.
I think “indifference” to the poor is more is more accurate. Insurance companies are in the business of making money not of orchestrating the Final Solution. The point is that if someone asked the insurance companies, “but how do these costs help the poor to afford or have access the healthcare?” The answer is “who cares? Not our problem! The business of business is business!” (Though maybe there will be some PR-inspired faux-CSR campaign for all I know which actually gives them some moral licensing cover - this last bit is just speculation.)
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Old 10th November 2020, 12:29 AM   #212
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Originally Posted by Meadmaker View Post
The price I quoted was for me alone. My wife, on a different plan, was more expensive. My 21 year old son, on a different plan, was much cheaper.
Oh.
That's truly expensive, if you put it like this.

Thanks for enlightening me.
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Old 10th November 2020, 04:46 AM   #213
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
You say tomato.



It's also how it is designed to kill poor people.
No it's a very real and significant difference.
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Old 10th November 2020, 04:49 AM   #214
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Originally Posted by erwinl View Post
Oh.

That's truly expensive, if you put it like this.



Thanks for enlightening me.
Please don't go off Meadmaker's at best anecdotes, his view of the USA healthcare system is at odds with the facts. Look at the links to the articles I've posted and follow the links within those articles if you want to know the facts.
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Old 12th November 2020, 10:27 AM   #215
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Originally Posted by acbytesla View Post
You say tomato.

It's also how it is designed to kill poor people.
I don't know if it's designed to kill poor people or that's just a desirable (to Banana Republicans) side effect.
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Old 13th November 2020, 12:43 AM   #216
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Originally Posted by Darat View Post
Please don't go off Meadmaker's at best anecdotes, his view of the USA healthcare system is at odds with the facts. Look at the links to the articles I've posted and follow the links within those articles if you want to know the facts.

Meadmaker is stating the facts. Those are the costs for health insurance in the USA right now.

I’m on an employer plan and the monthly cost for a single employee on the basic HMO plan is $359 (of which our employer pays 65%). It’s double that for employee/spouse or employee/children or $718 (-$233.35). It’s $1436 (-$233.35) for employee family.
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Old 13th November 2020, 12:47 AM   #217
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My family plan at work, me wife and kids, is $350 per month and my employer pays $900 per month.
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Old 13th November 2020, 12:57 AM   #218
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Originally Posted by dirtywick View Post
My family plan at work, me wife and kids, is $350 per month and my employer pays $900 per month.

You are lucky that your employer pays so much of the cost. Most small businesses cover only a portion of the employee’s single rate.
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Old 13th November 2020, 01:07 AM   #219
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Originally Posted by xjx388 View Post
You are lucky that your employer pays so much of the cost. Most small businesses cover only a portion of the employee’s single rate.
Yeah it's alright. I work in manufacturing and I think it's about an average plan. But manufacturing tends to have better benefits than other industries also, so I don't know.
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Old 13th November 2020, 01:20 AM   #220
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Originally Posted by xjx388 View Post
Meadmaker is stating the facts. Those are the costs for health insurance in the USA right now.

I’m on an employer plan and the monthly cost for a single employee on the basic HMO plan is $359 (of which our employer pays 65%). It’s double that for employee/spouse or employee/children or $718 (-$233.35). It’s $1436 (-$233.35) for employee family.
Nope, read about the bankruptcies and so on. The articles I link to provide the references to actual data and so on.
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