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Old 4th November 2020, 09:07 AM   #41
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As a sort of general principle, one can always turn to Shakespeare at times like this:

Quote:
Alas, poor country, -
Almost afraid to know itself! It cannot
Be called our mother, but our grave: where nothing
But who knows nothing, is once seen to smile;
Where sighs and groans, and shrieks that rent the air,
Are made, not marked; where violent sorrow seems
A modern ecstasy; the dead man's knell
Is there scarce asked for who; and good men's lives
Expire before the flowers in their caps,
Dying or ere they sicken.

(Macbeth)
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Old 4th November 2020, 09:17 AM   #42
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I am sad to see Republicans still in charge in the Senate. That guarantees at least two more years of nothing good getting done.
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Old 4th November 2020, 09:18 AM   #43
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Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
- Florida's passed a 15 dollar an hour minimum wage, which is good.
No, it isn't. Artificially inflating wages will simply price low skill workers out of the labor market.

But it will be a boost for companies that sell automation tools.
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Old 4th November 2020, 10:06 AM   #44
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
No, it isn't. Artificially inflating wages will simply price low skill workers out of the labor market.
Absolutely. Except for that literally never happening in any place that has raised the minimum wage and you being 100% completely wrong, there's nothing wrong with that sentence.
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Old 4th November 2020, 10:16 AM   #45
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However it turns out, even in the unlikely event we flip the senate, I'll never understand how freakishly deplorable the people are in this **** hole country.

So many times during 16+ years on this forum, I've written: It's impossible to underestimate the US public. But part of me thinks I'm just being cynical. It doesn't make me feel any better knowing I was right, and that i can discard that lingering doubt.

Has it always been this bad? And now we see it due to social media? It was plenty bad. But I do think it got a whole lot worse the last 4 years.
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Old 4th November 2020, 10:20 AM   #46
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
Man, that's Ceiling Cat/deMotivational Poster era internet.
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Old 4th November 2020, 10:31 AM   #47
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Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
Absolutely. Except for that literally never happening in any place that has raised the minimum wage and you being 100% completely wrong, there's nothing wrong with that sentence.
You're confusing economics with facts.
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Old 4th November 2020, 10:47 AM   #48
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Originally Posted by varwoche View Post
However it turns out, even in the unlikely event we flip the senate, I'll never understand how freakishly deplorable the people are in this **** hole country.

So many times during 16+ years on this forum, I've written: It's impossible to underestimate the US public. But part of me thinks I'm just being cynical. It doesn't make me feel any better knowing I was right, and that i can discard that lingering doubt.

Has it always been this bad? And now we see it due to social media? It was plenty bad. But I do think it got a whole lot worse the last 4 years.
I think it's due to the desensitization, and sheer volume, bad form by the President. It happened so often that normal people hardly had time to absorb how bad it is before the next thing comes out. It emboldened creeps who might never have thought about doing those things before because now there was a tacit permission.
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Old 4th November 2020, 10:51 AM   #49
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It's the "Well I can afford to be worse because at least I'm not as bad as that person." mentality.

I've long suspected that the appeal of "Slow down and look at the train wreck" shows like Hoarders and My 600 Pound Life and all that come from people who have lesser versions of the same (or thematically similar) problems and watch the show to specifically feel less guilty because "Well at least I'm not that bad."

That's what Trump has been to some members of the GOP. When you're watching My 600 Pound Life and you're only 300 pounds, it's easier for some people to enjoy that second slice of strawberry cheesecake.
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Old 4th November 2020, 12:00 PM   #50
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Also we seem to have another dead person elected to office this go around, a COVID-denier who died of COVID.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/11/04/polit...rnd/index.html
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Old 5th November 2020, 12:03 AM   #51
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Originally Posted by alfaniner View Post
I am sad to see Republicans still in charge in the Senate. That guarantees at least two more years of nothing good getting done.
I hope Biden shows McConnell that he is powerless without an accomplice POTUS.

Biden can still fix the devastation Trump wrought and replace all the department employees and managers with competent persons.

And he can reverse all of Trump's damaging EOs plus write more. After all, it was the GOP that sanctioned all that POTUS power to act alone.

And Barr is out of there. That's an important replacement.
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Old 5th November 2020, 12:05 AM   #52
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
No, it isn't. Artificially inflating wages will simply price low skill workers out of the labor market.

But it will be a boost for companies that sell automation tools.
And in order to design and build that automation creates jobs. More money in people's pockets means more spending and a boost to the economy.

People lose jobs, but other jobs are created.
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Old 5th November 2020, 12:08 AM   #53
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Originally Posted by varwoche View Post
However it turns out, even in the unlikely event we flip the senate, I'll never understand how freakishly deplorable the people are in this **** hole country.

So many times during 16+ years on this forum, I've written: It's impossible to underestimate the US public. But part of me thinks I'm just being cynical. It doesn't make me feel any better knowing I was right, and that i can discard that lingering doubt.

Has it always been this bad? And now we see it due to social media? It was plenty bad. But I do think it got a whole lot worse the last 4 years.
It has gotten worse. Trump has given these people permission to act like *****.
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Old 5th November 2020, 12:12 AM   #54
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It would be interesting to see some stats on the job types that make under $15/hr. I don't think you can automate away retail and service jobs so much. Manufacturers in my area start much higher than $15/hr and have been automating as much as possible for years.

In fact automation is probably the primary reason why manufacturing jobs are returning imo
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Old 5th November 2020, 12:16 AM   #55
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Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
No, it isn't. Artificially inflating wages will simply price low skill workers out of the labor market.

But it will be a boost for companies that sell automation tools.
that would only be true if wage is the primary cost for employers, not healthcare, social security etc.
The number of people being paid minimum wage is tiny compared to the total workforce - a raise to $15, overdue by more than a decade, will have no meaningful effect on the labor market, but a big impact for the individual workers.
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Old 5th November 2020, 08:04 AM   #56
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Puerto Rico voters approve statehood referendum

Quote:
A majority of voters in Puerto Rico approved a non-binding referendum that supports elevating the island territory to statehood status.

The referendum narrowly passed by a 52-48 margin.
But of course it would take an act of congress to make PR a state. Also seems a bit too close to 50/50. Then again, that's the same margin that Brexit passed by.
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Old 5th November 2020, 03:24 PM   #57
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It's not seeing too much airtime, but both Senate seats in Georgia are heading for a January run-off. I've seen some speculation that depending on whether or not trump bothers campaining in case of a loss could have an effect on that.

It's a bit unlikely but Democrats could potentially tie the Senate.
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Old 5th November 2020, 04:08 PM   #58
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Unfortunately democratic turnout tends to fall in special elections. I wouldn't get my hopes up too much about winning any senate seats from Georgia.

I also noticed that there was a lot of ballot splitting in Maine. About 100,000 more voters voted for Biden than for Susan Collins' opponent, Sara Gideon.

In fact, Collins got more votes in Maine than Trump did, by about 40 K. If every Maine voter who voted for Biden had also voted for Gideon, she would have won easily.
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Old 5th November 2020, 04:12 PM   #59
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Originally Posted by Puppycow View Post
Unfortunately democratic turnout tends to fall in special elections. I wouldn't get my hopes up too much about winning any senate seats from Georgia.

I also noticed that there was a lot of ballot splitting in Maine. About 100,000 more voters voted for Biden than for Susan Collins' opponent.
Usually yes... but think about if control of the Senate rests SOLELY in Georgia voter hands in January. I would think, and hope, that there's a record turnout. Just hope there isn't a snow flurry in Atlanta it being Georgia and all
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Old 5th November 2020, 04:14 PM   #60
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Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
that would only be true if wage is the primary cost for employers, not healthcare, social security etc.
The number of people being paid minimum wage is tiny compared to the total workforce - a raise to $15, overdue by more than a decade, will have no meaningful effect on the labor market, but a big impact for the individual workers.
FICA adds 7.something percent. Healthcare for minimum wage workers
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Old 5th November 2020, 04:57 PM   #61
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Grrrfff! It's been over 24 hours and there's been literally no movement! Lots of speculation, ifs, mights, maybes, etc. The TV anchors are really stretching (and obviously exhausted!)
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Old 5th November 2020, 05:27 PM   #62
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Trump's "Army of Poll-Watchers" seems to have been a no-show. What happened? Was Kushner organising it? Or did the volunteers back out when they realised they'd have to get out of their cars to participate?
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Old 5th November 2020, 07:09 PM   #63
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Originally Posted by CapelDodger View Post
Trump's "Army of Poll-Watchers" seems to have been a no-show. What happened? Was Kushner organising it? Or did the volunteers back out when they realised they'd have to get out of their cars to participate?
They knew they weren't gonna get paid, so they didn't show up.
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Old 5th November 2020, 07:34 PM   #64
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Originally Posted by alfaniner View Post
They knew they weren't gonna get paid, so they didn't show up.
It offered the prospect of so much incident and turned out to be utterly vacuous. A fiitting, almost poetic last act to the Trump farce.
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Old 5th November 2020, 11:14 PM   #65
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Question:

assuming that we will find thousands if not hundreds of thousands of in-bound mail-in ballots undelivered by deJoy's USPS, and in no way will they arrive in time to be counted even if discovered tomorrow ...

... what will happen to them?
will they ever be counted, just to figure out what would have changed? Will the disenfranchised voters at least be informed? Will there be any legal consequences?

I'm sure someone here knows more than me about this.
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Old 17th November 2020, 12:29 AM   #66
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Interesting Ballot Measure in Alaska, that would, among other things:

1) replace partisan primaries with open top-four primaries for state executive, state legislative, and congressional offices;
2) establish ranked-choice voting for general elections, including the presidential election, in which voters would rank the candidates.

At this moment, it is very close, Yes has 171,045 votes, while No has 168,018.

https://ballotpedia.org/Alaska_Ballo...itiative_(2020)

A ranked-choice voting Initiative in Massachusetts was rejected by 55%-45%.
https://ballotpedia.org/Massachusett...itiative_(2020)

(Give it a century, and surely the US will be able to modernize its arcane election system.)
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Old 17th November 2020, 12:49 AM   #67
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Originally Posted by Firestone View Post
Interesting Ballot Measure in Alaska, that would, among other things:

1) replace partisan primaries with open top-four primaries for state executive, state legislative, and congressional offices;
2) establish ranked-choice voting for general elections, including the presidential election, in which voters would rank the candidates.

At this moment, it is very close, Yes has 171,045 votes, while No has 168,018.

https://ballotpedia.org/Alaska_Ballo...itiative_(2020)

A ranked-choice voting Initiative in Massachusetts was rejected by 55%-45%.
https://ballotpedia.org/Massachusett...itiative_(2020)

(Give it a century, and surely the US will be able to modernize its arcane election system.)
People get nervous at the prospect of eliminating their party's candidate in the primary.
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Old 17th November 2020, 02:34 AM   #68
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
People get nervous at the prospect of eliminating their party's candidate in the primary.
It's not clear to me whether the Massachusetts initiative abolishes the partisan primaries, or merely wants them to use RCV instead of first past the post. The latter seems more logical, but admittedly the text of the Initiative is not clear (to me).
This explainer explicitly uses a recent primary to illustrate the effect of the ballot Initiative.
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Old 17th November 2020, 07:05 AM   #69
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Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim View Post
Man, that's Ceiling Cat/deMotivational Poster era internet.
I don't think that's precisely the origin of "has a sad" phrasing, but I think it was popular around the same time it started. Along with "I am disappoint."
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Old 17th November 2020, 07:12 AM   #70
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Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
It's the "Well I can afford to be worse because at least I'm not as bad as that person." mentality.

I've long suspected that the appeal of "Slow down and look at the train wreck" shows like Hoarders and My 600 Pound Life and all that come from people who have lesser versions of the same (or thematically similar) problems and watch the show to specifically feel less guilty because "Well at least I'm not that bad."

That's what Trump has been to some members of the GOP. When you're watching My 600 Pound Life and you're only 300 pounds, it's easier for some people to enjoy that second slice of strawberry cheesecake.
Maybe it affects different people differently. For example, I consider myself a mild packrat. When I see "hoarders" it scares the hell out of me because I worry that I could become that if I neglect a situation for too long.

Fortunately my wife is a minimalist and the trend has been away from accumulation. I've been able to just let go of so much stuff gathered in my garage from over the years, and even trust her to go through an old box oir something without me and understand what might be important to me and what isn't.

She doesn't do that a lot anyway, because (fairly) she thinks I should be doing that work. But it's a good feeling of trust to have, that she knows me well enough not to throw away anything that matters, by mistake. We're actually planning a move, and she's gotten me on board the idea that the less stuff we have, the easier the actual move will be.

The ability to digitize content helped a lot too. My library is mostly e-books, mp3s, and video files now instead of boxes filled with books, CDs, DVDs, etc.
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