ISF Logo   IS Forum
Forum Index Register Members List Events Mark Forums Read Help

Go Back   International Skeptics Forum » General Topics » USA Politics
 


Welcome to the International Skeptics Forum, where we discuss skepticism, critical thinking, the paranormal and science in a friendly but lively way. You are currently viewing the forum as a guest, which means you are missing out on discussing matters that are of interest to you. Please consider registering so you can gain full use of the forum features and interact with other Members. Registration is simple, fast and free! Click here to register today.
Reply
Old 6th November 2020, 05:27 PM   #41
eerok
Quixoticist
 
eerok's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: ON Canada
Posts: 2,996
Originally Posted by Darat View Post
Why would that be the last thing? I'd say if you want to see USA democracy "repaired" and if Trump should be taken to trial then Biden needs to move heaven and earth to have him put on trial, the example has to be set.
I don't disagree, but I don't think Biden will see it that way. He's more like the kindly grandpa who wants everyone to get along. Also, traditionally presidents have pardoned other presidents in the US.
__________________
"Every saint has a past and every sinner has a future." - Oscar Wilde
eerok is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th November 2020, 05:27 PM   #42
Brainster
Penultimate Amazing
 
Brainster's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 18,068
As with almost everything else, the outcome will completely surprise you. I predict no charges will be filed against him.
__________________
My new blog: Recent Reads.
1960s Comic Book Nostalgia
Visit the Screw Loose Change blog.
Brainster is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th November 2020, 05:28 PM   #43
eerok
Quixoticist
 
eerok's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: ON Canada
Posts: 2,996
Originally Posted by Brainster View Post
As with almost everything else, the outcome will completely surprise you. I predict no charges will be filed against him.
That wouldn't surprise me, but there's more than one jurisdiction, so I wouldn't put money on it.
__________________
"Every saint has a past and every sinner has a future." - Oscar Wilde
eerok is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th November 2020, 05:32 PM   #44
dirtywick
Master Poster
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,447
Originally Posted by Darat View Post
Why would that be the last thing? I'd say if you want to see USA democracy "repaired" and if Trump should be taken to trial then Biden needs to move heaven and earth to have him put on trial, the example has to be set.
They tried to impeach him and failed. They blew that one. Itís too bad and not fair but it happened. A redo on impeachment would stink of the same politically motivated abuse of the federal government that Trump has been abusing his whole presidency. 70M voting Americans are going to see it that way. 6 SC justices might see it that way too. Then what?

Thereís a chance to diffuse the situation. I didnít vote for Biden for 4 more years of Trump dysfunction except this time around itís ďmy guyĒ. They can simply get him with existing investigations and spend his political capital productively.
dirtywick is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th November 2020, 05:45 PM   #45
dudalb
Penultimate Amazing
 
dudalb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Sacramento
Posts: 48,726
Trump might be facing a whole slew of charges that have nothing to do with his presidency.
__________________
Pacifism is a shifty doctrine under which a man accepts the benefits of the social group without being willing to pay - and claims a halo for his dishonesty.

Robert Heinlein.
dudalb is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th November 2020, 05:56 PM   #46
eerok
Quixoticist
 
eerok's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: ON Canada
Posts: 2,996
Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
Trump might be facing a whole slew of charges that have nothing to do with his presidency.
Well, Trump has been a scofflaw his whole life, so I'd expect so. These might not flow directly from the new DOJ, but yeah, he's vulnerable now.
__________________
"Every saint has a past and every sinner has a future." - Oscar Wilde
eerok is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th November 2020, 07:22 PM   #47
EHocking
Philosopher
 
EHocking's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 8,214
Originally Posted by eerok View Post
Cruel but accurate. He'd never use this as a legal defence, though, due to his ego problems.
Hmmmm, dunno.
Think of all the arrogant, narcissistic, misogynistic and criminal bastards who suddenly develop medical issues as soon as they are pulled up in front of a court. From despots to film producers. Catholic priests to journalistic activists.

All these manly ********* all suddenly end up needing oxygen and a walking frame to appear.

Although you could be right, Trumpís ego may even be stronger than his cowardice. Certainly stronger than his common sense.
__________________
"A closed mouth gathers no feet"
"Ignorance is a renewable resource" P.J.O'Rourke
"It's all god's handiwork, there's little quality control applied", Fox26 reporter on Texas granite
You can't make up anything anymore. The world itself is a satire. All you're doing is recording it. Art Buchwald
EHocking is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th November 2020, 07:29 PM   #48
eerok
Quixoticist
 
eerok's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: ON Canada
Posts: 2,996
Originally Posted by EHocking View Post
Hmmmm, dunno.
Think of all the arrogant, narcissistic, misogynistic and criminal bastards who suddenly develop medical issues as soon as they are pulled up in front of a court. From despots to film producers. Catholic priests to journalistic activists.

All these manly ********* all suddenly end up needing oxygen and a walking frame to appear.

Although you could be right, Trumpís ego may even be stronger than his cowardice. Certainly stronger than his common sense.
I suppose that even a desire for self-preservation could trump one's ego, so to speak. You have to factor in that he's an idiot, though. It's a hard call.
__________________
"Every saint has a past and every sinner has a future." - Oscar Wilde
eerok is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th November 2020, 07:52 PM   #49
EHocking
Philosopher
 
EHocking's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 8,214
Originally Posted by eerok View Post
I suppose that even a desire for self-preservation could trump one's ego, so to speak. You have to factor in that he's an idiot, though. It's a hard call.
Iíve said it before.

I look forward to visuals of Trump being bodily dragged from the WH ala Assange from an embassy.
__________________
"A closed mouth gathers no feet"
"Ignorance is a renewable resource" P.J.O'Rourke
"It's all god's handiwork, there's little quality control applied", Fox26 reporter on Texas granite
You can't make up anything anymore. The world itself is a satire. All you're doing is recording it. Art Buchwald
EHocking is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th November 2020, 07:55 PM   #50
The Atheist
The Grammar Tyrant
 
The Atheist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 27,343
Originally Posted by EHocking View Post
Iíve said it before.

I look forward to visuals of Trump being bodily dragged from the WH ala Assange from an embassy.
Pick me! Pick me!

I'd sling that prick over my shoulders and dump him the footpath outside like last week's trash.

Which he is!
__________________
The point of equilibrium has passed; satire and current events are now indistinguishable.
The Atheist is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th November 2020, 08:00 PM   #51
eerok
Quixoticist
 
eerok's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: ON Canada
Posts: 2,996
Originally Posted by EHocking View Post
Iíve said it before.

I look forward to visuals of Trump being bodily dragged from the WH ala Assange from an embassy.
Well, one can dream.
__________________
"Every saint has a past and every sinner has a future." - Oscar Wilde
eerok is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th November 2020, 08:00 PM   #52
Bob001
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: US of A
Posts: 12,051
Originally Posted by eerok View Post
I don't disagree, but I don't think Biden will see it that way. He's more like the kindly grandpa who wants everyone to get along. Also, traditionally presidents have pardoned other presidents in the US.
"Traditionally?" Where does that come from? It's only happened once: Ford pardoned Nixon, and it probably cost him his own election.

Most presidents haven't needed to be pardoned.
Bob001 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th November 2020, 08:01 PM   #53
eerok
Quixoticist
 
eerok's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: ON Canada
Posts: 2,996
Originally Posted by Bob001 View Post
"Traditionally?" Where does that come from? It's only happened once: Ford pardoned Nixon, and it probably cost him his own election.

Most presidents haven't needed to be pardoned.
It was Nixon I was thinking about. I should've referred to this as "precedent."
__________________
"Every saint has a past and every sinner has a future." - Oscar Wilde

Last edited by eerok; 6th November 2020 at 08:04 PM.
eerok is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th November 2020, 08:18 PM   #54
Segnosaur
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 16,330
Originally Posted by eerok View Post
It was Nixon I was thinking about. I should've referred to this as "precedent."
A couple of differences though....

- as bad as Nixon was, he at least did some good... Opened relations with China, created the EPA, etc. Trump was all failure, all grift, all the time.

- Nixon resigned. Granted it was after the GOP turned on him, but at least he did reach the point where he realized enough was enough. Trump is hanging on till the end, and will probably keep hurting the US long after he leaves office

- Trump has engaged in more crimes (and arguably worse crimes) than Nixon. And many of his crimes pre-date his time in office.




Sent from my LM-X320 using Tapatalk
__________________
Trust me, I know what I'm doing. - Sledgehammer

I'm Mary Poppin's Y'all! - Yondu

We are Groot - Groot
Segnosaur is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th November 2020, 08:21 PM   #55
eerok
Quixoticist
 
eerok's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: ON Canada
Posts: 2,996
Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
A couple of differences though....

- as bad as Nixon was, he at least did some good... Opened relations with China, created the EPA, etc. Trump was all failure, all grift, all the time.

- Nixon resigned. Granted it was after the GOP turned on him, but at least he did reach the point where he realized enough was enough. Trump is hanging on till the end, and will probably keep hurting the US long after he leaves office

- Trump has engaged in more crimes (and arguably worse crimes) than Nixon. And many of his crimes pre-date his time in office.
I absolutely agree that Tricky Dick, for all his faults, was a better man, and a better president, than Trump ... even though Nixon was the cartoon villain of my generation.
__________________
"Every saint has a past and every sinner has a future." - Oscar Wilde
eerok is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th November 2020, 08:37 PM   #56
Meadmaker
Penultimate Amazing
 
Meadmaker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 23,751
Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
That will probably be the case.

Not necessarily.

First of all, tax and financial crimes far too often get overlooked, and it does take time to build a case. (Remember, Manafort went years before his crimes were uncovered, and if it wasn't for his connection with Stubby Mcbonespurs, he might never have been charged.) Its possible that there are some potentially big crimes that Trump could be charged with, but have simply been overlooked. And how long did the Trump foundation function before people started seriously looking into its crimes?

And as for 'revealing the evidence', usually prosecutors want to avoid revealing details of their investigation prior to trial.
Usually the target of the investigation is not the President of the United States, who they couldn't prosecute if they wanted to, but they could tell Congress about the evidence.


However, this is all speculation on my part. If he hasn't paid the taxes he owed, "Lock! Him! Up!....Lock! Him! Up!"

(Aside: I truly hated the lock him/her up chants. An angry mob incited to hate with no actual knowledge of anything. It was about as ant-democratic as it could get.)
__________________
Yes, yes. I know you're right, but would it hurt you to actually provide some information?
Meadmaker is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th November 2020, 08:59 PM   #57
Segnosaur
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 16,330
Originally Posted by Meadmaker View Post
Usually the target of the investigation is not the President of the United States, who they couldn't prosecute if they wanted to, but they could tell Congress about the evidence.
If you were a prosecutor going after stubby Mcbonespurs, why would you bother telling Congress? 5the republicans held the senate, so regardless of the evidence, Trump was never going to be impeached. And telling Congress might give trump an advantage in a trial... His congressional allies would tell him the evidence so he could respond better.

So better to investigate, keep details private, then prosecute when trump is out of office




Sent from my LM-X320 using Tapatalk
__________________
Trust me, I know what I'm doing. - Sledgehammer

I'm Mary Poppin's Y'all! - Yondu

We are Groot - Groot
Segnosaur is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th November 2020, 09:26 PM   #58
Meadmaker
Penultimate Amazing
 
Meadmaker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 23,751
Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
Trump was never going to be impeached.
We'll never know.

My opinion is that if there was blatant tax evasion, public support would have dwindled, and his Senate support would turn on him, just like it did on Nixon.

It would have to be pretty blatant though.


I know a lot of people think Trump's various alleged crimes were already pretty blatant, but I don't see it that way.

Anyway, all speculation.

Although, I was talking with my sister the other night about what kind of stunts Trump could pull as a lame duck, and we agreed he was the sort of person who might try something so far out of line in an attempt to get the election overturned that they would have to pull some sort of emergency impeachment. Fantasy? Almost certainly, but this is Trump we're talking about.
__________________
Yes, yes. I know you're right, but would it hurt you to actually provide some information?
Meadmaker is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th November 2020, 09:55 PM   #59
smartcooky
Penultimate Amazing
 
smartcooky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Nelson, New Zealand
Posts: 15,776
Originally Posted by Meadmaker View Post
We'll never know.

My opinion is that if there was blatant tax evasion, public support would have dwindled, and his Senate support would turn on him, just like it did on Nixon.

It would have to be pretty blatant though.


I know a lot of people think Trump's various alleged crimes were already pretty blatant, but I don't see it that way.

Anyway, all speculation.

Although, I was talking with my sister the other night about what kind of stunts Trump could pull as a lame duck, and we agreed he was the sort of person who might try something so far out of line in an attempt to get the election overturned that they would have to pull some sort of emergency impeachment. Fantasy? Almost certainly, but this is Trump we're talking about.
Or invoke the 25th Amendment, on the basis that it is so-far out of line, the only reasonable expanation would be because the President must have had a mental breakdown and be incapable of carrying out the duties of POTUS... I'm sure they would have no trouble finding a doctor to certify that!

Of course, many of us know he has been incapable of carrying out the duties of POTUS since the day he was elected.
__________________
"Silence is Donald Trump's concession speech" - Lawrence O'Donnell.

If you don't like my posts, my opinions, or my directness then put me on your ignore list. This will be of benefit to both of us; you won't have to take umbrage at my posts, and I won't have to waste my time talking to you... simples! !
smartcooky is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th November 2020, 10:12 PM   #60
The Great Zaganza
Maledictorian
 
The Great Zaganza's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 13,643
Cheating at Golf - have his Golf Cart driving license revoked.
__________________
Ceterum autem censeo fox et amicis esse delendam.
The Great Zaganza is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 6th November 2020, 10:15 PM   #61
Segnosaur
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 16,330
Originally Posted by Meadmaker View Post
We'll never know.



My opinion is that if there was blatant tax evasion, public support would have dwindled, and his Senate support would turn on him, just like it did on Nixon.

.
The public already got a peak at Trump's tax info (via the NYT article), with hints of tax fraud. His approval ratings didn't fall below 40%. This is in addition to all his other fraud... Trump U. And his foundation... Both of which went to court (and trump lost both cases), and still he kept an approval rating of ~40%. And without his base turning on him, the senate won't either.

MAGAchuds are just too idiotic to change their opinion over a little thing like criminal activities. Now if trump wore a tan suit...


Sent from my LM-X320 using Tapatalk
__________________
Trust me, I know what I'm doing. - Sledgehammer

I'm Mary Poppin's Y'all! - Yondu

We are Groot - Groot
Segnosaur is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th November 2020, 01:18 AM   #62
Dave Rogers
Bandaged ice that stampedes inexpensively through a scribbled morning waving necessary ankles
 
Dave Rogers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Cair Paravel, according to XKCD
Posts: 31,645
Originally Posted by dirtywick View Post
I think this is all things Biden will avoid doing. Letting the ongoing financial investigations play out is a better call for him. They can result in prison time and dismantling of the Trump empire without Biden having to be accused of any wrong doing by virtue of not being involved since these were initiated before he became president.
The problem with that is, the moment anyone brings any charges against Trump, he will instantly make those accusations against Biden anyway, and all his supporters will believe him.

Dave
__________________
Inspiring discussion of Sharknado is not a good sign for the audience expectations of your new high-concept SF movie sequel.

- Myriad
Dave Rogers is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th November 2020, 01:49 AM   #63
Segnosaur
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 16,330
Originally Posted by Dave Rogers View Post
The problem with that is, the moment anyone brings any charges against Trump, he will instantly make those accusations against Biden anyway, and all his supporters will believe him.



Dave
Yeah but here is the thing... Trump will still accuse Biden if crimes, even if Trump isn't charged with anything.

Sent from my LM-X320 using Tapatalk
__________________
Trust me, I know what I'm doing. - Sledgehammer

I'm Mary Poppin's Y'all! - Yondu

We are Groot - Groot
Segnosaur is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th November 2020, 02:15 AM   #64
The Atheist
The Grammar Tyrant
 
The Atheist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 27,343
We have a contender: https://www.huffpost.com/entry/bill-...b64c88d400b2a5
__________________
The point of equilibrium has passed; satire and current events are now indistinguishable.
The Atheist is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th November 2020, 02:25 AM   #65
The Great Zaganza
Maledictorian
 
The Great Zaganza's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 13,643
Originally Posted by The Atheist View Post
nothingburger.

Trump and cohorts have been declared to be in violation of the Hatch Act countless times.
__________________
Ceterum autem censeo fox et amicis esse delendam.
The Great Zaganza is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th November 2020, 02:25 AM   #66
psionl0
Skeptical about skeptics
 
psionl0's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: 31į57'S 115į57'E
Posts: 16,755
Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
I wonder if an impeachment counts as trial for Double Jeopardy purposes.

It doesn't:
Quote:
Judgment in Cases of Impeachment shall not extend further than to removal from Office, and disqualification to hold and enjoy any Office of honor, Trust or Profit under the United States: but the Party convicted shall nevertheless be liable and subject to Indictment, Trial, Judgment and Punishment, according to Law.
Article 1 Section 3 of the Constitution
__________________
"The process by which banks create money is so simple that the mind is repelled. Where something so important is involved, a deeper mystery seems only decent." - Galbraith, 1975
psionl0 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th November 2020, 02:52 AM   #67
Darat
Lackey
Administrator
 
Darat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: South East, UK
Posts: 94,750
Originally Posted by dirtywick View Post
They tried to impeach him and failed. They blew that one. Itís too bad and not fair but it happened. A redo on impeachment would stink of the same politically motivated abuse of the federal government that Trump has been abusing his whole presidency. 70M voting Americans are going to see it that way. 6 SC justices might see it that way too. Then what?



Thereís a chance to diffuse the situation. I didnít vote for Biden for 4 more years of Trump dysfunction except this time around itís ďmy guyĒ. They can simply get him with existing investigations and spend his political capital productively.
Totally disagree, that attitude is the reason that people like Trump I. e. the "elite" get away with what they do time and time again. You can only have a fair and equitable society when every one faces the same consequences.
__________________
I wish I knew how to quit you
Darat is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th November 2020, 03:08 AM   #68
dirtywick
Master Poster
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,447
Originally Posted by Darat View Post
Totally disagree, that attitude is the reason that people like Trump I. e. the "elite" get away with what they do time and time again. You can only have a fair and equitable society when every one faces the same consequences.
Iíve been wrong before, many times. Iíd be open to hearing out how that would work. I canít see a good ending to Biden spending his first term rehashing impeachment with a 6-3 conservative SC.
dirtywick is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th November 2020, 03:19 AM   #69
Garrison
Philosopher
 
Garrison's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: UK
Posts: 5,334
I think he may avoid charges if those who have been suggesting there is a clear deterioration in Trump's mental faculties over the last few months turn out to be correct.
__________________
So I've started a blog about my writing. Check it out at: http://fourth-planet-problem.blogspot.com/
And my first book is on Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B077W322FX
Garrison is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th November 2020, 03:23 AM   #70
Darat
Lackey
Administrator
 
Darat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: South East, UK
Posts: 94,750
Originally Posted by dirtywick View Post
Iíve been wrong before, many times. Iíd be open to hearing out how that would work. I canít see a good ending to Biden spending his first term rehashing impeachment with a 6-3 conservative SC.
How on earth is seeing someone (if there are grounds of course) prosecuted for crimes is in any way equivalent to the "4 years of dysfunction" of the Trump presidential term?
__________________
I wish I knew how to quit you
Darat is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th November 2020, 03:23 AM   #71
Darat
Lackey
Administrator
 
Darat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: South East, UK
Posts: 94,750
Originally Posted by Garrison View Post
I think he may avoid charges if those who have been suggesting there is a clear deterioration in Trump's mental faculties over the last few months turn out to be correct.
"last few months"? You mean the last 4 years?
__________________
I wish I knew how to quit you
Darat is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th November 2020, 03:29 AM   #72
dirtywick
Master Poster
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,447
Originally Posted by Darat View Post
How on earth is seeing someone (if there are grounds of course) prosecuted for crimes is in any way equivalent to the "4 years of dysfunction" of the Trump presidential term?
First of all, he is being investigated and, if there are grounds, prosecuted for crimes right now. My position is to continue to do that and have Biden focus on being the president. What I donít want Biden to do is to rehash the impeachment. Thatís a path to a dysfunctional government where Trump is the center of the universe for another 4 years and Biden is fighting ghosts of a presidency he defeated at the polls. Thatís what I donít want.
dirtywick is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th November 2020, 05:13 AM   #73
psionl0
Skeptical about skeptics
 
psionl0's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: 31į57'S 115į57'E
Posts: 16,755
Originally Posted by dirtywick View Post
First of all, he is being investigated and, if there are grounds, prosecuted for crimes right now. My position is to continue to do that and have Biden focus on being the president. What I don’t want Biden to do is to rehash the impeachment. That’s a path to a dysfunctional government where Trump is the center of the universe for another 4 years and Biden is fighting ghosts of a presidency he defeated at the polls. That’s what I don’t want.
Yep. There is nothing to be gained by retrying an impeachment that has already failed. Even if it were to succeed, the only penalty would be removal from office which would only matter if Trump got re-elected (and he only has two chances at that - buckleys and none).

Whether there are grounds to indict Trump would be up to the appropriate authorities and not politicians.
__________________
"The process by which banks create money is so simple that the mind is repelled. Where something so important is involved, a deeper mystery seems only decent." - Galbraith, 1975
psionl0 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th November 2020, 07:44 AM   #74
alfaniner
Penultimate Amazing
 
alfaniner's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 24,044
I'm hoping that Biden doesn't play nice and say "Let's all just forget it and move on" (even though he would have no input or affect on the State indictments). If he won't insist on The PDJT being charged with everything possible, I'd rather he not say anything about it and just let due process take its course.
__________________
Science is self-correcting.
Woo is self-contradicting.
alfaniner is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th November 2020, 07:47 AM   #75
eerok
Quixoticist
 
eerok's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: ON Canada
Posts: 2,996
Originally Posted by alfaniner View Post
I'm hoping that Biden doesn't play nice and say "Let's all just forget it and move on" (even though he would have no input or affect on the State indictments). If he won't insist on The PDJT being charged with everything possible, I'd rather he not say anything about it and just let due process take its course.
It's very possible that Biden will pardon Trump IMO.
__________________
"Every saint has a past and every sinner has a future." - Oscar Wilde
eerok is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th November 2020, 08:01 AM   #76
Segnosaur
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 16,330
Originally Posted by The Atheist View Post
According to the Wikipedia page, the hatch act does not apply to the president and vice president.

Unless prosecutors make it a charge of conspiracy (ie trying to get others in the administration to violate the act) I think Stubby Mcbonespurs is safe from prosecution from it.

Sent from my LM-X320 using Tapatalk
__________________
Trust me, I know what I'm doing. - Sledgehammer

I'm Mary Poppin's Y'all! - Yondu

We are Groot - Groot
Segnosaur is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th November 2020, 08:07 AM   #77
Susheel
Graduate Poster
 
Susheel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Hyderabad, India
Posts: 1,637
Originally Posted by Segnosaur View Post
According to the Wikipedia page, the hatch act does not apply to the president and vice president.

Unless prosecutors make it a charge of conspiracy (ie trying to get others in the administration to violate the act) I think Stubby Mcbonespurs is safe from prosecution from it.

Sent from my LM-X320 using Tapatalk
Interesting. Does Lindsey Graham's solicitation for election donations during a senate hearing fall under its purview?
__________________
I've got to get to a library...fast Robert Langdon
Susheel is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th November 2020, 08:14 AM   #78
Segnosaur
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 16,330
Originally Posted by Susheel View Post
Interesting. Does Lindsey Graham's solicitation for election donations during a senate hearing fall under its purview?
I am not sure if it is part of the hatch act (it might only apply to certain employees and administration members) or some other law, but it is still illegal.

ETA: upon more research, it does look like it was the hatch act.

https://www.newsweek.com/lindsey-gra...ilding-1539300

Sent from my LM-X320 using Tapatalk
__________________
Trust me, I know what I'm doing. - Sledgehammer

I'm Mary Poppin's Y'all! - Yondu

We are Groot - Groot

Last edited by Segnosaur; 7th November 2020 at 08:16 AM.
Segnosaur is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th November 2020, 08:24 AM   #79
slyjoe
Master Poster
 
slyjoe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Near Harmonica Virgins, AZ
Posts: 2,334
Question - at one point I thought Mueller returned a sealed indictment. I though there was speculation it was directed at Trump, but wouldn't be unsealed/filed until he was out of office. Whatever happened there?
__________________
"You have done nothing to demonstrate an understanding of scientific methodology or modern skepticism, both of which are, by necessity, driven by the facts and evidence, not by preconceptions, and both of which are strengthened by, and rely upon, change." - Arkan Wolfshade
slyjoe is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 7th November 2020, 08:46 AM   #80
Mike!
Official Ponylandistanian National Treasure. Respect it!
 
Mike!'s Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Ponylandistan! Where the bacon grows on trees! Can it get any better than that? I submit it can not!
Posts: 38,084
Originally Posted by The Great Zaganza View Post
Cheating at Golf - have his Golf Cart driving license revoked.
This brings up something I've been wondering about for a few days. Has anyone ever interviewed anybody who beat Trump playing golf, and how he took the loss? Was he sportsman like, or a mean petty excuse type loser? I know what we think, but I was looking for real world examples.
__________________
"Never judge a man until youíve walked a mile in his shoes...
Because then it won't really matter, youíll be a mile away and have his shoes."
Mike! is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Reply

International Skeptics Forum » General Topics » USA Politics

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 07:09 AM.
Powered by vBulletin. Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

This forum began as part of the James Randi Education Foundation (JREF). However, the forum now exists as
an independent entity with no affiliation with or endorsement by the JREF, including the section in reference to "JREF" topics.

Disclaimer: Messages posted in the Forum are solely the opinion of their authors.