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Tags Gable Tostee , murder cases , New Zealand cases

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Old 14th October 2016, 02:57 AM   #161
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Originally Posted by Ben1985 View Post
Agree mostly with gareththomasnz

If you read the full transcript of the recording (which has been publicly available for over two years):

Wright become highly intoxicated.
She faked losing her phone and accused Tostee of stealing it before revealing she had it on her person the entire time.
Later she started to become violent and began throwing rocks at Tostee.
He then repeatedly and increasingly angrily asked her to leave (this was when he said "you're lucky I haven't chucked you off the balcony).
She stayed.
He then tried to physically throw her out (this is when he said "You're not taking any of your things, I'm throwing you out just as you are")
She grabbed a telescope and hit him with it.
He then pinned her to the floor and forced her to drop it.
He threw her onto the balcony, accused her of trying to kill him and said he had proof (the recording).
She begged him to let her go and she refused ("I would but you've been a bad girl")
He then locked the door, she screamed and then silence.

I understand the cops are relying on a precedent where a woman jumped out her 9th story window when her husband came at her with a knife. This case is very different though. By locking her out on they balcony Tostee removed any immediate threat of harm

All up, it seems more like he was threatening to press charges than to kill her. His actions in locking her on the balcony where definitely vindictive and malicious, but it's fairly clear that he never intended her physical harm imo.

Now you could argue that leaving a drunk, frightened and unbalanced young woman on the balcony was reckless/criminally negligent. Manslaughter maybe, but definitely not murder imo.

The judge that granted him bail said as much when she stated that the case for a murder charge was not strong and that manslaughter might be more appropriate.
Two defenders of Tostee join in short order. Tell me, so I can properly understand your posts and motivations. Are you part of some sort of Tostee defence group?
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Old 14th October 2016, 03:00 AM   #162
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Thanks for the welcome bb. Regarding the transcript, just try typing in "gable tostee transcript" into Google. There are several detailed summaries available.
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Old 14th October 2016, 03:03 AM   #163
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Originally Posted by Ben1985 View Post
Agree mostly with gareththomasnz

If you read the full transcript of the recording (which has been publicly available for over two years):

Wright become highly intoxicated.
She faked losing her phone and accused Tostee of stealing it before revealing she had it on her person the entire time.
Later she started to become violent and began throwing rocks at Tostee.
He then repeatedly and increasingly angrily asked her to leave (this was when he said "you're lucky I haven't chucked you off the balcony).
She stayed.
He then tried to physically throw her out (this is when he said "You're not taking any of your things, I'm throwing you out just as you are")
She grabbed a telescope and hit him with it.
He then pinned her to the floor and forced her to drop it.
He threw her onto the balcony, accused her of trying to kill him and said he had proof (the recording).
She begged him to let her go and she refused ("I would but you've been a bad girl")
He then locked the door, she screamed and then silence.

I understand the cops are relying on a precedent where a woman jumped out her 9th story window when her husband came at her with a knife. This case is very different though. By locking her out on they balcony Tostee removed any immediate threat of harm

All up, it seems more like he was threatening to press charges than to kill her. His actions in locking her on the balcony where definitely vindictive and malicious, but it's fairly clear that he never intended her physical harm imo.

Now you could argue that leaving a drunk, frightened and unbalanced young woman on the balcony was reckless/criminally negligent. Manslaughter maybe, but definitely not murder imo.

The judge that granted him bail said as much when she stated that the case for a murder charge was not strong and that manslaughter might be more appropriate.
Okay assuming you are posting in good faith. Please explain why Tostee didn't throw Wreight out the front door and call the police? Then please explain why he casually strolled out to have a pizza before calling the police?

This isn't the behaviour of a simple jerk. This is the behaviour of a narcissistic, violent murderer. Behaviour displayed in the audio where he threatened to throw her off the balcony. He was twice her size. She was no doubt in fear of her life. He's going down.
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Old 14th October 2016, 03:03 AM   #164
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The transcript.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...fterwards.html
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Old 14th October 2016, 04:15 AM   #165
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Originally Posted by gareththomasnz View Post
Normally yes, but when that person has physically and verbally assaulted you for an hour, left you with bleeding welts, begun to damage your property and has possession of a blunt instrument that they have struck you with you restrain them & put them somewhere they can not further do you damage.

How do you know he was not planning to call the police?

I assume he intended to leave her there to sober up
Even a Gold Coast shoebox will have a bathroom with a door - not lockable from the outside perhaps, but in her state far better than a 14th floor balcony.

And welcome, by the way
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Old 14th October 2016, 04:24 AM   #166
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Originally Posted by lionking View Post
This isn't the behaviour of a simple jerk. This is the behaviour of a narcissistic, violent murderer. Behaviour displayed in the audio where he threatened to throw her off the balcony. He was twice her size. She was no doubt in fear of her life. He's going down.
Not as cut and dried as you think - there are precedents that point to both a guilty and not guilty verdict.

Quote:
A CRIMINOLOGIST has predicted Gable Tostee could be acquitted after a jury rejected a similar argument in a separate case this week.

Criminologist, barrister and former detective inspector Terry Goldsworthy said the acquittal of Christopher Cairns and Dion Pydde for the murder of Tumara Cousins could set a precedent for Tostee.
...
During the trial Crown Prosecutor Glen Cash said Mr Cousins had been threatened with a gun, later found to be a replica, and assaulted so severely it “forced him to take the very risky option” of climbing the balcony to flee.

Mr Goldsworthy said the not guilty verdict for Cairns and Pydde could be a sign of things to come in Tostee’s case.

“I thought the Cousins’ case was reasonably strong from the facts known but the jury wasn’t prepared to accept that as murder even though there was a gun used, criminal activity taking place and witnesses who escaped,” he said.

On the other hand, there is a similar case where the accused was found guilty:

Quote:
Mr Goldsworthy said a 1986 murder case where a woman fell to her death while climbing out a sixth floor window to flee her violent boyfriend was the precedent for such cases.

Kelly Healey was in the shower when her boyfriend Kim William Royall broke down the bathroom door, grabbed her throat and punched her in the face causing her to try to escape out of a window. Ms Healy fell 21m to her death and Royall was found guilty of her murder – not because he necessarily threw her, but because she fell trying to escape him.
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Old 14th October 2016, 04:29 AM   #167
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Originally Posted by lionking View Post
Okay assuming you are posting in good faith. Please explain why Tostee didn't throw Wreight out the front door and call the police? Then please explain why he casually strolled out to have a pizza before calling the police?

This isn't the behaviour of a simple jerk. This is the behaviour of a narcissistic, violent murderer. Behaviour displayed in the audio where he threatened to throw her off the balcony. He was twice her size. She was no doubt in fear of her life. He's going down.
I can't pretend to know what Tostee was thinking. My guess is that he was angry that she had just trashed his apartment, refused to leave and then tried to cave his head in with a telescope. Was locking her out on the balcony irresponsible and vindictive? Absolutely. Does it display murderous intent? No. Could it be argued that he unintentionally caused her death? Maybe (drunk people are well known to overestimate their own capabilities, it's why so many people get behind the wheel after a few drinks).

Furthermore, I don't see how his subsequent culinary choice provides any indication of any latent murderous tendencies. I remember it being reported at his bail hearing that Tostee is mildly autistic and that that may be responsible for his behavior. Our he could've just been in shock and running on auto-pilot. Either way, I really don't see the significance.
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Old 14th October 2016, 04:33 AM   #168
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Originally Posted by Hard Cheese View Post
Not as cut and dried as you think - there are precedents that point to both a guilty and not guilty verdict.




On the other hand, there is a similar case where the accused was found guilty:
The difference between these cases is that the acquitted case involved a male, the conviction a female.

I'm confident he will be convicted. Stranger things have happened though.
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Old 14th October 2016, 04:38 AM   #169
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Originally Posted by Ben1985 View Post
I can't pretend to know what Tostee was thinking. My guess is that he was angry that she had just trashed his apartment, refused to leave and then tried to cave his head in with a telescope. Was locking her out on the balcony irresponsible and vindictive? Absolutely. Does it display murderous intent? No. Could it be argued that he unintentionally caused her death? Maybe (drunk people are well known to overestimate their own capabilities, it's why so many people get behind the wheel after a few drinks).

Furthermore, I don't see how his subsequent culinary choice provides any indication of any latent murderous tendencies. I remember it being reported at his bail hearing that Tostee is mildly autistic and that that may be responsible for his behavior. Our he could've just been in shock and running on auto-pilot. Either way, I really don't see the significance.
Please stop with this rubbish. You are on a skeptical forum. Where is the evidence of such violent damage to Tostee?

You are biased, this is clear. But can you please explain why he, as big and strong as he was, didn't simply put the victim out the door and/or call the police?
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Old 14th October 2016, 04:47 AM   #170
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I am not biased (or at least not to the extent of trying to push pizza eating as evidence of murderous intent). As for your question, I've mentioned twice already, he was doing exactly that when she assaulted him.
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Old 14th October 2016, 05:04 AM   #171
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Originally Posted by lionking View Post
The difference between these cases is that the acquitted case involved a male, the conviction a female.
It should be irrelevant.

Originally Posted by lionking View Post
I'm confident he will be convicted. Stranger things have happened though.
I don't think you can say beyond reasonable doubt that his actions were life threatening. You can make a case for the scenario where he locks her out on the balcony to sober up, but she is not in fear of her life; in her inebriated state she just makes a very bad judgement call about her ability to climb down. I think he'll be found not guilty. But I wouldn't put a lot of money on it.
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Old 14th October 2016, 05:15 AM   #172
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Originally Posted by Ben1985 View Post
Our he could've just been in shock and running on auto-pilot.
Be careful, people will tell you that it's perfectly normal to behave irrationally in stressful situations...unless it's Gable Tostee, where eating a pizza after seeing someone fall 14 floors is proof of his guilt

And welcome, Ben1985
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Old 14th October 2016, 05:18 AM   #173
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Originally Posted by Hard Cheese View Post
Be careful, people will tell you that it's perfectly normal to behave irrationally in stressful situations...unless it's Gable Tostee, where eating a pizza after seeing someone fall 14 floors is proof of his guilt

And welcome, Ben1985
Thanks
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Old 14th October 2016, 05:19 AM   #174
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Tostee was drunk as a skunk - not as drunk as her for sure but still well beyond what would be considered a rational sober state.

After the incident no doubt the shock & adrenaline sobered him up as would have eating a meal. So he was drunk & needed to sober up.

He could have thrown her out with her belongings yes but she would have made a terrible commotion in the corridor screaming and yelling

Also he did offer to walk her home earlier on, but by the end she was beyond that. So the balcony was somewhere she could not cause any trouble for anybody - if he had shoved her out the door she could have caused more trouble in the building

He could have locked her in the bathroom but the sliding french door was right there & he could see what she was doing

I dont believe he did this to be vindictive but it was certainly irresponsible.

Her behaviour was beyond irresponsible & vindictive but I have been paralytic myself many times & yep its not ones best


This was the 14th floor I believe so he could not just shove her out the door in that state - she would never have made it out of the building unassisted.

I'm not connected to the case at all - just listened to the recordings and am making a non-emotional judgement

Last edited by gareththomasnz; 14th October 2016 at 05:24 AM.
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Old 14th October 2016, 05:20 AM   #175
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Originally Posted by Ben1985 View Post
I am not biased (or at least not to the extent of trying to push pizza eating as evidence of murderous intent). As for your question, I've mentioned twice already, he was doing exactly that when she assaulted him.
You have no evidence of this. Remember that you are not on a "True Crime" forum, but a skeptical one.
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Old 14th October 2016, 05:27 AM   #176
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Oh and there is ample evidence of the damage to Tostee he had scabs and scars all over so must have been bleeding a fair bit at the time
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Old 14th October 2016, 05:30 AM   #177
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Originally Posted by gareththomasnz View Post
Tostee was drunk as a skunk - not as drunk as her for sure but still well beyond what would be considered a rational sober state.

After the incident no doubt the shock & adrenaline sobered him up as would have eating a meal. So he was drunk & needed to sober up.

He could have thrown her out with her belongings yes but she would have made a terrible commotion in the corridor screaming and yelling

Also he did offer to walk her home earlier on, but by the end she was beyond that. So the balcony was somewhere she could not cause any trouble for anybody - if he had shoved her out the door she could have caused more trouble in the building

Of couse that was not the case - but they were both too drunk to behave responsibly

This was the 14th floor I believe so he could not just shove her out the door in that state - she would never have made it out of the building unassisted.

I'm not connected to the case at all - just listened to the recordings and am making a non-emotional judgement
I am totally gobsmacked by this.You are saying that Tostee's drunkenness somehow excuses him. Amazing ********.

The poor, buffed, bodybuilding baby was so upset by the Tinder girl getting thrown out on the balcony, threatened with violence and subsequently being murdered that he had to comfort himself by eating a pizza. Before calling the police.
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Last edited by lionking; 14th October 2016 at 05:31 AM.
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Old 14th October 2016, 05:31 AM   #178
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Originally Posted by gareththomasnz View Post
Oh and there is ample evidence of the damage to Tostee he had scabs and scars all over so must have been bleeding a fair bit at the time
Rubbish.
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Old 14th October 2016, 05:40 AM   #179
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No its not rubbish there are photographs which I have seen online & he had a medical examination of the injuries. He still had bruising and scabs from the cuts more than a day later so he would have definitely been bleeding a fair bit

He had cuts all over arms, legs etc . There was also his blood on the stones and other items. While she inflicted this he was still being somewhat affable toward her.

In the end all she got was held down & told off. It was her choice to climb off the balcony. Clearly hysterical & blind drunk.

Clearly she was drunk beyond sound judgement & so was he. Are we to have drunken breathalizer tests for balcony owners? I think not.

Yes you can argue that he should not have put her on the balcony in that state - but he was also in a state of drunkeness

She should not have chosen to drink alcohol in an apartment with a 14 floor balcony when she was fully sober at the beginning - same rationality in that argument

She was a grown woman fully responsible for her actions. She was guilty of assault. She knew when she began drinking that there was a dangerous balcony. She chose to get blind drunk and have sex with a total stranger in an apartment with a 14 floor balcony. Even I wouldnt do that.

So I dont have any sympathy or malice in this case. I just dont like to see people finger pointing unjustly.

Last edited by gareththomasnz; 14th October 2016 at 05:50 AM.
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Old 14th October 2016, 05:42 AM   #180
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Originally Posted by lionking View Post
I am totally gobsmacked by this.You are saying that Tostee's drunkenness somehow excuses him. Amazing ********.

The poor, buffed, bodybuilding baby was so upset by the Tinder girl getting thrown out on the balcony, threatened with violence and subsequently being murdered that he had to comfort himself by eating a pizza. Before calling his daddy, his lawyer, and eventually the police.
FTFY.

I don't believe autism ever came up in the trial. I'm pretty sure it was BS in 2014, and still is now. I wonder if anyone has evidence of it.
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Old 14th October 2016, 05:46 AM   #181
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Originally Posted by gareththomasnz View Post
No its not rubbish there are photographs which I have seen online & he had a medical examination of the injuries. He still had bruising and scabs from the cuts more than a day later so he would have definitely been bleeding a fair bit

He had cuts all over arms, legs etc
Yeah. Evidence of what? Active sex?

How does this excuse this large man throwing a small woman on to the balcony?

I don't believe you have answered the question. Why did he not throw her out the door and/or call the police? I don't expect an answer from the Tostee apologists.
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Old 14th October 2016, 05:50 AM   #182
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Originally Posted by gareththomasnz View Post
No its not rubbish there are photographs which I have seen online & he had a medical examination of the injuries. He still had bruising and scabs from the cuts more than a day later so he would have definitely been bleeding a fair bit
Those scabs and scars are old, there's no way they were made in the last 24 hours.

Originally Posted by lionking View Post
The poor, buffed, bodybuilding baby
He's not much of a bodybuilder, TBH. I've seen musclier legs on a size 12 Tegel.
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Old 14th October 2016, 05:57 AM   #183
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It was a 14 floor apartment & she was pissed out of it. If he wanted her out he would have had to get her to the ground floor & out the front door

At stake ? - his tenancy perhaps

It was a bad night on the piss for the pair of them. Neither is guilty of anything really except being extremely immature. I used to do this stuff when I was 15.
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Old 14th October 2016, 05:58 AM   #184
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Originally Posted by Hard Cheese View Post


He's not much of a bodybuilder, TBH. I've seen musclier legs on a size 12 Tegel.
He was twice her size
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Old 14th October 2016, 06:10 AM   #185
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Originally Posted by lionking View Post
He was twice her size
That didn't stop her from attacking him at one point, so I don't see how she was intimidated by his size. Looking at the photos of his injuries, if you hadn't told me beforehand he was a bodybuilder I would have laughed at you. He is about the most unimpressive bodybuilder I've ever seen.
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Old 14th October 2016, 06:57 AM   #186
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Just as a thought exercise...

Suppose he shoves her, drunk as she is, out the front door, and she tries to leave by the stairwell, falls down the stairs and dies?

Or maybe she makes it to the street, and walks out in front of a bus?

Is he responsible for her death in either of those scenarios under the relevant laws?
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Old 14th October 2016, 07:00 AM   #187
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Originally Posted by Ben1985 View Post
Agree mostly with gareththomasnz

If you read the full transcript of the recording (which has been publicly available for over two years):

<snip>

By your own account she begged him to let her go and he refused.

Then she died.

He's culpable.
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Old 14th October 2016, 07:01 AM   #188
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Originally Posted by Shiner View Post
You can also find it here and here, for those who find clicking on Fail links makes them feel dirty.

I note that Wright states, several times, that she wants to call the police. And that she would jump off the balcony


Then there are gems like:
Originally Posted by Wright
'Are you going to f***ing untie me because I will F***ing destroy your jaw. It is not *************** funny...
and
Originally Posted by Tostee
...you are lucky I haven’t chucked you off my balcony you god damn psycho little (expletive).
Originally Posted by Tostee
You are not going to collect any of your belongings you are just going to walk out and I am going to slam the door on you, do you understand? If you try and pull anything. I’ll knock you out, I’ll knock you the (expletive) out. Do you understand? Do you understand?
And.
Quote:
Female:"Just let me go home.”
Male: “I would but you have been a bad girl.”
Sound of door sliding shut.
Followed by
Quote:
Female:“Just let me go home. Just let me go home.”
Male heavy breathing.
Faint scream detected.
No call to police or medical service, just calls to lawyer and father.

Curious who Wrisght's phone ended up in Tostee's pocket isn't it? Almost as if he'd take it so she couldn't call...
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Old 14th October 2016, 07:02 AM   #189
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Originally Posted by gareththomasnz View Post
<snip>

This was the 14th floor I believe so he could not just shove her out the door in that state - she would never have made it out of the building unassisted.

<snip>

She didn't have any trouble making it off the balcony.
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Old 14th October 2016, 07:05 AM   #190
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Originally Posted by Ben1985 View Post
I am not biased (or at least not to the extent of trying to push pizza eating as evidence of murderous intent). As for your question, I've mentioned twice already, he was doing exactly that when she assaulted him.
Yet she asked to leave and he wouldn't let her.

Originally Posted by gareththomasnz View Post
After the incident no doubt the shock & adrenaline sobered him up as would have eating a meal. So he was drunk & needed to sober up.
Yeah.. He seemed very calm when he called his father and lawyer...

Originally Posted by gareththomasnz View Post
He could have thrown her out with her belongings yes but she would have made a terrible commotion in the corridor screaming and yelling
His problem. He could have called the police.

Originally Posted by gareththomasnz View Post
This was the 14th floor I believe so he could not just shove her out the door in that state - she would never have made it out of the building unassisted.
So why not call, for example, a taxi?

Originally Posted by gareththomasnz View Post
I'm not connected to the case at all - just listened to the recordings and am making a non-emotional judgement


Originally Posted by gareththomasnz View Post
Oh and there is ample evidence of the damage to Tostee he had scabs and scars all over so must have been bleeding a fair bit at the time
Yeah, minor scratches and abrasions.
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Old 14th October 2016, 07:13 AM   #191
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Originally Posted by gareththomasnz View Post
<snip>

Yes you can argue that he should not have put her on the balcony in that state - but he was also in a state of drunkeness

Is drunkenness an affirmative defense in Australia?
"I was drunk when I did it, yer Honor."

"Oh. Well I guess that's alright, then."
Quote:

She should not have chosen to drink alcohol in an apartment with a 14 floor balcony

I wonder if the owners have that in the lease. Apparently they should. Otherwise there might be grounds for maintaining an attractive nuisance.

Quote:
when she was fully sober at the beginning - same rationality in that argument

Except that she didn't choose to go out on the balcony. Someone made that choice for her.

Quote:

She was a grown woman fully responsible for her actions. She was guilty of assault. She knew when she began drinking that there was a dangerous balcony. She chose to get blind drunk and have sex with a total stranger in an apartment with a 14 floor balcony. Even I wouldnt do that.

<snip>

Just a paragraph before this you were using drunkenness as a defense for Tostee, How did it all of a sudden get to be evidence of culpability for her?

Double standard much?
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Old 14th October 2016, 10:32 AM   #192
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Originally Posted by gareththomasnz View Post
Normally yes, but when that person has physically and verbally assaulted you for an hour, left you with bleeding welts, begun to damage your property and has possession of a blunt instrument that they have struck you with you restrain them & put them somewhere they can not further do you damage.

How do you know he was not planning to call the police?

I assume he intended to leave her there to sober up

Also a question to you - how much of the recording have you listed to?

I have listed to 40 minutes chronologically.

As this case was it could have been between two females, muliple people of either sex, two males. There is clear bias because it was a man and a woman.

Some time ago I had a friend that got drunk and the story police were told is that he fell from a chair & broke his neck. Now this guy was a scraper & the odds that this is what really happened are slim. There was no court case. Yet he was most probably killed wrestling in a fight.

Here because it is a female that screamed hysterically there is an assumption of guilt - that is wrong & it degrades the law and the civil rights we all have.

Warrena Wright had no right to assault Tostee or verbally abuse him. He at no time stuck her or behaved maliciously. Finally at the end his temper snapped and even then all he did was restrain her & put her out on the porch.

Honestly if you have not listened to as much of the recording as possible you should refrain from forming an opinion

I still have an open mind if there is incriminating content I have not heard in the full context.
If I had a date go that sour, the last thing I would want to do is keep the girl around. The notion that locking her on the balcony was in any way justifiable is ridiculous and deplorable. The only rational thing to do at that point was throw her out and send her on her way. If she calls the police, deal with it.

I don't know if he's guilty of murder, but he is certainly guilty of holding her against her will.
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Old 14th October 2016, 11:59 AM   #193
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Originally Posted by gareththomasnz View Post
The balcony was the best place for her to be had she not climbed off it.
The balcony was the best place?

I guess your home planet has no gravity.

Originally Posted by lionking View Post
Wild conjecture devoid of evidence. This large, strong guy could have easily put her out the front door and/or called the police. Instead he put on the balcony and threatened to throw her over.
Here you go - the two people on this forum least likely to agree that the sky is blue, yet we agree 100% here.
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Old 14th October 2016, 04:57 PM   #194
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Jury deliberations begin on monday - we should have a verdict by Friday I expect, possibly sooner.

I have nothing further to say - awaiting the verdict of the court. But if its guilty I fully support an appeal and retrial.
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Old 14th October 2016, 05:09 PM   #195
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Originally Posted by gareththomasnz View Post
Jury deliberations begin on monday - we should have a verdict by Friday I expect, possibly sooner.

I have nothing further to say - awaiting the verdict of the court. But if its guilty I fully support an appeal and retrial.
You will only accept a guilty verdict. How very skeptical of you......
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Old 14th October 2016, 05:26 PM   #196
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I made an online poll so lets vote - Is he guilty of Murder or Manslaughter yes/no

goo.gl/9v4sOK results at goo.gl/uZ6GHS
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Old 14th October 2016, 05:29 PM   #197
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Originally Posted by gareththomasnz View Post
I made an online poll so lets vote - Is he guilty of Murder or Manslaughter yes/no

goo.gl/9v4sOK results at goo.gl/uZ6GHS
Online polls are rubbish. At all times. On any subject.
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Old 14th October 2016, 05:39 PM   #198
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Originally Posted by lionking View Post

I don't believe you have answered the question. Why did he not throw her out the door and/or call the police? I don't expect an answer from the Tostee apologists.
I'll throw it back at you. If he wanted to kill her, why lock her on the balcony? He could've killed her quite easily inside the apartment. putting her on they balcony made it much easier for her to call for help and attract attention. And why close and lock the door if he wanted to murder her?
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Old 14th October 2016, 05:48 PM   #199
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Originally Posted by Ben1985 View Post
I'll throw it back at you. If he wanted to kill her, why lock her on the balcony? He could've killed her quite easily inside the apartment. putting her on they balcony made it much easier for her to call for help and attract attention. And why close and lock the door if he wanted to murder her?
Have a look at the law he is being tried under. The act of locking her on the balcony, threatening her and putting her in fear of her life is sufficient to make him a murderer. He didn't have to throw her off the balcony.

One thing that is for certain is that if he had thrown her out the front door, she would still be alive.
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Old 14th October 2016, 06:33 PM   #200
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Originally Posted by lionking View Post
Have a look at the law he is being tried under. The act of locking her on the balcony, threatening her and putting her in fear of her life is sufficient to make him a murderer. He didn't have to throw her off the balcony.

One thing that is for certain is that if he had thrown her out the front door, she would still be alive.
The law says that he needs to either have intended to kill her (which he clearly didn't), or that he engaged in the commission of an unlawful act that is likely to endanger a human life.

Not being a lawyer, I'm not going to speculate on whether the action of locking her on the balcony amounted to wrongful detention. But regardless, I think it's extremely difficult to argue that the act of locking her on the balcony was an act of intimidation "likely to endanger a human life". And I think a jury will likely think the same.

Last edited by Ben1985; 14th October 2016 at 06:46 PM.
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