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Old 7th September 2023, 07:51 PM   #81
dudalb
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Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
What scares me the most is Dem voter apathy. I think that is what gave Trump the WH in 2016. The polls all said that she was a sure thing and some people just didn't bother to vote due to complacency. That coupled with those Dems/Indies who just didn't like her so wrote in Bernie or some other person got us Trump and all that followed.

Trump could not win if Dems/Indies come out in the numbers they did in 2020.
Biden is not nearly as disliked as HIlary was.
And I think the Dems will come out like they did in 2020 for one reason: Fear. Never understimate Fear as a motivator.
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Old 7th September 2023, 07:53 PM   #82
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Originally Posted by Venom View Post
I think there could be riots and communal violence at least.

I'm seriously considering going gun-nut like many rightwingers did after Obama was elected.
Oh, for some time I have been amused by people saying how bad and evil Trump is..and he is very bad and very evil...and then shocked by the suggestion that if gets back in power armed resistence will not be necessary.
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Old 7th September 2023, 08:12 PM   #83
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
Biden is not nearly as disliked as HIlary was.
And I think the Dems will come out like they did in 2020 for one reason: Fear. Never understimate Fear as a motivator.
Exactly. Im afraid and i will bang on doors if necessary to get people out. Jan 6 was not in existence in 2020 and Trump still lost partly because those of us who were not terribly worried about him beating Hillary in 16 were definitely worried about another Trump presidency 4 years later. In 2016 I at least held out hope that he would not kowtow to the far right--after all he used to be a Democrat---but obviously it quickly became clear by the next election that his malignant narcissism fed on far right adoration. In 2020 the fear was just for another 4 years of horrible policy and stupidity--after the election the fear now is for the survival of democracy. I'd like to think that's a pretty strong incentive for a strong turnout. I do think the Dems would be wise to put in some young blood--i dunno about Newsom but he certainly would shred Trump in a debate far better than Biden could at this point.
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Old 7th September 2023, 08:31 PM   #84
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I think Trump will shred himsel fin a debate ; he will come off looking insane.
OF course I think Trump will probably refuse to debate; he hates debates.
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Old 7th September 2023, 08:59 PM   #85
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
I think Trump will shred himsel fin a debate ; he will come off looking insane.
OF course I think Trump will probably refuse to debate; he hates debates.
Hasn't hurt him so far. But yeah, it's likely he would avoid any debate except maybe if Newsmax sponsors it. He will just say that it is part of a conspiracy to gang up on him. Of course, since he will be so tied up in court he can make the honest contention that he is unavailable for debates--can't miss his sentencing hearing!
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Old 7th September 2023, 09:26 PM   #86
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Trump has no idea what a "debate" is. To date, he sees it as an opportunity to interject on others with loud wisecracks when he is not changing the subject. The MAGA chuds love that because they see it as Trump "sticking it to the man".
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Old 8th September 2023, 02:01 AM   #87
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Originally Posted by Hercules56 View Post
It is my personal opinion that Biden appears to be less neurologically sharp than Trump. You are of course free to disagree. But it seems a lot of people out there believe Biden is too old to be president.

However I also do believe that Biden's political and social views are much better for this country and he would still make a much better president, regardless of his neurological and cognitive failures. I can look beyond these things but I fear a lot of Americans will not be able to.
Be honest now lad, when was the last time your personal opinion had any relationship to reality?

You believe many things that even a toddler could tell you are manifestly untrue. Well, if we take your pronouncements on here as sincere, that is.
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Old 8th September 2023, 05:12 AM   #88
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
I think Trump will shred himsel fin a debate ; he will come off looking insane.
OF course I think Trump will probably refuse to debate; he hates debates.
That would be good for Joe.
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Old 8th September 2023, 05:14 AM   #89
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Originally Posted by sir drinks-a-lot View Post
You think?



I'm guessing it's gonna be Newsom.
I was thinking yesterday that Andrew Cuomo could be our man.
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Old 8th September 2023, 05:28 AM   #90
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You mean Amazon Cuomo?

Replacing either Biden or Harris is a fantasy. Its nonsense on par with "Trump looks mentally sharp"

I agree with the sentiment that these polls are useless right now and we should not be reacting to everytime the needle moves for the next year.
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Old 8th September 2023, 05:43 AM   #91
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Originally Posted by Donal View Post
You mean Amazon Cuomo?

Replacing either Biden or Harris is a fantasy. Its nonsense on par with "Trump looks mentally sharp"

I agree with the sentiment that these polls are useless right now and we should not be reacting to everytime the needle moves for the next year.
Ok, i hope you're right.
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Old 8th September 2023, 06:12 AM   #92
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Originally Posted by sir drinks-a-lot View Post
I think Newsom would be a great chance for the Dems. They could just claim that the failings of California are a right-wing conspiracy (like they do with everything else). Besides, there are some successes that can be pointed to in California.

He's also got good hair, is somewhat well spoken (at least compared to Trump, Biden and Harris), and he's young.

I'm not really that familiar with who else might be available from the Dem's pool, but I think they'd be much better off with Newsom than with Biden or Harris.
Trump himself complimented Newsom's good looks and said they "got along"...
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Old 8th September 2023, 06:24 AM   #93
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Originally Posted by Venom View Post
Trump himself complimented Newsom's good looks and said they "got along"...
There has to be a younger Dem governor out there, besides Newsom and Cuomo, who could energize the crowds. Whitmer?
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Old 8th September 2023, 07:30 AM   #94
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Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger View Post
The election is more than a year away. Someone bump the thread closer to Nov 2022. Thanks.
Sorry, can't, my time machine is on the fritz.
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Old 8th September 2023, 08:26 AM   #95
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
I think Trump will shred himsel fin a debate ; he will come off looking insane.
OF course I think Trump will probably refuse to debate; he hates debates.
This was what I was about to say. Why are people assuming he plans to participate?
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Old 8th September 2023, 08:31 AM   #96
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
I think Trump will shred himsel fin a debate ; he will come off looking insane.
OF course I think Trump will probably refuse to debate; he hates debates.
I think so, you think so but there are a lot of Republicans out there who would disagree.

In 2016 I thought he comprehensively lost the debates, but the right wing echo chamber thought he won them handsomely or at the very least it was a narrative they were happy to push.
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Old 8th September 2023, 08:39 AM   #97
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
I think Trump will shred himsel fin a debate ; he will come off looking insane.
OF course I think Trump will probably refuse to debate; he hates debates.
How do you think Joe Biden would do in a debate?
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Old 8th September 2023, 08:39 AM   #98
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Originally Posted by sir drinks-a-lot View Post
How do you think Joe Biden would do in a debate?
... he DID fine. It's not some hypothetical we have to run simulations on.
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Old 8th September 2023, 08:41 AM   #99
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Originally Posted by dudalb View Post
I think Trump will shred himsel fin a debate ; he will come off looking insane.
OF course I think Trump will probably refuse to debate; he hates debates.
It works for him now because he is running away with the GQP nomination. Debating only exposes him. Why give any of his opposition a chance to create a viral moment with him?

But if the general election is going to be neck and neck the whole way (which it most likely will) or if he even finds himself behind most of the way, he'll have to debate.
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Old 8th September 2023, 08:43 AM   #100
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Originally Posted by The Don View Post
I think so, you think so but there are a lot of Republicans out there who would disagree.

In 2016 I thought he comprehensively lost the debates, but the right wing echo chamber thought he won them handsomely or at the very least it was a narrative they were happy to push.
basically, if he can avoid ******** in his hands and smearing it all over the stage, he'll get credit for it.
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Old 8th September 2023, 08:43 AM   #101
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Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
... he DID fine. It's not some hypothetical we have to run simulations on.
That was 4 years ago, his mental state seems to have deteriorated a bit since then. But if you think Biden sounds like a sharp 38 year old, more power to you.
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Old 8th September 2023, 08:43 AM   #102
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Originally Posted by JoeMorgue View Post
... he DID fine. It's not some hypothetical we have to run simulations on.
Ah, but that was 2020 Joe Biden before his brain turned to porridge due to his dementia.

President Trump on the other hand is, as he has always been, an intellectual colossus who revels in the cut and thrust of debate - Person, Woman, Man, Camera, TV, Covfefe
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Old 8th September 2023, 08:45 AM   #103
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Originally Posted by gnome View Post
This was what I was about to say. Why are people assuming he plans to participate?
You may be very correct that it would be to Trump's advantage to not participate in the debates and simply give lots of Fox News and Newsmax interviews. It's a shame we can't make participation in the debates mandatory for being on the ballot.
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Old 8th September 2023, 08:46 AM   #104
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Originally Posted by Hercules56 View Post
That was 4 years ago, his mental state seems to have deteriorated a bit since then.
It has ?

Has President Trump's ?

Originally Posted by Hercules56 View Post
But if you think Biden sounds like a sharp 38 year old, more power to you.
Why a 38 year old ?

It's like the guy in the running shoes on the savannah, "I don't have to outrun the lion, I only have to outrun you". Biden needs to outwit Trump.
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Old 8th September 2023, 08:46 AM   #105
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Originally Posted by The Don View Post
Ah, but that was 2020 Joe Biden before his brain turned to porridge due to his dementia.

President Trump on the other hand is, as he has always been, an intellectual colossus who revels in the cut and thrust of debate - Person, Woman, Man, Camera, TV, Covfefe
Did you have to rent all that straw or are you making partial payments over a six month period?
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Old 8th September 2023, 08:47 AM   #106
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Originally Posted by Hercules56 View Post
That was 4 years ago, his mental state seems to have deteriorated a bit since then. But if you think Biden sounds like a sharp 38 year old, more power to you.
Again, have you heard the presumptive opponent?
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Old 8th September 2023, 08:47 AM   #107
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Originally Posted by The Don View Post
It has ?

Has President Trump's ?



Why a 38 year old ?

It's like the guy in the running shoes on the savannah, "I don't have to outrun the lion, I only have to outrun you". Biden needs to outwit Trump.
All we can hope for is that Trump's performance during the debate will be as erratic and delusional and angry as his posts on Truth Social. Or during the first debate with Biden in 2020.
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Old 8th September 2023, 08:48 AM   #108
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Originally Posted by Donal View Post
Again, have you heard the presumptive opponent?
Why don't you post a link to a YouTube video where you think Trump sounds incoherent and neurologically deteriorated.
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Old 8th September 2023, 08:51 AM   #109
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Mainly because I don't what that garbage screwing up the videos YouTube recommends me. Are you not aware of his rambling screeds at his rallies?
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Old 8th September 2023, 08:52 AM   #110
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Originally Posted by Donal View Post
Mainly because I don't what that garbage screwing up the videos YouTube recommends me. Are you not aware of his rambling screeds at his rallies?
Okay post a link to a video that's on CNN or MSNBC that shows Trump incoherent rants.
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Old 8th September 2023, 08:56 AM   #111
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I can't imagine Biden doing a debate at this point. I don't think he will.
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Old 8th September 2023, 08:58 AM   #112
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This is a weird squabble. Both Trump and Biden have a very long video record given their lifetime of public prominence, and it's not hard to find videos of their younger years where they both sound much more sharp and coherent.

Trump was always a reactionary heel but the difference in how he speaks in his younger years is stark. Here he is on Larry King Live in 1987.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A8wJc7vHcTs

Same old grievance routine and a familiar stream of consciousness approach to speaking, but much more clarity, coherence, and focus. The cadence is much quicker too.

Likewise here's an old video of Biden speaking extemporaneously about foreign affairs back when he was a Senator in the 90s

https://www.c-span.org/video/?86974-1/nato-expansion

The decline of both men is glaring.
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Old 8th September 2023, 09:04 AM   #113
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https://youtu.be/CmekpMxhFmg?si=1vVXKjMDEVFJ-vVk

Here's a good, long interview. It's a real shame the interviewer keeps on trying to lead his answers for him. Biden is not the man he was in 2020, definitely not in 2016.
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Old 8th September 2023, 09:05 AM   #114
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Originally Posted by TurkeysGhost View Post
The decline of both men is glaring.
We seem to have people here who don't believe Biden has declined recently.
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Old 8th September 2023, 09:17 AM   #115
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A debate that includes Trump could only work if they give each candidate a set time limit and then cut off the microphone when time is up.

Otherwise it is just Trump talking over Biden, interrupting Biden. Trump is a loudmouth and is proud of that. He would consider rudeness in the debate to be victory.


ETA: For that matter, with his mike cut off, I would fully expect Trump to hover round Biden talking over him loudly enough to get picked up by Biden's mike.

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Old 8th September 2023, 09:21 AM   #116
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Originally Posted by crescent View Post
A debate that includes Trump could only work if they give each candidate a set time limit and then cut off the microphone when time is up.

Otherwise it is just Trump talking over Biden, interrupting Biden. Trump is a loudmouth and is proud of that. He would consider rudeness in the debate to be victory.
Agree. Moderator must have the power to shut off Trumps mic.
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Old 8th September 2023, 09:35 AM   #117
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Originally Posted by Hercules56 View Post
Okay post a link to a video that's on CNN or MSNBC that shows Trump incoherent rants.
How about a transcript?

Trump was asked a rather simple question by Fox host Sean Hannity about his plans for an upcoming term.. This is what he answered:

Well, one of the things that will be really great, you know, the word experience is still good. I always say talent is more important than experience. I've always said that. But the word experience is a very important word. It's a very important meaning. I never did this before--I never slept over in Washington. I was in Washington I think 17 times, all of the sudden, I'm the president of the United States. You know the story, I'm riding down Pennsylvania Avenue with our First Lady and I say, 'This is great.' But I didn't know very many people in Washington, it wasn't my thing. I was from Manhattan, from New York. Now I know everybody. And I have great people in the administration. You make some mistakes, like you know an idiot like Bolton, all he wanted to do is drop bombs on everybody. You don't have to drop bombs on everybody. You don't have to kill people.

A very softball question... Easy to answer... "More tax cuts for the rich! More non-white people in jail! MAGA!". Instead, it devolves into an incoherent stream of thought that goes from "what you mean by experience", how he "knows people in NY but not Washington", how bombing people is wrong.

See:
CNN
Rolling Stone
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Old 8th September 2023, 09:42 AM   #118
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Biden never had to be physically restrained from staring into the sun during an eclipse.
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Old 8th September 2023, 09:46 AM   #119
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Originally Posted by sir drinks-a-lot View Post
We seem to have people here who don't believe Biden has declined recently.
I don't think anyone believes Biden hasn't felt his age, but the concern trolling keeps focusing on his gaffes without considering the addle brained speed addict he'd be up against. You have a guy who occasionally stumbles over his words v a guy who can't complete a sentence, especially if it doesn't involve shouting out buzzwords.
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Old 8th September 2023, 09:50 AM   #120
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Originally Posted by sir drinks-a-lot View Post
We seem to have people here who don't believe Biden has declined recently.
Another rousing game of "Man with no pants demands you acknowledge your fly is down."
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